Nani's "goal" v Spurs

What should have happened

  • Ref should have blown for free kick and not played advantage

    Votes: 13 24.5%

  • Ref should have ruled out goal after Nani scored

    Votes: 7 13.2%

  • Goal should stand, you should play to the whistle

    Votes: 33 62.3%
  • Total voters
    53
cambsno

cambsno

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Interested to see other peoples opinions re: Nani's goal v Spurs.

Ideally would like to keep this objective and not think it was fine just because you are a Man U fan or hate Spurs, or that it should not have counted just because you are a Spurs fan.

I cant decide myself. On the one hand, Nani did handball and maybe the ref should have given a free kick, but then on the other hand, it would be more of an advantage to Gomes to have the ball in hand, rather than take the kick from where the offence took place so maybe advantage was right to do.

I think the goal was the right thing though as

a) Advantage would be of slightly more benefit to Spurs than a free kick.
b) If Gomes thought it was a free kick, then why did he not place the ball where the offence took place.
c) In football you are always taught to play to the whistle, even if you think the decision is wrong.
 
cambsno said:
I think the goal was the right thing though as

a) Advantage would be of slightly more benefit to Spurs than a free kick.
b) If Gomes thought it was a free kick, then why did he not place the ball where the offence took place.
c) In football you are always taught to play to the whistle, even if you think the decision is wrong.
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A) The advantage went to Man U, they scored....
B) Although it's not right, many players mover the ball forward to take a free kick. If you watch, Gomez seems to be asking the ref if it's OK to take the kick, but he doesn't give Gomez any feedback.
C) Yes you are, which is why Gomez was asking the ref (see above).

Nani should have got a yellow card for diving, another for deliberate handball, and a third for petulance when he didn't get his own way. But we are talking about Man Utd at Old Trafford, where you can NEVER give major decisions against them.

Clattenburg is a terrible ref, he's made more errors on the pitch than Titus Bramble !!

Steve
 
Ref should have blown in the first place for the hand ball, then again he could have booked Nani for diving and/or the handball which would have resulted in the free kick

but on the other side, Gomes should have played to the whistle so you can see both sides of it
 
The goal should have stood.

Clattenburg said he didn't think Nani had been fouled but when Nani handled the ball he allowed play to go on as an advantage for Spurs.

If Gomez had just cleared the ball upfield then nobody would be questioning Clattenburg's handling of the situation but Gomez made a dogs dinner of the advantage.
 
would have chosen 2 options:
advantage Spurs......... and
play to the whistle.......one of the biggest rules in football
 
Rookie mistake, one of the first things you get taught in schoolboy football is 'play to the whistle',
 
AndyJ1980 said:
would have chosen 2 options:
advantage Spurs......... and
play to the whistle.......one of the biggest rules in football
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Surely however there was no advantage so he should have stopped it?

Agree with playing to the whistle though
 
play to the whistle....But the linesman had his flag up for handball and there was confusion, then Nani slyly placed himself by the ball.
How strange the ref went over to the linesman (who was clearly seen to mouth the words "i know" to Bale) to consult him and the ref waved the Spurs players away and DIDNT wave Ferdinand (united) away.
The referee's account had monies wired this morning !
 
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Simmotino said:
Handball isn't a bookable offence, deliberate or otherwise, unless it is in a deliberate attempt to gain an advantage.
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The only reason someone would handle the ball deliberately is to gain an advantage whether it be stopping an opponents attack or helping your own team it is still gaining an advantage so should be a booking.
 
Simmotino said:
Handball isn't a bookable offence, deliberate or otherwise, unless it is in a deliberate attempt to gain an advantage.
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Deliberate handball is definitely a bookable offence, whether it gains you an advantage or not, as you are seeking to gain an advantage by an unlawful act.

Let's face it, the referee should have stopped the game as he did not have control of the situation.

I hate Spurs, I'm a Gooner; however the ref had lost the plot and was not prepared to take action against man Utd at Old Trafford.

Steve
 
Jelster said:
Deliberate handball is definitely a bookable offence, whether it gains you an advantage or not.
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Sorry Steve, but I'm afraid you are wrong.

It is only deemed a bookable offence if deliberate handball is used to score a goal or gain advantage by preventing the opposition gaining possession.

Neither of those could realistically be levelled at Nani in this instance.
 
Simmotino said:
Sorry Steve, but I'm afraid you are wrong.

It is only deemed a bookable offence if deliberate handball is used to score a goal or gain advantage by preventing the opposition gaining possession.

Neither of those could realistically be levelled at Nani in this instance.
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Correct. Redknapp is talking out his backside. Maybe he should spend less time having a go at the ref, and instead coach his goalkeeper on playing to the whistle and not assuming he has a free kick.
 
Graham00 said:
play to the whistle....But the linesman had his flag up for handball and there was confusion, then Nani slyly placed himself by the ball.
How strange the ref went over to the linesman (who was clearly seen to mouth the words "i know" to Bale) to consult him and the ref waved the Spurs players away and DIDNT wave Ferdinand (united) away.
The referee's account had monies wired this morning !
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No. The linesman had his flag up AFTER Gomes was right in his face. And Nani played to the Whistle like any normal player would do.

And for people to say Nani dived are ignoring the fact he had his shirt pulled then?
 
As I see it there was a handball (no question) but there was little advantage to be gained. The ref was wrong not to blow the whistle but it's understandable why he didn't. As it was, Gomes was foolish to protest with the ref rather than getting the ball safe and the goal was right to stand. The absolute worst thing they could have done in that situation was disallow the goal.
It was pretty disappointing to see the spurs team sent away from the ref and Ferdinand allowed to hang around, that's something I'm sure the ref will regret and learn from.
Aside from that the advantage was justly played (although could have just as easily not been played) and the goal was legitimate. Harsh on spurs but within the rules of the game as they stand.
 
In my view the goal should have stood, but when the ref speaks to the assistant he had the chance to rightfully overturn that (I know it sounds like I'm contradicting myself by read on)

Firstly, the ref never blew the whistle for the free kick. It could be that he never saw the original handball (Highly possible considering that it was on the goal side and blocked by Nani's and Gomez bodies)

Secondly, neither did the assistant at the time. When Nani had tapped the ball into the net, the assistant started to run back to the halfway line.

Now to contradict myself a little but still remain correct. When the assistant had raised his flag, this gave the ref a get out clause. He could have taken on board what had happened and held his hands up and say "Lads I got this one wrong....my bad. Free kick to Spurs" However while he would have been right to do so, he is also right to stand by his original call and give the goal.

Refs are generally advised that they should never give an advantage if the foul was on the defending team if the ball is in the defending teams third of the half (So in this case from the Spurs by-line to about 10/15 yards short of half way). This is due to any possible advantage been given resulting in a disadvantage to the defending team if the ball was lost from the advantage given, therefore turning advantage into disadvantage.

The whole situation could have been avoided by the simplest 2 rules that keepers should always abide by.

1 - Play to the whistle.
2 - If the ball is in your hands, make sure it is safe to put it on the deck before doing so.
 
If it wasn't a foul (couldn't have been as there was no penalty) and Nani goes down like a sack of spuds (which he did) then it should have been a "feigning" which is a bookable offence.

Nani prevented the ball being played by grabbing it with his hand therefore not allowing Gomez to play the ball quickly (no advantage then, and Nani definitely gained an advantage by slowing the play down).

When he didn't get his free kick Nani rolled around the floor like a petulant 2 year old, but as it's Man Utd at Old Trafford we'll ignore that should we ?

I don't like Spurs at all but I'm really fed up of seeing Man Utd get everything their own way. As for Ferdinand he should have been given a yellow card also.

I can't blame Nani for putting the ball in the net, but the ref got that situation so wrong. He's a c**p ref anyway and shouldn't be in control of Premiership games.

Harry always has too much to say but he has a point, if the ref is poor why can't he say so on TV ??

Steve
 
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There was an advantage to Spurs. If the ref had given a free kick, it would have been taken from the 6 yard line on the floor, which normally would mean less distance and accuracy on the kick than the keeper kicking it from his hands. By playing advantage Gomes could have had a more accurate kick, or even throw the ball out. Gomes 'assumed' that he would get a free kick.
 
Seeing as Nani Deliberately handballed, even without the Ref blowing, he knew he has fouled. So ethically he shouldn't have even tried to score. Seeing as he did, and I have seen this in the past, Alex Ferguson should have instructed his players to allow Spurs to score to level things up. But then "Sir" alex is never the gentleman is he. The whole of the stadium knew it was a foul, just like with Henry and the Irish, and it should not of been a goal. It is instances like this when Fifa need to introduce some kind of punishment after the final whistle have blown, so that players who do act like Nani did face some kind of ethical yellow/red card for cheating, which the Hand ball was.
 
lawrie29 said:
Seeing as Nani Deliberately handballed, even without the Ref blowing, he knew he has fouled. So ethically he shouldn't have even tried to score. Seeing as he did, and I have seen this in the past, Alex Ferguson should have instructed his players to allow Spurs to score to level things up.
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Thats rubbish, lots of players foul or handball but only stop if the ref blows. I gave never seen a player foul and then give the ball back.
 
There have been occasions when goals have been scored under the wrong circumstances, when the opposition have an injury for example and the scoring team have allowed the opposition to score one back without contesting the ball.

And maybe that is what is wrong with football. In cricket, for a long time before replays, and in the lower levels of the game, you are expected to say if you knicked the ball, or stepped over the boundary rope. And in look at Golf, Ian woosnam could have played on with an extra club in his bag, but owned up and disqualified himself.

I am not saying that the game should be played with a lad of pomp, but if a player could be honest and have a conscience, the game would be the better for it.
 
This sits with me as a lot of other incidents of this ilk do.

Nani did nothing wrong in regard to the laws of the game, however it was not in the spirit (that's assuming there is any left in the money-dominated, win-at-all-costs Premiership). If Clattenburg had any degree of common sense he would have given the free-kick retrospectively after talking to the assistant. I suspect that being at Old Trafford played a part in the decision to allow the goal to stand.
 
SuperAP said:
I suspect that being at Old Trafford played a part in the decision to allow the goal to stand.
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Likewise, if it was at White Hart Lane, I suspect we would have seen the opposite.
 
There have been occasions when goals have been scored under the wrong circumstances, when the opposition have an injury for example and the scoring team have allowed the opposition to score one back without contesting the ball.
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Only a couple of extremes come to mind. What about when Reading (or Watford) scored the goal that was not given by Attwell, did they give them a goal to make up for it? If a team gets a penalty which is not a penalty do they miss? When Roy Carroll 'saved' the Spurs shot the other year do you expect him to say it was a goal to the ref?
 
Jelster said:
If it wasn't a foul (couldn't have been as there was no penalty) and Nani goes down like a sack of spuds (which he did) then it should have been a "feigning" which is a bookable offence.
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So Steve, what you're saying is. If there is any contact during the game that is not deemed as a foul causing a player to go to ground, then he should be booked for diving ??? Have you been to the Arsene Wenger school of let's get rid of tackling from football ?
 
As someone who plays 5 aside (to a very low standard), you can fall over without diving or being fouled! I am not as quick as I was in my younger days but even now, if I run at full speed and get a slight knock it can be very easy to lose balance and go over.
 
cambsno said:
Only a couple of extremes come to mind. What about when Reading (or Watford) scored the goal that was not given by Attwell, did they give them a goal to make up for it? If a team gets a penalty which is not a penalty do they miss? When Roy Carroll 'saved' the Spurs shot the other year do you expect him to say it was a goal to the ref?
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Yes, and the German keeper with Lampards.
 
Speaking as a former ref Clattenburg was correct within the rules in that he did not blow for a foul so play was continuing,common sense which very few refs are allowed to use says that he should hve called play back and given a foul.In addition having waved the Spurs players away he should have done the same with Ferdinand because allowing him to stand by as ref and linesman chatted fueled the conspiracy theory.

Gomez was a moronic half wit who had the ball in his hands and should have played on instead of trying to play silly buggers.

Nani is a little scrote like Ronaldo before him who would not know sportsmanship if it stood up and hit him,the dive was bad enough but to score the goal was a disgrace
 
Jelster said:
A) The advantage went to Man U, they scored....
B) Although it's not right, many players mover the ball forward to take a free kick. If you watch, Gomez seems to be asking the ref if it's OK to take the kick, but he doesn't give Gomez any feedback.
C) Yes you are, which is why Gomez was asking the ref (see above).

Nani should have got a yellow card for diving, another for deliberate handball, and a third for petulance when he didn't get his own way. But we are talking about Man Utd at Old Trafford, where you can NEVER give major decisions against them.

Clattenburg is a terrible ref, he's made more errors on the pitch than Titus Bramble !!

Steve
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The advantage didn't go to Man U because Gomez had the ball in his hands. At that point the advantage with with Spurs. It's only when he assumed it was a free kick that he put the ball on the ground.
 
Reminds me of a penalty Leicester scored against Man Utd at Old Trafford a few years ago:

Bartez was against the post kicking mud off his boots - but touching the line - having already spent over a minute standing next to the ball on the penalty spot talking to the ref.

Ball was on the spot.

Referee blew his whistle.

Izzet side footed it in.

Goal dissallowed.


Seems like Man Utd get away with all sorts at Old Trafford yet again.... and I'm a rugby fan!
 
Pieface said:
And for people to say Nani dived are ignoring the fact he had his shirt pulled then?
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No, had he have went down when his shirt was pulled it would have been a penalty, he went down 3/4 steps after making the most of it once he knew the ball had gone
 
Marcos James said:
So Steve, what you're saying is. If there is any contact during the game that is not deemed as a foul causing a player to go to ground, then he should be booked for diving ??? Have you been to the Arsene Wenger school of let's get rid of tackling from football ?
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Not at all, but Nani went down like he's been shot by a sniper, so he was either fouled, or he dived.

Wenger does not want to take tackling out of football, what he talks about is the over zealous physical side of the game which has no place in modern football. Players are now so "tuned" in physique that the amount of long term injuries is far greater than it was even 15 years ago. Arsenal have suffered 3 broken legs in 3 seasons. In the old days most clubs wouldn't see 1 in 5 years, and includes the likes of Norman Hunter and most of the old Wimbledon side :lol:

Football has moved on from the days of giving the striker a rap around his heels in the first 5 minutes to let him know you are there. It can still be physical, it's just that injuries seem to last longer and more players seem to suffer them.

I still say, that at the end of the day, it was all down to Clattenberg for making such a b***s up of the situation, which could quite easily of been rectified by just giving Spurs the free kick.

Steve
 
I think a lot of injuries are down to the speed of the game aswell, never has the PL been played to such a high standard and at such a high speed than in the last 5 years
 
I still say, that at the end of the day, it was all down to Clattenberg for making such a b***s up of the situation, which could quite easily of been rectified by just giving Spurs the free kick.
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So Gomes did nothing wrong? Play to the whistle....
 
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