Lighting a horse.

alpina

alpina

Suspended / Banned
Messages
1,179
Name
Andy
Edit My Images
Yes
I have a brief from uni to get some moody dramatic horse shots and whilst I have researched as much as I can I am looking for some tips and advice from anyone that has actually lit horses with flash.
 
Unless you are 100% comfortable, confident AND capable around horses OR have an owner/handler that understands photography well, just don't do it.

There are photographers that light equine (as opposed to equestrian) subjects, for example Treeman on here, but they know what they are doing around four hoofed beasts.
 
DemiLion said:
Unless you are 100% comfortable, confident AND capable around horses OR have an owner/handler that understands photography well, just don't do it.

There are photographers that light equine (as opposed to equestrian) subjects, for example Treeman on here, but they know what they are doing around four hoofed beasts.
Click to expand...

Not really an option. Thanks for your concern regarding my safety though. I have researched quite deeply and have built up a good relationship with the horses already. They quickly acclimatised to the lights and kit. I was looking for any gems of information or tips on lighting.
 
That was an essential piece of advice/gem; it wasn't really your safety that I was concerned about! :)
 
I'd second what Mark has already said, but if you are confident and feel you're able to read your subject and be aware it can all go pear shaped very quickly, you should get some great images. Are you shooting indoors or outside?
 
Matthew uses big powerful lights 2400W/s Profotos, and lights mostly with Softlight (beauty dish) and the large magnum reflector. This allows him to overpower the sun at any time of day or year, so if you don't have access to big toys, just choose your time of day right, I have to!

I hope your lecturer didn't actually tell you all to go out popping flashes at horses:nono: I'll await the news story if he did!!

Forgot to add his name is Matthew Seed not Steel, and he is God as far as I'm concerned :)
 
Last edited:
treeman said:
Matthew uses big powerful lights 2400W/s Profotos, and lights mostly with Softlight (beauty dish) and the large magnum reflector. This allows him to overpower the sun at any time of day or year, so if you don't have access to big toys, just choose your time of day right, I have to!

I hope your lecturer didn't actually tell you all to go out popping flashes at horses:nono: I'll await the news story if he did!!

Forgot to add his name is Matthew Seed not Steel, and he is God as far as I'm concerned :)
Click to expand...

Lol no, I have done all my own research and knew straight away of the dangers involved. I have access to the same Profotos from uni and I also have the Safari kit two.

To help me practice I have been setting up a softbox up on a boom to create a pool of light and been placing all sorts as subjects, even a shed at one point!

I am keen to get some close ups of nostrils and lips and the like and I think I might try a snoot, this may or may not work.

Killing the ambient is a must as it's part of my brief. Being November will obviously help and we are shooting at 2-3 in the afternoon, I am interested in the reflector you mentioned. How does he use it?
 
I'll echo what the others have said.
Horses are big, heavy predated beasts that can react very badly to things that their instinct tells them could be a predator - which means that they can react very badly to anything they don't know...

And, to get good shots (which I assume you want to do) you need to know enough about horses to have them standing correctly, with the weight distributed correctly, with the head in the right place, the ears pointing the right way and so on.

I'm guessing that either your tutor doesn't know much about horses or that s/he doesn't like you:)

Lighting wise, you can manage without loads of Profoto 2400j packs, but you'll struggle with something like hotshoe flashes in full daylight.
 
Garry Edwards said:
I'll echo what the others have said.
Horses are big, heavy predated beasts that can react very badly to things that their instinct tells them could be a predator - which means that they can react very badly to anything they don't know...

And, to get good shots (which I assume you want to do) you need to know enough about horses to have them standing correctly, with the weight distributed correctly, with the head in the right place, the ears pointing the right way and so on.

I'm guessing that either your tutor doesn't know much about horses or that s/he doesn't like you:)

Lighting wise, you can manage without loads of Profoto 2400j packs, but you'll struggle with something like hotshoe flashes in full daylight.
Click to expand...

Heh, they love me really. It's a degree in Commercial photography that I am doing. It's great to be able to try out things and push myself.. It's like saying underwater or pothole photography is dangerous so don't do it.. I want to stretch myself and add a string to my bow.

I have studied albeit briefly the behaviour of horses and their flight tendencies, I realise if they spook they are coming forward at me and the danger of being trampled..
 
I'm pretty sure some pros drug horses.

Yes, there's a "legitimate" use for ketamine.
 
JonathanRyan said:
I'm pretty sure some pros drug horses.

Yes, there's a "legitimate" use for ketamine.
Click to expand...

What makes you think that?
 
I have studied albeit briefly the behaviour of horses and their flight tendencies, I realise if they spook they are coming forward at me and the danger of being trampled..
Click to expand...
Or bolt and injure themselves, often fatally...
The sound of a rifle bolt being pushed home to end suffering isn't a good one:(
 
alpina said:
...I have studied albeit briefly the behaviour of horses and their flight tendencies, I realise if they spook they are coming forward at me and the danger of being trampled..
Click to expand...
The danger is to the horse, if spooked they can seriously hurt themselves.
 
alpina said:
I am interested in the reflector you mentioned. How does he use it?
Click to expand...

Don't quote me, but I'm guessing on a boom pointing at the horse possibly zoomed in a bit too. :shrug:
When i first started I used Octa boxes but they just became a nightmare in the slightest breeze, especially if you don't have an assistant. I trashed 3 before I saw sense. I now normally only use the Softlight or Zoom reflectors, but love using a 5' Octa when weather allows :)

JonathanRyan said:
I'm pretty sure some pros drug horses.

Yes, there's a "legitimate" use for ketamine.
Click to expand...

You are joking.............are'nt you? :eek:
 
alpina said:
Heh, they love me really. It's a degree in Commercial photography that I am doing. It's great to be able to try out things and push myself.. It's like saying underwater or pothole photography is dangerous so don't do it.. I want to stretch myself and add a string to my bow.

I have studied albeit briefly the behaviour of horses and their flight tendencies, I realise if they spook they are coming forward at me and the danger of being trampled..
Click to expand...

Sorry if I've misunderstood you but are you saying you don't have any actual experience around horses?

Also, a horse will run away from perceived danger so if it thinks that danger is you, it will run away from you and quite possibly kick out with its hind legs as it does.
 
No need to be sorry , I am fairly new to horses. I would say perhaps 20 hours with the 2 I am going to be photographing. More with their owner and I am aware of their behaviour so far. They let me walk them and groom them but I wouldn't say they are used to me in any way.

I have taken their photographs with a softbox setup from a distance of say 20 feet. They were quite disinterested on the three occasions. I have also with the help of their owners let them hear the shutter sound from a distance of around 6 feet away again they were not interested.

They didn't like the seeing a round reflector at all and I wouldn't take that out again.
 
perhaps reading his last post might help clear up the fact he is trying to take a sensible approach to something he has not previously had to deal with.


Can we please keep it calm and civil in here, I think the point has been very adequately made regarding the safetly implications of working with large flight animals - advice on the actual lighting now thankyou.
 
alpina said:
No need to be sorry , I am fairly new to horses. I would say perhaps 20 hours with the 2 I am going to be photographing. More with their owner and I am aware of their behaviour so far. They let me walk them and groom them but I wouldn't say they are used to me in any way.
Click to expand...

Err, now you're making me nervous, I took your second post at face value.

Trust me, I currently own two and have been around horses all my life, they will always surprise you. Personally I think you should seriously think about shooting in a sand school from the safety of the other side of the fence. Certainly don't use any stands, only camera and lighting kit you can keep on you, so there's nothing to get in the way of you or horse, should a situation arise.
Don't get me wrong, it's all perfectly doable, I know, I do it, just concerned you're not there yet :)
 
treeman said:
Err, now you're making me nervous, I took your second post at face value.

Trust me, I currently own two and have been around horses all my life, they will always surprise you. Personally I think you should seriously think about shooting in a sand school from the safety of the other side of the fence. Certainly don't use any stands, only camera and lighting kit you can keep on you, so there's nothing to get in the way of you or horse, should a situation arise.
Don't get me wrong, it's all perfectly doable, I know, I do it, just concerned you're not there yet :)
Click to expand...

Thanks for this. It's great advice and appreciated. I should have maybe mentioned that I am 47 years old with a fair bit of common sense :)

I was thinking of shooting from a distance and maybe using a snoot on the flanks or belly to start with.
 
From my limited experience shooting a horse I couldn't even get a reflector in the same field with an assistant, and that was with the owner leading the horse too. Good luck, in the end the shots I needed were fine without any lighting or reflectors.
 
Let's just for a minute put the whole 'whether horses should be flashed' debate to one side, what makes 'moody' and 'dramatic'? I think that is your key question because after all, this is a lighting test so you need to know what you want to achieve and how to take it from concept, visualisation and into reality.

That guy you've linked to uses some pretty hard, directional light to pick up detail and structure and to add the drama. But do you want to uses something softer, more modified?

I reckon you should do some pre-visualisation shots on a subject (maybe a toy horse) to see how the lighting set-up you want to use works. If it's a pap set-up then it'll delay the shoot as you move things round trying to nail it. The horse (and owner/keeper) would want to be as quick as possible to minimise stress.

As for people worrying about the horse, IMO I think the human life comes first if a tragedy happens, but it's on your head if your actions put you in the path of serious harm (and the subsequent legal issues).
 
Last edited:
Spot on Pat.
Like I said I have been practicing getting the light right and calculating distance and exposure away from the horses, the comment about even using a shed wasnt a joke.

I want learn something that looks beautiful and inspires me to try. Its a pity that its turned out to be so controversial to discuss. It is probably down in part to my awkward communication skills:shake:
 
Alpina - it's easy for questions to be mis-interpreted. I wouldn't worry too much : Just be safe and create something special :)
 
I think you need to consider what temperament the horses you are shooting have - if they are "dope on a rope" types you may be ok, but if you wanted to shoot a more flighty type like an Arab, you would undoubtedly encounter problems. Do think about the horses psyche in this as they don't forget things easily. My horse is quite scared of the sound of the shutter clicking but will tolerate it.
If you are thinking of sticking your camera up it's nose and using lots of equipment and lighting - either drug it first or wear headgear!!! (that was a joke b t w but the headgear actually would be good if in close proximity)
 
Better you then me :) I was washing a horse once it went mental lol hate to think what it'll do if you start flashing it with studio strobes :P.

I tooks some photos of my ex's horses in a field and on a nice day you can still get some very nice photos :) but I guess if your forced to use flash for a course then Good luck dude & look forward to seeing the results.
 
treeman said:
You are joking.............are'nt you? :eek:
Click to expand...

Not even slightly.

alpina said:
What makes you think that?
Click to expand...

I went to a talk by one of the big names in horse portraits (love his work but I'm not going to name him as taken out of context people might get upset with his remarks). He said that with some animals the only effective way to get some of the shots he needs is to tranquillise them.

Ethical considerations apart it makes a lot of sense. Skittish horse rears up, kicks assistant in head and breaks its own leg and that's your whole afternoon messed up. It can however set some unrealistic expectations for enthusiasts. You can watch all the lighting videos you want and study diagrams but if it's not safe without ketamine then you can be in a whole world of trouble.

Realistically anybody who knows horses knows that some are pretty much immune to anything to do with flashing lights, bangs or strange people shouting. Others are spooked by crisp bags or a rider wearing a different jacket. I'd talk to the owner about what you can get away with with individual horses.
 
Skittish horse rears up, kicks assistant in head and breaks its own leg and that's your whole afternoon messed up.
Click to expand...

lol! You are a master of understatement Jonathan! 'we've killed the assistant and the horse has to be put down.....hhmmm, that's messed the whole afternoon up...' :lol:
 
Completed the task today and it went very well. The horses were fantastic and no problems at all. Not sure about being licked by a horse though.
 
In my humble opinion, if you are going to photograph any animal like a horse, it should be oblivious of your presence. I would get it used to all the sounds of the shoot in advance and I would create an area in advance that had been meticulously set up and pre lit perfectly. The animal then led into this area and its time in front of the camera as minimal possible. The photographer etc, should be invisible at all times to the animal and as many familiar things as possible placed in the area.

I see no reason why any horse should be scared or any stranger to it, put in danger if the shoot is approached with this level of preparation.
 
specialman said:
We need pics so humble pie can be forced down some people's throats.... ;)
Click to expand...

Dunno about alpina, but my shoot this morning was a disaster. Horse in the foreground bolted and ended up with severe carpet burn - and I didn't even use flash!



ISO 5000, 85mm, f/1.4
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top