Beginner Not good, not good at all

Slippery slope mate.....

My suggestion would be to have a look at Steve's Chroma stuff. It's a very cost effective and lightweight way of having a go at LF and if you don't take to it you can sell it on without losing too much.
If you're only going to use it in studio conditions then a rail camera would be perfect. They are a little less expensive than the lighter, more portable view camera but are ideal for portraits. But they are bulky and heavy.
 
Definitely a good slippery though :D

Looking forward to seeing your results, and it goes without saying, but the bunch here would no doubt happily answer any questions you have :)
 
Thanks guys.

Had a look at the Carbon Adventurer and the Intrepid mk4.

The Carbon looks great but is double the Intrepid. The build quality and materials used is probably worth that though.

I can't see me doing many portrait in a studio so folding camera is more practical I think.

Still a little confused on the lenses.
 
120 film standard lens would be around trhe 80-85mm, 4x5 about 130-135mm. Should give the same (almost) image as a 50mm on a 35 camera... As ever, less is more and more is less :cool:
 
MrDrizz said:
Still a little confused on the lenses.
Click to expand...
Just embrace that sense of confusion, it never goes away with LF :D

Have you thought about processing the negs? Worth thinking about before splashing out on a camera and lenses.
 
MrDrizz said:
Thanks guys.

Had a look at the Carbon Adventurer and the Intrepid mk4.

The Carbon looks great but is double the Intrepid. The build quality and materials used is probably worth that though.

I can't see me doing many portrait in a studio so folding camera is more practical I think.

Still a little confused on the lenses.
Click to expand...

The Chroma is double the camera of the intrpid too, will go lots wider. The MkII Carbon has really good extension too for closer focus.

Lens wise, with portraits in mind, a 210mm would make a good starting point, it's a focal length that tends to be fairly cheap.
For landscapes I mostly use a 75mm Nikkor and a 150mm
 
sirch said:
Just embrace that sense of confusion, it never goes away with LF :D

Have you thought about processing the negs? Worth thinking about before splashing out on a camera and lenses.
Click to expand...
As I process my own 35mm moving to LF is a simple case of getting the right kind of tank.
 
Woodsy said:
LF lenses are not the most obvious thing in the first instance. Where's the confusion coming from?
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Confusion mainly from the lens boards, seen Copal 0 and so on.
As for lenses, there are those with shutter and aperture and I've seen some that don't have either?
 
MrDrizz said:
Confusion mainly from the lens boards, seen Copal 0 and so on.
As for lenses, there are those with shutter and aperture and I've seen some that don't have either?
Click to expand...

Ahh ok, so the number really just defines the size of the hole in the board that the lens itself sits within. For the sake of ease, 'modern' LF lenses have a front cell (group of elements) and a rear cell, which screw into the front and back of the shutter unit, respectively. Typically modern lenses were sold with shutters, so that the aperture iris built into the shutter unit had a calibrated settings scale suited to the specific lens it had attached to it. Copal was a brand of shutter, as were Seiko and Compur (?) and the number refers to the size of the unit itself, and the corresponding size of the hole in the lens board that it sits within.

The terms people use are 'the lens' which typically refers to the collection of the front and rear cells and the shutter unit (which typically does contain the aperture as well). The lens board is what the lens sits within in order to marry it to the front standard of the camera itself. It is then simply a case that the lens board needs to have the hole in the middle that fits the corresponding shutter unit, and a overall shape that matches your specific camera. The most common shapes are Linhof style (which camera like Ebony, Shen Hao, Chamonix, Intrepid, Chroma etc accept natively), which are about 96x98mm and have clipped corners at the bottom, and Sinar, which are 140x140mm. Unless you plan on getting an 10x8 camera, or a Sinar camera, it's unlikely you'll need a lens mounted in a Sinar lensboard. Not to confuse things, but you can transplant lenses between lens board styles, provided the holes match. So for example, a lens mounted in a copal 0 sinar lens board can be simply moved onto a copal 0 linhof style board, and vice versa.

The standard Copal shutter sizes are 0, 1, and 3, and there are a few other less common sizes as well. The main thing though is that any lens you buy should come as a complete unit (lens cells, shutter and lens board. If this is complete, and the lens board is the right style, you're all sorted :) If it doesn't come with a lens board, this is the easiest thing to fix, as one simply buys a suitable lens board for that shutter. In the beginning, perhaps stay clear of people selling 'lens cells only', as shutters are much harder to come by, and may not have an appropriate aperture scale for the cells you want to mount to it.

As for lenses that come without either a mechanical shutter or aperture, these are less common. Depending on what you shoot (portraits), I would not go for a lens without a shutter or aperture. Lenses without shutters are fine for long exposure (provided it comes with at least an aperture) as you can use 'top hat' timing - literally, use a top hat, or dark cloth to uncover and cover the lens. This is fine for exposures of tens of seconds or more, as the error in the precise timing is typically unnoticeable. Lenses that come without an aperture I would avoid personally.

Apologies, I know that's a lot to take in; do let me know if you want anything clarifying! :)
 
To add to Woodsy's bit, a 75mm lens at f4.5 will need a max aperture of 16.67mm and minimum at f45 of 1.67mm

A 240mm lens at f5.6 will be 42.86mm and at f45 5.33mm

The same shutter would struggle to cover both so there is the range of shutter sizes.
 
MrDrizz said:
As I process my own 35mm moving to LF is a simple case of getting the right kind of tank.
Click to expand...
You need a special tank and they aren't cheap as far as I recall. I think they're a bit of a faff too although I'm sure you'd get used to it like you get used to loading 35/120 onto spirals. I am waiting until we move to a house where I can have a darkroom and tray dev it. I have no clue how one deals with non-home dev of colour though?

Also you will need to consider scanning. I have a Plustek for 35mm and a V550 for MF. If you're scanning 4x5 you will either need a bigger scanner, or the patience to stitch with the 120 scanners. If you're DSLR scanning I guess you'd need the equipment for a bigger neg too?

These 2 issues are what's preventing me going LF at the moment.

[Edit to add, I misread your statement as a question, so apologies for answering a question you never asked...]
 
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MrDrizz said:
As I process my own 35mm moving to LF is a simple case of getting the right kind of tank.
Click to expand...
I use a Paterson system 4, 1 litre, 3 film tank with a 20th century cameras reel. Probably the best reel on the market, easy to use and always get even developing.
 
Not sure how much of the kit advertised HERE is left...
 
Woodsy said:
Ahh ok, so the number really just defines the size of the hole in the board that the lens itself sits within. For the sake of ease, 'modern' LF lenses have a front cell (group of elements) and a rear cell, which screw into the front and back of the shutter unit, respectively. Typically modern lenses were sold with shutters, so that the aperture iris built into the shutter unit had a calibrated settings scale suited to the specific lens it had attached to it. Copal was a brand of shutter, as were Seiko and Compur (?) and the number refers to the size of the unit itself, and the corresponding size of the hole in the lens board that it sits within.

The terms people use are 'the lens' which typically refers to the collection of the front and rear cells and the shutter unit (which typically does contain the aperture as well). The lens board is what the lens sits within in order to marry it to the front standard of the camera itself. It is then simply a case that the lens board needs to have the hole in the middle that fits the corresponding shutter unit, and a overall shape that matches your specific camera. The most common shapes are Linhof style (which camera like Ebony, Shen Hao, Chamonix, Intrepid, Chroma etc accept natively), which are about 96x98mm and have clipped corners at the bottom, and Sinar, which are 140x140mm. Unless you plan on getting an 10x8 camera, or a Sinar camera, it's unlikely you'll need a lens mounted in a Sinar lensboard. Not to confuse things, but you can transplant lenses between lens board styles, provided the holes match. So for example, a lens mounted in a copal 0 sinar lens board can be simply moved onto a copal 0 linhof style board, and vice versa.

The standard Copal shutter sizes are 0, 1, and 3, and there are a few other less common sizes as well. The main thing though is that any lens you buy should come as a complete unit (lens cells, shutter and lens board. If this is complete, and the lens board is the right style, you're all sorted :) If it doesn't come with a lens board, this is the easiest thing to fix, as one simply buys a suitable lens board for that shutter. In the beginning, perhaps stay clear of people selling 'lens cells only', as shutters are much harder to come by, and may not have an appropriate aperture scale for the cells you want to mount to it.

As for lenses that come without either a mechanical shutter or aperture, these are less common. Depending on what you shoot (portraits), I would not go for a lens without a shutter or aperture. Lenses without shutters are fine for long exposure (provided it comes with at least an aperture) as you can use 'top hat' timing - literally, use a top hat, or dark cloth to uncover and cover the lens. This is fine for exposures of tens of seconds or more, as the error in the precise timing is typically unnoticeable. Lenses that come without an aperture I would avoid personally.

Apologies, I know that's a lot to take in; do let me know if you want anything clarifying! :)
Click to expand...
Brilliant, that you so much.
 
Harlequin565 said:
You need a special tank and they aren't cheap as far as I recall. I think they're a bit of a faff too although I'm sure you'd get used to it like you get used to loading 35/120 onto spirals. I am waiting until we move to a house where I can have a darkroom and tray dev it. I have no clue how one deals with non-home dev of colour though?

Also you will need to consider scanning. I have a Plustek for 35mm and a V550 for MF. If you're scanning 4x5 you will either need a bigger scanner, or the patience to stitch with the 120 scanners. If you're DSLR scanning I guess you'd need the equipment for a bigger neg too?

These 2 issues are what's preventing me going LF at the moment.

[Edit to add, I misread your statement as a question, so apologies for answering a question you never asked...]
Click to expand...
I was looking at the Stearman press 445 as it looks pretty easy to load. Not cheap though.

Just found this B's reel.

www.bounetphoto.com

B's 4x5 developing reel Mk2 — Bounet-Photography

www.bounetphoto.com www.bounetphoto.com

As for scanning that would be the Fuji XT3 and light table.
 
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Recently I've been using a Paterson Orbital which I have found to be much easier than any of the tank based solutions. It was suggested that popping four dots of glue in the bottom of each quarter of the base helps to keep the developer swishing about under the sheet of film. So far it's worked very well for me.
 
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