Police brutality against photographers, again! And some painting with light.

welly

welly

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Except the photographer was me! And brutality isn't quite true, to be fair. I was served with a section 44 notice tonight while out shooting! They were very good about it and it was just routine.

To be fair, I was shooting out and about near RAF Menworth Hill, which is a US early warning station. We had a good chat, they were very friendly and explained about how section 44 was in force around the base.



So I got my bit of paper, which he recommended I kept and if I was out taking photos in the area in future, it could be handy to show to whichever police officers might approach me for the same reason.

I was out doing some painting with light near the base and was lighting up the barn below:



I was sat behind the camera on a 30 second exposure waving my torch at the barn. I was pretty pleased with the result.
 
Lol, taking photos round RAF Menworth Hill, can't say I'm suprised. As for the barn photo, I quite like it, but for me the barn is just too small in the shot. i'd like to have seen the barn a bit closer and be able to see more detail on it.
 
i like the barn one and agree with Hawker it would have been better closer

just out of curiosity what is a section 44?
 
I'm surprised they didn't point one of those dishes at you and microwave your camera
 
I would just be glad it was the rozzers and not Menwith Hill security ;) Nice shots though :thumbs:
 
Here's a couple of closer up images :)



 
Jimmy_Lemon said:
I would just be glad it was the rozzers and not Menwith Hill security ;) Nice shots though :thumbs:
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These two coppers were armed to the teeth! Ok, perhaps not the teeth. They had guns though. I'm not sure how I feel about our coppers carrying guns about.
 
Like the pics.

Most cops only ever get Tazer authorisation these days not live guns due to past events
 
Much prefer those ones, probably the second one out of the two. Much nicer colours in the sky. Just though it might look good using some funky colour flash gels.
 
Hawker said:
Much prefer those ones, probably the second one out of the two. Much nicer colours in the sky. Just though it might look good using some funky colour flash gels.
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There's an idea. might take some with me next time I go.
 
I prefer the one further away!
Nice shots, nice story.
I've never been stopped with my camera except when I was taking a picture of my mate with a toy gun for a media project haha. That's a story for another day :p
 
welly said:
RAF Menworth Hill, which is a US early warning station.
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:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Look up "Echelon".... I suppose some might call that "early warning", but its definitely not a radar station for detecting incoming missiles...

BTW, the only place you could have tried to have taken photos with a greater chance of arrest in the UK would probably have been Faslane or Aldermaston...
 
Oakey22 said:
whats the big balls for?
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I think they house satelite dishes. They cover them to protect them from the elements & so you can't tell which direction they're pointing.

I like the first barn pic but with maybe a slightly tighter crop keeping both the left and right trees in. Maybe lose the telegraph pole & wires too.
 
how were you painting with light?was it a torch?

be wary of police with guns they are not trained to a high enough standard as many events have shown.certainly not to the standard of safety we had in the army.
friendly fire is as lethal as enemy fire.
 
ditchdigger said:
how were you painting with light?was it a torch?

be wary of police with guns they are not trained to a high enough standard as many events have shown.certainly not to the standard of safety we had in the army.
friendly fire is as lethal as enemy fire.
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Yeah, just stood behind the camera waving the torch back and forth over the building for about 30 seconds. I saw Garry Edwards images that he'd done with the models and thought I'd try a variation on the theme. I used a fairly hefty Maglite torch as the building was of a reasonable size.
 
ditchdigger said:
how were you painting with light?was it a torch?

be wary of police with guns they are not trained to a high enough standard as many events have shown.certainly not to the standard of safety we had in the army.
friendly fire is as lethal as enemy fire.
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totally off topic but what a load of b****cks. A spotty 18yr old with a SA80 or allegedly more mature cop with a gun. I have done both and yes I trained every day with my weapon oo-er missus:lol: in the army and stay away from guns in the thin blue line, but as an ex squaddie you should know better. Too many soldiers get hurt by friendly fire and ND's happen every day. ND's don't happen in the police but accidents do, if you're a brazillian illegal immigrent wrongly identified by an ARMY surveillance officer as a suicide bomber ! But don't forget that those cops(if they were - hint hint) thought they were going to take out a suicide bomber and went to do it, fully expecting to end vapourised. The last blatant incompetence of a police shooting was years ago when some innocent guy in a mini got filled full of holes, in London and mercifully survived. That was inexcuseable. Modern day - Press portray it all bad and victims families get all the press time- oh my brother was a good man, he was a super father, he only had a piece of wood in a plastic bag. OK, but he may(read was) also have been a very violent man with a track record of weapons offences and firearms offences and stupidly when asked to drop the bag, after telling people in a pub it was a gun - police get called ! - he holds it as if a shot gun and points it at armed police after being challenged and ends up dead.:cuckoo:

Was he unarmed yes, avoidable, yes, but at that time in those circumstances it was inevitable, as was stockwell. You sit in your (when I was in the army bubble) and dream on!

Do we want to talk abouit squaddies drowning prisoners in Iraq or beating up looters - no - why because they are doing one hell of a job and **** happens. I can think of 5 RMP's who were left to die by the army in BASRA, A marine who was forgotten about and left to die but the story of attaching themselves to helicopters to get him back made the press. Standards of safety, whatever. Stuff happens, been there got the t shirt etc etc but compare standrds, nobody is perfect and 99% are trying to do their job for the right reasons, whether a suaddie or cop.
 
Richie-ST said:
i like the barn one and agree with Hawker it would have been better closer

just out of curiosity what is a section 44?
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I think its that bit of legislation that states the police have the rights to stop and search anyone they feel like. I think its related to terrorism
 
hiddybiddy said:
totally off topic but what a load of b****cks. A spotty 18yr old with a SA80 or allegedly more mature cop with a gun. I have done both and yes I trained every day with my weapon oo-er missus:lol: in the army and stay away from guns in the thin blue line, but as an ex squaddie you should know better. Too many soldiers get hurt by friendly fire and ND's happen every day. ND's don't happen in the police but accidents do, if you're a brazillian illegal immigrent wrongly identified by an ARMY surveillance officer as a suicide bomber ! But don't forget that those cops(if they were - hint hint) thought they were going to take out a suicide bomber and went to do it, fully expecting to end vapourised. The last blatant incompetence of a police shooting was years ago when some innocent guy in a mini got filled full of holes, in London and mercifully survived. That was inexcuseable. Modern day - Press portray it all bad and victims families get all the press time- oh my brother was a good man, he was a super father, he only had a piece of wood in a plastic bag. OK, but he may(read was) also have been a very violent man with a track record of weapons offences and firearms offences and stupidly when asked to drop the bag, after telling people in a pub it was a gun - police get called ! - he holds it as if a shot gun and points it at armed police after being challenged and ends up dead.:cuckoo:

Was he unarmed yes, avoidable, yes, but at that time in those circumstances it was inevitable, as was stockwell. You sit in your (when I was in the army bubble) and dream on!

Do we want to talk abouit squaddies drowning prisoners in Iraq or beating up looters - no - why because they are doing one hell of a job and **** happens. I can think of 5 RMP's who were left to die by the army in BASRA, A marine who was forgotten about and left to die but the story of attaching themselves to helicopters to get him back made the press. Standards of safety, whatever. Stuff happens, been there got the t shirt etc etc but compare standrds, nobody is perfect and 99% are trying to do their job for the right reasons, whether a suaddie or cop.
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You've saved me the time to type something very similar. :thumbs:

The section I have highlighted in bold above are exactly my views, police firearms training doesn't (or it certainly didn't in my day) include shots to the head, particularly at point blank and certainly not several times. I have my own theories on this but I would wager money that they were not police officers.
 
Hi Welly,

I think you mean RAF Menwith Hill.

What goes on there is a bit more sinister than early warning.

Google it and also Project Echelon.

You know all the fuss about laws to permit eavesdropping on email and phones.
It's already happening. Has been for years.

I have photographed at mil bases for years with never a bit of bother (some have a policy of asking spotters etc to keep an eye open for suspicious people), but I would not hang about that place. Might end up in Guantanamo Bay.
 
Oakey22 said:
never knew they had a US early warning base over here, whats the big balls for?
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The early warning place is Fylingdales - Sorry if that is spelled incorrectly - Off the Whitby road. They have funny pyramid thingies. Still chase you off with guns though.
 
Just reading some of the websites about that place and quite a few say it's run by the NSA. Not surprising the Police are a little bit concerned when people take photos of the site.
 
Sounds like you had a run in with the MOD Police, rather than the local North Yorks Constabulary. MOD police are almost always armed.
 
Richie-ST said:
i like the barn one and agree with Hawker it would have been better closer

just out of curiosity what is a section 44?
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Section 44 basically means that the Police can stop and search you without suspicion that you are involved in criminal activity, or anything else dubious. It's applied to certain locations, for a limited time and has to have the Home Secretary's approval before it comes into force for a given location. It's anti-terrorism legislation basically, so I'm not surprised it's in use there.
 
Police powers are explained here:-

http://www.npia.police.uk/en/docs/Stop_and_Search_in_Relation_to_Terrorism_-_2008.pdf

I am not wading through that lot, but Feb Digital Camera mag has a good article on it.
Terr Act 2000 does not prohibit people taking pics where Section 44 is in place. Officers should not prevent people taking pics unless they are in an area where other legislation prohibits photography.

Pol can stop and search if they have reason to suspect someone is involved in terr activites.

Pol don't have powers to make you delete images etc.

New guidelines are being issued to pol because there has been confusion by the men on the ground as to what is permitted and what is not.

Sign of the times, I am afraid.
 
arclight said:
Pol don't have powers to make you delete images etc.
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To alter an old joke slightly...

"What do you do when you see a copper with a gun?"

"Whatever he tells you to do."

So, to avoid any unnecessary unpleasantness, delete the images - hell, format the card! Don't use that card again until you've run SanDisk's RescuePro on it and got your images back.
 
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