New to RAW

[redhed17]

The easiest thing is to convert to TIFF and then edit that as much as you want with the final result saved as a JPEG.

Simples!

Is this save as a TIFF post RAW processing in NX-D, or just convert the RAW file with no changes to a TIFF, and then edit in Elements?

 

[redhed17]

I'm just going off what others have said here and to convert to .dng
I'm pretty clueless as you can see and have no idea of the difference between .tff and .dng

A TIFF is a (normally) non compressed image format, usually saved from another format like RAW, as there are only a few cameras that cam save as a TIFF in camera. Because of that it is a large file, which is good because you want the most data you can get when editing. It is a rendered file though, and any changes to the image are altering the actual pixels. Better than a JPEG, because that has been compressed to some degree, and some information has been thrown away. Whether you can see the difference in a TFF and a high Quality JPEG is debatable. And depending on what you actually want to do to the image editing wise, there may not be that much difference between a TIFF and a high Quality JPEG.

A RAW, or DNG file are not an image files, they are data files, which is why you normally need software to even see them on your computer, never mind process them. The DNG, unless a native format of the camera, (I think Leica and Pentax may offer that as an option) the DNG Converter software converts the cameras RAW into a DNG, which is a 'wrapper' for the RAW file from your camera. It retains the benefits and editability of your RAW file, but the DNG 'wrapper' makes the file compatible with older software. You also have the option to have the original cameras RAW file saved within the DNG file, at the expense of a larger file size.

And why RAW or DNG? Because any edits you do to colour, white balance and exposure etc, are manipulating data, rather than pixels. You have more leeway to make changes to the data than the pixels, with less visible side effects. I rarely have to go into Photoshop because the Adobe Camera Raw and Lightroom RAW processing options are so powerful.

For some JPEGs are enough, and if they want to edit, they are happy with those files, for others who want to edit their images, and would like the best possible file to edit, RAW is the best option in most peoples opinion.

 

[J40ADF]

Ok,
I think I am understanding a bit more now.

I've been editing .jpg files in my version of photoshop (elements 7)
The main editing I do is cropping, I generally try to lock the image size but sometimes will be a little creative with cropping manually.
I use the auto function and let Elements show me what it thinks the colour should look like but if I don't like the suggestion I just undo it and edit brightness/contrast/shadows/highlights.
I rarely mess around with colour/saturation/hue unless I'm 'overprocessing' for artistic content iyswim

To be honest, I have not noticed any loss of quality but I've not had anything to compare.

So, you can see why I'm reluctant to get up to date versions of editing software, what I have seems to be serving me well.

So, I can continue as I am. Happy in my ignorance.

Or

Having seen Nikon's Capture NX-D, It's clear that all that editing I'm doing in Elements, can be done with Capture NX-D. This allows me to edit using the .nef files, straight out of my camera, and then save them down as .jpg or if I want to use elements for any layering or more complex editing I can save them down as a .tff for use in elements.

How does this sound as a workflow?
(Have I used the right term there?)

 

[gramps]

Having seen Nikon's Capture NX-D, It's clear that all that editing I'm doing in Elements, can be done with Capture NX-D. This allows me to edit using the .nef files, straight out of my camera, and then save them down as .jpg or if I want to use elements for any layering or more complex editing I can save them down as a .tff for use in elements.

How does this sound as a workflow?
(Have I used the right term there?)

Exactly what many people do

 

[petersmart]

Is this save as a TIFF post RAW processing in NX-D, or just convert the RAW file with no changes to a TIFF, and then edit in Elements?

Just convert the RAW file to a TIFF (usually 16 bit) then edit it in whatever program you want.

The good thing about TIFF files is that you can edit them as much as you want without degrading the quality and almost all editing programs work with TIFFs so there's no waiting for the latest program to run your version of RAW or DNG etc.

And once you've finished editing them then convert to JPEGs to view etc.
.

 

[petersmart]

A TIFF is a (normally) non compressed image format, usually saved from another format like RAW, as there are only a few cameras that cam save as a TIFF in camera. Because of that it is a large file, which is good because you want the most data you can get when editing. It is a rendered file though, and any changes to the image are altering the actual pixels. Better than a JPEG, because that has been compressed to some degree, and some information has been thrown away. Whether you can see the difference in a TFF and a high Quality JPEG is debatable. And depending on what you actually want to do to the image editing wise, there may not be that much difference between a TIFF and a high Quality JPEG.

There is if you do a lot of editing because the JPEG, even when converted to a TIFF, will often show "banding" whereas a RAW file (12 or 14 bit) converted to TIFF gives you much more headroom in the editing.

 

[J40ADF]

I'd only be going two ways using this workflow;
1 - .nef - .jpg using Capture NX-D only
Or
2 - .nef - .tff edit in photoshop the things I cant do in Capture NX-D then save as .jpg

 

[redhed17]

Just convert the RAW file to a TIFF (usually 16 bit) then edit it in whatever program you want.

The good thing about TIFF files is that you can edit them as much as you want without degrading the quality and almost all editing programs work with TIFFs so there's no waiting for the latest program to run your version of RAW or DNG etc.

And once you've finished editing them then convert to JPEGs to view etc.
.

The larger uncompressed 16bit TIFF file, as opposed to a compressed 8bit JPEG file, will give you more options when editing as you say, especially extreme editing, but you can't really "edit them as much as you want without degrading the quality". If you are trying to make too large a change, in colour for example, the image will degrade. Same with RAW files, except there may be a bit more leeway, because you are manipulating data rather than pixels, and a colorspace is only applied in saving into whatever format you choose.

There is if you do a lot of editing because the JPEG, even when converted to a TIFF, will often show "banding" whereas a RAW file (12 or 14 bit) converted to TIFF gives you much more headroom in the editing.

I think I said depending on what you want to do to an image may determine what type of file you edit, and whether it would make a noticeable difference. Simple edits may not require a TIFF file, where lots of extreme edits may benefit from the larger 16bit TIFF file as you say.

I personally do as much as I can in the RAW processor, colour correction, white balance correction, exposure changes, noise reduction, straightening, lens corrections, sharpening etc, leaving out of the ordinary things to do Photoshop. And I would open straight from Camera Raw into Photoshop which will open (I think) a 16 TIFF in the Pro Photo colorspace, to give me the optimum file to work with from the RAW file. I very rarely use Photoshop now as I can do a whole lot to a file in Camera Raw (and occasionally Lightroom).

We are so blessed to be living in a time that allows us to manipulate (when needed) images so much and so easily.


The OP seems to have decided on his course action from now on. Hopefully he will find some improvements whatever way he does it.

 

[J40ADF]

Well, I have a plan.
Thanks for everyone who has held my hand and helped me to understand this as I was clueless when I started.
I'm used to a strip of negatives, ann enlarger, dev fix and stop chemicals and a darkroom (that was over 30 years ago now though)

I had originally been editing .jpg in my version of elements, I'm now going to change my workflow with all of the help and advise I've had on this thread.