PP woes

Raptor Mike

Raptor Mike

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Name
Mike
Edit My Images
Yes
I am having problems with PP at the moment. I have had comments that I have over done some photos. However I also want to get them to 'pop' and not look flat. I have had really helpful help from Cobra with Lions but I'm still not getting it on other photos. I am using PSE9 and shooting in RAW with my Canon 60D. My LG LED monitor is calibrated with the Spyder 2 express. I am also using a book called The Photoshop Elements 9 Book For Digital Photographers by Scott Kelby & Matt Kloskowski. It's a good book but it can't look at my photos and tell me what's wrong with them. I went on a photography course last year that was rubbish and we spent 2 hours a week moving peoples photos around the table getting them ready for LRPS and listening to the teachers stories about holidays etc. So it's not for lack of trying

So my question is how do I sort this out. I dont want to keep hassling people on here. I wondered if there is an online course or something I could do to help me? Or any other advice would be great.

I have spent a lot on my gear (all the gear and no idea lol) and hours, no days on PS. Photography is a hobby I really enjoy and dont want to give up, but I am having difficulty nailing it and getting those WOW photos.

You can see some of my photos here: www.500px.com/Michael_Parker
and the most recent post here: http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/th...os-for-club-exhibition-please-updated.552790/

Thanks for reading
Mike :)
 
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Mike, you could try taking a look at Lynda.com or kelbyone.com. Both offer video tutorials on a subscription basis.

Another suggestion I'd give you is to download a trial of Lightroom, and see if you find that easier to use.

Finally, do upload a few of your RAW files for other people to have a play with. If you can see what they do to get a photo looking good, it may give you some pointers as to where you are overdoing it.
 
I's second the trial of Lightroom. It's a lot easier to use than PSE I think when it comes to image editing. But then I have been using it for 6 years.

A quick look at some of your images it looks as though some are fine and some are over edited. Very easy to do. A couple show what looks like way to much sharpening and others over saturated, whilst a lot look OK. Lightroom is a non destructive editing app. That means you can go back and forward without degrading the original image. It's only when you output is the changes applied, and then to a separate image not the original.

The only drawback with Lightroom is it is very sophisticated and can take a while to master. There are a lot of video's on the web, particularly from Adobe, explaining the best way to use the app. Lightroom works best with RAW files as there is a lot more data in them than JPEG's

If you want a book on Lightroom I'd opt for Martin Evenings book.
 
melaniejane said:
Mike, you could try taking a look at Lynda.com or kelbyone.com. Both offer video tutorials on a subscription basis.

Another suggestion I'd give you is to download a trial of Lightroom, and see if you find that easier to use.

Finally, do upload a few of your RAW files for other people to have a play with. If you can see what they do to get a photo looking good, it may give you some pointers as to where you are overdoing it.
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Chappers said:
I's second the trial of Lightroom. It's a lot easier to use than PSE I think when it comes to image editing. But then I have been using it for 6 years.

A quick look at some of your images it looks as though some are fine and some are over edited. Very easy to do. A couple show what looks like way to much sharpening and others over saturated, whilst a lot look OK. Lightroom is a non destructive editing app. That means you can go back and forward without degrading the original image. It's only when you output is the changes applied, and then to a separate image not the original.

The only drawback with Lightroom is it is very sophisticated and can take a while to master. There are a lot of video's on the web, particularly from Adobe, explaining the best way to use the app. Lightroom works best with RAW files as there is a lot more data in them than JPEG's

If you want a book on Lightroom I'd opt for Martin Evenings book.
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Thank you both. I'd love Lightroom but it's another £100 to find so have to stick with Elements 9 for now. TBH I dont think it's the softwear thats the problem. It has Adobe RAW with it so using that also. Just about to post those RAWs now on the other thread.

Thanks, Mike
 
Any pros near you that offer Photoshop type workshops?
Can't help thinking that using 'trials' without guidance will just lead to more grief :)
 
Mike
When people comment on your images and say they are over processed ask them what they mean. Simply stating you don't like an image isn't much help to you. So if you get the comment ask for them to clarify why they made it.

Just a tip that I find works, when you think you've made the adjustments you like, go back a week or so later and check that you are happy with the results. Sometimes your own second opinion sees what you may have missed first time round
 
Chappers said:
Mike
When people comment on your images and say they are over processed ask them what they mean. Simply stating you don't like an image isn't much help to you. So if you get the comment ask for them to clarify why they made it.

Just a tip that I find works, when you think you've made the adjustments you like, go back a week or so later and check that you are happy with the results. Sometimes your own second opinion sees what you may have missed first time round
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Sounds like good advice to me (y)
 
Get the Adobe Cloud photography subs which will get you LR and Photoshop for £9 a month so it's not too bad.

Head to Youtube and there is basically a limitless supply of quality videos showing everything from composition (the start of the workflow) to importing and editing images. Just watch and watch, go practice, go back and watch some more, refine, rinse and repeat.

Good channels:

phlearn <--- excellent channel
adorama
b&h
Gavin Hoey
learnmyshot
matt granger
Tony Northrup
Tim Grey <-- highly recommend for PS and LR
 
Sharky said:
Get the Adobe Cloud photography subs which will get you LR and Photoshop for £9 a month so it's not too bad.

Head to Youtube and there is basically a limitless supply of quality videos showing everything from composition (the start of the workflow) to importing and editing images. Just watch and watch, go practice, go back and watch some more, refine, rinse and repeat.

Good channels:

phlearn <--- excellent channel
adorama
b&h
Gavin Hoey
learnmyshot
matt granger
Tony Northrup
Tim Grey <-- highly recommend for PS and LR
Click to expand...

I will take a look at those. Thanks (y)
 
i would look at joining a local camera club lots of people there to help
 
Sharky said:
Get the Adobe Cloud photography subs which will get you LR and Photoshop for £9 a month so it's not too bad.

Head to Youtube and there is basically a limitless supply of quality videos showing everything from composition (the start of the workflow) to importing and editing images. Just watch and watch, go practice, go back and watch some more, refine, rinse and repeat.

Good channels:

phlearn <--- excellent channel
Click to expand...

One of the first things he says is 'If you suck at editing photos, I gonna help you get better' That's for me then lol.

 
Hi Mike, ive had a quick look at your 500px account and other than some over processing (something i do a lot, but i'm getting better) i think your photography isn't that far off.

You didn't mention what lenses you are using, this is much more important than the body and will mean you might struggle to achieve the depth of separation you are seeing elsewhere which is one of the biggest reasons for the pop that you see others photos.

I am now going to be a bit controversial and say that a fair amount of what you are seeing on other peoples photos is partly down to the equipment that is being used, full frame cameras have greater separation than a crop camera (as yours is) and fast lenses also help with depth of field, the lenses you use will have a great effect on the outcome of your photos and before i get flamed for what i have just wrote all of the best gear is useless if you have no idea how to use it (but your images would still be better than using crap gear :troll:).

A large part of the pop that you are after is down to separation of the subject from the backgrounds, this is where depth of field will help you, if you have a 1.8 or 2.8 lens then turn it fully open with the camera set to Aperture mode and try taking a shot with a subject in frame and you will see the subject will pop due to the separation.

But the main thing to watch by far is the light, i noticed that some of your shots are just timed slightly wrong, sunset shots 10mins too late after the sun had actually gone down, shots taken in the middle of the day when the light isn't good for the shot to begin with etc.
Try to watch the light and how it changes throughout the day, hour to hour and think about what type of shot the light at a time of day would suit, look at the shadows that are cast at different times of day.

And there are just some people out there that have mastered all of this, not to mention those sickening people with natural talent that were just good from day 1.

I do hope i am not teaching you to suck eggs here as this is by far the longest post i have ever made on here.
 
Very quick look at yr 500px and only the rainbow shot jumped out me as overprocessed (contrast, saturation?). At your best you have a good eye, but it's erratic. I'd bin most of the animal shots - poor composition generally & the light's boring too.

'Pop', just in processing terms, can be a delicate balancing act between a sense of reality and cheap theatre. I'd say that at this point you don't need to think about buying any more software, but rather keep on with what you've got. It's not about more shopping, it's in the mind. Keep putting in the effort.
 
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Thank you both. I'm using a tamron 17-50 f2.8 non vc, canon 55-250 and a sigma 150-500 that I've had since April.
Thanks for the advice and nice comments about my 500px. And thanks for the long reply basseit (y)
 
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Mike
I struggle with my processing too and try to do as little as possible mainly because I don't really know what I am doing. I use a combination of Aperture and Nik Software which suits me.
My work flow is as follows:
Import RAW to Aperture.
Adjust Highlights and Shadows if needed (Aperture makes this easy to do).
Use Nik Software Define to reduce noise which is done automatically.
Then again Use Nik Software Sharpener Pro for sharpening and I try not to move the sliders too much but I do zoom into image to 100% to see if the image is too pixelated. Once that is done I save the image and look at the image on full screen to check it looks OK (I have a 27" iMac)
I don't spend more than five minutes on any image processing as why take hours going around in circles. I must admit that when I first started I tended to over saturate and sharpen everything.
I would say I agree with Bassit that better equipment can help. I say this because I am lucky enough to own a 1D MK IV and two L Series Lenses and the colours come out great so I don't need to add any saturation or inhance the colour.
I wish I could be of more help but I really only ever do basic processing.

On a slight different tack. It is my understanding that you have to be invited to joint Axminster Photography Group? It doesn't seem to me that the group would be very helpful to you with regard to processing or am I completely wrong?
 
Looking at the thread you've linked to (the one with lots of zoo animals) I'd say they are way overprocessed, as you already know. However, I think the problem is more fundamental. I think you've attempted to rescue some shots that were never going to be good in the first place, the lighting and focus is bad, and I think the only problem with the processing is that you've had to push it really hard to simulate good lighting and focus.
The one of the rhino, for example, is soft and is harshly lit. I'd also guess that you've cropped it severely at some point and then maybe tried to resize it? A recipe for disaster and PP is never going to fix that. Many of the others are the same, but the rhino (and elephant) stand out as particularly bad starting images.
It will be easier for you to learn PP if you have the basics of a good image to start with. Your motorsport images aren't bad at all, and the PP on them might be just a touch harsh but nothing major. But this is because they were pretty good to start with, so you've clearly not felt the need to push the PP so hard.
I think we've all been over zealous with PP at some point on the learning curve, and the fact you've recognised that they are no good means you are halfway to fixing the problem.
Stick at it, but learn to bin fundamentally bad photographs rather than trying to save them with sharpening, clarity, saturation and (shudder) HDR. These are all useful tools, but they need to be used appropriately and on images that are decent to start with.
 
So it seems I've been not paying much attention to rule number one... Get it right in camera. Not trying to make excuses but I always check the screen after taking and they looked OK.

I think with the exception of racing shoots I will start bracketing for now until I'm confident with lighting.

Regarding the Axminster Photography Group send them an email, Addy on the website, telling them about yourself as a photographer. The group has a limit on numbers and I think we are at it at the mo. We have an exhibition at peco soon. I wil put a post about this on the e south west area bit soon.

Many thanks for your helpful input guys,
Mike
 
Hi Mike, that little screen on the back of your camera tells lies, the amount of times i have got excited about what appears to be an excellent photo on the rear screen only to get home and look on my computer to find a photo that looks nothing like it does at 3", but the info that the rear screen can show you is worth looking at, turn blinkies on and look out for over exposure, start to take note of the histogram and eventually you will be able to tell if you have got a good exposure just by looking at the histogram.

But the main thing that will effect your photography is the light and the shadows that the light casts, just think about these two things when taking your shots and i am sure you will start to see an improvement quickly.

As for editing tips, try moving every slider to it maximum and to its lowest (one at a time) to see what effect it will have, to see what it will and can do and what effect it will have on the image on the screen at the time, these will also act differently on different images.

I would advise you to be careful with the shadow, contrast, sharpening, clarity and masking tools as these are the tools that when taken too far will start to mess up your image, with these tools its best to be gentle.

Personally i don't think you need bracketing, you may then just end up with overdone HDR images.

Blinkies, histogram and watch the light and shadows whilst you are out and about and your images will improve quickly.

And my apologies for teaching you to suck eggs in at least some parts of my posts.;)
 
Bassit said:
Hi Mike, that little screen on the back of your camera tells lies, the amount of times i have got excited about what appears to be an excellent photo on the rear screen only to get home and look on my computer to find a photo that looks nothing like it does at 3", but the info that the rear screen can show you is worth looking at, turn blinkies on and look out for over exposure, start to take note of the histogram and eventually you will be able to tell if you have got a good exposure just by looking at the histogram.

But the main thing that will effect your photography is the light and the shadows that the light casts, just think about these two things when taking your shots and i am sure you will start to see an improvement quickly.

As for editing tips, try moving every slider to it maximum and to its lowest (one at a time) to see what effect it will have, to see what it will and can do and what effect it will have on the image on the screen at the time, these will also act differently on different images.

I would advise you to be careful with the shadow, contrast, sharpening, clarity and masking tools as these are the tools that when taken too far will start to mess up your image, with these tools its best to be gentle.

Personally i don't think you need bracketing, you may then just end up with overdone HDR images.

Blinkies, histogram and watch the light and shadows whilst you are out and about and your images will improve quickly.

And my apologies for teaching you to suck eggs in at least some parts of my posts.;)
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Thanks for that advice. I went to the BSB at Thrusxton yesterday and have been thinking a lot about the advice peeps have been giving, I even started checking the histogram and letting some highlights blow to get better quality shadows. As for the photos, well they are up loading now... all 24gig of RAWs :eek: lol. I think some are ok, but as you say 'the screen lies' And yes, I will be careful on photoshop. ;)

Also I'd rather someone tell me something I already know than not tell me so I never know, if that makes sense (y)
 
The 'screen lies' you see are the jpeg produced by the camera using default processing settings as optimised by the maker. With good software and practice you should be able to comfortably exceed the quality of those images, but I wonder if it would be worth you saving in both raw and jpeg, so that you can use the jpeg as a reference when working on the raw?

One of the things that makes many images pop is a difference in contrast and sharpness between the subject and the background. This can be easier to achieve using wide apertures as bassit suggested, but you can also help it along yourself a little by selectively sharpening the subject (us a brush) and leaving the rest of the image. The big no-no is sharpening so hard that the image is no longer smooth or starts to get white lines and hard edges - with the standard Adobe sharpening there is usualy a reduction in detail at the same time if overcooked.

Never be afraid to ignore an image that's not good enough, but also remember that you can come back to them if they had potential but you lacked ideas for processing. However if an image is faulty - blurred, badly composed or badly exposed - salvage work is a waste of time.
 
I've just looked at your images, and I would suggest you're barking up the wrong tree. Why are you assuming that what you need is better processing? I don't see any images that could be described as "wow" no matter how they were processed. Assuming you mean "wow" the way I think you do, then what makes that is a great subject, with great lighting, and and great choice of view piont, composition, lens choice etc... it all has to come together - you can't just go to the zoo, take some snaps and then expect to create a wow image from a snapshot. There's some stuff on there that's really well observed though. The baby giraffe and mother is a great image, but no, it's not "wow" in the sense the Flickr brigade would mean, but it's a more powerful image than a "wow" landscape if you ask me. It says something more. Why do you need "wow" in every image?

A lot of your images are technically quite poor too.. with lots of noise, and softness - often caused by excessive cropping I imagine. No amount of processing can alter that.

Can you post a link to what you consider has this "wow" factor you talk about? That's quite a nebulous term... what's "wow" to me, may be something entirely different to you.

There are some nicely chosen moments in the motor sport images, but technically... some of it is awful.. again, usually over cropped and missed focus... and again, no amount of processing will help this.

The images that have beautiful light, are just lacking in content. A rainbow and great lighting doesn't make a boring scene any less boring, and this is a boring scene. Again... technically, it's really poor... very noisy, very soft. Are you cropping excessively? No processing you can do will alter any of this. A photo of a field is still a photo of a field even if there is a rainbow.

Some shots just are what they are though. That just doesn't need any processing. Is it WOW? Probably not... but I think you're putting too much faith in having eye candy = great photography. It doesn't.

The biggest issues you have are photographic in nature, and nothing to do with processing. It's very common these days to assume that the answers lie in processing. They invariably do not. A great photograph, while often enhanced with careful and tasteful processing, will still be a great photo with no processing at all.

Why everyone's suggesting this software or that I've no idea. While your processing is variable, and often overdone, processing is not your main concern in my opinion. Great photographers have been taking great images straight onto Kodachrome for decades before computers have anything to do with photography.
 
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Pookeyhead said:
I've just looked at your images, and I would suggest you're barking up the wrong tree. Why are you assuming that what you need is better processing? I don't see any images that could be described as "wow" no matter how they were processed. Assuming you mean "wow" the way I think you do, then what makes that is a great subject, with great lighting, and and great choice of view piont, composition, lens choice etc... it all has to come together - you can't just go to the zoo, take some snaps and then expect to create a wow image from a snapshot. There's some stuff on there that's really well observed though. The baby giraffe and mother is a great image, but no, it's not "wow" in the sense the Flickr brigade would mean, but it's a more powerful image than a "wow" landscape if you ask me. It says something more. Why do you need "wow" in every image?

A lot of your images are technically quite poor too.. with lots of noise, and softness - often caused by excessive cropping I imagine. No amount of processing can alter that.

Can you post a link to what you consider has this "wow" factor you talk about? That's quite a nebulous term... what's "wow" to me, may be something entirely different to you.

There are some nicely chosen moments in the motor sport images, but technically... some of it is awful.. again, usually over cropped and missed focus... and again, no amount of processing will help this.

The images that have beautiful light, are just lacking in content. A rainbow and great lighting doesn't make a boring scene any less boring, and this is a boring scene. Again... technically, it's really poor... very noisy, very soft. Are you cropping excessively? No processing you can do will alter any of this. A photo of a field is still a photo of a field even if there is a rainbow.

Some shots just are what they are though. That just doesn't need any processing. Is it WOW? Probably not... but I think you're putting too much faith in having eye candy = great photography. It doesn't.

The biggest issues you have are photographic in nature, and nothing to do with processing. It's very common these days to assume that the answers lie in processing. They invariably do not. A great photograph, while often enhanced with careful and tasteful processing, will still be a great photo with no processing at all.

Why everyone's suggesting this software or that I've no idea. While your processing is variable, and often overdone, processing is not your main concern in my opinion. Great photographers have been taking great images straight onto Kodachrome for decades before computers have anything to do with photography.
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Thanks for all that David, I think lol. I am having trouble with getting the wow factor. I see what I think is a really nice scean for example and take it. But none of my phots give me the wow impact as some do on here. I can't put my finger on what I'm not getting quite right. I need to practice more... a lot more. I have good enough kit now so just need to practice with it.

However, although my photos aren't great, nor my pp, its not a hobby I want to give up just because I can't do it. Comments like I've had although a little disheartening, just make me want to try harder. And as I've said before how do you know you're not getting it right unless someone tells you.

Oh and sorry for the late reply. Been camping with the family since Tuesday.
 
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Can you link to something that you aspire to creating, so we can get an idea of what you mean by "wow" etc?
 
I've had a browse through your album and I would say they aren't all that bad! Good "honest" shots while not being dull or over the top (I particularly like the steam train one). I think there is such a thing as overanalysing things and thus making it hard to see the trees for the woods as such.
There will always be that desire to push the boundaries when it comes to photography but it is meant to be a fun hobby - or at least I think so. :D

Incidentally, do you shoot mostly in JPEG? Might be worth being a RAW convert as that would give you more processing room - something I've found out for myself very recently.

EDIT: Just seen your mentioning about RAW. :)
 
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Pookeyhead said:
Can you link to something that you aspire to creating, so we can get an idea of what you mean by "wow" etc?
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I will have a look through some later, I'm on my tablet at the moment and pasting images in can be a nightmare

Ian D J said:
I've had a browse through your album and I would say they aren't all that bad! Good "honest" shots while not being dull or over the top (I particularly like the steam train one). I think there is such a thing as overanalysing things and thus making it hard to see the trees for the woods as such.
There will always be that desire to push the boundaries when it comes to photography but it is meant to be a fun hobby - or at least I think so. :D

Incidentally, do you shoot mostly in JPEG? Might be worth being a RAW convert as that would give you more processing room - something I've found out for myself very recently.

EDIT: Just seen your mentioning about RAW. :)
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Thank you .My wife also said 'as long as you're enjoying it'
 
Pookeyhead said:
Can you link to something that you aspire to creating, so we can get an idea of what you mean by "wow" etc?
Click to expand...

Had a quick look and basicly stuff like this:

This from 500px here
http://ppcdn.500px.org/59901132/679c9dcf62d0bfad4046a03dffe7c25e193514b2/4.jpg

and this sort of thing of here
http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/lakeside.548863/#post-6342682

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/loch-awe-yesterday-morning-attempt-at-sunrise.549911/

Bikes like these from TP
http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/bsb-stormy-sizzler-brands-gp.552373/#post-6388449

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/more-brands-gp-bsb.552461/#post-6388426

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/brands-hatch-bsb-gp1-stormy-times.552567/#post-6388411

And zoo shots
Edit: Reposted one of the above links rather than this one http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/more-zoo-nosis-well-it-is-quite-infectious.551797/

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/a-few-from-paignton-zoo.550542/#post-6363521

Thanks
 
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I've just had a flick through those, and I'd say that for most of them it's an excellent lens, combined with spot on exposure and good lighting conditions. There may be small amounts of work in Photoshop, but it's certainly not what's making the photographs.
 
Interesting. I would expect them all to have received significant careful processing in Lightroom, but as Melanie said, they were all basically good to start with and processing would have brought out the best, rather than been a recovery option. The ones that look like they had least processing were Cobra's zoo pix. I'm pretty sure the first landscape image has had significant and careful work to get that intensity of colour without being garish.
 
Just proves that I've been over doing the pp and not getting it right in camera. There is a list of my gear in my SIG in the first post. Its not the best gear ever but its not rubbish either so must be me.
 
You say you are using Photoshop Elements 9 and that may well be the problem I cant remember if it has A Depth of Field facility on it which later versions have from 10 onwards under heading Lens Effect.
 
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Mike, I wouldn't worry too much. As I said, a lot of them would have also have needed great light conditions. No matter how good a photographer you are, if you're shooting outdoors, there's nothing you can do about the light (other than be patient).

As for the equipment, I started off with a Canon 10D - gosh, I don't know how many years back, then bought a Canon 20D. I used to use a Sigma macro lens, not top of the range, but respectable enough. Anyway, when the 5D came out, I bought one with the 24-105 L lens. That lens blew me away! It was the first time I had ever taken a photograph, and seen that 'pop'. Honestly, I could not believe the difference, for the first time ever I felt that I'd taken a photo of professional standards.
 
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Hi Mike,

Lots of good advice above, and you do have equipment that is quite capable of producing stunning photographs.
It takes a while to pull it all together, but photographers don't always get that perfect shot. Read some of the blogs and you will see, some photographers are up at the crack or sit for hours to get that shot that 'pops' because in a lot of cases it's all about location, light and planning. (And a lot of skill and experience).

In the case where you don't have the time or the opportunity to plan ( location, light etc ) then, it's a matter of taking the opportunity to take 'A shot'. The opportunity might suddenly arise and you might not have the luxury of having time to set up the shot or think very much, the opportunity will be there and gone. This is where the Pros shine because there ... Well Pros, switched on, know their cameras back to front etc.

Also consider few people will post their carp photos! So on a shoot where you might take 300 photos, how many make PP? And how many that get through PP get posted.
If you have lovely light, a stunning location, an eye for composition and you know your camera, your on a winner, where not all that fortunate so we have to learn, and I guess we never stop that. I'm still trying maybe I'm too thick to understand I'll never be a Pro but a budding amateur.
The important thing is you enjoy what your doing and the more you shoot the more you learn, because you question yourself why isn't that a good shot, and once you comprehend why you'll do it better next time.

I guess you understand about cropping now on a APS sensor and softness it can cause.

One tip I have, a lot of photographers find when they move to RAW they see their images flat, because obviously there unprocessed. If you want to try a little experiment ( if you think your jpegs pop more) set the camera to save JPEG and RAW. Then when you process try and process to make your raw file look like the JPEG, flick back and forth on the screen and see if your image looks better.

BTW as Melanie says Equipment can make a difference but it shouldn't stop you getting cracking images.
When I move onto good lenses it did make quite a bit of difference to my photography and my bank balance ;).

If you message me might be able to sort you out some books if your interested Mike

Keep on going for it Mike, it will come together.
 
Raptor Mike said:
Had a quick look and basicly stuff like this:

This from 500px here
http://ppcdn.500px.org/59901132/679c9dcf62d0bfad4046a03dffe7c25e193514b2/4.jpg

and this sort of thing of here
http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/lakeside.548863/#post-6342682

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/loch-awe-yesterday-morning-attempt-at-sunrise.549911/

Bikes like these from TP
http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/bsb-stormy-sizzler-brands-gp.552373/#post-6388449

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/more-brands-gp-bsb.552461/#post-6388426

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/brands-hatch-bsb-gp1-stormy-times.552567/#post-6388411

And zoo shots
Edit: Reposted one of the above links rather than this one http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/more-zoo-nosis-well-it-is-quite-infectious.551797/

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/a-few-from-paignton-zoo.550542/#post-6363521

Thanks
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The landscapes all have wonderful light, and great contrast (again a product of the light). The first image also has a great colour palette.

Bikes are a combination of great focus, appropriate depth of field, appropriate focal length use, and perhaps more importantly, a great position on the track, and great timing.

I don;t think the zoo shots in the first link are that impressive actually. Look over sharpened to me. Second link shots again have really nice light, are sharp, and use correct lens choice.


Effectively.. processing isn't really the reason why these images are good... it's good photography. That's not to say they're not well processed, which they are (with the possible exception of the first zoo link, but that may well be over sharpening by whoever is hosting the image), but would still be great shots is not processed at all.
 
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SO I'm over processing photos that aren't much good in the first place as mentioned. The biggest problem I've always had is knowing if a photo that I think is good actually is. That's why I joined a camera club and one of the many reasons for joining TP.

I have to say I'm a little annoyed because I did go on a course and all I learnt about was grey cards, very quickly covered dof shutter speeds and ISO, and a bit about manually bracketing. But most of the time was spend trying to help other people decide on RPS panel and listening about the teachers holidays. It was 10 weeks of 2 hours a week so you would expect my work would be of some sort of quality after that.. Seems it hasn't helped my photography one bit :mad: . I have been considering doing a day with a guy in our area who dose trains and landscapes called Don Bishop, but am a little hesitant after the previous course.

Anyway that said I will endeavor to practice and will take on all the advice you good folks have given.

Thank you soooo much for all the advice, (y)
 
Mike, why don't you see if there are any photographers on here who are local to you who wouldn't mind doing a meet up. Most photographers are happy to share their knowledge, and whilst they wouldn't necessarily be teaching you, you will pick up a lot from watching how other photographers work. It's also a good opportunity to see how your results compare with someone elses, under the same circumstances - which may enable you to work out what you're doing wrong, if anything.
 
melaniejane said:
Mike, why don't you see if there are any photographers on here who are local to you who wouldn't mind doing a meet up. Most photographers are happy to share their knowledge, and whilst they wouldn't necessarily be teaching you, you will pick up a lot from watching how other photographers work. It's also a good opportunity to see how your results compare with someone elses, under the same circumstances - which may enable you to work out what you're doing wrong, if anything.
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Good idea. Someone has already suggested we meet up but we've both been quite busy. Thing is I dont want to burden anyone but if they are happy to have some company then so am I :)
 
Just keep posting images up for crit Mike.

BTW.. where are you?
 
Any Pros running workshops in your area ... Google 'Photography Workshops' Devon - I can see a couple that look to have promising content :)
 
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