Online Petition

Very well considered petition too - i signed :)
 
Being cynical for a minute - surely the response from the Gov. will be to quote the laws we already know about, therefore providing the clarification asked for...

The real issue here is one of deterrent. By making life difficult for ordinary people the hope is to also deter the bad guys. Does that work? Probably to a limited degree. After all it's not hard to work out that walking around as a happy snappy tourist with a decent P&S will give great results without the hassle. So remove the restrictions would seem sensible - of course then Mr Terrorist can walk around with his DSLR, lenses and tripod and getter better results but at least the general public will be able to enjoy a peaceful existence without the hassle...
 
Done, and seeing as it affects us all how about making this a "sticky"
 
pxl8 said:
Being cynical for a minute - surely the response from the Gov. will be to quote the laws we already know about, therefore providing the clarification asked for...
Click to expand...

Agreed... I thought petitions where designed to try and change things, to make a difference.. Not for everyone to collectivly ask one question.

I feel the petition is nearly there. But instead of asking to clarify the law to us the photographers something we already know. Ask them to clarify the law to the people who are stopping us photographing. The uneducated.
 
Done :thumbs: If enough sign :rules:, they may just listen:wave:
 
pxl8 said:
Being cynical for a minute - surely the response from the Gov. will be to quote the laws we already know about, therefore providing the clarification asked for...

The real issue here is one of deterrent. By making life difficult for ordinary people the hope is to also deter the bad guys. Does that work? Probably to a limited degree. After all it's not hard to work out that walking around as a happy snappy tourist with a decent P&S will give great results without the hassle. So remove the restrictions would seem sensible - of course then Mr Terrorist can walk around with his DSLR, lenses and tripod and getter better results but at least the general public will be able to enjoy a peaceful existence without the hassle...
Click to expand...

I think the real point here is twofold:

1. A greater understanding from jobsworth fascist security / 'community' (in the the most abstract) police "person" as to what rights they are allowed to disregard or violate at any given time. Or more importantly, not.

2. Equal treatment between mobile phone cam user and DSLR user.

The terrorist angle is the biggest load of BS we have collectively swallowed as a nation since the Church rewrote history. Tell me what further information "Mr Terrorist" needs that cant be downloaded freely from the internet, or the level of IQ needed to plan a bombing? Surely a 5mp snap taken from a phone at next to point blank range is adequate and maybe better than a 21mp DSLR taken where it is deemed to be acceptable to operate such camera on that particular day.

Tell me: when the IRA were blowing up London and Birmingham on a fairly regular basis, were there draconian measures to prevent photography? Were human rights violated regularly? Was imprisonment without trial acceptable? Or was that regular and REAL threat less or a problem than this FEARed threat?

Maybe if we stopped terrorising other countries and concentrated on our own this current threat would gradually diminish...............?

I believe it was Churchill that said: "The true test of society is how well it treats its prisoners".

And on that note i'll stop my ranting which has gone way off topic.
 
You know I am not sure that this is a good idea why disturb a hornets nest when there is no need to the current laws are enough and in general photographers are not subject to over regulation in the UK I would suggest that this type of action is a way to reverse that at a stroke.

Bill
 
Disturb a hornets nest in what way Bill?
 
Hmmm there is another old saying "if it ain't broke don't fix it" the way I see it is that it ain't broke OK we have the "odd" and I mean odd incident now and again but nothing to get all excited about but to me I know these people I was in business long enough to understand the way they work and stirring up beurocrats and politicians (the hornets nest) and presenting them with another opportunity to ride roughshod over yet more civil liberties in this country is courting disaster.

Bill
 
Sorry Bill, couldn't disagree with you more stongly.

The key point is there are various levels of understanding of the law - amongst those whom uphold it and those private sector individuals that ape it.

A clear understanding of what is legal and what is not is vital to both the general public and law enforcement.

I cannot imagine this will lead to more draconian laws or regulations as that would necessitate equal treatment: the police force is not equipped to manage this.

How many articles have you read in the last 6 months whereby a police officer or security guard has wrongfully interfered with a photographer (pro or am)? Is that right or acceptable? I'd argue that one error in the application of the law is enough to necessitate a rethink (a generic argument not based solely on photography, but equally not mutually exclusive).
 
and I too couldn't disagree with you more strongly...so

it appears we will agree to disagree and people can be left to make up their own mind what to do.

Cheers
Bill
 
But the petition only asks for us the photographers to be given clarification as to what the laws are...

It should be asking for the police and the security people etc to be told what the law is.

I feel the right thought is there but the wrong question is being asked... IMHO :)
 
You're absolutely right, but this is the question to ask. The knock on effect is that clarification is given and then there is a charter of sorts.

If the petition requested the Govt clarify the law to the enforcement agencies it would be booted out and laughed at.
 
Its harder nough trying to find the laws, and for us more unexperienced photographers its a little scarry, the feeling i get when i am out and about among crowds is very off putting as i am not sure how i stand when i want to take a shot. So the idea of it being more understanble and better excess to the laws would help me a great deal, And i am sure it won't do any one any harm to sign. Or am i just:bang: lol.
 
probem with this is that it is signed by photographers. A bit like terrorists signing a pertition to make terrorism legal. In other words it is the general public who need to support this and say they think photographers should have more freedom. It's pointless coming from us alone - we need suport from outside the circle.
 
So lets sit on our thumbs and moan from a distance?
 
I wasnt saying I haven't signed it Jonny. I was saying it isn't enough for only us to do it - otherwise we are all sitting on it
 
Apologies - my mistake.
 
Apology accepted. I like your way of thinking - anyone who mkes disparaging remarks about religion is on my side lol.

Anarchy anyone?
 
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