Quick lesson needed 5DMKII + 580EX

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rogertb

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Hi chaps, only recently acquired a Speedlite and have been asked if I can take some pics at the local British legion, they're holding a charity party, it will be a few 'happy-snaps' of the guests and maybe a group shot of 20 people, I have a cable and thought I'd get the flash off the camera on a 'flash bar' and bounce off the ceiling (about 12' high) and use TTL I have the choice of my 24-105 or a 50mm prime (1.8). For the group shot I thought I'd pop out the wide angle diffuser. I have explained my very inexperienced status to the organiser and they are just happy that someone's willing to spare some time and if I can hand over a cd with a couple of shots on it they'd be overjoyed !

So, at last, to my question, I can practice a bit at home but does the outline above sound about right ?

Any advice very welcome.

Roger

(I'm awaiting delivery of Syl Arena's book which I'm sure will teach me a lot but it probably won't arrive in time).
 
To be quite honest, in those sort of conditions with tall ceilings it might be a good time to give the Canon 5D's low light a run for its money.

Unless you can get it quite far off camera and closer to the group I personally would shoot natural with a high ISO.

but try both, if you don't get on with the speed lite just turn it off.
 
12' ceilings are nothing, double, tripple that are still fine for a 580. I would set a manual exposure that puts you about 1 stop under ambient (you can just use aperture priority if you like and see what shutter speed it is suggesting, then dial down a little), for safety have 1/60s shutter so bring up ISO if needed. Then bounce the flash, ceiling is OK, better still to be behind and from the side. I often have my flas pointing backwards/up/sideways to the right at 45 degress then if I shoot in portrait it is then backwards/up/sideways to the left. This will give less shadows than just off the ceiling. I find that you want to add +2/3 or +1 stop on the flash exposure compensation in a lot of cases, but have a play. Shoot raw and make sure you are getting quite close to the correct exposure all the time.

The good thing about this method is you can keep the flash on camera.
 
Thanks Jamie and Mark, good advice from you both, luckily I have time so I can experiment 'on-the-job' - I'll be able to treat it as a training exercise and try no flash etc. and the suggested variations are useful - why though Mark do you say "for safety have 1/60s shutter " ?

Roger
 
rogertb said:
Hi chaps, only recently acquired a Speedlite and have been asked if I can take some pics at the local British legion, they're holding a charity party, it will be a few 'happy-snaps' of the guests and maybe a group shot of 20 people, I have a cable and thought I'd get the flash off the camera on a 'flash bar' and bounce off the ceiling (about 12' high) and use TTL I have the choice of my 24-105 or a 50mm prime (1.8). For the group shot I thought I'd pop out the wide angle diffuser. I have explained my very inexperienced status to the organiser and they are just happy that someone's willing to spare some time and if I can hand over a cd with a couple of shots on it they'd be overjoyed !

So, at last, to my question, I can practice a bit at home but does the outline above sound about right ?

Any advice very welcome.

Roger

(I'm awaiting delivery of Syl Arena's book which I'm sure will teach me a lot but it probably won't arrive in time).
Click to expand...

No point in taking the gun off-camera when you're bouncing - it's where the light is coming from that matters, ie the ceiling. 12ft is no problem.

Point the gun straight up and pull out the hilight panel and that will add a dash of direct fill-in light to brighten faces and lighten shadows under eyes and chins. Works great :thumbs:

Practise is important. Put the camera on a tripod to keep that constant, then try a few things. With that technique, you have three light sources - ceiling, hilight panel, and ambient. You can tweak the flash ratios by zooming the flash head (more zoom will put extra light to the ceiling, and proportionally less reflected of the panel) and tilting the gun slightly forward also makes the hilight panel stronger.

What you do with the ambient light depends on what's available, eg daylight/window during the day, or artificial light (could be tungsten, or fluorescent). In a smallish room the bounced flash will fill most of it but in a larger venue you'll want to brighten the background. Drop the shutter speed to pull that in, bearing in mind that longer than about 1/60sec runs the risk of movement blur. If people are keeping fairly still you can go a bit longer, but watch out for lively kids.

Final trick is to balance the colour of the flash with the ambient light. If it's tungsten, a yellow celophane wrapper from a box of Quality Street works well. Do a custom white balance, or correct in post.

I would do all this on Av using E-TTL and adjusting exposures and balance with compensation. +/- on the camera adjusts ambient light, and +/- on the flash changes that independently. Or manual, whatever - personal preference.

Flash is very sensitive to distance. Try to keep all important subjects roughly the same distance from the camera.
 
Thanks again to all ... what an excellent resource this site is and Richard you've certainly covered all the basics and given me several other things to think about, I'll probably print this thread out and take it with me ... I'll have plenty of time on the night to try the various options and, hopefully, get some understanding of 'speedlite' use.

(I got the flash as part of the 'deal' with the camera and to make the purchase more reasonable was thinking of selling it but figured it might be fun to try and work out what to do with it, this is an ideal opportunity)!

Cheers chaps - Roger
 
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There's a whole pile of info HERE if you fancy a read.
 
rogertb said:
Thanks again to all ... what an excellent resource this site is and Richard you've certainly covered all the basics and given me several other things to think about, I'll probably print this thread out and take it with me ... I'll have plenty of time on the night to try the various options and, hopefully, get some understanding of 'speedlite' use.

(I got the flash as part of the 'deal' with the camera and to make the purchase more reasonable was thinking of selling it but figured it might be fun to try and work out what to do with it, this is an ideal opportunity)!

Cheers chaps - Roger
Click to expand...

Pleasure Rog :)

580EX is a great gun and you'll surely learn to love it soon*. Flash is a whole new area of creative opportunity, well as being a handy problem solver.

Syl Arena's book you mentioned is excellent. Lots of learning and practical stuff too. Meanwhile, here are three key points to remember.

The larger the light source, the softer the shadows - one of the reasons bouncing works so well as the tiny flash head becomes effectively several feet wide. When using a softbox or umbrella, size is relative to distance so the closer it is, the softer the light.

The inverse square law says that when you double the distance from light source to camera, the light is reduced to one quarter brightness. Basically, flash falls off very rapidly which is why you should try and keep important subjects at the same distance. It also explains part of the reason why bouncing uses so much power.

Angle of incidence equals angle of reflection, ie light bounces off a surface at the same angle it strikes, like a snooker ball off the cushion. Remember than when using a reflector and also when bouncing, though bounced light from a ceiling usually spreads over quite a wide area.

Let us know how you get on :)

*Edit: your 270EXII is also a very handy gun, much more powerful than it reads from the spec. Remember than your 580EX can also act as a remote master to control the 270 off camera. For example, you could put that at the back of a large room, aimed at the ceiling, to fill the background. E-TTL will manage the exposure, and you can control/moderate it from the camera. Maybe one step at a time though ;) Both your flash guns also have a high speed sync mode which is very handy for fill-in outdoors when the shutter speed neeeds to run above x-sync (above 1/200sec on 5D2).
 
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I can heartily recommend Syl's book and if you get into moving the flash around while staying connected to the camera his 10mtr ettl cord is brilliant :)
 
Thanks Brian, read the first chapter last night and am really impressed, well written and 'sensible' ...
 
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