Parking ticket on a car park at retail outlet

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:( Dropped into a retail estate near where I live for the start of the Christmas shopping - thought I would get in early and sort it all out......after shopping for an hour or so I visited a coffee shop and had a nice latte and some munchies, as you do....when I got back to the car I find a £90.00 ticket on the screen thats says there is a discount if paid within 14 days to 55 quid.....:shrug:

This was on a retail estate car park I have been using for years - never had this before though.

The store managers of at least two of the stores I visited are well aware of this but could offer no help - are they all mad the high street is dying as it is, the last thing they need is another hurdle for shoppers to have to think about? surely the stores want people to stay a while and browse and shop some more? this flies in the face of any business model on this trading estates. Looks like I shall not bother with supporting the UK retail sector Im doing the rest of my shopping on AMAZON then


Are these tickets lawful - it would seem entering the car park means I have been offered a contract, I apparently accepted the terms of said contract and agreed to abide by its terms, O and waived any cooling off period...:rules:
 
What retail estate was it.
 
its madness i got one for staying over 2 hours

hardley the way to attract customers.

i believe they can do it but getting you to pay is something else.

i would expect one of the managers to do somethging for you or contact head office..
 
I'm guessing it says a parking enforcement or the like and not parking fine, The police, traffic wardens and council controlled agents/car parks are the only ones who can legally prosecute parking fines.
DVLA sell on your details to these numpties who then try to get you to pay by offering a discount, if it came through my post it would be filed straight into the bin
Lots of good info here...
http://forums.pepipoo.com/
 
Good to see rip off Britain alive and well isnt it.
 
Martyn D said:
I'm guessing it says a parking enforcement or the like and not parking fine, The police, traffic wardens and council controlled agents/car parks are the only ones who can legally prosecute parking fines.
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Correct, they're parking charges, not fines. It's a matter of contract law and trespass. What you have received is an invoice. Previous advice was pretty well always to ignore them as they were unlikely to pursue the debt to court.

However, the law changed on 1st October, permitting the parking enforcement companies to pursue the registered keeper of the vehicle for the charge, rather than the driver - which made things more complicated for them to prove who owned the debt.

http://www.beatparkingchargenotice....rivate-parking-tickets-from-1st-october-2012/

http://www.theaa.com/public_affairs/reports/parking-tickets-private-land.html

How that will pan out in terms of their willingness to take their claims to court and their ability to obtain a civil judgement is unclear.
 
Musicman said:
However, the law changed on 1st October, permitting the parking enforcement companies to pursue the registered keeper of the vehicle for the charge, rather than the driver - which made things more complicated for them to prove who owned the debt.
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This was a necessary change to complement the removal of the ability to clamp cars on private land which happened at the same time.

Too many people think that they have a divine right to park on other people's property without consent. I'm pretty sure someone on this forum had a problem with it in reserved spaces associated with a block of flats, in fact.
 
onomatopoeia said:
This was a necessary change to complement the removal of the ability to clamp cars on private land which happened at the same time.

Too many people think that they have a divine right to park on other people's property without consent. I'm pretty sure someone on this forum had a problem with it in reserved spaces associated with a block of flats, in fact.
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i still have
 
I'd be tempted to write to the store managers and get an article in the local paper about how they are sending away shoppers with their stupid charges. People power is good. If the store gets boycotted due to the parking company's actions then they'll soon change their tune. If there is a 2 hour limit how do you buy extra time at the parking site? Not everyone wants to do everything within 2 hours. They may need longer. If there is no way of doing this then it further makes a mockery of their stupid invoice.

And stores wonder why people shop on the internet?? None of this garbage of being charged extra if you spend too long on Amazon!
 
Usually if you can prove you were shopping during the time of the ticket (receipts from any purchases) then you can get the ticket overturned, these tickets are usually dished out for those sort of people who use these carparks for purposes other than shopping

Certainly worth looking into
 
If it's a fine from the council or the police then pay it, other wise don't. You're not legally obliged to do so.

I had the same at my college car park. Looked into it and found this out. I sent them an email stating that the pass I had for the car park was there just in the foot well as the wind blew it down and basically said that I will never be paying it. They lifted the fine.

I spoke to a guy at work at the time and he had one a couple of years back and just ignored it. The fine went like this:

£90>£55>£90>£120>£200 then they kept on phoning him and telling him that they would take him to court which again he ignored as he didn't have to pay a thing and they forgot about it. Basically they just scare you into paying. Mickey mouse fines.
 
The retail park was ROBIN (ROBING)? PARK RETAIL WIGAN - behind the large ASDA store who BTW also has a similar system in place:shrug:

It was not a ticket by council or traffic warden - after a brief look at PEPIPOO and the Martin Lewis website it seems this car park is notorious for these antics and the parking charge has no basis what so ever


WHY would ANY retailer want LIMITS placed on customers - they all wonder why people are going to the Trafford Center - FREE PARKING all day NO restrictions or hassle.

:bonk:
 
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Don't pay it we had one about three months ago we binned it never heard a thing from it.
 
LASTOLITE said:
The retail park was ROBIN (ROBING)? PARK RETAIL WIGAN - behind the large ASDA store who BTW also has a similar system in place:shrug:

It was not a ticket by council or traffic warden - after a brief look at PEPIPOO and the Martin Lewis website it seems this car park is notorious for these antics and the parking charge has no basis what so ever


WHY would ANY retailer want LIMITS placed on customers - they all wonder why people are going to the Trafford Center - FREE PARKING all day NO restrictions or hassle.

:bonk:
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They wouldn't (and this is not an excuse for what happened to the OP), but some retail parks have a problem with people leaving their car there all day and commuting to work in a city by bus. Problem then arises that legitimate shoppers cannot get parked. Retail parks I have used allow a parking time limit of 4 hours which is plenty.
 
i'd bet you'd be amazed by the number of people that pay these 'bogus' fines!
My parents got a parking ticket for parking outside my house one time they visited!!:cuckoo:
There's a dropped kerb outside my drive, and their front wheel was about 1 inch over it.
It was issued by a traffic warden on his moped, and they were that scared about the fine going up if they didn't pay within 14 days that they were going to pay it!
Turns out if you have the house owners permission (that the dropped kerb is outside) you can park on a dropped kerb.
I successfully appealed the ticket for them.
Then 2 weeks later my wifes friend gets one, outside our house again! this time the guy is there writing the ticket so i go out explain they had my permission, but the ****hole totally ignored me and carried on writing the ticket...appealed and won again.
Weird thing is i live in the middle of nowhere, only at end of the road is fields and a farm!...turned out a neighbour was ringing them up everytime someone parked on the road as someone once blocked him in!!!
 
I had one of these about 18 months ago from some bunch of cowboys called G24 for over staying in a empty Homebase carpark , i left my car there at about 21:00 and met my wife who picked me up and we went on somewhere else, got back about midnight and picked the car up, abount 2 weeks later got a very aggressive letter demanding £90 and threatening bailiffs , court costs and all sorts if i didn't pay it ! - I'd never seen a parking notice ( there are no ticket machines) in the 6 yrs i'd shopped here , so did some research and found the company had been on BBC watch dog and found loads of other info on the web, and the consensus was ignore it and do not respond and you get 6 more threatening letters then nothing. I was prepared to go to court and fight against the excessive charges and the aggressive, threatening nature of letters and went and photographed the crap signage as evidence and also evidence carppak was empty on the following nights at the time i was done( apparently the penalty charge is in relation into the loss of income caused to the landowner while you were parked there or something like that) . I ignored the letters and after 6 nothing else (3 were from a bailiff company owned by G24 and operating out of the same address) and i've NEVER used homebase since. Apparently they have no legal way of making you pay unless they take you to court, and at the time none of these company's had ever done that , in-case they got an unfavorable result which would set a precedence for any further attempts to fleece money from people.
 
ignore it and any correspondance from the company.

it is an invoice not a fine.

You'll get lots of snotty letters becoming more threatening then they give up.
 
Lynton said:
ignore it and any correspondance from the company.

it is an invoice not a fine.

You'll get lots of snotty letters becoming more threatening then they give up.
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The law has changed in the last few weeks to make it possible for the parking company to enforce against the registered keeper through the courts without needing to identify the driver. Musicman explained it earlier in the topic.

Consequently the traditional advice of ignoring may no longer be valid and others quoting stuff that happened some time ago when the legal situtation was different likewise.
 
onomatopoeia said:
The law has changed in the last few weeks to make it possible for the parking company to enforce against the registered keeper through the courts without needing to identify the driver. Musicman explained it earlier in the topic.

Consequently the traditional advice of ignoring may no longer be valid and others quoting stuff that happened some time ago when the legal situtation was different likewise.
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But under what legislation will they attempt to use at court? What legislation makes the registered keeper liable for a private "parking fine"?!

Edit - I see the act and section, but what would they actually take you to court for? It doesn't really change anything as they still really don't have any more powers as such, and would they still really bother?? It still remains a flakey "civil debt" which they have to go through the same processes with.
 
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All these probs could be saved if you turned all the car parks to pay and display.
 
Unless its police or council do not pay it.... I had a parking charge issued for 80 quid which rose and rose up for 3 years as i deliberately ignored there correpondance.... I then started getting court letters from them, so i responded once.....

My reply was basically along the lines of 'will see you in court'. Soon as they realised i was happy to go to court they dropped everything as they wasnt a legal registered parking company and they kne i knew it.... Its their bully antics that make peopl pay unnecessarily...
 
I'm all for standing up to bullies and fighting to make the car park free for a longer period (e.g. 4hours)... but I'm surprised so many people are telling the OP to ignore it when he was in the wrong - what ever happened to taking responsibility for your own actions?
 
TopBanana said:
I'm surprised so many people are telling the OP to ignore it when he was in the wrong - what ever happened to taking responsibility for your own actions?
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Was he knowingly in the wrong?
 
Had a similar situation a couple of months ago i got loads of threatening letters and phone calls , i just told them i was,n,t going to pay it and they gave up .
 
Well this little topic has attracted lots of interest ;)


I had not knowingly entered into a contact with the land owner to leave my car on his / her land and the damages or loss to the land owner in respect of my overstay is zero - thus it is in fact an unenforceable penalty derived by my so called breach of contract. a foolish and wholly unfair act on the part of the company operating the car park. They are a third party so cannot take you to court - it seems only the land owner can do that. so the chances of court case are minimal to nowt.
 
If it's not issued by the council or the police ignore it. It's not a ticket, it's a speculative invoice.
 
LASTOLITE said:
Well this little topic has attracted lots of interest ;)

I had not knowingly entered into a contact with the land owner to leave my car on his / her land and the damages or loss to the land owner in respect of my overstay is zero - thus it is in fact an unenforceable penalty derived by my so called breach of contract. a foolish and wholly unfair act on the part of the company operating the car park. They are a third party so cannot take you to court - it seems only the land owner can do that. so the chances of court case are minimal to nowt.
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Exactly, hence why I'm questioning why the apparent "change in the law" is going to make any difference as some keep quoting - it's still only the land owner that can take you to court and for what? Civil trespass? I can't see that they'll bother!

As above, ignore it, it's legalised fraud committed by bully boys relying on the victims fear of prosecution. Financial terrorists if you will!
 
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it's still only the land owner that can take you to court
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No, it's not, the owner of land can employ an agent, ie an enforcement company to enforce the rules he puts on his property, in this case his car park.
It seems the new law relies on breach of contract, I'd guess if the owner wasn't the driver, it's difficult to see how he can have entered into a contract with the land owner or his agents.

Lastolite

The best advise is go and read the AA link posted earlier. The advice you're being given about not paying and ignoring it, is out of date, the legislation has changed.
So go back, get photos of the signs, or lack of it.
If they are inadequate, then dispute the charge if the company is BPA accredited. If not, then you have the option, pay or tell them to take you to court. They might take that offer up, they may not. If they do then be prepared if you loose to pay their costs, that might be expensive.
 
My son had 2 of these. In different places. He didn't tell me about the 1st one and just paid it. :bang: £60 if I remember correctly. He left himself skint. But he was 17 and hadn't passed his test long. He was too embarressed to tell me. UNTIL he got another one at KFC. He was sat in the place talking and eating with his mates.
He came to dad this time after getting threatening letters from them. I did a bit of research on the net to find out who the company where. Turns out that there was a lot of info on the net about it.
They will keep sending letters, with further threats of court action etc. They give up after the eighth letter.
If I remember correctly, they haven't yet taken anyone to court or persued payment after 8 letters. Things may have changed since then.
But Google is your friend. ;)

Kev.
 
Bernie174 said:
you're being given about not paying and ignoring it, is out of date, the legislation has changed.
So go back, get photos of the signs, or lack of it.
If they are inadequate, then dispute the charge if the company is BPA accredited. If not, then you have the option, pay or tell them to take you to court. They might take that offer up, they may not. If they do then be prepared if you loose to pay their costs, that might be expensive.
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I thought all they could claim for was the money lost as a result of you occupying the space, ie if it's £2 an hour and you stay 3 hours they can claim for £6 + costs

Agreed the costs could be expensive but are they likely to take anybody to court for £6 and risk losing

The only case I read about that went to court was a taxi driver who repeatedly parked his liveried taxi in a supermarket car park as a free advert, are there any others
 
This really is a can of worms. I very much applaud those who feel confident enough of the outcome to take the "go to blazes approach (or are well heeled enough to bear the consequences if it goes awry).
The situation is that the roads and such parking spaces as exist are under increasing pressure. There are just too many people on the road for the infrastructure to support.
We have become an overcrowded country.
If full knowledge of this, those who have own land on which you can park see a revenue opportunity to be exploited to the max. The motorist is a cash cow.
The almost mandatory time limit in supermarket car parks is the result of customers whingeing that they cannot find a space, and selfish swines who would once have parked there all day and gone somewhere else - 'cos it's free.
As an aside, it is often time consuming to park when there ARE spaces because there are plenty who won't walk a yard further than necessary and obstruct others in their vain attempt to find a space five yards from the door.
My circumstances are slightly different. I no longer own my own car and use that provided as a tool of the job by my employer, it belongs to a leasing company.
If I haven't had a physical parking ticket stuck to the windscreen, the first I know about it is a phone call from the leasing company saying they've had notification of an alleged infringement. Then it's up to me to pay or dispute. If I fail to respond, the leasing company just pay and add an administration charge on top.
 
We have monitored parking where I work . We were forced into this due to city workers parking up all day . They were filling all of the spaces and then started parking in disabled spaces and dangerously on curbs , blind corners on the entrance . It got to the point where it drove our customers away due to them not been able to park . We also had problems with our delivery trucks not been able to get onto site safely . Now we have a man come and check to see if the cars belong to our customers , if not they get a ticket . We don't mind if people ask first , we just tell him that there ok . What really annoys us is people who just think that they have the right to park where they like , no need to guess what happens to those .
 
I have read stories about "change in the law" allowing private parking companies to pursue the registered keeper of the car rather than the driver, but I can't see what can really be changed as it's basically contract law they are relying on and they would still need to prove that the registered keeper has "accepted" the contractual terms. Very difficult I think.
 
FWIW, here's the relevant legislation that came into force on 1st October - s56 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, which brings into effect Schedule 4

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4/enacted

Schedule 4 said:
4(1)The creditor has the right to recover any unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle.
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and the DfT Guidance to Schedule 4

http://assets.dft.gov.uk/publicatio...g-charges/guidance-unpaid-parking-charges.pdf

of which, this is notable also

DfT Guidance said:
Charges for breaking a parking contract must be reasonable and a genuine preestimate of loss. This means charges must compensate the landholder only for the loss they are likely to suffer because the parking contract has been broken.

For example, to cover the unpaid charges and the administrative costs associated with issuing the ticket to recover the charges. Charges may not be set at higher levels than necessary to recover business losses and the intention should not be to penalise the driver.
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Bernie174 said:
. If not, then you have the option, pay or tell them to take you to court. They might take that offer up, they may not. If they do then be prepared if you loose to pay their costs, that might be expensive.
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Assuming this would only ever get to small claims court because of the low value. You can't be held liable for the other parties costs in small claims. Only the court fees and a very small prescribed solicitor cost. You'd never run up massive costs
 
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