Personal Safety

Davec223 said:
Only about an hour away, between Southampton and Bournemouth.
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Bovington here :) I'm guessing Ringwood way for you? But I don't want to hijack the thread :rules:
 
Badger UK said:
I have to say that you should try to look on the bright side and understand that in the UK you are pretty much safe really. I understand that it may not feel like that some times and I know it does happen from time to time, but the chances of getting attacked are pretty slim in real life.
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Agreed. I walk round Liverpool without a bag. My camera is always slung over my shoulder for the world to see. Its insured. Worst comes to it I get new gear. Can't say I've ever had any issues.
 
The only problem, with using a Manfrotto is having to pick the flesh and hair out of it... ;) j/k

my 055XPROB would be very handy if someone tried to take my kit. However, if they push a gun into my face, they can have the lot.
 
Manfrotto 680 monopod - a formidable weapon fit for a Jedi.
 
a 5d,grip,and a 16-35 lens does(woops(could)) make a mess of any would be thief's face:D
 
Now being a tog who really likes wildlife, I carry a Priest (a small truncheon used to despatch any wounded animals I may come across) and I also have one of those fold out saws for removing the odd twig or two, now if I had to defend myself I'm quite capable providing the odds are fair:thumbs: but if they're not I fight dirty and I'll happily rip someone's eyes out if they think it's a me or them scenario, I ain't no hero but whats mine is mine including my life, it's the way I was bought up, I respect others right to have items I cannot even dream about owning and I expect the same rules to be applied to me:shrug::thumbs:
 
I was recently followed on foot by people intent on getting my car keys and more - very frightening.
Situation re carrying weapons is very risky. Carry anything solely for that purpose and you could be in big trouble.
In cities I carry a large brolly. Most have a metal spike.
If forced to use such a thing stick to saying that you were convinced your life was in danger. Then hope the court comes down on your side.
If you think that handing over your kit etc will keep you safe then do so.
Personally I don't believe all these stats that the chances of becoming a victim are remote.
Much crime no longer gets reported because it achieves damn all.
 
katielouise said:
I believe the person above to be misinformed about the defence sprays, there are products available (Dyejet, StoppaRed and Xmarker) that will both spray an attacker with a permanant dye and give you a chance to get away. I am thinking of investing myself! I would just advise you all to avoid anyone running around with a bright red or blue face! They probably havent been up to much good!

http://www.ukcrimeprevention.org/self-defence-sprays.htm

http://www.c-p-p.co.uk/product/asp/ProdID/2324/CtgID/1006/af/page.htm
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I believe he was referring to pepper sprays which cause actual harm rather than the defense sprays which contain dye. That said, these days you will still probably still be sued by your attacker for the trauma they've been caused! :bang:
 
Does anyone actually know of any photographers attacked and robbed of their equipment? I have to admit to never giving it a second thought, and I'm not about to start worrying about it now.
 
KelV6 said:
Does anyone actually know of any photographers attacked and robbed of their equipment? I have to admit to never giving it a second thought, and I'm not about to start worrying about it now.
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I must admit, not personally however it's becoming common practice for Police and Security guards to attempt to separate 'togs from their kit as we're hearing all too often.... sad times.
 
BRASH said:
Nearly right. Things like pepper spray, CS gas/spray and stun guns are actually classed as Section 1 Firearms, and or prohibited weapons. Serious stuff:nono::nono:
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Theres a spray "stoppa" claimed to be UK legal, it's a sticky dye marker stuff, but in this country chances are you'll get your arse sued off if you use it. Wayne
 
One of the modules I teach is personal safety; this was driven by my experiences of lone working in difficult areas with clients with mental health issues and ex offenders.

(Before anyone mentions it I will, people with mental health issues are 100 times more likely to be the victims of crime than the perpetrators, so there you go)

I don’t teach self defence as statistically you are more likely to get in to conflict if you have had some type of martial arts training for example I can remember in the 80’s seeing a so called martial arts expert getting a kicking in a pub because, A, he had told the perpetrators that he was a martial arts expert thus upping the ante, B, when it all kicked off he forgot he was not in a dojo and ended up tripping over tables/ chairs, quite simply he escalated the situation and paid the price.

Things to think about when considering personal safety:-

Inform someone of your whereabouts, where you are what time you will be back (a good tip for worried parents, who’s older children want independence is to ask then to write where that are going / contact details on a piece of paper then pop it in to a sealed envelope which you retain,you get piece of mind they get a bit of independence)

Carry a charged mobile phone

Take any medication you need with you

Get a weather report and dress accordingly

Know where you are going, if you want gritty social deprivation pictures on a rundown estate considerer the risk/reward factor. You are not working for Getty images/Magnum.

If you have to do this sort of photography then buddy up, one to take the pictures the other to keep an eye out. Remember that thanks to the government most people are paranoid about photographers so if you are photographing individuals street style don’t be surprised if you are challenged aggressively, Using a good quality compact camera in these situations is a lot better than an SLR. Always be polite if challenged and reinforce the idea that you do not want to cause offence.

Carry the minimum amount of kit, walk round looking like a photographic shop and you will get the wrong sort of attention.

Be creative when thinking camera bags, the local paper photographer uses an old adidas bag you would never now he was a photographer.. Clever eh.

If you are approached by youths calling you ‘p****’ best thing you can do is pack up and leave, you won’t win with this one , kids instinctively know to wind adults up. Put your gear away and do what the British army calls a ‘tactical withdrawal’

If you are approached by a person or persons under the influence do the above but quicker, and put as much distance between you and the individuals concerned, never run, walk quickly and confidently.

Finally. always clock ‘Safe Havens/Bolt holes ‘shops, garages and even pubs can be useful if you need to get off the street and get some assistance.

Footnote

Many years ago as a young man I found a copy of an SAS survival guide in a second had book shop , one section covered disarming an individual with a gun or a knife. It said “ Make use that you are physically / and mentally able to take the individual down , killing them if necessary, if you cannot do this then consider other options. Brilliant piece of advice :thumbs:
 
Good advice Holden, only thing I'd add is on safe havens, if it has to be a pub, make sure it's a nice friendly family pub...you don't want to be jumping out of the frying pan into an inferno no, do you? :lol:
 
get yourself to the gym, a boxing gym prefferably and dont take any crap. If youths give you cr*p dont take it, dont shout at em, but just laugh with them and make jokes, if they aint getting an aggreive reaction 9 out of 10times they give up and find someone else! always act confident, not cocky. and if worst comes to worst keep the car close and the key accesible so not in your bag like my friends do!
 
There's some good advice on this thread and some really funny replies too :lol:

I don't go out with other people really when I take my camera. But I do take my dog with me. He's really well trained and will stay by my side (we do obedience advanced level). He's not bothered about other dogs, so I know if I'm taking a shot and a person with a dog comes along, he won't move.

People always say don't rely on your dog but we had an intruder in our house last year and this dog held the petrified man in place whilst we waited for the police to arrive. (The dog didn't make contact by the way). Yes, I know the intruder was on the dog's territory but I do have faith in him.

Anyway, here's my little teddy bear handbag dog:

adieselfeb.jpg


Lisa
 
DarrenToogood said:
Is there any sprays which we can legally use?

I was thinking pepper would be a quick spray to resolve a situation
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Sorry but you can't legally do that. The cops and military are exempt on this and many other laws.
 
!
 
BRASH said:
Nearly right. Things like pepper spray, CS gas/spray and stun guns are actually classed as Section 1 Firearms, and or prohibited weapons. Serious stuff:nono::nono:
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The only things that are classed as firearms are articles which discharge a projectile. CS spray and a few other things are prohibited weapons.
 
Davec223 said:
Sorry brash but you are nearly right aswell;) they are actually section 5 which is more serious than section 1. Section 5 means that they are in the same classification as machine guns and handguns and not the same as sporting rifles. A far more serious crime.
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The Firearms Act has lots of sections some of which deal with firearms and some with prohibited weapons. If it doesn't discharge a projectile its not a firearm. CS spray isn't a firearm of any type its a prohibited weapon.
 
ChrisMClark said:
Good advice Holden, only thing I'd add is on safe havens, if it has to be a pub, make sure it's a nice friendly family pub...you don't want to be jumping out of the frying pan into an inferno no, do you? :lol:
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When I got targetted recently I made my escape by going in to busy council premises then quickly exiting via another door before my "tail" realised what I had done.
It nearly went wrong because I only just made it back to my car when I discovered there were 3 assailants involved and not just one.

With the benefit of hindsight I should have remained in the public premises and phoned the police, but when you are put under pressure logical thought is difficult.

Apart from the shock of the situation I felt really annoyed with myself for not being more wary because had I thought about where I was parking and who was hanging about alarms bells would have rung before I fell into a trap.

BTW that's another thought before you decide to set about some scumbag. Are you certain he does not have backup?
 
Veracocha said:
As the title mentions personal safety then I consider my kit secondary to my own life. I carry a knife when I am out togging or running. It is against everything which I stand but I will take my chances being judged by 12 rather than being carried by six.
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ANYTHING carried with the intention of using it for self defence is an offensive weapon. The starting point for sentencing for possession of an offensive weapon is custody - even if it isn't used or brandished. Not much room for a not guilty plea in those circumstances.

bear in mind that carrying a knife makes you a lot more liable to be stabbed than not having one. Any toe rag who tries to intimidate you into parting with a camera by waving a knife wants the camera, he doesn't want to injure you or he would stab you and then take the camera. If you produce a knife it then becomes a matter of self defence - for the attacker - and he becomes MUCH more likely to use his weapon. Then he will take the camera.
 
katielouise said:
I believe the person above to be misinformed about the defence sprays, there are products available (Dyejet, StoppaRed and Xmarker) that will both spray an attacker with a permanant dye and give you a chance to get away.
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The confusion comes because a lot of so called defence sprays are actually marker sprays.

carrying a personal alarm is an excellent idea but make sure its a good one and keep it where you can ALWAYS get at it at once - even with gloves on. They are no good at all if kept in the bottom of a bag.


What is, or is not, legal to carry is more complicated. Some things eg CS spray and pepper spray are ALWAYS illegal in the UK if possessed by civilians as their sole purpose is to cause injury, which makes them offensive weapons at all times. Any knife which does not fold is an offensive weapon when carried without lawful excuse. Self defence is not a lawful excuse. . Any knife where the blade can be locked open is an offensive weapon.The starting point for sentencing for possession of an offensive weapon is custody.

Other things may or may not be offensive weapons. A marker spray is not automatically an offensive weapon but becomes one if carried for the purpose of self defence. Thats where the grey area starts as far as the law is concerned. Spray a marker into somebodys face and you run a real risk of conviction for using an offensive weapon. Spray it on to their clothing and you run very little risk of prosecution for possession of an offensive weapon but you hugely increase the risk of injury from the person you sprayed.
 
don't carry weapons, as a tog you perfectly normally carry a big heavy lump of metal, it's only self defence if you weren't carrying a weapon beforehand isn't it?

sooo glad i live in the country :D
 
If you are in a position to do so, and you are 100% confident you can remove said persons from play, then do so. I think the "just give them what they want and run" is the reason why your so much more likely to get attacked!

These tools think they can get away with it! In my opinion, send them packing!

Someone tried to nick my friends camera, there was another bloke about, who just, in typical British manner ignored and walked off, saving his own skin.

But, my mate just sent the ******* into the railings, face first. Which im proud of him for, and he even got to keep his camera
 
t when you are put under pressure logical thought is difficult.
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Good point that is why its a good idea to plan;), carrying weapons is never a good idea ( back to the SAS manual) as what might happen is they could be taken off you and used against you.

As for areosols, nice idea in principal,. in practice any kind of breeze will send the spay in all directions including yours :'(
 
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