RANT: TP classifieds vs Ebay

[hashcake]

What is it with some of the oxygen thieves who inhabit ebay?
Whenever I sell an item, I send the buyer a message to inform them that the item has been posted and I also give them the tracking number if there is one.
I also ask them to leave me feedback when they have received the item and that way, I know they are happy and I can then leave them feedback.
In days gone by things were good but nowadays, quite often I don't even get a reply from the message and a fair few haven't left feedback.
Even when I know they have received the item and I have sent them another message requesting feedback, some of them don't bother.
Thankfully the last couple of items I have sold where paypal have withheld the money, both parties left feedback on the day that they received the items.
Yet on TP classifieds, I've never had a problem with feedback from someone I have either sold to or bought from.
I really do loath selling on ebay but like we all know, some items won't sell on the classifieds so ebay is the best solution.

In some ways the Internet reminds me of CB radio.
When CB radio was illegal and on the AM band, there was a good sense of community.
When the government legalised it and introduced FM, the wavebands became full of utter muppets.
When broadband became cheap, the people who previously only used the internet for mainly email and a bit of browsing started to use the net a lot more and the level of ignorance and stupidity rose tenfold.
I know some of you have not been using the Internet since the mid 90's and I am not having a dig at you so please don't take this personally.
In fact, a lot of people I have met via TP have only been using the net for a few years and are all decent, clued up people.

Perhaps I am just a grumpy old git

/rant mode off.

 

[Simmotino]

I also ask them to leave me feedback when they have received the item and that way, I know they are happy and I can then leave them feedback.

Not being funny, but that's not how feedback is supposed to work and, as such, you are part of the problem you appear to loathe.

 

[Flash In The Pan]

Iirc its an offence to solicit feedback on Ebay

 

[puddleduck]

A lot of Ebay sellers are crap - no comms, items get posted out when they fancy, and as they don't let you know, you end up making special trips to the post office for unexpected items.

When I sell on Ebay, I always leave feedback first for buyers, like I do here. If a seller doesn't leave me feedback for my prompt payment, or doesn't leave any comms I'm starting not to bother leaving any, because as I buyer I can do very little more than pay promptly and Buyer Feedback is meaningless anyway, as you can only be a 100% Buyer.

A lot of people don't leave feedback which is not good due to the 21 day payment hold, although that doesn't affect me.

 

[KIPAX]

A seller should give feedback as soon as he has been paid.. Not dependant on the buyers feedback. thats blackmail and I agree your part of the problem

 

[hashcake]

Not being funny, but that's not how feedback is supposed to work and, as such, you are part of the problem you appear to loathe.

I failed to mention that initially I did leave feedback straight away and and it in a fair few cases, I didn't received any.
Hence I started to explain the lack of feedback to buyers and explained to them that I would leaved them feedback as soon as they did the same for me.
A few said they understood this and were happy others never replied saying they didn't like this idea.

 

[Simmotino]

I failed to mention that initially I did leave feedback straight away and and it in a fair few cases, I didn't received any.
Hence I started to explain the lack of feedback to buyers and explained to them that I would leaved them feedback as soon as they did the same for me.
A few said they understood this and were happy others never replied saying they didn't like this idea.

Sorry, but that is irrelevant. As a seller, you are leaving feedback based purely on the buyer's actions as a buyer, not on how good his or her feedback was for you!

Feedback as a seller should be left before the item is even posted IMO.

 

[hashcake]

A seller should give feedback as soon as he has been paid.. Not dependant on the buyers feedback. thats blackmail and I agree your part of the problem

It's not blackmail when you are fed up with leaving feedbaclk and don't get any in return.

 

[hashcake]

Sorry, but that is irrelevant. As a seller, you are leaving feedback based purely on the buyer's actions as a buyer, not on how good his or her feedback was for you!

Feedback as a seller should be left before the item is even posted IMO.

As I have already said, I used to leave feedback as soon as I received the payment and I did this for years without problem.
However, the last twelve months or so I stopped initially leaving feedback because more and more people were not leaving me feedback when I had left it for them.
I've not had anyone on ebay say that they didn't agree with my method.
It's just go to the point that if I don't receive feedback there is not point me leaving it.
I've left feedback for everyone I have bought / sold from who has always left me feedback.

 

[Simmotino]

As I have already said, I used to leave feedback as soon as I received the payment and I did this for years without problem.
However, the last twelve months or so I stopped initially leaving feedback because more and more people were not leaving me feedback when I had left it for them.
I've not had anyone on ebay say that they didn't agree with my method.
It's just go to the point that if I don't receive feedback there is not point me leaving it.
I've left feedback for everyone I have bought / sold from who has always left me feedback.

I'm not being funny here, but you don't get it, do you? :bang:

You are ranting that 'oxygen thieves' on fleabay aren't leaving feedback, and then go on to admit that you don't leave feedback when you should, thus placing yourself firmly in the same category of those who you are ranting about in the first place!

It doesn't matter whether they have left you feedback or not. If you are the seller, you rate them as a buyer. That's how it works.

 

[puddleduck]

If you are the seller, you rate them as a buyer. That's how it works.

Although buyer feedback is meaningless as you can only be a 100% buyer. You can't leave negative for buyers or put in negative comments as a positive.

Only seller feedback is important now.

 

[hashcake]

I'm not being funny here, but you don't get it, do you? :bang:

You are ranting that 'oxygen thieves' on fleabay aren't leaving feedback, and then go on to admit that you don't leave feedback when you should, thus placing yourself firmly in the same category of those who you are ranting about in the first place!

It doesn't matter whether they have left you feedback or not. If you are the seller, you rate them as a buyer. That's how it works.

Of course I get, I think it is you who doesn't. :bang:
Are you telling me that if you left feedback for buyer and you did not received any in return, it would not bother you at all?

 

[KIPAX]

It's not blackmail when you are fed up with leaving feedbaclk and don't get any in return.

My post was made in response to you saying you wait for feedback from them so you can leave feedback..

You changed your story AFTER I posted so its a little unfair to take me to task now.. I could at the time only reply to what you posted.. not what you meant to post

 

[Marcel]

A seller should give feedback as soon as he has been paid..

TBH I partly disagree with that. I think feedback should be a scoring of how the buyer conducted himself throughout the whole transaction. Leaving it so soon ignores any possible problems after payment, such as not being available for delivery perhaps (for a couriered item), maybe damaging items once theyve received them, trying to swap items for similar broken ones and return them as "Delivered faulty". Or maybe even just claiming that things haven't turned up when they have.

 

[Simmotino]

Of course I get, I think it is you who doesn't. :bang:

No, I get it totally

Are you telling me that if you left feedback for buyer after after buyer and you did not received any in return, it would not bother you at all?

I'm not sure I understand this but, but I'm guessing you mean would I leave feedback without it being reciprocated?

Yes, I would. As a seller it is down to me to leave feedback for the buyer as a buyer. End of.

 

[Simmotino]

Although buyer feedback is meaningless as you can only be a 100% buyer. You can't leave negative for buyers or put in negative comments as a positive.

Only seller feedback is important now.

Doesn't make any difference. It should still be left irrespective of whether it is reciprocated or not.

 

[Simmotino]

TBH I partly disagree with that. I think feedback should be a scoring of how the buyer conducted himself throughout the whole transaction. Leaving it so soon ignores any possible problems after payment, such as not being available for delivery perhaps (for a couriered item), maybe damaging items once theyve received them, trying to swap items for similar broken ones and return them as "Delivered faulty". Or maybe even just claiming that things haven't turned up when they have.

Those aren't part of the process as a buyer though. You don't negative someone because the postman had to try three times to get it delivered! That's the postman's problem, not yours.

 

[hashcake]

My post was made in response to you saying you wait for feedback from them so you can leave feedback..

You changed your story AFTER I posted so its a little unfair to take me to task now.. I could at the time only reply to what you posted.. not what you meant to post

You are correct, I did fail to mention it in my first post that I used to give feedback as soon as I received payment, hence I needed to add an update.
I wasn't trying to have a pop at you

 

[puddleduck]

Doesn't make any difference. It should still be left irrespective of whether it is reciprocated or not.

Well I always do leave buyer feedback first - I find a lot of buyers don't leave feedback, I sold a lot of Nintendo stuff on Ebay and I only got about 60% of people leaving feedback even though I always left it first. Its just the way it is.

I personally as a seller leave it first, as all a buyer can do is pay. If they don't pay its best not to leave feedback as leaving feedback for non-payers lets them get past seller blocks.

 

[KIPAX]

TBH I partly disagree with that. I think feedback should be a scoring of how the buyer conducted himself throughout the whole transaction..

Hmm yes.. Now i think about it having read that explanation I would probably agree with you. Good point.. Have a cigar . However my original response as said was to the blackmail mentality of only giving feedback if feedback recieved (since changed by OP) however many many poeple do practice this.

 

[Mikesphotaes]

The bottom line here is all feedback is entirely voluntary.

Morally of course, if you have received your money for an item, you should leave good feedback there and then.

 

[hashcake]

No, I get it totally



I'm not sure I understand this but, but I'm guessing you mean would I leave feedback without it being reciprocated?

Yes, I would. As a seller it is down to me to leave feedback for the buyer as a buyer. End of.

Well that's your choice and we are obviously not going to agree on this subject, I just see feedback as a two way thing.

 

[puddleduck]

... not really relevant on 2nd thoughts

 

[hashcake]

TBH I partly disagree with that. I think feedback should be a scoring of how the buyer conducted himself throughout the whole transaction.

That's another point I was also trying to make but my orignal post was done without thinking it through.
I've read plenty of negative feedback when a buyer has either not been available to receive the item or the delivery company cocked up.
Even retailers have had negative comments on their website for failed deliveries and a fair proportion of the public still blame the supplier.

 

[puddleduck]

or the delivery company cocked up.
Even retailers have had negative comments on their website for failed deliveries and a fair proportion of the public still blame the supplier.

Ebay have suspended the "Dispatch" rating at the moment due to the strikes, as buyers where marking down Sellers during the postal strike.

Now what does "Dispatch" mean? .. it means when its posted... not when its delivered.

So yes.. certainly on Ebay buyers do blame sellers for delivery problems and might click 1 out of 5 without thinking about what they should be marking it Dispatch.. not delivery time.

 

[clicktor]

FEEDBACK IS NOT MANDATORY

This summarizes actually.

 

[crusher]

Perhaps I am just a grumpy old git

Yup

 

[hashcake]

FEEDBACK IS NOT MANDATORY

This summarizes actually.

The point of feedback is to help people build up a good reputation.
It takes next to no time to leave feedback and doing it when you can be bothered is unfair.
It's a shame you edited this post, because it seems like you have a problem because of receiving some unfair feedback.
This shouldn't go against the people you have been 100% happy with.

Ebay do come up with some annoying ideas but if they made feedback mandatory, it would be better for everyone.

 

[hypnotic]

I refuse to leave feedback as a buyer if I am "Blackmailed" into leaving it.

More often than not, my part in the transaction is completed a few days before the sellers and feedback should have been left.

My feedback should be about triple the 300 or so that it is now but I do not care, it does not effect me in any way.

With the amount of people on here saying the same as me, you should now know why you are not getting as much feedback as you want.

 

[clicktor]

The point of feedback is to help people build up a good reputation.
It takes next to no time to leave feedback and doing it when you can be bothered is unfair.
It's a shame you edited this post, because it seems like you have a problem because of receiving some unfair feedback.
This shouldn't go against the people you have been 100% happy with.

Ebay do come up with some annoying ideas but if they made feedback mandatory, it would be better for everyone.

I didn't mean it to come across that way as an isolated incident that got me annoyed. I have had it A LOT on ebay, where people ruin transactions worrying about feedback. Feedback has always been flawed in its implementation on ebay.

 

[raythefab]

For what its worth i always wait for the buyer to tell me he/she are satisfied with the goods before i give feedback, twice i didnt recieve feedback in return

 

[clicktor]

For what its worth i always wait for the buyer to tell me he/she are satisfied with the goods before i give feedback, twice i didnt recieve feedback in return

You have just defined how feedback is not supposed to be used again.

 

[raythefab]

You have just defined how feedback is not supposed to be used again.

Who are you the feedback copper:nuts:
Please leave feedback : When the deal is complete, please leave your thoughts using our feedback system. It is integral to ensuring a happy classifieds community. This is not compulsory, but strongly recommended

 

[puddleduck]

For what its worth i always wait for the buyer to tell me he/she are satisfied with the goods before i give feedback, twice i didnt recieve feedback in return

But why does the buyer not deserve feedback if he is not satisfied?

I have had one recent transaction here where I was not wholly satisfied. I paid immediately. I've not had feedback as there were a couple of small issues I pointed out.

As a buyer I did all I could. I've not pushed the issue or kicked up a stink. No feedback for me - bad buyer, or bad seller?

 

[kelack]

As a buyer, I don't think I've ever received feedback until I've posted mine and I won't post mine until the item arrives.

 

[hashcake]

I refuse to leave feedback as a buyer if I am "Blackmailed" into leaving it

If potential buyers consider it as blackmail even when I state it in my ads, then how come I've never had anyone complain about it or left me negative feedback?

With the amount of people on here saying the same as me, you should now know why you are not getting as much feedback as you want

I really don't see why people would get stroppy when I've explained the reason for my actions due to some previous buyers.
I've bought from people who have adopted the same method and I don't see a problem with it.

You're not bothered about the amount of feedback you receive then as I said in another post, fine but this does not apply to everyone.

 

[hashcake]

I'm begining to wonder why I posted this.
I'm really suprised how many people are against the idea but then this is a debate and we are entitled to our point of view.

 

[raythefab]

But why does the buyer not deserve feedback if he is not satisfied?

I have had one recent transaction here where I was not wholly satisfied. I paid immediately. I've not had feedback as there were a couple of small issues I pointed out.

As a buyer I did all I could. I've not pushed the issue or kicked up a stink. No feedback for me - bad buyer, or bad seller?

No point asking me that i didnt say you shouldnt get feedback my view is simple if its not broken dont mend it

 

[puddleduck]

No point asking me that i didnt say you shouldnt get feedback my view is simple if its not broken dont mend it

Its too simple for me as I don't understand what you are trying to say by "if its not broken dont mend it"?

From what I understand your policy is to only leave feedback for your buyer if your buyer is satisfied and has left if for you? Or they don't get it - correct?

So.. do you assume that if someone hasn't left feedback they are unsatisfied - do you follow it up to ask why not and how you can help address this?

BTW this isn't aimed at you - I just don't think feedback should be used in this way.

 

[hashcake]

Another point I didn't clear in my orginal post was paypal withholding the payment on some items until feeback has been left.
I've read a thread on here and I know a couple of people who have had to wait 21 days before paypal released the money because the buyer did not leave feedback.
Even when the buyer had been contacted days and a couple of weeks after receiving the items, they haven't responded.
So please explain to me why people should be allowed to buy an item that they are happy with and the seller has to wait 21 days for payment?
Would any of you not be bothered to leave feedback asap if it causes a problem with the buyer accessing the funds?