RAF Low Level Scotland

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duggiebee

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Two weeks ago or thereabouts I was driving from Ullapool to Lochcarron in the Highlands. I had just driven through Achnasheen and had turned left onto the A890 from the A832. I could not have gone more than a mile or two before a Tornado jet screamed directly towards me at what seemed like a hundred feet above the ground. My girlfriend in the passenger seat saw it then bank hard right behind us and disappear off. It was a total shock but a fantastic sight. Does anyone know if this is a regular route for low level flights? I will going to that part of the world far more often now and if this was a regular training route I would definitely consider going there to try and get some amazing head on shots. Any info would be appreciated.
 
I used to have relatives living in Achnasheen and although I haven't been up there in 15 years I remember there used to be regular jets flying down the valley, can only imagine it has probably got more activity these days. Sounds like a cool experience none the less.
 
That is exactly the reason I have created the thread. I am interested to know if this route is used anywhere near the same frequency as the Mach Loop for instance.
 
When I was up in Balquhidder, at the end of Loch Voil, Tornados quite often went up the loch in pairs - normally at 100 to 200 feet.
There are quite a few vantage points where you could look down on them, but you would have a very long wait for them.
They go East to West, but hardly ever more than once a day.
 
duggiebee said:
That is exactly the reason I have created the thread. I am interested to know if this route is used anywhere near the same frequency as the Mach Loop for instance.
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I don't think so. Bear in mind that a large part of the north of Scotland is available for low flying so that gives them a lot of different places in which to "play". If you can manage, Lossiemouth is good for military aircraft photography. You can get very near to landing aircraft and the base is fairly active on weekdays.
 
The Shinnel Glen in Dumfriesshire is also used that way
 
Aircraft look an awful lot lower than they actually are. Usually, 500ft is the absolute minimum for military pilots. This can easily look an awful lot lower, particularly if it's heading for you.

As an ex military pilot, i always watch aircraft when it's safe to do so, and consequently, I've seen a few near misses, and one mid air. I think it was 1982, a bright sunny afternoon. I was sitting in my Police car on top of the highest road over the Pennines, Hartside summit, on the A686 near Alston, Cumbria. I saw in the distance, two Jaguars 'dogfighting' on the horizon. I saw one pull up, and do a Chandelle turn, and plunge straight into the other, which was turning to meet it. Big explosion, but only one parachute. The pilot that ejected was fine, the other died. They found debris near Haltwhistle in Northumbria, some 50 miles away!!

Being classed as an expert witness, I spent four weeks in a first class hotel in London, on full expenses, for the board of Enquiry.
 
Really?

That would render at least two settings on the TFRCP redundant then.
 
terrain following radar is only as good as the information entered prior to takeoff. Ever heard of pilot error??

Are you insinuating that I've fabricated this story??
 
I was back at Loch Doon last week hoping to get a sunset shot, when around the corner of the loch came this very low flying plane which almost seemed to be silent. It was very low and close to the water for such a big plane. Well as you do I aimed my camera and shot away as it came towards me. It was a funny little moment as the plane seemed to go higher when he saw me, and only when he went over my head was I aware of an engine sound. A bit of excitement to be honest.
No idea what kind if plane it is but when I get back onto my computer in the morning I will post one of the shots as it would be nice to know what it was. It was camouflaged and green. :)
On iPad right now and please keep in mind I only had my kit lens on when you see the photo.
Cathy


Ok here it is below



plane3.jpg






plane4.jpg
 
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dougdarter said:
terrain following radar is only as good as the information entered prior to takeoff. Ever heard of pilot error??

Are you insinuating that I've fabricated this story??
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Nonsense. Tornado TFR relies on real time returns from various systems.
 
Seajay said:
I was back at Loch Doon last week hoping to get a sunset shot, when around the corner of the loch came this very low flying plane which almost seemed to be silent. It was very low and close to the water for such a big plane. Well as you do I aimed my camera and shot away as it came towards me. It was a funny little moment as the plane seemed to go higher when he saw me, and only when he went over my head was I aware of an engine sound. A bit of excitement to be honest.
No idea what kind if plane it is but when I get back onto my computer in the morning I will post one of the shots as it would be nice to know what it was. It was camouflaged and green. :)
On iPad right now and please keep in mind I only had my kit lens on when you see the photo.
Cathy


Ok here it is below



plane3.jpg







plane4.jpg
Click to expand...

Great opportunistic picture. It's a Lockheed C130 Hercules. Looks to be around 600' high. When I lived in Alston, Cumbria, our house was on one side of a steep valley, and on more than one occasion, a Hercules flew down the valley, below our position!!
 
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Oggy said:
Nonsense. Tornado TFR relies on real time returns from various systems.
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I didn't mention a Tornado, the aircraft involved were Jaguars, and it was nearly 30 years ago when TFR technology was in a completely different state of development. Whether or not TFR was fitted and working, or faulty, I don't know, it happened, I saw it, and testified at the board of enquiry.

I searched and found this: http://www.cwherald.com/a/archive/25-years-eden.358095.html

Why are you trying to pick a fight?? to demonstrate your superior intellect, or knowledge, or just to be rude?? I merely posted a story about my experience, which was true, and in which I thought other members might be interested.
 
dougdarter said:
Great opportunistic picture. It's a Lockheed C130 Hercules. Looks to be around 600' high. When I lived in Alston, Cumbria, our house was on one side of a steep valley, and on more than one occasion, a Hercules flew down the valley, below our position!!
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Thank you very much I appreciate you getting back with this information. :)

I can now tell my friends what kind of plane it was.

On the first photo he was flying it between the trees at the bend you see in the distance and the other was as he took it over my head.
I took quite a few and although not great pics I really enjoyed the moment.
 
Seajay said:
I was back at Loch Doon last week hoping to get a sunset shot, when around the corner of the loch came this very low flying plane which almost seemed to be silent. It was very low and close to the water for such a big plane. Well as you do I aimed my camera and shot away as it came towards me. It was a funny little moment as the plane seemed to go higher when he saw me, and only when he went over my head was I aware of an engine sound. A bit of excitement to be honest.
No idea what kind if plane it is but when I get back onto my computer in the morning I will post one of the shots as it would be nice to know what it was. It was camouflaged and green. :)
On iPad right now and please keep in mind I only had my kit lens on when you see the photo.
Cathy


Ok here it is below



plane3.jpg






plane4.jpg
Click to expand...
Probably one of the 2 I saw in the area last week too. I've seen them a lot lower than that, especially down over the Loch, probably half that height. You get it quite a lot round here, a lot of the take-offs from Prestwick involves low level.
 
Could have been!
It was the silent way it appeared coming round that bend that made it such a surprise.
Cathy
 
dougdarter said:
Great opportunistic picture. It's a Lockheed C130 Hercules. Looks to be around 600' high. When I lived in Alston, Cumbria, our house was on one side of a steep valley, and on more than one occasion, a Hercules flew down the valley, below our position!!
Click to expand...

Think it could be much lower than 600', Douglas. C130 wingspan is 131 feet. If you use that as a scale the water is about two wingspans below.
 
Seajay said:
Could have been!
It was the silent way it appeared coming round that bend that made it such a surprise.
Cathy
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The Hercules is a very quiet aircraft, coming towards you, but at low level, once it's past you, the noise is like thunder, reverberating in your chest, and quite enjoyable. It's an amazing aircraft.

I once sat in the freight compartment of one of these, from Lyneham in Wiltshire, to RAF Bruggen. I was quite deaf for an hour after it landed.
 
arclight said:
Think it could be much lower than 600', Douglas. C130 wingspan is 131 feet. If you use that as a scale the water is about two wingspans below.
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You may be right, but the perspective changes as the aircraft get's close. Those hills in the background, are probably around 1000', and the grass in the foreground about 6".

The second picture is quite a large crop, and it still looks as though the Herc is quite high.
 
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There is quite a lot of activity going on over Leuchars and Tentsmuir. Some huge airplanes and some jets flying around most of the week. They look like they are landing or coming in to land and then pulling up again and flying in circles. Great to watch, especially when they fly over head.
 
LOL! well I am only 5ft and it felt real close to me so much I ducked down when i heard the engine :lol:


This gives a better idea of the height as i am standing at this stage just before he went over my head.
It was fun shame about the photo but truth is i just quickly shifted to the auto sport dial.
I do hope i see this again and I would be better prepared .

plane5.jpg
 
We get stuff coming over Loch Sunart most days.

Mainly Tornados and Hercules plus a few Typhoons.

From a photography point of view, I'm normally on the Loch itself so despite them being much lower than the surrounding hillsides they're always above me.

Looking at some of my pics, a quick Google of the numbers tell be they're from Lossiemouth.
 
dinners said:
We get stuff coming over Loch Sunart most days.

Mainly Tornados and Hercules plus a few Typhoons.

From a photography point of view, I'm normally on the Loch itself so despite them being much lower than the surrounding hillsides they're always above me.

Looking at some of my pics, a quick Google of the numbers tell be they're from Lossiemouth.
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The hercs are not from Lossie, Phil.
 
Sorry, I meant the Tornados

ZG754 130
8088148829_a836631941_c.jpg


8088160647_e5ab79593b_c.jpg


The Hercules tend to be blank...
8088168304_d552e984be_c.jpg


8088166284_6e255e8fe3_c.jpg
 
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dougdarter said:
I didn't mention a Tornado, the aircraft involved were Jaguars, and it was nearly 30 years ago when TFR technology was in a completely different state of development. Whether or not TFR was fitted and working, or faulty, I don't know, it happened, I saw it, and testified at the board of enquiry.

I searched and found this: http://www.cwherald.com/a/archive/25-years-eden.358095.html

Why are you trying to pick a fight?? to demonstrate your superior intellect, or knowledge, or just to be rude?? I merely posted a story about my experience, which was true, and in which I thought other members might be interested.
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Firstly my credentials. I was a simulator engineer for twenty plus years, most of which on Tornado. My specialisation was avionics so I know this system in very great detail.

The OP did specifically mention Tornado and that is what I was referring to.

I was not trying to be rude, simply trying to give the facts correctly. Remember you were a little brusque in your response to me.

If you know where to look (Cad/Bwlch) you will be able to find a Tornado at substantially less than 500ft.
 
Oggy said:
Firstly my credentials. I was a simulator engineer for twenty plus years, most of which on Tornado. My specialisation was avionics so I know this system in very great detail.

The OP did specifically mention Tornado and that is what I was referring to.

I was not trying to be rude, simply trying to give the facts correctly. Remember you were a little brusque in your response to me.

If you know where to look (Cad/Bwlch) you will be able to find a Tornado at substantially less than 500ft.
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I have to apologise. The post, which I thought was intended to cast doubt on my story, was directed at another, which is why I may have sounded somewhat brusque.

I have no experience of advance avionics, indeed, when I was flying rotary wing aircraft for the Army, my navigation instruments consisted of an altimeter, compass, Jeppesen slide rule and a wristwatch, oh, and a 1/5000 OS map.

I have no idea whether or not the TFR was working on the Jaguars, but even if it was, it's use did not prevent the collision. This is the point I was trying to make, and that the system in use, was not state of the art.

Again, I apologise for the confusion, and in no way did I wish to doubt your expertise or credentials.

Having said that, there was many a time, that an REME avionics 'tiffy told me what a bloody awful pilot I was, particularly if they had flown a test flight with me. :)
 
Apology accepted. Takes a big man.:thumbs:
 
dougdarter said:
I once sat in the freight compartment of one of these, from Lyneham in Wiltshire, to RAF Bruggen. I was quite deaf for an hour after it landed.
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You should try 13 hours from Ascension to the Falklands with Air to Air refuelling from a Victor thrown in for good measure.........mind numbing.
 
John1964 said:
You should try 13 hours from Ascension to the Falklands with Air to Air refuelling from a Victor thrown in for good measure.........mind numbing.
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Nooooooooooooooooooooo!
 
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