Photos in a swimming pool?

[Paul_W]

Have a look here - well worth the read

I like this bit-- Freedom to photograph/film

Members of the public and the media do not need a permit to film or photograph in public places and police have no power to stop them filming or photographing incidents or police personnel

http://www.met.police.uk/about/photography.htm


Les

but a swimming pool is not a public place

 

[jonoooo125]

I gave them a ring, they said you can apply for a permit whilst you're there, you fill it in on your way in. Parents and other people can argue it and I might be asked to stop but the person I spoke to said if its not busy I shouldn't have a problem, so Sunday at 5 hopefully I'll be able to take some pictures as they're usually not busy.

I don't understand why it's such a problem, if someone was taking pictures of their child whilst I was there, I would ask if they wanted to be in it and take one of them on their camera? Or at least be out of the way if I didn't want my picture taken, the camera is quite clearly pointed in a single direction you can move out of the way of, unless they've got a fisheye or something. My girlfriend was the person who brought up there might even be a problem as I'd never even thought twice about it.

Oh well, hopefully if I leave my trench coat at home and shave before we all go, I shouldn't have too much of a problem.

Any advice for taking pictures whilst I'm there? If I get that far...

 

[Brendan Mulachy]

the baths by ours has huge windows, i could sit outside in the car and take shots from there

i remember trying to take a pic of my eldest girl on her first visit to the bath's (blackpools sandpiper), must be 18 years ago, before the days when everybody with a camera must be a pervert, the lifeguards didnt mind a bit in them days but did tell us off for putting a t-shirt on her because she was cold when she was running round in the very shallow water

in all honesty i can understand why this sad state of affairs has happened, we hear of p****'s caught who have thousands of indecent pictures etc etc, somebody must be taking the shots, i wonder what percentage of these pictures are taken in public places surreptitiously, myself i can imagine it being a very very small percentage, well at least id hope it was.

i think its terrible,my mums got loads of pictures of me and my brothers with our mates, out playing, riding bikes, footy, etc etc you know normal everyday stuff that we did back in the 70,s and 80's and she loves the memories of them that they bring back, especially since my dad died, we get them out all the time and laugh at them and talk about the great times we used to have as kids...but.....i wont have that with my kids, never in a million years would i take pics of my kids and their mates, id even feel a bit funny asking their respective parents.

sad times really thinking about it

 

[jon ryan]

I gave them a ring, they said you can apply for a permit whilst you're there, you fill it in on your way in. Parents and other people can argue it and I might be asked to stop but the person I spoke to said if its not busy I shouldn't have a problem, so Sunday at 5 hopefully I'll be able to take some pictures as they're usually not busy.

I don't understand why it's such a problem, if someone was taking pictures of their child whilst I was there, I would ask if they wanted to be in it and take one of them on their camera? Or at least be out of the way if I didn't want my picture taken, the camera is quite clearly pointed in a single direction you can move out of the way of, unless they've got a fisheye or something. My girlfriend was the person who brought up there might even be a problem as I'd never even thought twice about it.

Oh well, hopefully if I leave my trench coat at home and shave before we all go, I shouldn't have too much of a problem.

Any advice for taking pictures whilst I'm there? If I get that far...

see post #7

 

[jonoooo125]

Bear in mind that if they do let you shoot, it'll be a good few minutes before the condensation on your lens clears. Let this happen naturally. If you wipe it, it'll just re-form until the glass warms up to the temperature in the building. And don't change lenses in there unless you want condensation on your mirror and sensor! A polo filter is a good idea to kill the glare from the water.

Thank you

 

[jon ryan]

Thank you

Good luck - and watch out for splashes!

 

[ernesto]

I don't understand why it's such a problem,

You need to go and talk to a typical paranoid Daily Mail reader that thinks every other person is a P**** yet doesn't bother looking into the facts and discover that the most risk is within their own family (not their family though, surely!)
So the biggest risk of the photos being used inappropriately are from a relative at the pool snapping away happily...

 

[LongLensPhotography]

Probably going to Greece or France for that would be less hassle these days. Shame

 

[welshwizard645]

but a swimming pool is not a public place

on what basis? It's owned by the local council, we forget the councils and people who work for them are owned and employed by the community. They should therefore be public amenities.

The way the world is going you'd think We were owned by the councils:bang:

Shopping centres are privately owned - most if not all of them.

 

[Steve Smith]

The way the world is going you'd think We were owned by the councils.

My father's usual comment on councillors, politicians and police officers:

"They are our servants, not our masters".

Steve.

 

[Nod]

they can't format your card, they are not allowed to, so you wouldn't need to do this in the first place

They can - very easily. However, they may not. Even if they do, unless the card is overwritten, many data recovery programmes will recover photos from even formatted cards.

 

[jon ryan]

They can - very easily. However, they may not. Even if they do, unless the card is overwritten, many data recovery programmes will recover photos from even formatted cards.

They have no right whatsoever to format your card! Never, ever agree to do this, even
if the police demand it. Only a court is allowed to do this.

 

[Nod]

Indeed Jon. It's a semantic point - can means they are able to while may means they're allowed to!

 

[joescrivens]

Indeed Jon. It's a semantic point - can means they are able to while may means they're allowed to!

No they can't. To do so would mean taking the camera off you first. How do you propose they would do that?

 

[Thmaga]

I've had a shopping centre security guard delete photographs off my camera in the past, after spending over half an hour arguing with him, I just let him delete them and recovered the files when I got home...I would have stood my ground but I didn't have all day to be arguing. Most security staff have poor knowledge of both the law and technology.. so he went away thinking he did a great job in preventing terrorism.

 

[joescrivens]

why didnt you just walk away from him instead?

 

[posiview]

why didnt you just walk away from him instead?

30 minutes arguing. After 3 minutes you know you're not going to get enywhere. I agree, I'd have just waked away. What would/could he have done?

Cheers.

 

[Steve Smith]

why didnt you just walk away from him instead?

Exactly what I would have done.

You can do the same with a police officer who is questioning you too. Ask "are you planning to detain me?" and if the answer is "no" you can walk away.


Steve,

 

[Thmaga]

There were two security guards there and one was talking over his radio using phrases such as " he's not cooperating, shall I detain him?" At that point I didn't think walking away would have been a good idea.

 

[Phall82]

I think there is too much paranoia. Anyone can take photographs of anyone else out in a public place. A swimming pool isn't really any different. People don't generally swim or run around naked in swimming pools.

Steve.

I agree. If the swimming pool is a place of such sexual content as they appear to suggest with their rules, why do you not need a CRB check to even go swimming yourself? It's a joke!

I've got 2 little kids (6 month and 18 month) and if somebody was taking a family swimming photo and my kids were in the background I wouldn't care at all, if there was a guy with a long trench coat on his own smoking a cigar taking photos, I may have a different opinion

 

[Steve Smith]

There were two security guards there and one was talking over his radio using phrases such as " he's not cooperating, shall I detain him?" At that point I didn't think walking away would have been a good idea.

That is exactly the point at which you walk away as he has no power to detain you.


Steve.

 

[Steve Smith]

if there was a guy with a long trench coat on his own smoking a cigar taking photos, I may have a different opinion

I think I would feel the same way as you in that scenario... However, the reality is that even if someone takes a photograph with one of my children as the main subject rather than incidental, that person having that photograph does no harm to my child.


Steve.

 

[Phall82]

I think I would feel the same way as you in that scenario... However, the reality is that even if someone takes a photograph with one of my children as the main subject rather than incidental, that person having that photograph does no harm to my child.

Steve.

Agreed. It's a strange world we live in where the innocent are made to feel guilty over everyday innocent things and the guilty just get away with it

 

[joescrivens]

That is exactly the point at which you walk away as he has no power to detain you.


Steve.

A security guard has the right to detain you just like a member of the public does if they have reasonable cause that you have commited a crime. They can detain you for a reasonable amour of time which usually means until the police have arrived.

24A Arrest without warrant: other persons(1)A person other than a constable may arrest without a warrant—

(a)anyone who is in the act of committing an indictable offence;
(b)anyone whom he has reasonable grounds for suspecting to be committing an indictable offence.

(2)Where an indictable offence has been committed, a person other than a constable may arrest without a warrant—

(a)anyone who is guilty of the offence;
(b)anyone whom he has reasonable grounds for suspecting to be guilty of it.

(3)But the power of summary arrest conferred by subsection (1) or (2) is exercisable only if—

(a)the person making the arrest has reasonable grounds for believing that for any of the reasons mentioned in subsection (4) it is necessary to arrest the person in question; and
(b)it appears to the person making the arrest that it is not reasonably practicable for a constable to make it instead.

(4)The reasons are to prevent the person in question—

(a)causing physical injury to himself or any other person;
(b)suffering physical injury;
©causing loss of or damage to property; or
(d)making off before a constable can assume responsibility for him.

 

[Paul_W]

on what basis? It's owned by the local council, we forget the councils and people who work for them are owned and employed by the community. They should therefore be public amenities.

The way the world is going you'd think We were owned by the councils:bang:

Shopping centres are privately owned - most if not all of them.

you find me a swimming pool that i owned and run by the council.

You are paying a fee to go in and use the facilities, therefore in my understanding it is not a public place

 

[jonbeeza]

There were two security guards there and one was talking over his radio using phrases such as " he's not cooperating, shall I detain him?" At that point I didn't think walking away would have been a good idea.

Last time I had a bit of a do with a security guard I simply kept walking, I did not even speak to them I simply ignored them. They soon got fed up and left me walking on my merry way. I always thought a security guard does not have the power to detain you

 

[Brian_of_Bozeat]

Regarding the swimming pool, I used to do a lot of club swimming and we had a nightmare trying to convince them to let us film adult learners as part of a training session. (got there in the end)

I don't think It's the rules that are at fault, I think it's the way they are administered, people seem to love to say no, it must be the power trip!

 

[Phil V]

Regarding the swimming pool, I used to do a lot of club swimming and we had a nightmare trying to convince them to let us film adult learners as part of a training session. (got there in the end)

I don't think It's the rules that are at fault, I think it's the way they are administered, people seem to love to say no, it must be the power trip!

It's so easy to justify a no and stay safe, whereas to say yes, actually requires a consideration of the risks. And if you give permission to someone and it was a mistake, you share liability.

You can say No to people all your life and never risk being responsible for something going wrong. Unfortunately, risk assessment means risk avoidance to anyone without the intelligence to do it.

 

[itsdavedotnet]

Out of normal hours is pretty much all you'll likely get, so expect a super early morning start!

Need to take extra amounts of care about kit etc - you're gonna need a LOT of sandbags for all your light stands etc. Have at least one assistant too.

 

[jonneymendoza]

I've not shot in a pool before but I would not be surprised if they gave you a permit but there would have to be a pool attendant escorting you.....

Absolute madness I know but it's the way of our crazy country.

blame the pedophiles. if they did not exist then this rule would never exist

 

[Phil V]

blame the pedophiles. if they did not exist then this rule would never exist

I'm not sure that the logic follows through, there have always been abusive people but we haven't always had the bureaucracy to deal with everyday life in the mistaken belief it offers 'protection'.

It's difficult to blame a paedophile when rules like this aren't inconveniencing them in any way, but they are inconveniencing the rest of society.

 

[gnirtS]

The entire county borough policy here is no cameras are allowed in the building full stop without permission of the manager.

Obviously its routinely ignored because everyone has a camera on their phones but that is the policy.

No photographs are allowed in or from anywhere without permission.

We had an issue because we rent the pool for a private session as a diving club (no public allowed, only club members and so on). We still aren't allowed cameras even in that.
It means we cant test underwater camera equipment for leaks, can't run tuition or anything else.

Quite a few councils i know have this policy for their leisure centres.

 

[joescrivens]

Have you tried asking for permission?

 

[Steve Smith]

It's difficult to blame a paedophile when rules like this aren't inconveniencing them in any way, but they are inconveniencing the rest of society.

And somehow the general public now believes that almost everyone else is a paedophile* - especially if they have a camera... (*or a terrorist!).

The reality is that most child abuse is carried out by people known to the family rather than strangers.


Steve.

 

[Phil V]

And somehow the general public now believes that almost everyone else is a paedophile* - especially if they have a camera... (*or a terrorist!).

The reality is that most child abuse is carried out by people known to the family rather than strangers.


Steve.

You're only a paedophile if you're not 'CRB checked' of course

 

[Steve Smith]

You're only a paedophile if you're not 'CRB checked' of course

Self checked!


Steve.

 

[Flightphoto]

The thing is, the CRB is a cause for concern in itself, it only looks back on your previous history - this is to say basically that the Paedophile has not yet been caught!
I just think no one is safe these days, it only takes me 2 minutes walking down a high street with my 70-200 L and the looks I get are soo worrying that I ask the wife if she can put the camera in her handbag (she has one of those Zatchel things - Mary Poppins springs to mind!)
I don't have kids as yet but would love the idea of a few underwater shots but at this rate, I think I may just go to the parents and use their swimming pool (although it's not heated!)
I find society is disgraceful these days, what ever happened to freedom of speech? It only takes you to make a comment that you and others think is fair but someone will find a negativity towards that and this can make you lose your job (as you see on the news often)
To the OP, I would try and see how you get on with regards to permission etc, if you have no luck, just move on, it's seriously not worth a negative outcome as there are certain people out there who will bring up the Paedophile scenario, just look at the stereotypes we see in the media, we're led to assume that a Paedophile is a guy with long hair wearing a wax jacket yet it appears that there's no cap on the age, just look at that evil 18 years old that was caught last year, it seems that baby sitters are the ones that need to be regulated more imho!

 

[Phil V]

The thing is, the CRB is a cause for concern in itself, it only looks back on your previous history - this is to say basically that the Paedophile has not yet been caught!

I'd have thought the Laugh out loud smileys were obvious enough

 

[Flightphoto]

They were, I just have a habit of rambling on about something

 

[Jamey121]

Not really. They have rules and it's up to you to find out what they are and follow them. Most places are flexible if approached correctly.

Rubbish, they can stick their rules. It's not up to them to decide how I act, as long as it's legal which it is.

Is there only one pool around your area?? if not phone around and see what they say.
If they say no then it means no, and no point trying to sneak it in and take a few before they say no again as it could turn ugly specially if there is another mother or father around and does not like you taking pics.

Well if another parent doesn't like it, then the other parent can stick it! I will take photos of my kid's whenever I damn well like and no one is going to stop me. This wouldn't have happened back in the 90's and you have the mainstream gutter press and crap journalism for creating hysteria resulting in this pathetic and sad state of affairs.

I took my daughter swimming for the first time when she turned 4 months, she is now 6 months old and I take her swimming at the local pool and my gym quite regular.

I queried taking pictures but was told that this is forbidden due to other users of the gym and kids present.

This seems to be the case with most pools, it's a shame really as I would have loved to have caught the experience, even on my phone.

Don't query it, just do it! If they say anything and make a fuss tell them to call the police. There's absolutley nothing they can do about it providing you're not breaking the law.

From my experience no chance.

I tried to film my daughter in an empty pool when she was around 4 months old. Was told not allowed. I said there's nobody else here. He said rules is rules.

I was a bit miffed and I did consider hiring the pool but never got around to it. The irony is that with the number of mobile devices around these days you could easily do it surreptitiously.

Cheers.

You should have told him to get stuffed and stick his rules. What is it about this country's new obsession with paedophilia? There are the same amount of paedophiles today that there were in the 50s. Only today people are paranoid about it thanks to the press having ruined our wonderful country - and a lot of people have allowed them to do it!!!

I was thinking along the same lines, but rules are rules.

Do you realize that the people who make these rules are probably paedophiles? It's always the ones that make these kind of rules that are shifty and want to work in places where they can see naked people. My friend worked at a swimming pool and two of the lifeguards were paedophiles. Think about that next time you're asked to adhere to their 'rules'.

Exactly. Remove the paranoia and it's just nonsense.

My daughter could go swimming in the pool or wear the same swimming costume at the beach which is a public place with no restriction on photography.

She could easily end up in someone's photograph.

Who cares? What's the problem?


Steve.

Exactly, someone with some common sense speaks!!

Except a swimming pool, like a shopping centre, and many other locations, is NOT a public place.

Therefore you follow the rules of whoever owns it. If they decide you can't take photos, then you can't take photos. End of discussion.

Instead of the usual clamour 'photographers rights', what about the other side of it. There you are with your Nicpenon XY3002 and little Jonny leaps into the water next to you and ruins it. Many people would be straight into the local law centre to sue, which is a different reason to the one you all are assuming is the cause of reluctance on the part of pool owners.

Sue me all they want, they won't be keeping my photos cause when the case gets to court it will be overrules as farcical - much like this thread. And it IS a public place actually because it's used by the public just like shopping malls.

Have you been swimming yet???

I'd go early and ask permission. If there aren't many people in the pool and you're polite then there shouldn't be a problem. Just hunt out the head lifeguard or manager.

Julie you don't need to do this!!! It's so pathetic that so many people are worried about this when there's nothing to fear. If perverts want pics of naked kid's they can get them off the internet. FFS!!