New British Eventing Rules

tiler65 said:
I notice that it is only a guideline and not a rule enforcement, so will anything change?
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Technically BE own the IP rights to all photographs taken at affiliated events. It's more of an instruction to organisers at the moment, but if things don't improve then they'll start cracking down on rogue photographers who are flogging photos or (worse) just giving them away.
 
It's a good idea in principle but is virtually unenforceable. The stewards, fence judges etc are busy enough without having to interrogate anyone with a "zoom lens".

I totally agree that something needs to be done. I'm just not sure how any form of prohibition will ever work other than at the few 4* events.

It will be interesting to see if there is any feedback from the early season events.

Andy
 
Keebsuk said:
It's a good idea in principle but is virtually unenforceable. The stewards, fence judges etc are busy enough without having to interrogate anyone with a "zoom lens".

I totally agree that something needs to be done. I'm just not sure how any form of prohibition will ever work other than at the few 4* events.

It will be interesting to see if there is any feedback from the early season events.

Andy
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Banning cameras is the only way. Is that going to happen?
 
Keebsuk said:
It's a good idea in principle but is virtually unenforceable. The stewards, fence judges etc are busy enough without having to interrogate anyone with a "zoom lens".

I totally agree that something needs to be done. I'm just not sure how any form of prohibition will ever work other than at the few 4* events.

It will be interesting to see if there is any feedback from the early season events.

Andy
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Already been discussed. And you're right, policing at an event would be a nightmare if it was just a bunch of anonymous amateurs However, 90% of the people causing a problem are already known.

The other method of enforcement is 'after the fact', requiring a photographer to remove their images if they are deemed to be for other than private use.
 
The whole question of "rights" seems strange to me.
Most of my life any one could photograph anything.
No one else even cared.

Professionals (including myself) could only sell what they took if it was better than other offerings.
Amateurs rarely sold anything. (good or not)
In most fieds of enterpries "closed shops" are banned; I can not understand why photographers now think they should be protected in this way.

official Professionals had the advantage in as much as they could go where they chose (with in the guidelines set by the organisers)

I see no reason at all why some one should not give away their own photographs for free, if they want to, or sell them if they can. The price is totally irrelevant
 
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The other side to this is people like me who turn up with an DSLR to enjoy the sport and take a few photos but get hounded by stewards etc. Daughter turns up with top end point and shoot no questions get asked. The ones most likely to turn up on flickr etc are daughters.
 
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Steve Smith said:
No chance!

Steve.
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No chance? How do you work that out?

It's part of British Eventing's T&Cs with all affiliated events that BE reserve the intellectual property rights over both still and moving images. It has been for years.
 
DemiLion said:
No chance? How do you work that out?

It's part of British Eventing's T&Cs with all affiliated events that BE reserve the intellectual property rights over both still and moving images. It has been for years.
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They might well claim those rights, but how far up the legal chain have they been tested.
They might win a particular limited case that was well enough defined at the event, but I doubt they would win in all situations.

Judges are not keen on ill defined wide blanket claims.

They are rather like saying, these belong to me because I say so. Which of course is meaningless.
 
Its only advice and they'll have no control of fb or similar places people nick images from but may help at the actual event as I'm sure organisers will try to enforce it.

At some ice skating events they follow a similar policy and it is anounced over the mike trhat no photography or video is allowed while the skaters are on the ice.
 
Intresting, my brother rides in lower level and I was planning to go along to few to get some photos of him this year, so would private stop me posting them on my facebook site for him to see (I have open to generally public), would it also stop people posting them on here as well?
 
yamahatdm900 said:
Intresting, my brother rides in lower level and I was planning to go along to few to get some photos of him this year, so would private stop me posting them on my facebook site for him to see (I have open to generally public), would it also stop people posting them on here as well?
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Question should be "Will you be allowed to photograph him?"
 
snapzz said:
Question should be "Will you be allowed to photograph him?"
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I can't see how any event like eventing which allows paying spectators being able to enforce a total ban on all cameras (camera phones, compacts etc)
and the link that DemiLion posted doesn't say that there will be a total ban on photography but they will only allow it for private purposes.
 
yamahatdm900 said:
I can't see how any event like eventing which allows paying spectators being able to enforce a total ban on all cameras (camera phones, compacts etc)
and the link that DemiLion posted doesn't say that there will be a total ban on photography but they will only allow it for private purposes.
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They do it at the golf 'Open'
 
yamahatdm900 said:
I never been, so how do stop people using their camera phones?
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Mobiles were banned completely in 2006, but it was lifted last year.
 
yamahatdm900 said:
I can't see how any event like eventing which allows paying spectators being able to enforce a total ban on all cameras (camera phones, compacts etc)
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Paying customers enter event on private property do so under organisers rules. They say no photography then they mean no photography and if you get caught you may/will be evicted. It does however depend on them enforcing the rule though.
 
In the big events - Badminton etc (can be any major sporting event really) - do the pro agencies 'pay' to shoot at these events? (A licence of some description?)
 
snapzz said:
Paying customers enter event on private property do so under organisers rules. They say no photography then they mean no photography and if you get caught you may/will be evicted. It does however depend on them enforcing the rule though.
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I know and do apprecaite that, but reading the BE press release they state that photography will be banned except for private puposes, they are not saying that photography is not allowed. How do they at tell at the time if its for private purposes or not:shrug:

Would private purposes stop me taking pictures of my brother and sharing them with him?
 
yamahatdm900 said:
Would private purposes stop me taking pictures of my brother and sharing them with him?
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Based on the fact that it is only a press release and not a final statement of intent, the line underneath "Further wording is currently being amended and will be posted in due course. " should make it clearer. My guess is you will need to register either before or on the day and wear some sort of badge/label displaying you are able to photograph.
 
snapzz said:
Paying customers enter event on private property do so under organisers rules. They say no photography then they mean no photography and if you get caught you may/will be evicted. It does however depend on them enforcing the rule though.
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But any photographs you have taken before your eviction are still yours. They have no rights to them and cannot order you to delete them.

Also, terms and conditions have to be known before the ticket is purchased. So if the only place you can find the terms and conditions is on the back of the ticket, they are invalid as they are trying to impose them after you entered into a contract.

yamahatdm900 said:
Would private purposes stop me taking pictures of my brother and sharing them with him?
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No. Just go ahead and don't worry about it.


Steve.
 
Steve Smith said:
But any photographs you have taken before your eviction are still yours. They have no rights to them and cannot order you to delete them.
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Look up Trespass Ab Initio. It's how Dataco works and they use it very very successfully.
 
Steve Smith said:
Also, terms and conditions have to be known before the ticket is purchased. So if the only place you can find the terms and conditions is on the back of the ticket, they are invalid as they are trying to impose them after you entered into a contract.
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Wrong!



Steve Smith said:
No. Just go ahead and don't worry about it.
Steve.
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More sound advise on how to be evicted!
 
Re Dataco a few things:
it is a lot easier to "police" in a stadium
it is a lot easier to prosecute when you have the money to do it
There is vested interest in them doing this as it gives football even more money.
 
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