Loading 35mm cassette from bulk film

meddyliol

meddyliol

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Brian
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As I will be going back to black and white film again sometime in the future, I seem to remember having all sorts of problems fiddling about in a changing bag, trying get a length of bulk film into the cassette getting sweatier and sweatier as I went. Is there an easier way of doing it in this age of modern technology?

Cheers

Brian
 
I used a daylight loader back in the 1960s - as far as I know they are still available. All you need a changing bag (or darkroom) for is putting the bulk film in the loader, although you can simply use the loader as a convenient length counter and work in the dark, to make sure that you can carry on taking photos until the film comes to the end, without worrying about the fogged end.
 
If you use one of the bulk loaders with the big red screw on the side, watch out as the red screw is not totally light fast and will fog the film if left out. I once fogged a whole bulk load of Fiji 100 before I found out. A quick spray of black paint soon fixed the issue, covering it with black electrical tape will do the job as well.

Don't know if they ever fixed it as all the ones I have ever seen still have the red knob on the side.

Allowing for this issue they do make reloading cassettes a breeze, just make sure the velvet in the cassette opening are clean otherwise your film will get scratched from end to end.

Paul
 
OK, I will look out for the red knob. Unbelievable that they had such a bad design flaw.
 
I've got an old Watson loader - I just found a photo on the net describing it as "vintage" - which is black with grey parts. The later ones had red and seemed lighter (flimsier?) to me. Silverprint have a Kaiser loader; Firstcall have two other brands.

I have seen bulk loaders in "bargain bins" at various odd times in photo dealers.
 
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Checkout the bulk loader on the "Jack the Hat " website it's more expensive than most but once loaded it's very easy to use and it has a dial to give you information on film left. I have 3 off these after having real problems with standard bulk loaders
 
The more common 'teardrop shape' loaders like the Watson and my own Prinz version do force you to fog at least two frames as you tape the pay off spool to the film. Unfortunately these frames are at the end of the cassette that you fill, meaning that at least the last frame that you take on that cassette is ruined.

I believe that the squarish shape loaders like the 'Jack The Hat' one fog less film and are preferable in that respect.
 
Yes, the Pro 35mm bulk loader is expensive at £64.99. Might be able to get a used one on ebay.
 
I used a teardrop loader and avoided the end tape fogging problem by doing it in a dark bag. It took some practice with old dead film before I got my routine & layout in the bag properly sorted out. Gave all my film stuff to a young photog student years ago, can't remember the name of the loader. It had a crank handle rather than a knob for winding. I still have the dark bag, because it's an integral part of the lining of a photography tech waistcoat which still fits me :-)
 
I have the box-type loader and it's possible, if fiddly, to tape the end to the cassette spool without losing a frame, though that depends on what camera you're loading it into - my T90 holds the film canister further from the shutter than my mju-II, for example, so it's less of an issue with that camera.
 
I have used a Watson & found it OK. Much better than the one that I had before, can't remember what it was called now as it went in the bin long ago because it was a pain in the bum to load. Finally lost my temper with it & wreaked violent vengeance on it.

I only got into it as a few years ago rolls of bulk film were cheap on ebay. Now at £40 for a 17Mtr roll of FP4 no sure it is worth the hassle any more?
 
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It's certainly not worth it for film like Tri-x, I found that was cheaper buying retail packs than bulk last time I looked. I got a roll of HP5+ with my loader and I still have a few metres of that as it's not one of my favourite films.

There do seem to be quite a few odd bits on ebay though, such as traffic camera film that isn't extortionately expensive and might be worth trying. I've just loaded 7.5m of 25 ISO technical film which I think is a Kodak film for recording documents. Got to be worth a try. :)
 
I think that paying around £65 for a bulk loader doesn't make it worthwhile unless you are using a hell of a lot of film which I wouldn't be doing. Might be better, as suggested, to shop around for bulk pre loaded cassettes. I used to use Pan F a lot so will look for that as well as FP4. Thanks for all of your inputs, it is greatly appreciated.

Brian
 
This thread is interesting as I'm thinking of shooting more 35mm with my eos5. I really love Delta 100 and it's currently £5.29 a roll on Amazon (which seems to be about the cheapest). AG Photographic have 30m rolls of Delta 100 for £67, and assuming you get 18 lots of 36 exposures, works out at £3.72 a roll, which is a saving of 30%. I think as well as the cost saving it would be ideal for me as I really had to work hard yesterday to use a 36 exp roll, and with a bulk loader I wind less frames onto a roll if I need/want to.

Need to keep my eyes open on eBay and Gumtree for the cassettes and loader. Great advice in the previous posts for what kind of loaders to look into and what to avoid!
 
Carl Hall said:
Need to keep my eyes open on eBay and Gumtree for the cassettes and loader. Great advice in the previous posts for what kind of loaders to look into and what to avoid!
Click to expand...

I've been intending to sell my loader for a while, if you don't mind waiting a day or two I'll get some photos and stick it in the classifieds. :)
 
In the old days we\ I sometimes used bulk cinema B\W film...someone must have cut it up to handy 100ft lengths and still have my Pentax reloadable cassette bought 50 years agp...anyway old memories but one warning about the watson and is to make sure you read the instructions as I forgot how to use it a few years back and ended up with shots like this:-
 
Digi types would give their eye teeth to get a texture screen like that! :D

Didn't open the light trap after closing the external flap, I assume?
 
StephenM said:
Digi types would give their eye teeth to get a texture screen like that! :D

Didn't open the light trap after closing the external flap, I assume?
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Something like that as I can't remember. :( and can't even remember when I put the bulk FP4 film in as it was well over 30 years ago. :eek:
 
I've got one of these somewhere I think, although it may have been left at the first Mrs Snapper's house when I left in 95 as I don't recall seeing it recently (recent is relative). I bought it along with a stock of re-useable cartridges which had a very handy screw cap.I was never too worried about a few fogged frames as bulk FP4 was so cheap (bought mail-order!) but I also don't think it was a problem. If recall correctly once the film was safely in the loader the cartridges slotted into the loader in daylight and spooled into the cartridges. I also seem to remember that 36 exp was a tight fit in the cartridges so I used to aim for 30 knowing that I would lose a couple either end so basically worked on a 24 exp film. Excuse me while I go and have a look in the loft . I may be some time...
 
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how much film can you actually squeeze into a cassette?

also when i looked into the costs it wasnt worth it, with the costs of cassettes too..
 
pingu666 said:
how much film can you actually squeeze into a cassette?

also when i looked into the costs it wasnt worth it, with the costs of cassettes too..
Click to expand...

I'd say about 40ish any more than that it will possibly get tight and end up either tearing the sprockets or scratching the film
 
Lankysnapper said:
....I was never too worried about a few fogged frames as bulk FP4 was so cheap (bought mail-order!)........
Click to expand...

pingu666 said:
also when i looked into the costs it wasnt worth it, with the costs of cassettes too..
Click to expand...

This reminds me of the late 60s when bulk film really was cheap. Ilford also used to sell refills, which were just 20 or 36 exposure lenghts in a foil bag without a cassette, as all Ilford cassettes were reusable. The best bargain to be had was when FP4 came out in 35mm, as then FP3 in bulk lengths in mail order ads in AP seemed so cheap to me as a schoolboy, it was almost like they were giving it away. I can't remember the exact price but I know my friend and I bought hundreds of feet of the stuff.
 
I used to reckon on getting 42 exposures in a cassette when bulk filling; I then worked on being able to safely use 36 of them. Back in those days, cassettes could be reused quite easily - and required no tools to extract the film for processing.

Ilford film prices

1960/1
6/10d 36 exp
3/11 darkroom refill
5/1d darkroom refill (presumably 24 and 36 exposures; 24 exp films weren't listed in the catalogue)

Quite a rise ten years on:

1970/1
10/3d 36 exp
8/- 24 exp
6/1d darkroom refill
16/3d 5 metres bulk
48/4d 17 metres bulk
 
I have a watson daylight and konica Hi-loader, the Konica is MUCH better same as the one shown here:

View: https://youtu.be/-eqnuilNnAM


if you want cheap Eastman 5222 B&W cinema stock is very nice but now about £200 for 400ft, which doesn't fit into a daylight loader so you have to spool a sodding great load off into the daylight loader first.
 
StephenM said:
I used to reckon on getting 42 exposures in a cassette when bulk filling; I then worked on being able to safely use 36 of them. Back in those days, cassettes could be reused quite easily - and required no tools to extract the film for processing.

Ilford film prices

1960/1
6/10d 36 exp
3/11 darkroom refill
5/1d darkroom refill (presumably 24 and 36 exposures; 24 exp films weren't listed in the catalogue)

Quite a rise ten years on:

1970/1
10/3d 36 exp
8/- 24 exp
6/1d darkroom refill
16/3d 5 metres bulk
48/4d 17 metres bulk
Click to expand...

Indeed Ilford B\W were increasing their prices rapidly as for 5m bulk in 1963\64 it was 10shillings and 7pence and 17m was 32 shillings..in today's money allowing for inflation would be £9.06 to £28.11 and £27.04 to £85.03....Why not one value? well there are about six + answers from real price to economic power :eek:
 
Strappy said:
I've been intending to sell my loader for a while, if you don't mind waiting a day or two I'll get some photos and stick it in the classifieds. :)
Click to expand...

I was planning on getting a cheap second hand one from ebay, but then saw that Firstcall have basic brand new one for £25, which I thought would be a good idea as I know it'll work and will be light tight, although I guess not the best to use as it's quite cheap. What kind do you have? Any idea roughly how much you were looking to get for it?
 
pingu666 said:
how much film can you actually squeeze into a cassette?

also when i looked into the costs it wasnt worth it, with the costs of cassettes too..
Click to expand...

I think if you shoot quite a lot then it becomes worth it fairly quickly; the cassettes seem to be fairly cheap (first call sell 10 for £6.49) so if you can get a second hand loader for cheap then the gear pays for itself on the first bulk roll
 
Carl Hall said:
I was planning on getting a cheap second hand one from ebay, but then saw that Firstcall have basic brand new one for £25, which I thought would be a good idea as I know it'll work and will be light tight, although I guess not the best to use as it's quite cheap. What kind do you have? Any idea roughly how much you were looking to get for it?
Click to expand...

Mine's the AP type as in Puggie's video, the one that retails at £55 from Firstcall. Apologies but I'm not prepared to discuss pricing outside of Classifieds (I'm not prepared to risk a ban with all the stuff I want to sell soon).
 
Strappy said:
Mine's the AP type as in Puggie's video, the one that retails at £55 from Firstcall. Apologies but I'm not prepared to discuss pricing outside of Classifieds (I'm not prepared to risk a ban with all the stuff I want to sell soon).
Click to expand...

Ahh ok, my bad. I didn't know it had to be in the classifieds to even say the price, I'll wait for you to post it there :)

Think it's time I had a good read of the forum rules before I get a red card lol
 
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