Networking Woes

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ACW

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With a few internet hungry devices in one room I think I need to reconfigure my set up.

It's currently 2 cabled into the room in question. 1 into the Laptop which is my main browsing / webby things machine and always plugged in, and 1 which switches between a games console, tv box and pc when needed. This is an obvious P.I.T.A.

I also have a NAS which I'm plugging straight into the PC / Laptop, but can't set up at the actual router downstairs. I want physical access to the NAS in the specified room.

Wireless is not an option as it does not reach to where I am.

If I've understood correctly, I should be able to plug either ethernet cable into another router(?) or some such device, creating a subnet(?) and giving me 4/5 sockets? I know I'm nowhere near the limit in which I would need to create a subnet, so is there another option?

Ideally the NAS will not be connected to the outside network.

Probably around 20 - 25 devices using the network.

I can't move the router, nor have any more cables coming off of it.

The top part of the image is what I have, and the bottom half is what I (think I) want.

View attachment 4146

Any advice?
 
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You want a gigabit 5 port switch not a router. Make sure you are using cat 6 cable.

Duff cable can slow things down. 100 mbit might get a bit swamped if you have a lot of activity. Hubs are also slower so make sure all multi port devices are definitely switches and not hubs.
 
Jin said:
Wait I am struggling with your explanation here.

Why would you introduce an additional router for those devices?

From what I gather you want everything cabled? in which case you don't need an additional router for that.
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What he said.

Also are you sure you have a nas if you're plugging it into your pc rather than on to the network?
 
srichards said:
You want a gigabit 5 port switch not a router. Make sure you are using cat 6 cable.

Duff cable can slow things down. 100 mbit might get a bit swamped if you have a lot of activity. Hubs are also slower so make sure all multi port devices are definitely switches and not hubs.
Click to expand...


When was the last time you even saw a hub?!

Don't bother with a gigabit switch or cat6.

A gigabit device will only operate as a fast as the slowest device on the network. So if your laptop or the switch or router further down the line isn't gigabit rated then it will auto-negotiate to 100mbps. As a result Cat6 is wasted upon the network. Cat5e which is cheaper is capable of near gigabit speed but isn't guaranteed which is why true gigabit networks will use Cat6

neil_g said:
What he said.

Also are you sure you have a nas if you're plugging it into your pc rather than on to the network?
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My assumption this is rented accommodation and OP isn't the master of the router hence using a NAS on USB??
 
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Gigabit isn't entirely wasted if only used for internal traffic (pc accessing the nas for example). No need for cat6 though, cat5e is perfectly fine for gigabit.

Wouldn't necessarily say hubs are much/noticeably slower persay but as above can you even get hubs any more (at least for the reputable network names).
 
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Okay so why not just move the existing 5 port switch into the room with the pc/ps3 etc. and the users currently running from that plug into the router? If its a capacity problem then just add in a switch where you currently have the second router on the diagram.
 
neil_g said:
Gigabit isn't entirely wasted if only used for internal traffic (pc accessing the nas for example). No need for cat6 though, cat5e is perfectly fine for gigabit.
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Which is why I said, "So if your laptop or the switch or router further down the line isn't gigabit rated". ;)
 
Drobo? I can't remember any synology, or qnap with dual type. Netgear I'm not so sure but I threw those in the bin a long time ago ;)

OP is this for a student digs or similar? If so I would consult your campus IT dept on what can and cannot be plugged in. You don't want to start putting dhcp servers on their network for example but they're should have preventative measures in place which shuts down your port.
 
USB = DAS (directly attached)
LAN = NAS (attached to network)
 
Wasn't expecting so many replies this quickly, thanks for taking the time to reply.

I'll try and clarify where possible:

neil_g said:
Also are you sure you have a nas if you're plugging it into your pc rather than on to the network?
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^ Yes definitely a NAS box (although as mentioned, not currently on primary network). I'm connecting it by ethernet, but port to port, so not ideal. Another reason I'm trying to streamline it all.

Jin said:
Wait I am struggling with your explanation here.

Why would you introduce an additional router for those devices?

From what I gather you want everything cabled? in which case you don't need an additional router for that.
Click to expand...
^ Everything cabled is the aim. Only reason router came to mind (bare in mind I know practically nothing about networking) was that I wanted the devices in this room separate to the rest of those in the house. Not essential, just presumed it would be more secure.

srichards said:
You want a gigabit 5 port switch not a router. Make sure you are using cat 6 cable.

Duff cable can slow things down. 100 mbit might get a bit swamped if you have a lot of activity. Hubs are also slower so make sure all multi port devices are definitely switches and not hubs.
Click to expand...
^ There is already a 5 port switch in-between the router and the room (see top diagram for current layout). Is it that simple that I can add another to the chain?

Jin said:
A gigabit device will only operate as a fast as the slowest device on the network. So if your laptop or the switch or router further down the line isn't gigabit rated then it will auto-negotiate to 100mbps. As a result Cat6 is wasted upon the network. Cat5e which is cheaper is capable of near gigabit speed but isn't guaranteed which is why true gigabit networks will use Cat6


My assumption this is rented accommodation and OP isn't the master of the router hence using a NAS on USB??
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^ I can confirm nothing is Cat6. Just Cat5e.

NAS is being used by ethernet, but I don't have a spare socket connection for the NAS upstairs to put it onto the network (plus I also would prefer it was local to the room). I require easy physical access to the device too as I use the front interface for 1 touch transferring.

I am the master of the router and in a private property (but with 5 of us living here need to make sure whatever I do doesn't affect them). I was ideally after a solution that didn't require reworking everything that's already set up.
 
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You can use an ethernet router, not an ADSL router.

This would provide your own wireless (if you buy one with wireless ;) ) and your own private network no one else can access.
 
ACW said:
^ Everything cabled is the aim. Only reason router came to mind (bare in mind I know practically nothing about networking) was that I wanted the devices in this room separate to the rest of those in the house.


.
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Clarified, then yeah thats what you want to do.

I highly recommend Mikrotik for routers, cheap routers with amazing features built into it. It is a bit of a scary interface to newbies but there is a really good support forum and a lot of wiki content plus it will generally work straight out the box anyway.

If you do buy a router make it one with a wireless access point built into it and that will solve your wireless issue in your end of the property and all your guests will love you forever.

HOWEVER, you need to consider some bandwidth management.

That 5 port switch currently connected to the router.

Port 1 goes to the router
port 2 goes to to your PC
Port 3 goes to your PS3

Where does ports 4 and 5 go?
 
Jin said:
Clarified, then yeah thats what you want to do.

I highly recommend Mikrotik for routers, cheap routers with amazing features built into it. It is a bit of a scary interface to newbies but there is a really good support forum and a lot of wiki content plus it will generally work straight out the box anyway.

If you do buy a router make it one with a wireless access point built into it and that will solve your wireless issue in your end of the property and all your guests will love you forever.

HOWEVER, you need to consider some bandwidth management.

That 5 port switch currently connected to the router.

Port 1 goes to the router
port 2 goes to to your PC
Port 3 goes to your PS3

Where does ports 4 and 5 go?
Click to expand...

Thanks for the recommendation, browsing their site now. They seem to be in budget. More wireless would go down pretty well too :LOL:

The 5 port switch goes:

Port 1 router
port 2 PC
Port 3 PS3 / BT Vision
Port 4 Xbox (another room)
Port 5 PC (another room)

Other devices are either wireless elsewhere in the house, or off of other outlets from the downstairs router.

Presumably I'd keep the BT Vision box in P3, use P2 for the router, leave the rest as they are, and then off of that router have the PS3, PC, Laptop, NAS etc by way of another 5 port switch?
 
Dale_tem said:
You can use an ethernet router, not an ADSL router.

This would provide your own wireless (if you buy one with wireless ;) ) and your own private network no one else can access.
Click to expand...

That is just what I'm after, thank you. Browsing through a few options now. Looking forwards to no more constant cable changing.
 
I've used Draytek in the past

You may be limited down to 100Mbit for the connection to the other network, but should be able to get gigabit ports for your LAN.
 
ACW said:
That is just what I'm after, thank you. Browsing through a few options now. Looking forwards to no more constant cable changing.
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ACW said:
Thanks for the recommendation, browsing their site now. They seem to be in budget. More wireless would go down pretty well too :LOL:

The 5 port switch goes:

Port 1 router
port 2 PC
Port 3 PS3 / BT Vision
Port 4 Xbox (another room)
Port 5 PC (another room)

Other devices are either wireless elsewhere in the house, or off of other outlets from the downstairs router.

Presumably I'd keep the BT Vision box in P3, use P2 for the router, leave the rest as they are, and then off of that router have the PS3, PC, Laptop, NAS etc by way of another 5 port switch?
Click to expand...

You probably wouldn't need another switch, most ethernet routers have 5 ports.

So
Port 1 = Incoming connection from the other switch
Port 2 = Nas
Port 3 = Laptop
Port 4 = PS3
Port 5 = BT Vision

between you and your housemate you are unlikely to bottleneck at the router so generally you should be okay.
 
ACW said:
That is just what I'm after, thank you. Browsing through a few options now. Looking forwards to no more constant cable changing.
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If you definitely want wireless then have a look at the asus mentioned in a few other recent threads. Seems to be very recommended.

If you do get a router then remember to turn of dhcp and let the original router hand it all so you don't confuse matters.
 
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If you want people outside of the room, but on your side of the Internet (i.e. the "people" hanging off the router or switch in your diagram) to have access to anything in the room, you don't want a router (or at least you don't want it in router mode). Personally, I'd go for a decent switch. You also only want to connect a single cable between the router outside the room and whatever you have inside the room otherwise you'll get a network loop. It also isn't clear if you have a NAS or DAS (I suspect a DAS from your description).

Unless you know exactly what you are doing with a router and how to set it up and why, I'd go for a switch....
 
well it will (for that port).

for example a gig switch connected to a 100mbps device will negotiate at 100mpbs. the other ports of the switch (if connected to a compatible device) will still be able to connect at 1000mbps although there will be a "bottleneck" when hitting the slower connection.

i believe that is what he is saying.
 
What you've said above is accurate, saying a device will only work as fast as the slowest device on the network is wrong.
 
inkiboo said:
That is completely wrong.
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Not perfectly worded made a lot worse by you taking it out of context but Neil seemed to take the correct understanding...

But the point still stands unless your laptop has a gigabit port on it it would be pointless to have anything else gigabit rated.
 
The cost difference is minimal. Buying fast Ethernet equipment as opposed to Gig Ethernet will just mean buying twice. Don't skimp on network infrastructure. It will cost you (been there, done that, got the T)
 
Thank you all for the further advice.

I hadn't replied yet as I don't have any real updates yet. Time isn't on my side at the moment.

Soon as I get a chance I'll be following some of the suggestions above and posting the results. Not noticing the lack of connectivity at the moment as I haven't had chance to use any of it!
 
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