Long lens replacement ideas, please.

C

Chipper

Suspended / Banned
Messages
3,226
Name
Linda
Edit My Images
No
i sold my Canon 500f4 mk1 yesterday as it is too heavy for my shoulder these days and I was told by a nature photographer at my club that sooner rather than later it would no longer be possible to get parts for it - maybe even as early as March next year. Seems very wrong that this can happen to such expensive items but there you go. As he pointed out, it would eventually become a very heavy doorstop.

As my lack of use of this lens has bothered me ever since I bought it ( my shoulders started playing up 3 months afterwards), it was the push I needed to move it on. I had 4 offers and, happily, the best was from an independent retailer only an hour from me. The lowest was from a very popular online seller of used photo gear.

I still like to photograph bigger birds and am currently waiting for the Bewicks to return to Slimbridge. I shoot full frame and have the 100 - 400 mk 2 and the 1.4 III extender.

Now, I could stick with this and maybe I will but I am interested to hear what you might suggest for that extra reach; on seeing my sad face yesterday, the chap in the store suggested the Sigma zoom - not sure which one.

Thanks for reading and also for telling me your thoughts.
 
If you can run to it I have read very good reports on the MKII 400mm DO even with the 2x converter(couple of people on here use one). Out of my price bracket therefore I have the Sigma 150-600mm sport which is a decent lens but have always wondered if the 100-400mm MKII with 1.4x would be any better so am expecting one on Monday.
 
Mike.P said:
If you can run to it I have read very good reports on the MKII 400mm DO even with the 2x converter(couple of people on here use one). Out of my price bracket therefore I have the Sigma 150-600mm sport which is a decent lens but have always wondered if the 100-400mm MKII with 1.4x would be any better so am expecting one on Monday.
Click to expand...
I would be interested to hear how that goes - thanks.
 
SFTPhotography said:
Crop body and the lens plus tele you have...
Click to expand...
I have 2 FF bodies at the moment and that is the limit for me especially as I have a second system going (Oly). Good idea though. I have wandered what the 7D3 would be like when it turns up as it must surely do at some point. But then I would have to direct myself to my first comment! :ROFLMAO:
 
I expect he was referring to the Sigma 150-600. There are two versions, C and S. The S version is much heavier so probably no good for your shoulder. They are slower than your current lens but each are well respected. Have a look at their threads and I'm sure you will find posts comparing them to the 100-400 mark ii and the 1.4.
 
If you are fixed on Canon I can't offer any advice, but if you need something light I can recommend a Nikon D500 and Nikon 300 f4 VR PF which would give you the lightest 450mm equivalent you can get. It also works very well with the 1.4 and 1.7 TC's giving you 630mm & 765mm ... even the 2.0 (V3) will work giving you 900mm.
 
Chipper said:
I have 2 FF bodies at the moment and that is the limit for me especially as I have a second system going (Oly). Good idea though. I have wandered what the 7D3 would be like when it turns up as it must surely do at some point. But then I would have to direct myself to my first comment! :ROFLMAO:
Click to expand...

Flog 'em and get a 7d2.

Crop sensors only use the center part of a lens so you'd be using the best center part of your 100-400 and getting a 1.5 reach making it a 150-600 but sharp all over the frame (unlike buying a 150-600 sigma and sticking it on a FF body).

That's my advice.
 
Hi Steve,
I had a 7D2 and did like it but the basketball arena where I shoot needed something with less noise so I splashed out on a 1DX2 and it is awesome...and can't be splashing on an extra body now. Perhaps it's next version will persuade me to try that line again. So, I think for now, rather than a Sigma zoom, I will go try what I have and see how much I miss my 500 when the Bewicks turn up. Thanks.
 
gramps said:
If you are fixed on Canon I can't offer any advice, but if you need something light I can recommend a Nikon D500 and Nikon 300 f4 VR PF which would give you the lightest 450mm equivalent you can get. It also works very well with the 1.4 and 1.7 TC's giving you 630mm & 765mm ... even the 2.0 (V3) will work giving you 900mm.
Click to expand...
Yes, been with Canon a long time and quite liking my Oly for lighter moments but not the fast stuff. Thanks though.
 
Out of interest, I'm sure the IQ and noise performance of the 1DXii is better than the 7D ii, but how do the AF sytems compare?
 
Archie747 said:
Out of interest, I'm sure the IQ and noise performance of the 1DXii is better than the 7D ii, but how do the AF sytems compare?
Click to expand...

I have no idea! However I do have the 1DX (Mk1?) and the 7D2 - the 7D2 is very good but the 1DX is much better for both noise and AF - the 1DX 2 should be just more of the same.
 
Just my 2p!

To Chipper. My canon 7D2 performs well with my Canon 100-400 Mk2 - but why does my 1DX perform so much better with it? Better/faster/more accurate AF and more detailed images + no crop factor?!?

I know you want to move away from heavy lenses but my 7D2 is excellent on my 300 F2.8 L IS and 800 F5.6 L IS so it can deliver the goods but is just not as consistent/reliable as my 1DX (let alone your 1DX2!).

If you only wanted to loose a little weight I would suggest that you look long and hard at the Canon 300 F2.8 L IS Mk1 or 2. they are some of the sharpest/fastest focusing lenses out there and take extenders really well. Having said that they are still not lightweight.

Given that you already have the Canon 100-400 Mk2 (I like mine!) I would stick to that for now and see if it is limiting you. Naturally it is a compromise after the 500 F4 but it is a much lighter setup that will do a lot of what you need and is more flexible. As to the long Sigma/Tamron zooms - I was not too happy with the AF on my bodies. It worked but not as well as I had hoped.

Just food for thought?
 
Taking weight limit into consideration I think your 100-400mkii and 1dXmii combination is optimum.

Is your weight limit for hand holding, carrying or both? Presumably you have tried tripods and gimbals for the longer lens?
 
Thanks for chipping in to the discussion.

Archie - the auto focus is amazing and any errors are always mine and the noise is better.

John - I can't really hand hold the 1-4 for very long - biceps tendon ☹️. I had heard that the autofocus was less good on the Sigma and Tamron zooms. There was also the issue of the mk1 long lenses not being supported and being left with a doorstop which pushed me to move it on.

Newbie 1 - Yes I have a Wimberley head and only ever used the lens on a tripod. This is great at Slimbridge when the Bewicks are about but it never goes for a walk. I have also used it for surfers and other stuf like that. It was as good as having a dog for getting people to come and have a chat! So, it was a major event taking it out.


So, I will try my current combo and hope it cuts the mustard. And maybe keep an eye out for used a Mk two... which I am told is lighter and a tad smaller. And very rare.

Thanks all.
 
I would have thought that the obvious answer was the 500/4 MkII?
 
I am sure it is..£8000! And still heavy.... I expect I will get over it soon. Hopefully. :(
 
One of our club who is a top nature man has sold his long lens and gone for one of those. I might well ask him to bring it to club next time he comes. I haven't seen one in a shop yet.

Thanks Andrew.
 
Chipper said:
I would be interested to hear how that goes - thanks.
Click to expand...

I received my 100-400mm MKII this morning so did a quick test ... will hopefully get more time to do a thorough comparison at the weekend. As the Canon lens with extender was maxed out at 560mm that's what I did with the Sigma as well (within 12mm). Must admit the results quite suprised me but I may need to do some fine tuning on the Canon lens.

Sigma 150-600mm Sport

IMG_3670.jpg

IMG_3670b.jpg


Canon 100-400mm MKII with MKIII 1.4x

IMG_3672.jpg

IMG_3672b.jpg
 
new tamron 100-400mm new lighter telezoom?
but for a prime lens, like a 300mm and TC would bump the max aperture right up
 
Last edited:
I'm confused as to why the sigma images are showing in the Exif data as taken using a Canon 100-400mm Mk1?
 
Standard Information
Make: Canon
Model: Canon EOS 7D
ImageSize: 5184x3456
CameraType: EOS High-end
CreateDate: 2017:11:08 09:41:54
ModifyDate: 2017:11:08 09:41:54
DateTimeOriginal: 2017:11:08 09:41:54
ExposureTime: 1/512"
Aperture: F8.0
MaxAperture: F6.2
CircleOfConfusion: 0.019 mm
HyperfocalDistance: 1961.88 m
ExposureProgram: Manual
ExposureBiasValue: 0
CompressedBitsPerPixel: 0
MeteringMode: Evaluative
Flash: Off, Did not fire
ISO: 3200, 3200
WhiteBalance: Auto
FocalLength: 548.0 mm
FocalLength35efl: 548.0 mm (35 mm equivalent: 860.5 mm)
SensingMethod: Unknown (0)
SceneType: Unknown (0)
ColorSpace: sRGB
Contrast: Normal
Saturation: Normal
Sharpness: 4
LensSpec: Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

GPS Information

Other Information
AEBAutoCancel: On
AEBBracketValue: 0
AEBSequence: -,0,+
AFAreaHeights: 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266 266
AFAreaWidths: 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222 222
AFAreaXPositions: -1373 -881 -881 -881 -393 -393 -393 0 0 0 0 0 393 393 393 881 881 881 1373
AFAreaYPositions: 0 393 0 -393 393 0 -393 743 393 0 -393 -743 393 0 -393 393 0 -393 0
AFAssistBeam: Emits
AFImageHeight: 3456
AFImageWidth: 5184
AFMicroAdjActive: Unknown (2)
AFMicroAdjValue: 1
AFMicroadjustment: Adjust by lens; 19; 1; 2; 0
AFMode: Single-point AF
AFPointsInFocus: (none)
AFPointsSelected: 9
AIServoImagePriority: 1: AF, 2: Tracking
AIServoTrackingMethod: Continuous AF track priority
AIServoTrackingSensitivity: Unknown (255)
AddAspectRatioInfo: Off
AddOriginalDecisionData: On
ApertureValue: 8.0
Artist: Mike Pursey
AutoExposureBracketing: Off
AutoISO: 100
BaseISO: 3200
BitsPerSample: 8
BlackMaskBottomBorder: 0
BlackMaskLeftBorder: 0
BlackMaskRightBorder: 0
BlackMaskTopBorder: 0
BracketMode: Off
BracketShotNumber: 0
BracketValue: 0
BrightnessValue: 0
BulbDuration: 0
CameraISO: Auto
CanonExposureMode: Manual
CanonFirmwareVersion: Firmware Version 2.0.3
CanonFlashMode: Off
CanonImageHeight: 3456
CanonImageSize: Unknown (-1)
CanonImageType: Canon EOS 7D
CanonImageWidth: 5184
ColorComponents: 3
ColorTemperature: 5200
ColorTone: Normal
ContinuousDrive: Single
ControlMode: Camera Local Control
Copyright: cdrw@hotmail.com
DialDirectionTvAv: Normal
DigitalGain: 0
DigitalZoom: None
Directory: C:\Users\Jim\Desktop
DriveMode: Single-frame shooting
EasyMode: Manual
EncodingProcess: Baseline DCT, Huffman coding
ExifByteOrder: Little-endian (Intel, II)
ExifImageHeight: 3456
ExifImageWidth: 5184
ExifVersion: 0230
ExposureIndex: 0
ExposureLevelIncrements: 1/2 Stop
FNumber: 8.0
FOV: 2.4 deg
FileModifyDate: 2017:11:10 10:46:17+00:00
FileName: IMG_3670.jpg
FileSize: 2.4 MB
FileSource: Unknown (0)
FileType: JPEG
FlashActivity: 0
FlashBits: (none)
FlashExposureComp: 0
FlashExposureLock: Off
FlashGuideNumber: 0
FlashSyncSpeedAv: Auto
FlashpixVersion: 0100
FocalPlaneResolutionUnit: inches
FocalPlaneXResolution: 5715.54576
FocalPlaneXSize: 296.55 mm
FocalPlaneYResolution: 5808.40336
FocalPlaneYSize: 500.13 mm
FocalUnits: 1/mm
FocusMode: Manual Focus (3)
FocusRange: Not Known
HighISONoiseReduction: Unknown (3)
HighlightTonePriority: Disable
ISOSpeedIncrements: 1 Stop
ISOSpeedRange: Disable
ImageHeight: 3456
ImageWidth: 5184
InternalSerialNumber: S1228384A
JFIFVersion: 1.01
Lens: 150.0 - 600.0 mm
Lens35efl: 150.0 - 600.0 mm (35 mm equivalent: 235.5 - 942.2 mm)
LensDriveNoAF: Focus search on
LensID: Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS
LensModel: 150-600mm F5-6.3 DG OS HSM | Sports 014
LensType: Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS
LightSource: Unknown
LightValue: 10.0
LiveViewShooting: Off
LongExposureNoiseReduction: Off
LongFocal: 600 mm
MacroMode: Normal
ManualFlashOutput: n/a
MaxApertureValue: 1.0
MeasuredEV: 3.63
MeasuredEV2: 3.75
MeasuredRGGB: 349 1024 1024 946
MinAperture: 29
MirrorLockup: Disable
NDFilter: Unknown (-1)
NumAFPoints: 19
OpticalZoomCode: n/a
Orientation: Horizontal (normal)
OriginalDecisionDataOffset: 3494
OwnerName: Mike Pursey
PictureStyle: Standard
PrimaryChromaticities: 0 0 0 0 0 0
Quality: RAW
RawJpgSize: Large
RecordMode: CR2
ReferenceBlackWhite: 0 0 0 0 0 0
ResolutionUnit: inches
SRAWQuality: n/a
SafetyShift: Enable (Tv/Av)
ScaleFactor35efl: 1.6
SelfTimer: Off
SensorBlueLevel: 0
SensorBottomBorder: 3511
SensorHeight: 3516
SensorLeftBorder: 168
SensorRedLevel: 0
SensorRightBorder: 5351
SensorTopBorder: 56
SensorWidth: 5360
SequenceNumber: 0
SharpnessFrequency: n/a
ShootingMode: Manual
ShortFocal: 150 mm
ShutterSpeed: 1/512
ShutterSpeedValue: 1/512
SlowShutter: None
SubSecCreateDate: 2017:11:08 09:41:54.d
SubSecDateTimeOriginal: 2017:11:08 09:41:54.`
SubSecModifyDate: 2017:11:08 09:41:54.\
SubSecTime: \
SubSecTimeDigitized: d
SubSecTimeOriginal: `
SubjectDistance: 0 m
SuperimposedDisplay: Off
TargetAperture: 8
TargetExposureTime: 1/512
ThumbnailImageValidArea: 0 159 7 112
ToneCurve: Standard
ValidAFPoints: 19
WBBracketMode: Off
WBBracketValueAB: 0
WBBracketValueGM: 0
WBShiftAB: 0
WBShiftGM: 0
WhiteBalanceBlue: 0
WhiteBalanceRed: 0
WhitePoint: 0 0
XResolution: 72
YCbCrCoefficients: 0 0 0
YCbCrPositioning: Unknown (0)
YCbCrSubSampling: YCbCr4:4:4 (1 1)
YResolution: 72
ZoomSourceWidth: 0
ZoomTargetWidth: 0
 
Well, I had a look at the 400 DO Mk 2 last night, thanks to a forum member who is also at the same club. Interesting indeed. I did have another look for a used Mk2 and much to my surprise, one popped up at Harrisons. But of course, it is the same one that was there in May, which they said then was an oversight and they would take it down. Yeh, right!
 
I would go for the 400mm f4 do is mkii superb lens and works well with extenders. I use to use the 600mm f4 I.s and 300mm f2.8 I.s both great lenses but heavy. I changed just recently to the 400 do mkii. I am glad I did Canon elstree are no longer going to service mk I lenses because parts are running short I was told the cut off date would be March next year. It now transpires they have stopped servicing earlier than that please see this post
https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/canon-400-2-8-is-repair-anyone-had.653285/
I have the 1dx and 7d mkii I also carry the 70-200mm f2.8 is mkii this seems to cover most of my needs. I also have the 100-400mkii all three are great lenses.
 
Chipper said:
I have 2 FF bodies at the moment and that is the limit for me especially as I have a second system going (Oly). Good idea though. I have wandered what the 7D3 would be like when it turns up as it must surely do at some point. But then I would have to direct myself to my first comment! :ROFLMAO:
Click to expand...

If you've got a decent Oly as a back up its worth looking at the Oly 300mm F4 + 1.4 x tc, amazing reach and weighs less than the average 70-200 F2.8
 
admirable said:
Lens35efl: 150.0 - 600.0 mm (35 mm equivalent: 235.5 - 942.2 mm)
LensDriveNoAF: Focus search on
LensID: Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS
LensModel: 150-600mm F5-6.3 DG OS HSM | Sports 014
LensType: Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS
Click to expand...

It's fairly well known Sigma hacked the Canon mount (as well as others) so as not to pay royalties so maybe that's causing the dodgy info.
I know on my Pentax gear Sigma have used the same ID on at least 3 of their lenses which is a royal pain when you have to adjust the fine focus using the camera body.
 
lost said:
I would go for the 400mm f4 do is mkii superb lens and works well with extenders. I use to use the 600mm f4 I.s and 300mm f2.8 I.s both great lenses but heavy. I changed just recently to the 400 do mkii. I am glad I did Canon elstree are no longer going to service mk I lenses because parts are running short I was told the cut off date would be March next year. It now transpires they have stopped servicing earlier than that please see this post
https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/canon-400-2-8-is-repair-anyone-had.653285/
I have the 1dx and 7d mkii I also carry the 70-200mm f2.8 is mkii this seems to cover most of my needs. I also have the 100-400mkii all three are great lenses.
Click to expand...

You don’t miss the extra reach of the 600 or low light ability of the 300? I’m asking as Im lugging the mark II versions of these around. Not a problem at the moment as I can get both plus camera bodies, tripod etc into a flipside aw 500 backpack and thankfully fit for hiking.
 
magicaxeman said:
If you've got a decent Oly as a back up its worth looking at the Oly 300mm F4 + 1.4 x tc, amazing reach and weighs less than the average 70-200 F2.8
Click to expand...
Hi, yes that thought had crossed my mind but you know from the other thread that I doubt the results would match my Canon system even without the 500mm f4
 
Sadly there's always a trade off somewhere along the line when trying to reduce weight, unless funds are unlimited as then the compromises can be minimised.
With me its a never ending quest, searching for light and manageable gear that I can also operate remotely when needed (bedbound 24/7) either over wifi or USB.
For hand holding I'm really limited, bodies have to be under 500 gr the same with lenses though I can effectively hand hold the 300mm F4 +TC when I use the suspension system I invented that takes 90% of the weight of body & lens but still allows me full movement without restriction.
 
Chipper said:
Hi, yes that thought had crossed my mind but you know from the other thread that I doubt the results would match my Canon system even without the 500mm f4
Click to expand...

I think that is true, but well known professional wildlife photographers have moved to 100% M43 eg https://scottbourne.myportfolio.com/ and http://naturalexposures.com/ and another well known scandinavian photographer that I can't remember :-(

edit: http://jaripeltomaki.com/ is the missing link

I'm still not convinced about M43 as an all round format (and indeed probably selling my M43 kit) but there are people around who are producing very good work with it, and as I get older (retiring next year) there is a big chunk of me, thinks I should be investing in m43 rather than selling it.

As an aside, using DXO prime noise reduction lifts small sensors (Nikon 1 and M43) results into a whole new league in terms of quality.
 
Last edited:
magicaxeman said:
Sadly there's always a trade off somewhere along the line when trying to reduce weight, unless funds are unlimited as then the compromises can be minimised.
With me its a never ending quest, searching for light and manageable gear that I can also operate remotely when needed (bedbound 24/7) either over wifi or USB.
For hand holding I'm really limited, bodies have to be under 500 gr the same with lenses though I can effectively hand hold the 300mm F4 +TC when I use the suspension system I invented that takes 90% of the weight of body & lens but still allows me full movement without restriction.
Click to expand...
FairPlay to you, magicaxeman. I would be interested in seeing a photo of your suspension system. A few others on here might also be keen to see it too. You might even be able to get it produced for sale with a crowd sourcing thingy.
 
SFTPhotography said:
Flog 'em and get a 7d2.

Crop sensors only use the center part of a lens so you'd be using the best center part of your 100-400 and getting a 1.5 reach making it a 150-600 but sharp all over the frame (unlike buying a 150-600 sigma and sticking it on a FF body).

That's my advice.
Click to expand...

The 600mm Sigma is sharp across the frame on my FF body.
 
SFTPhotography said:
Flog 'em and get a 7d2.

Crop sensors only use the center part of a lens so you'd be using the best center part of your 100-400 and getting a 1.5 reach making it a 150-600 but sharp all over the frame (unlike buying a 150-600 sigma and sticking it on a FF body).

That's my advice.
Click to expand...

....Based on my experience with shooting on both Canon 7D2 and 5D4 bodies, Canon lenses 100-400mm L II, 500mm F/4L II and Canon 1.4x III and 2x III Extenders, exclusively shooting wildlife :

According to subject I will occasionally swop around the body+lens combo. Although very good, the IQ of a keeper shot on the 7D2 + 100-400 + 1.4x (@560mm) is not as good as the IQ when swopping body to the 5D4. Also, the IQ when shooting with the 2x on the 500mm prime is better with the 5D4 than the 7D2.

The FF image quality of 5D4 + 500mm + 2x (@1000mm) more than compensates for less reach with the 7D2 mounted instead.

The 7D2 is very good indeed (otherwise I wouldn't keep it) but the 5D4 has the edge every time regarding IQ and especially on large crops of the original. I only shoot RAW.

The IQ and AF speed is better without the 1.4x Extender on the 100-400mm L II but either 1.4x or 2x on the 500mm F/4L II is excellent and I expect it would be on a Canon 400mm DO too.
 
Thanks for that, Robin. Sadly the weather, Gloucestershire way has not been great so I haven't had much chance to use my various combinations yet. The Bewick's swans also haven't arrived.

I will bide my time although I would like to see a shot or two from your FF with both the extenders used if that's possible. I am on an iPad here and the number keys won't turn up. How odd.
 
Chipper said:
Thanks for that, Robin. Sadly the weather, Gloucestershire way has not been great so I haven't had much chance to use my various combinations yet. The Bewick's swans also haven't arrived.

I will bide my time although I would like to see a shot or two from your FF with both the extenders used if that's possible.
Click to expand...

....No problem. So I can sort some out for you, am I right in thinking you would prefer to see some of my shots with each Extender on the 100-400mm L II lens rather than on my 500mm F/4L II? Or does it not matter?
 
Chipper said:
Thanks for that, Robin. Sadly the weather, Gloucestershire way has not been great so I haven't had much chance to use my various combinations yet. The Bewick's swans also haven't arrived.

I will bide my time although I would like to see a shot or two from your FF with both the extenders used if that's possible. I am on an iPad here and the number keys won't turn up. How odd.
Click to expand...

I've seen people at Slimbridge with spotter scopes and compacts attached. Seems like a lightweight solution with a long reach - no idea what picture quality is like though.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top