Phone Cameras

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lulabell*123

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lindsey
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Hi all,

Basically Im after some information about mobile phone cameras.

I work in a photographic shop. (printing peoples photos onto canvas ect)

There is of people bringing in their phones and wanting them blown up to 20x30".

We encourage them to go for either a smaller canvas or bring in a better photo but 99% of the time they dont care, as they are not photographic enthusiasts.
A lot of phone cameras are offering bigger mega pixels and so people that come into the shop assume they can replace the Digital SLR.

At the moment as I dont have any answers I say that although the lens is a 12 mega pixel (for example) the memory in the phone doesn’t hold enough memory so when its printed out the quality isnt the best.
I also explain that because the screen on their phones are small the photo looks great until printed out.

Being honest im not sure if this is true... I just cant seem to find any information about the difference between a 12 mega pixel slr and a 12 metapixel phone camera.

Any information that i can pass on would be great.

Oh and I must stress that I know the main differences between the camera (options to change the iso and shutter speed) but any specific help would be great!

Cheers guys (go easy on me im a new girl in town)
 
you don't need to say anything, if you have said it won't print at a very good quality and they still want it printed that's there down fall not yours, can you not put the photo onto a pc or something to show them how crap it is?
 
Oh ye I size it up and all that and show them the print quality.

Unfortunatly we have to print what they want. Sometimes they bring in old photos and dont care about the qaulity becasue its of a loved one ect.

But more and more phones are coming into the shop. All I want is a bit of knowledge to pass on. :)
 
Why not get a camera phone and a DSLR (or any halfway decent camera reallY) side by side, shoot the exact same scene. Then enlarge both images a bit, show them side by side. Enlarge them a bit more show them side by side, and repeat until it's glaringly obvious how nasty a phone image will look! Make this into a nice big montage and print it big so they can see.
 
Thats a great idea.

I think the main problem is that the customers want to know why its so different. I just get the latest phone thrusted under my nose saying errr merrt this is a 12 mega pix camera this.

Drives me nuts.

I love it when someone actually interested in photography comes in and wants a few things touching up!
 
In the simplest terms (and generalising a bit lot), a phone camera has a very small sensor to capture the information, a DSLR has a larger sensor (but sensor size does vary between makes/models). Broadly speaking, for the same number of pixels the bigger the sensor the better.

Then in front of the sensor is the lens, again with a camera the lens is very small and a compromise design to fit into the phone. They are at their weakest in anything other than bright sunlight. And that's before you consider the finger smudges and scratches.

The customer gets what the customer wants.. and anyway, sharpness is over-rated.
 
The megapixels are smaller (this is probably the simplest way of putting it) and the optics are lower quality.

I think you'll be fighting a losing battle though, I'd just advise them the quality might not be great and then let them get on with it.
 
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Credit to you Lindsey for taking the time to be interested enough to want to get the correct info for your customers. :thumbs:
Pity your not a mechanic. I'd employ you! :D


Kev.
 
I'd tell them if they pay for a printout on paper and they still like it, then you'll knock the printout price off the canvas.
Assuming the printout is cheap enough to start with.
 
Just thought, can't you use an lcd telly to show the picture on first? That might show how crap the phone camera is.
 
I've had similar discussions like this about car stereos........

Someone says "my car stereo is 4x50 watts", I then explain that in reality it's more like 4x15watts RMS which is the only real/standardised power rating, using the size difference between a car stereo and a standalone amplifier that is actually 4x50 watts RMS. The amp only has to amplify, the stereo has a CD playing mechanism, a tuner AND an amp inside so how can it produce as much power ;)

I think there's a similar principle with cameras and camera phones and perhaps manufaturers should quote maximum print size possible instead of megapixels? This would take into consideration the sensor size, quality and lens quality of P&S camers, bridge cameras and phones.
 
There's no such thing as a maximum print size possible, you could print the size of a football pitch from a one megapixel camera with a Holga lens if you wanted to.

It'd look horrid unless you looked at it from a long way away but then you would be looking at something that big from a long way away.
 
kevshore said:
Credit to you Lindsey for taking the time to be interested enough to want to get the correct info for your customers. :thumbs:
Pity your not a mechanic. I'd employ you! :D


Kev.
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My dads a Mechanic (a very hard working and honest one too) must get it from him :)

I just think its nice from the customers point of view if the sales person actually cares and comes across as knowing something about the products or outcome of a photo.

Thanks for all your help guys and girls. Muchly appreciated. Happy snapping!
 
I was under the impression quality of print does not really apply to canvas??


anyways as a test I got an A3 of a pic taken with a Nokia N8(12mp real glass zeiss optic, largest sensor ever in a phone cam) and you know what it was okay, if I got the right shot in the right conditions I would trust it on canvas/poster
 
The average joe assumes a quick snap of their mates in a dark pub will turn out fine beacuse their mint phone has a 12 mega pixel camera. Pfff I get so frustrated!

BUT its all ok now. Ive got more than enoguh to give a quick explination.

Also ye your right any photo printed onto canvas will look a touch on the soft side becasue of the rough surface but its so slight that its not worth telling them! :)
 
Another way I try and explain the difference to people, when attempting to illustrate why a DSLR is better, is to state that whilst the phone may have 12 megapixels, the megapixels are a lot smaller than those on a DSLR.

This inevitably leads to further blank looks, so I go on to expand that statement by asking them to imagine that the pixels in their phone cameras are £1 coins and that those in a DSLR are like £2 coins, and which would they rather have; 12 million £1 coins or 12 million £2 coins. Seems to make sense to more people like that.
 
Scarecrow said:
Another way I try and explain the difference to people, when attempting to illustrate why a DSLR is better, is to state that whilst the phone may have 12 megapixels, the megapixels are a lot smaller than those on a DSLR.

This inevitably leads to further blank looks, so I go on to expand that statement by asking them to imagine that the pixels in their phone cameras are £1 coins and that those in a DSLR are like £2 coins, and which would they rather have; 12 million £1 coins or 12 million £2 coins. Seems to make sense to more people like that.
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A more accurate comparison in terms of size would be 12 million 5p pieces or 12 million £20 notes.......
 
You have to be a bit careful about comparing resolutions especially when combined with viewing distances. Think how those massive screens at concerts work (array of LEDs).
 
My phone camera continues to surprise me. It's only a 5mp on the back of a Motorola Droid but if you take a picture in daylight (anything less than daylight and things go ass up) when you zoom in you run out of pixels before you run out of sharpness. With a little colour editing to get rid of the dodgy wb and you're left with a half decent image. In 90% of situations I won't even bother trying because it does need good light but in a pinch when I don't have my proper camera it just about does the job. The fact that it has an autofocus lens in a massive help compared to the 'infinity focus' jobbies a lot of mobiles have.
 
I think the main points have been covered but here it is again.

- Sensor size
- Lens quality
- Auto Focus

the megapixels really comes last and becomes irrelevent when it goes beyond 10MP.
Infact the more pixels you have within the same sensor size could introduce more noise in the image particularly when using high ISO, so sometimes its better to have less. The whole crazy megapixels race in mobile phone cameras is just a marketing thing really.
 
Are you wanting to tell people because they saying oh it's not goof quality or because you don't think it's good quality? Dslr's are much better but most people woundt spend that much on a camera that's huge IMO. as an enthusiast you will probably notice more flaws like noise and so on but they might not.
 
Its great you are trying to help people, but I think you are fighting a lost cause.

Many folks have been sold on the megapixel idea. More megapixels must be better and all cameras with X megapixels must be better than any camera with less than X megapixels.

Partly this is the fault of advertising - a number is something that is easy to promote and more is apparently always better, and partly it is the fault of folks who have no idea about photography. Though if they stood back and asked themselves, "If my 12 megapixel camera phone can produce excellent quality 30x20 prints, why do photographers spend thousands on other cameras", they may think a bit more.

In really good light - bright but without high contrast - a phone camera can give some good results and I'm sure some phones are better than others, but I think you have done all you can by advising them the quality is likely to be poor.

Dave
 
Dblock said:
Are you wanting to tell people because they saying oh it's not goof quality or because you don't think it's good quality? Dslr's are much better but most people woundt spend that much on a camera that's huge IMO. as an enthusiast you will probably notice more flaws like noise and so on but they might not.
Click to expand...

They see the photo on the tiny phone (which looks fine) Then when I put it in photoshop and explain that if they are still happy with the quality then we can go ahead and print it.
Basically I didnt have enough info to give them as to why! (mainly so I can stun them with my wonderous knowledge.)

My boss says that half the time people come in with photos of dead dogs and it "Its the only photo ive got of spike (sniff sniff)" So then the quality kinda goes out the window.


But ye thanks again everyone for the help!

Nice to know the site is helpful...its like a wee little family!
 
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