News Of The World - How delightful!

Sadly the embarrassing and damaging story that seems to be blowing up is about corrupt police officers.

It's truly not a personal go at you mate, and I'm sure you'll take it in the right spirit but there's a tiny irony in you mentioning press embarrassment under your user name; it's akin to News International's release yesterday morning which seemed to want to finger Andy Coulson and the David Cameron connection immediately before Prime Minister's Questions in the hope of diverting attention from themselves.

Then again I whooped when I heard Chris Huhne interviewed on the Today programme this morning and he was asked what sort of an enquiry he wanted into the News of the World. What he DIDN'T say was "any one that diverts attention from the press having uncovered evidence that I ALLEGEDLY perverted the course of justice!!"
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There's nothing new about police corruption, police officers have a lot of opportunities and a lot of influence, just as politicians and a lot of other people in positions of power do.

Surely, the mark of a civilised society is not the absence of corruption, corrupt practices, rank incompetence and the like, but what we as a society actually do about these things when they're discovered - and personally I think we do pretty well!

The media needs to be free of regulation, because the media is often the only 'agency' capable and motivated to expose the wrongdoers and so protect society from them. I watched a TV programme a couple of nights ago about slum landlords who exploit their tenants and ignore the laws, and the programme also highlighted the enforcing authorities that seem to be ignoring the problem and sitting on their hands.

It seems to me that a free press is probably the last, and most effective watchdog and so have a huge value to the public.

So, as long as unacceptable and illegal behaviour is made public and dealt with when the press cross the line, everything seems to me to me more or less OK
 
Garry
I agree, the problem is one corrupt police officer tars the rest.
At this stage however, it's not clear what form these 'payouts' took. If it was a chief crime reporter taking a Detective Superintendent out for a meal, and that was all declared, its not considered corruption.
I'm not sure I agree with that, but thats the way it is.
If on the other hand its some berk taking £100 to do a name or car check, then rightly it is considered to be corrupt. Lets wait and see which if either of the 2 camps it falls into.

Yves
The press will and do always scream about thier freedom when they are often rightly critisied, that defence actually has nothing to do with any freedom, to them it means doing what they want.
There's no press censorship in the UK, yes there are injuctions, but mostly to prevent tittle tattle which is frankly no one elses business anyway, who craes if a football player is shagging a tom!
I'd go so far as to say the press in the UK have gone far too far, and do need to put thier house in order.
 
Garry Edwards said:
There's nothing new about police corruption, police officers have a lot of opportunities and a lot of influence, just as politicians and a lot of other people in positions of power do.

Surely, the mark of a civilised society is not the absence of corruption, corrupt practices, rank incompetence and the like, but what we as a society actually do about these things when they're discovered - and personally I think we do pretty well!

The media needs to be free of regulation, because the media is often the only 'agency' capable and motivated to expose the wrongdoers and so protect society from them. I watched a TV programme a couple of nights ago about slum landlords who exploit their tenants and ignore the laws, and the programme also highlighted the enforcing authorities that seem to be ignoring the problem and sitting on their hands.

It seems to me that a free press is probably the last, and most effective watchdog and so have a huge value to the public.

So, as long as unacceptable and illegal behaviour is made public and dealt with when the press cross the line, everything seems to me to me more or less OK
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I agree. I was discussing this with my immediate colleagues today, and we were aghast that police officers - and civilian staff, don't forget - might sell such information to the press. I fully agree with the sentiments echoed by the Commissioner. While it's no mitigation for "the police" as a whole, so far the only vaguely comforting feature for me (so far) is that the Soham enquiry was handled by Cambridgeshire, and the Milly Dowler murder was entirely a Surrey matter until the emergence of Bellfield as a suspect in 2008. That being said, I'm sure it will be too much to hope that the Met will emerge unscathed, because I think it's pretty clear we won't.

I can't really offer assurances on an Internet forum, because I'm not in a position to do so, and I'm not an official spokesman for the MPS. I'm a borough-level Detective Constable working on the "front line". All I can say is that it saddens me to think that this goes on, and I know that most of my colleagues feel the same.

While making no apologies for corrupt practice anywhere, I do still think it's worth remembering that most people in most countries around the world regard their police forces as utterly corrupt in ways that are inconceivable over here - Mexican police officers, for example, routinely hire out their firearms to criminals in order to make extra cash on the side. Most European forces are fairly shonky in the way they do business, and there isn't a single force across the whole of South America, Asia or Africa that can really hold its head high.
 
Tip of the iceberg but good news as well.
Murdoch is too appalling for words.

Do the proper thing and cancel all your SKY subscriptions as well.
 
As everyone is now saying on twitter - how long till "The Sun On Sunday" ? :(
 
\o/

*Does a little dance*

Now, onto the Scum and the Daily Fail :D

I really want to see Murdoch hounded by the press. Hounded by paps, journo's, and PI's.
I want to see every little bit of his life torn to bits and speculated on. Rumours and thoughts written as if they were true. See how he likes it.
 
Last ever publication will have no adverts and all proceeds to charity.

Tempting, but no, thank you.
 
Photo Plod said:
I agree. I was discussing this with my immediate colleagues today, and we were aghast that police officers - and civilian staff, don't forget - might sell such information to the press.
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It doesn't bother me, in the sense that I haven't lost any confidence in the integrity of the police as a result.

I'm old enough to remember the Sweeny and the widespread corruption there, and I once saw a uniformed PC knock on a door near Earls Court and walk away, openly stuffing so many banknotes into his pockets that he was struggling to get them all in. Back then, if I'd complained nothing would have been done. But now, these things are considered to be wrong and are investigated properly, and even if the police aren't interested then the IPCC are, which to me is all the justification that's needed for the IPCC even if some police officers may regard them as unfair.

In other words, corrupt practices are now very much the exception rather than the norm.

Now, if the powers that be can do something about incompetence...
 
Last edition on Sunday. Tweeted by News Int 20 min ago.
That's a lot of unemployed photographers.

Sorry no link - on phone.
 
Update:

The Sun will be 7 days a week.

Rebranding exercise!
 
I wonder how many people at the NOTW who may lose their jobs were actually involved in all these wrong doings?

Not many is my guess...
 
It's only going to change it's name, it's called The Sun on the other 6 days of the week.
 
ding76uk said:
. Unfortunately News International is too big and any government is not powerful enough to take them on.
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Consumer pressure is big enough to bring them down - they are only powerful because consumers buy their sad ***** - if enough people dont buy and enough pressure is put on advertisers to stay away the whole group could feel it like a kick in the nads
 
168yo 'news'paper and 300 staff gone or repositioned, Rebekah Brooks unaffected:suspect:
 
AndyB1976 said:
Rebekah Brooks unaffected:suspect:
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ahh but "its inconceivable that she might have known" remember ( which is the least plausible denial since " I did not have sex with that woman" )
 
ding76uk said:
The NOTW is not gone, it is just undergoing a makeover.

All this does is buy them time. Unfortunately News International is too big and any government is not powerful enough to take them on.

A scapegoat, a BskyB buyout and a Sunday Sun will be the only results here.
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Absolutely correct
 
An interesting tactical move by big M.

The tragedy, as someones already said, is that a fair number of people who had nothing to do with any wrong doing will loose their jobs.

Garry

Corruption wasn't ever that big an issue, I joined the Met at the end of it and saw almost none. I'd wouldn't have ever had anything to do with it, and like most Police Officers I knew would go straight to CIB if I saw it happen. Yes, there was a certain amount of cheap or free kebabs, curry chinese meals, and yes, that is corruption, but brown envelopes? Nope.

The Sweeney still exist, and I know one of their DCI's very well, I taught her beats, shes as straight as a die, and so are most people is C8 (as was!). Was it ever as bent as portrayed? No, I don't think it was, but it was a job where you were very open to false allegations, as well as being tempted.

Think nothing got done about complaints in these days? Oh it did, Met Police Orders were full of dismissals for every thing you can think of. Including one guy who was dismissed for failing to ensure a vehicle owned by his wife had a VEL. Thats really scrapping the barrel, even the IPCC don't stoop to that!

Unfortunately, yes it will get worse again, if you pay Police poorly, then you increase the instances of corruption and HMG are cutting Police pay.
 
im always surprised by how much people hate the sun, nowt, but wanting to take down the Murdoch empire always strikes me as a bit odd...if you dont like them, just dont buy them! I hate the mail, i dont buy it. simples.
 
I doubt anyone will lose their jobs as there aren't many people working 7day weeks...the old NOTW staff will work on the Sunday edition of The Sun.

The whole "we didn't know" line from senior management is just utter *******s. These private detectives/investigators will have been paid...someone signed and authorised that expense which was presumably tens of thousands of pounds so it will have been someone senior.

The police just need to get all the people authorised to sign for such expenses in a room and questioned under oath. Someone will talk.
 
matty said:
im always surprised by how much people hate the sun, nowt, but wanting to take down the Murdoch empire always strikes me as a bit odd...if you dont like them, just dont buy them! I hate the mail, i dont buy it. simples.
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:plusone:

Also, it never ceases to amaze me when people I work with quote 'news' from the tabloid and actually believe it is factual...
 
Bernie174 said:
Garry

Yes, there was a certain amount of cheap or free kebabs, curry chinese meals, and yes, that is corruption, but brown envelopes? Nope.
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The free takeaways are still very much with us, to be fair to the police officers though I don't think that many take advantage, it's more a case of the shop owners refusing their money. If you joined at the end of the purge, how can you be sure that there were no brown envelopes? Maybe they just didn't need to share with you, or maybe you had made it clear which side of the fence you were on.

Bernie174 said:
The Sweeney still exist, and I know one of their DCI's very well, I taught her beats, shes as straight as a die, and so are most people is C8 (as was!). Was it ever as bent as portrayed? No, I don't think it was, but it was a job where you were very open to false allegations, as well as being tempted.
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A lot of temptation, a lot of opportunity and a few bent coppers as well as a lot of straight ones.

Bernie174 said:
Think nothing got done about complaints in these days? Oh it did, Met Police Orders were full of dismissals for every thing you can think of.
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I've always had friends in the job, and the way it was explained to me more than once, the problem was who should someone in the job actually complain too? Go past his own line of command and have real problems for not going to his Guv'nor, or go to his Guv'nor only to find that he'd chosen someone who wasn't exactly on the side of honest policing. Screwed either way

Bernie174 said:
Unfortunately, yes it will get worse again, if you pay Police poorly, then you increase the instances of corruption and HMG are cutting Police pay.
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We've found something to agree on! We will only ever get the police we deserve, and if we don't allow them to earn a decent living, and stop them from earning overtime, then honesty as well as efficiency are bound to suffer. Maybe the short notice overtime rates need looking at, but that's very different from forcing police officers to choose to work without pay or not do the job properly.
 
Steep said:
Engage brain before pressing "Submit"

Quite honestly I've read some idiotic stuff on this forum recently but that takes the biscuit!

If proven true, send the guilty parties to jail - end of problem. The right of free speech within the press and elsewhere is the only thing keeping our politicians honest and I really do not think you'd enjoy living in the UK without it.
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Eh ..... :eek:

Keeping our politicians HONEST ... Now thats ridiculous ,or have i read this wrong ?
 
From the Guardian, 28th June Link.
Was Murdoch already planning to dump the NoW?
Quote "News International has created what it calls a "managing editor structure" at its four newspapers in what appears to be a move towards a form of integration of daily and Sunday titles."
 
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So what about the likes of the Mail, and the Daily Mirror or other such red tops.

All this bile and scorn being poured out against NOTW and Murdoch, do people not think other newspapers don't do it, or is it OK until they get caught. And I don't hear too many people offering to throw out their Sky boxes....has that been overlooked?
 
PetethePrimate said:
From the Guardian, 28th June Link.
Was Murdoch already planning to dump the NoW?
Quote "News International has created what it calls a "managing editor structure" at its four newspapers in what appears to be a move towards a form of integration of daily and Sunday titles."
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Yes we knew there was a merger going on behind the scenes, with lots of departments and staff already move to the new project, this was also on Radio 4 on Tuesday.

I'll lay money on The Sun On Sunday being out within a month.

The other media companies and the public are not going to let go until someone at the top if NI has gone.
 
mxfun said:
Eh ..... :eek:

Keeping our politicians HONEST ... Now thats ridiculous ,or have i read this wrong ?
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Blackadder : Criminal record ?
Baldrick : Absolutely not
Blackadder : Oh for gods sake Baldrick you're going to be an MP - I'll just put fraud and sexual deviancy

I think garry meant keeping them more honest than the scrounging theiving bar stewards would be without oversight - after all its only thanks to the media that we know that they were putting duck houses on their expenses :lol:
 
I hate to say it, but big M is playing it quite well. Forget public opinion because as far as BskyB is concerned it can only be refused for specific reasons, one of which is his almost monopoly. By dropping the NoW, hes making himself more selectable.
He's also able to claim that it's not him that created the problems with the NoW is the past, it was the management, and he's dealt with it, by killing off the paper. Ok, its stable door after the horse etc...But, he's right!

I think he'll hang on a until he's got that sorted before the Sun on Sunday appears.

I also think there's an element of hatred at play here, in the Guardian (who are/have probably been up to the same thing!) and amongst politicians, who have never forgiven the press for exposing their fiddles with expenses, not to mention a great deal of miss behavior.

It goes to show that no group or organisation is squeaky clean (although our political masters would prefer that wasn't mentioned in relation to them!).
 
Looks as if Andy Coulson will be getting his collar felt in the morning, I wonder how quickly Cameron will be to distance himself from him now :lol:
 
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