Nikon firmware update rant

StewartR

StewartR

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Sorry, but I have got to get this off my chest. I've just spent some time updating the firmware on various Nikon DSLRs, and if you've never done this and you won't believe how incredibly stupid it is.

With Canon and Fuji equipment, it's really simple. Copy all the firmware files you've got onto a memory card, put the card into a camera, and the camera will identify the correct file(s). Easy peasy.

You'd think it would be the same for Nikon equipment. After all, the files all have usefully descriptive names - for example D750 firmware version 1.12 is D750_0112.bin - and they surely have metadata in the file headers to identify them. So just copy all the firmware files onto a card, put the card into a camera and away you go.

Only it doesn't work like that. Nikon cameras are incapable of reading the filenames, and incapable of reading the file headers. They require you to have one and exactly one .bin file on the card. Trouble is though, Nikon DSLRs have TWO firmware files - one for the basic camera functionality, and one with lens data. So if you need to update both, you can only do one at a time.

Updating 4 Canon or Fuji cameras:
  • Put card into PC. Copy all firmware files onto card.
  • Put card into camera #1. Update firmware.
  • Put card into camera #2. Update firmware.
  • Put card into camera #3. Update firmware.
  • Put card into camera #4. Update firmware.
Updating 4 Nikon cameras:
  • Put card into PC. Copy firmware file for camera #1 onto card.
  • Put card into camera #1. Update firmware.
  • Put card into PC. Delete firmware file for camera #1. Copy firmware file for camera #2 onto card.
  • Put card into camera #2. Update firmware.
  • Put card into PC. Delete firmware file for camera #2. Copy firmware file for camera #3 onto card.
  • Put card into camera #3. Update firmware.
  • Put card into PC. Delete firmware file for camera #3. Copy firmware file for camera #4 onto card.
  • Put card into camera #4. Update firmware.
  • Put card into PC. Delete firmware file for camera #4. Copy lens data file onto card.
  • Put card into camera #1. Update lens data.
  • Put card into camera #2. Update lens data.
  • Put card into camera #3. Update lens data.
  • Put card into camera #4. Update lens data.
Absolute madness. What were Nikon's engineers thinking?
 
Or have multiple cards that you only use for firmware updates... Slightly less annoying but not massively so :rolleyes:
 
srichards said:
Or have multiple cards that you only use for firmware updates... Slightly less annoying but not massively so :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
True. But I have 7 different types of Nikon DSLR, so that's 8 cards, which would be quite annoying.
 
Not very often, Nikon give us something via a firmware update, that is worth the effort of updating :(
 
DG Phototraining said:
Ha - I've always had the simplest of solutions to this :)

I've never bothered to update ANY firmware at all from whatever the camera came with, and I've never noticed anything wrong with any of them

Simples - and I like simples :)

Dave
Click to expand...

This^

My D700 turns 9 in January, still running on the firmware it left the factory with.
 
viewfromthenorth said:
This^

My D700 turns 9 in January, still running on the firmware it left the factory with.
Click to expand...
Without wishing to be presumptuous, not updating isn't an option for Stewart, I'm surmising some customers would take out of date firmware as 'substandard'.
He can't risk that. Whether right or wrong.
 
Phil V said:
Without wishing to be presumptuous, not updating isn't an option for Stewart, I'm surmising some customers would take out of date firmware as 'substandard'.
He can't risk that. Whether right or wrong.
Click to expand...

You may be right. Fortunately, I’m not renting my own cameras out, so I’m not fussed about what the seemingly inconsequential updates that Nikon issue every now and again! [emoji3]
 
Of course not all updates are inconsequential :)
 
StewartR said:
True. But I have 7 different types of Nikon DSLR, so that's 8 cards, which would be quite annoying.
Click to expand...

In the old days we'd install microsoft office with 20+ floppy disks. Having a few small memory cards for firmware updates wouldn't be too difficult? just need to find somewhere to store them safely
 
Phil V said:
Without wishing to be presumptuous, not updating isn't an option for Stewart, I'm surmising some customers would take out of date firmware as 'substandard'.
He can't risk that. Whether right or wrong.
Click to expand...
Spot on, Phil.
 
Graham W said:
True that. Fuji give you free stuff and improve the functionality of the camera...Nikon try to fix problems that shouldn't be there in the first place.
Click to expand...
Well if you want to be argumentative about it let me correct that for you ... Fuji gives you stuff and improves the functionality which should have been in the camera from the start AS WELL AS fixing problems which shouldn't be there in the first place.

To quote from http://www.fujifilm.com/support/digital_cameras/software/firmware/x/xt2/index.html
The firmware update Ver.2.12 from Ver.2.11 incorporates the following issue:
  1. The phenomenon is fixed that in rare cases, a freeze could occur during repeated CH (continuous high speed) shooting and so on.
 
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I think to be honest all manufacturers do that. There's a list of features which the developers would happily keep working on but the sales team need something to sell, deadlines etc to keep the company profitable.
There's occasionally bugs that get sorted on releases or additional features get added later (which were in the original feature set, just not announced).
In the case of Canon, sometimes they look at things like magic lantern and add similar features.
 
Byker28i said:
In the old days we'd install microsoft office with 20+ floppy disks. Having a few small memory cards for firmware updates wouldn't be too difficult? just need to find somewhere to store them safely
Click to expand...
Well yeah. I realise this is pretty much a First World problem.

But again, look at the workflow when a manufacturer releases a bunch of firmware updates to different cameras (as Nikon did, for instance, when they introduced AF-P lenses):

Canon workflow:
  • Put card into PC. Copy all new firmware files onto card.
  • Update cameras as described above.
Nikon workflow:
  • Put card for camera #1 into PC. Delete existing firmware file. Copy new firmware file for camera #1 onto card.
  • Put card for camera #2 into PC. Delete existing firmware file. Copy new firmware file for camera #2 onto card.
  • Put card for camera #3 into PC. Delete existing firmware file. Copy new firmware file for camera #3 onto card.
  • Put card for camera #4 into PC. Delete existing firmware file. Copy new firmware file for camera #4 onto card.
  • Put card for camera #5 into PC. Delete existing firmware file. Copy new firmware file for camera #5 onto card.
  • Put card for camera #6 into PC. Delete existing firmware file. Copy new firmware file for camera #6 onto card.
  • Put card for camera #7 into PC. Delete existing firmware file. Copy new firmware file for camera #7 onto card.
  • Update cameras as described above.
 
I feel your pain Stewart - being a Canon user only :D
Only real way around it is a card per camera body for nikon, update the firmware each time an update comes out. It's a pain but there it is. Having worked with software developers they at no point will have considered multiple body owners (even two).

Do you track software version on your inventory and can search which need doing when firmware updates come around?
 
Phil V said:
Without wishing to be presumptuous, not updating isn't an option for Stewart, I'm surmising some customers would take out of date firmware as 'substandard'.
He can't risk that. Whether right or wrong.
Click to expand...

Also I would guess that a lot of those customers would then be very tempted to update the firmware themselves (which I imagine could cause a few problems in itself).
 
Eloise said:
Well if you want to be argumentative about it let me correct that for you ... Fuji gives you stuff and improves the functionality which should have been in the camera from the start AS WELL AS fixing problems which shouldn't be there in the first place.
Click to expand...
Byker28i said:
I think to be honest all manufacturers do that. There's a list of features which the developers would happily keep working on but the sales team need something to sell, deadlines etc to keep the company profitable.
There's occasionally bugs that get sorted on releases or additional features get added later (which were in the original feature set, just not announced).
Click to expand...
I agree. Let he who has never released a piece of complete and bug-free software cast the first stone.

But Fuji really are exceptional in adding new functionality to their cameras. For example checkout the list of changes implemented by version 5.00 of the X-T1 firmware:
http://www.fujifilm.com/support/digital_cameras/manuals/pdf/index/x/fujifilm_xt1_manual_07_en.pdf

And they're still adding: version 5.20 added the capability, when tethered, to save all the camera settings to a file and to load all the camera settings from a file. That might not be a big deal in itself, but this is a camera which is over 3 years old and has been superseded by the X-T2. I don't think any of the other manufacturers bother to add functionality to models that have been superseded.
 
Eloise said:
Well if you want to be argumentative about it let me correct that for you ... Fuji gives you stuff and improves the functionality which should have been in the camera from the start AS WELL AS fixing problems which shouldn't be there in the first place.

To quote from http://www.fujifilm.com/support/digital_cameras/software/firmware/x/xt2/index.html
The firmware update Ver.2.12 from Ver.2.11 incorporates the following issue:
  1. The phenomenon is fixed that in rare cases, a freeze could occur during repeated CH (continuous high speed) shooting and so on.
Click to expand...
No I don't want to be argumentative. I stand by what I said. As and when Fuji introduce new features they make them available to previous models.
I don't know whether it's relevant or not but I'm a long time happy user of both systems. (So there! :))
 
@StewartR , just curious...
If Nikon cameras can't read the filename or headers of the update file you present it with, are you at risk of bricking, say, a D5 if you accidentally put the D500 card in?
 
Tori_T said:
@StewartR , just curious...
If Nikon cameras can't read the filename or headers of the update file you present it with, are you at risk of bricking, say, a D5 if you accidentally put the D500 card in?
Click to expand...
I ...... don't know. I assume there's some sort of safeguard. But this is the kind of thing that makes me want to ensure that everything is kept up to date, as @Phil V said. If my customers never need to update firmware, it eliminates the risk of a potentially catastrophic error.
 
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Have a Google for wrong Nikon firmware and there's a tale of a bricked D3000 (IIRC) due to wrong firmware. Advice was to send it back to Nikon.
 
Nod said:
Have a Google for wrong Nikon firmware...
Click to expand...
So while it seems to be possible, it also seems to be quite rare for people to do so.
A new main board is a bit of an extreme fix IMO; a way to (re)flash new/blank/corrupt boards has to exist, so I suspect the old boards would be going straight back out in factory refurb cameras.
 
I was told by a Nikon Tec to always update the firmware as there is always things in the update they don’t tell you about.
 
Icee said:
I was told by a Nikon Tec to always update the firmware as there is always things in the update they don’t tell you about.
Click to expand...

Yeah, like blocking 3rd party accessories? ;) (apparently)
 
That’s in built in every new camera they bring out.
 
When you do a (nikon) firmware update does it reset all your customised settings?
 
ancient_mariner said:
When you do a (nikon) firmware update does it reset all your customised settings?
Click to expand...
I've just custom reset an old D80 and made some changes to the default settings, then updated it from 1.01 to 1.11.
The custom settings had returned to their default values, so the answer (at least for this model) is yes.
 
Icee said:
That’s in built in every new camera they bring out.
Click to expand...

It may well be, but as non OEM products are eventually introduced to work with X-camera, folk buy & use them.
If they later do a firmware update this can then stop them working.
 
Tori_T said:
I've just custom reset an old D80 and made some changes to the default settings, then updated it from 1.01 to 1.11.
The custom settings had returned to their default values, so the answer (at least for this model) is yes.
Click to expand...

Thanks Tori.
 
Byker28i said:
Yes it does on a Canon. I had to remember what I set all mine to on my 5D mk3. I have them recorded now.
Click to expand...
If memory serves me correctly my 1d2 can send it's settings to a card that can then be used to reset the values, another thing not implemented on the 5?
Matt
 
MatBin said:
If memory serves me correctly my 1d2 can send it's settings to a card that can then be used to reset the values, another thing not implemented on the 5?
Matt
Click to expand...
Nope not that I'm aware of. I don't think they took that through to the 5D mk3, just on the 1D's
 
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