More zoom - bigger lens or teleconverter/

blondie606

blondie606

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HI,hoping you chaps & chapess's can give me advice on this subject please as I don't really understand it all ?

I'm using a 70-300mm zoom on a D80 but would like to be able to get "closer" to the subject (motorbike racing & wildlife). I've looked at a 400mm zoom lens but realistically it's out of my price range if new.
I've been told I could use a 1x or 2x teleconverter but that this would drop 1 or 2 f stops which would be no good with the current lens which gives F4 -F5.6 - is that correct ? All my photography is outdoors where using flash is a no go so relies on natural light & as we know,british weather is a bit iffy at the best of times.

So, I have an option to buy a 2nd hand 28-300 f3.5-f6.3 or a 28-200 f3.5-f5.6 with either 1x or 2x converter.
Would either of these options be an improvement over my current lens in terms of getting closer to the subject ?
Or should I just save hard & try to find a decent 2nd hand 400mm lens ?


Or does anyone have any other idea's that haven't occured to me?

thanks in anticipation
 
Any of the lenses you mention would be too slow with a teleconverter, quality would not be adequate and you would most likely lose autofocus.

I ma sorry to be the bearer of bad news but the only way to get a longer lens than 300mm is to spend more money.

Cheaper choices include the oldish Sigma 400mm and Sigma 135-400mm
 
If going for the siggy 400, make sure its the APO version and check for fungus.
The only other option's are to try picking up an older 70-200 F2.8 and use a teleconvertor with it or picking up one of the older MF nikon 300mm lenses, just be careful as some of them where a bit soft.
 
Learn how to creep closer to the action - far more cost effective and better quality images to boot!

I startled a lizard today and after it had buggered off, I was snapping a grasshopper when after a while I turned around and the lizard had actually creeped up on me and I was able to take some shots! Moral of the story, money and equipment aren't everything! Luck and stealth frequently win out over technology when searching for action! :)

I appreciate its not so easy re: the motorcycling though :thumbsdown:
 
micloi said:
Any of the lenses you mention would be too slow with a teleconverter, quality would not be adequate and you would most likely lose autofocus.

I ma sorry to be the bearer of bad news but the only way to get a longer lens than 300mm is to spend more money.

Cheaper choices include the oldish Sigma 400mm and Sigma 135-400mm
Click to expand...

Sorry to agree with Micloi but he is right, if you tried using a converter on those lenses, chances are that at best they wont work and give you soft images in manual mode. At worst attaching the converter could break the lens converter or both

In Short, unless you have pro glass (Ie: F2.8 AF-S lenses) then converters are a no go
 
A rough budget would help?

Ffordes, Camtech, Mifsuds, MPB, Park Cameras, Digital Depot all have very good user camera equipment sections or specialise in used equipment and are good places to get rough idea's on price, personally would avoid eBay as your buying blind, don't know the history and maybe little comeback if things go wrong. TP forums are also a good source.

Being on the wrong side of the fence at many motorsports events this year, my weapon of choice has been a 300mm f2.8 prime with 1.4 and 2x TC, but I also achieve great results with the 300mm f4 There are other options, a couple of budget zooms from sigma, but you really need a starting budget of £400 (for used lens) to achieve 400mm +

If I was to chose a lens for motorsport, then I would go for the 300mm f4 and use when conditions are favourable the 1.4x and 1.7x TCs but it really depends what your budget is?
 
PeterCollins said:
In Short, unless you have pro glass (Ie: F2.8 AF-S lenses) then converters are a no go
Click to expand...

Would have to disagree slightly there, I've got some great shots with a 300mm f4 and 1.4x TC and I know several Nikon owner have achieve fantastic shots with the 300mm f4 and 1.7x TC

TCs were never designed to work with zooms, they were primarily intended to be used with prime lenses like the 300mm f2.8 etc, but its a cheap way of increasing the focal length on lenses so naturally TCs have progressed to be used with zooms as well, but they work best with prime lenses.
 
Thanks for all the info people,as a relative beginner the whole lens thing is a tad mind blowing.

I've been hunting round the Used Equipment shops on the web & found the following :

Sigma 400mm AF F5.6 APO lens Nikon fit at £255 ,ad states clean optics .
Have no idea if this is a suitable lens?

I'm just a keen amateur & quite pleased with a lot of my pic's,would just love to get closer to the action
I've given up trying to post pics on here but I've put a link to my photo site below if you wanna see what I've done to date & how good/bad/indifferent they are. No illusions of turning pro just want to improve

http://lljdreams.spaces.live.com
 
Thanks for all the advice .Sorry to be a pain but still learning about lenses. From what you've said above the lens I asked about is Prime which I gather means no zoom so possibly no good. With bike racing I tend to stand in a place where I can get several different shots at differing distances using the zoom .I only have one camera body .Although not new the cost of even 2nd hand lenses is quite considerably so trying to make sure I drop a clanger
With that in mind what would your thoughts be on the following :

Sigma 135-400f4.5-5.6APO

OR

Sigma 170-500 f5-6.3 APO
Both apparently for Nikon AF

Even better if you could advise a decent price for either of the above?

thanks in anticipation :-)
 
Neither of those are great lenses, the sigma 150-500mm is a better option than either of those 2. The 135-400mm is a very average lens and the 170-500mm is slow and heavy. Another option would be the sigma 120-400mm f4.5-5.6

A rough budget would really help and the places below are good to get a rough idea on used lens prices.

Ffordes, Camtech, Mifsuds, MPB, Park Cameras, Digital Depot all have very good user camera equipment sections or specialise in used equipment and are good places to get rough idea's on price
Click to expand...
 
pete.rush said:
Would have to disagree slightly there, I've got some great shots with a 300mm f4 and 1.4x TC and I know several Nikon owner have achieve fantastic shots with the 300mm f4 and 1.7x TC

TCs were never designed to work with zooms, they were primarily intended to be used with prime lenses like the 300mm f2.8 etc, but its a cheap way of increasing the focal length on lenses so naturally TCs have progressed to be used with zooms as well, but they work best with prime lenses.
Click to expand...

Ya point taken that combination always gets good write ups and was something i was thinking of trying

I have the 1.4 and 1.7x and was thinking of keeping an eye out for a 2nd hand 300 F4 AFS to try it with

as/when funds and availability allows
 
blondie606 said:
Thanks for the replies peeps,advice taken & now looking round for a used 400mm

pg333......bit difficult creeping up on a pride of lions on a safari :-) but I know what you mean...lol
Click to expand...

If it is just for a one-off holiday, then renting may be a better bet.
 
I have a Sigma bigma so the 50-500 and it is great! There are a few going round on the second hand market for a good price.
 
pete.rush said:
Neither of those are great lenses, the sigma 150-500mm is a better option than either of those 2. The 135-400mm is a very average lens and the 170-500mm is slow and heavy. Another option would be the sigma 120-400mm f4.5-5.6

A rough budget would really help and the places below are good to get a rough idea on used lens prices.
Click to expand...


Still working on this...
You say the 135-400mm is a very average lens... average in comparison to what ? Simply the fact it's a Sigma I suspect would make it better than my Tamron 70-300 or have I got that wrong?

The 170-500mm is slow. Understand the words just not the context. Do you mean it won't be any good for motorsports/showjumping? I don't tend to shoot on continuous though occasionally will string 4 or 5 shots together .Is it slow to focus so I may miss the shot altogether(my reactions aren't so quick either;) )

As with most peolple I'd like to buy the best I can get for a limited budget,in this instance £400 is total 100% top limit

Off to look at the Sigma bigma:help:
 
Rusk said:
I have a Sigma bigma so the 50-500 and it is great! There are a few going round on the second hand market for a good price.
Click to expand...

I don't know how much sample variation there is... The one I tried on 40D in good light was super soft.
 
blondie606 said:
Thanks for the replies peeps,advice taken & now looking round for a used 400mm

pg333......bit difficult creeping up on a pride of lions on a safari :-) but I know what you mean...lol
Click to expand...

For that sort of event, based on future need/useage, etc, perhaps you'd be better off hiring a lens... It's got to be the cheapest & most effective solution to meet this particular requirement?
 
blondie606 said:
All my photography is outdoors where using flash is a no go so relies on natural light & as we know,british weather is a bit iffy at the best of times.
Click to expand...

blondie606 said:
pg333......bit difficult creeping up on a pride of lions on a safari :-) but I know what you mean...lol
Click to expand...


Is British weather a problem on a safari ? :thinking:

;)
 
Rusk said:
I have a Sigma bigma so the 50-500 and it is great! There are a few going round on the second hand market for a good price.
Click to expand...

Have you got any example pics with it. I quite fancy a longer lens for those times when I do photography for pleasure in an area that I don't normally do. You know out with the NW TPers at the zoo, martin mere that kind of thing. Getting a 400mm would be a bit daft for those odd occasions.
 
You can get this sort of thing with a Sigma 150-500 OS good for the Martin Mere visits

http://SPAM/c3whur/Birds/Img_5951c.jpg
 
artyman said:
You can get this sort of thing with a Sigma 150-500 OS good for the Martin Mere visits

http://SPAM/c3whur/Birds/Img_5951c.jpg
Click to expand...

Thats good. Is the 50-500 as good although if I'm shooting at that kind of range 50-150 will not be much of a loss. If I stick the lens on the D300 rather than my normal weapon I will get a further boost. Might be worth taking a look :)
 
The old 50-500 non OS model is generally considered to be a tad sharper than my 150-500, though I have no personal experience to make a judgement. It takes TC's quite well without to much degradation as well. The OS system on mine is awesome so that is also a consideration. The new 50-500 has OS but probably getting moore expensive than you want. This is a shot with a 2X convertor on the 150-500

http://SPAM/c3whur/mar/Img_1986.jpg
 
artyman said:
The old 50-500 non OS model is generally considered to be a tad sharper than my 150-500, though I have no personal experience to make a judgement. It takes TC's quite well without to much degradation as well. The OS system on mine is awesome so that is also a consideration. The new 50-500 has OS but probably getting moore expensive than you want. This is a shot with a 2X convertor on the 150-500
Click to expand...

Excellent, I have a 1.4TC so that should be good.
 
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