Let's talk....electric cars

JonathanRyan

JonathanRyan

Suspended / Banned
Messages
10,765
Name
Jonathan
Edit My Images
Yes
Who has one? Do you like it?

I last looked for a "new" car about 5 years ago and really wanted a hybrid / low pollution vehicle. At the time, there were none that fitted my criteria so I did what any sensible person does and bought a second hand Honda :)

Time to look again and the market has shifted considerably - there are decent electric cars and they are leaking into the second hand market. However, apart from the MG Estate, most are either very small or very expensive. What would you buy right now?

I don't do a lot of miles - maybe 9k per year with a "feature" drive of 200 miles every month or so. I don't often take more than 1 passenger but I do often end up putting lots of stuff in the boot. I'd prefer second hand but really it's all going to come down to what I can get for my money. I'm looking at total cost of ownership on the assumption the price of petrol will at least double in the next 3 years.

And yes, I bet I end up keeping the Honda :)
 
I can't really add anything as I've not had an electric car but I'm interested and I'll read this thread.

I asked a taxi driver I use for his input as I thought he'd know people with electric cars and he does but wouldn't recommend them as (he says) the range and charging infrastructure just isn't there yet for them to add up to a viable replacement for ICE. That's a high mileage taxi drivers point of view and may only be true in some parts of the country. At the moment I do have massive reservations and I fear that at its worst electric cars could be nothing short of a disaster for the planet but I hope I'm wrong.
 
woof woof said:
I can't really add anything as I've not had an electric car but I'm interested and I'll read this thread.

I asked a taxi driver I use for his input as I thought he'd know people with electric cars and he does but wouldn't recommend them as (he says) the range and charging infrastructure just isn't there yet for them to add up to a viable replacement for ICE. That's a high mileage taxi drivers point of view and may only be true in some parts of the country. At the moment I do have massive reservations and I fear that at its worst electric cars could be nothing short of a disaster for the planet but I hope I'm wrong.
Click to expand...
Yes, some use cases are much more amenable to electric than others.

I can't really think of a worse one than taxis - unless it's towing 3.5 tonnes across a muddy field :D That's kind of interesting since taxis were a major reason for the success of the Prius hybrid.
 
JonathanRyan said:
Yes, some use cases are much more amenable to electric than others.

I can't really think of a worse one than taxis - unless it's towing 3.5 tonnes across a muddy field :D That's kind of interesting since taxis were a major reason for the success of the Prius hybrid.
Click to expand...

I live in east Cleveland in NE England and it's a relatively deprived area and I'd expect charging points to be fewer than in the fashionable cities plus once you've found a working charge point there's the down time while you're queuing to use it and then charging the taxi and time is money. I suppose. He also claimed that the quoted ranges were way off what his mates are getting in real world driving so if true that's another issue.

I've been sort of tempted because of the (for now) low per mile running costs and because I fancy a Jag ipace and I suppose I could probably live with some issues as I don't work anymore so rarely have to be anywhere at a particular time but having said that I don't like the thought of getting stranded and wasting or spoiling a day out and I do the occasional longer run and no electric car to date seems to be able to compete with ICE for range and convenience and ease of refuelling.
 
The electric car project so far:
  • Start a fuss about how electric cars are so good for the planet.
  • Give big grants of tax payers' money to people already rich enough to buy the things
  • Forget the fact that the people who can afford them will "refuel" them at home on tax free electricity.
  • When a "fortuitous" hike in fuel prices comes along, again forget that the wealthy aren't paying fuel duty.
...seems like a typical tory wheeze to me. :shifty:
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
The electric car project so far:
  • Start a fuss about how electric cars are so good for the planet.
  • Give big grants of tax payers' money to people already rich enough to buy the things
  • Forget the fact that the people who can afford them will "refuel" them at home on tax free electricity.
  • When a "fortuitous" hike in fuel prices comes along, again forget that the wealthy aren't paying fuel duty.
...seems like a typical tory wheeze to me. :shifty:
Click to expand...

Yes. I wondered if we could move on to the bit where we discuss which ones are a good buy.
 
This article - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-61505025 - is interesting. It is about the rural infrastructure but has some wider points.

and this programme - https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m00162yr - is worth a listen.

At present we have a car that will run on petrol or LPG and although there number of LPG garages is limited(apparently continetal Europe has much bigger coverage) and mpg from LPG is lower than petrol, LPG is much cheaper and less polluting than petrol; and refuelling takes about the same time as filling up with petrol.

I'm not suggesting LPG is the way forward. I think electric will, and should, be the way to go but I wonder if hydrogen powered cars could be an intermediate stage. Hydrogen has its problems in that the small molecule size means it leaks out of pipework, but I wonder if the current LPG infrastructure could be adapted to store and deliver hydrogen.

Before we got the current car we did look at electric one but the price and the infrastructure were the stumbling blocks.

Dave
 
Tringa said:
This article - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-61505025 - is interesting. It is about the rural infrastructure but has some wider points.

and this programme - https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m00162yr - is worth a listen.

At present we have a car that will run on petrol or LPG and although there number of LPG garages is limited(apparently continetal Europe has much bigger coverage) and mpg from LPG is lower than petrol, LPG is much cheaper and less polluting than petrol; and refuelling takes about the same time as filling up with petrol.

I'm not suggesting LPG is the way forward. I think electric will, and should, be the way to go but I wonder if hydrogen powered cars could be an intermediate stage. Hydrogen has its problems in that the small molecule size means it leaks out of pipework, but I wonder if the current LPG infrastructure could be adapted to store and deliver hydrogen.

Before we got the current car we did look at electric one but the price and the infrastructure were the stumbling blocks.

Dave
Click to expand...
Yes - I read the Wales article when it came out and I'll have a listen to the other one you link to. It's an interesting one because I no longer drive across Wales. I can imagine visiting and travelling from a base but I wouldn't want to go one end to another. As I say, for some use cases they now seem good (up from 0 last time I looked) but they still have many drawbacks - it's a question of how many of those are relevant to the individual buying one.

For example, about once a year I really need an estate car. But rather than compromising and buying an electric MG Estate, I'm thinking of buying a saloon and then renting a van on the rare occasions I need the extra capacity. But if I needed an estate every week I'd certainly stick with my Honda.
 
JonathanRyan said:
Yes. I wondered if we could move on to the bit where we discuss which ones are a good buy.
Click to expand...
Off you go then. Just bear in mind that they'll get round to charging you for, err, charging at some time. Assuming that the chargers are actually working...

Tesla chargers out of service on M40 TZ70 P1030302.JPG
 
JonathanRyan said:
They look nice but I can't find one without leather seats :( And they are basically Tesla money. I was wondering if a 3 year old Model S was a crazy idea.
Click to expand...
I've not looked into it a great deal, but looking more and more now. I guess it's like anything, only the bad get reported, but I've seen so many issues with Tesla reported it's unreal. My mate has one and hates it too.

Personally I've been looking at the Polestar 2 (I just loved my previous Volvo so see it as a no brainer), but again, living up in rural Cumbria, and often taking day trips up into the Highlands and then week to 10 day long trips to the Highlands and Islands, the infrastructure just isn't there yet for me personally.

Once there are cars that can do 1000 miles per charge, then I'll seriously start to consider it, but by that time comes, no doubt just like diesel was the best option for us, we'll get told electric cars aren't the future either....which I already somewhat believe.
 
It it helps at all... I read up on the electric Mini a couple of weeks ago and came away wondering why anyone would ever buy one. Sorry if any electric Mini owners are reading this but the issues just seemed to add up to it being completely unsuitable for me... or maybe anyone :D I'm kidding Mini owners :D but I do think it's one option that should be carefully thought about before jumping for.
 
JonathanRyan said:
I can't really think of a worse one than taxis - unless it's towing 3.5 tonnes across a muddy field :D That's kind of interesting since taxis were a major reason for the success of the Prius hybrid.
Click to expand...

You'd be thinking wrong re taxis. electric suits the taxi trade very well. Given that most taxi trade is in cities where electric excels. The MG5 estate car is very popular with taxi drivers, earlier it was the Nissan Leaf.
 
We have a 14 plate Leaf as the town car. Range isn't huge (70-75 miles per full charge, possibly more if we didn't live at the top of a steep hill which chews through the charge!!!) Usually charge at home but plug in to the free points (there's usually one available) when we go to Sainsbury's and after an hour or so, we've got more charge than the trip there and back uses. Performance is about the same as a 1600 petrol, if not a bit quicker, especially away from the lights. Driving experience is very similar to any automatic but with more "engine" braking. Carries 3 people and a week's shopping with room to spare. More comfortable than a similar age A Class Merc.
Most routine, shorter round trips get done in it rather than the MX-5 because it's so much cheaper per mile. Can't give any specifics on costs because it costs what it costs, just like petrol/Diesel so we don't look at it too closely - life's too short!
It would be nice to have more range but we don't need it at the moment.
 
Steep said:
You'd be thinking wrong re taxis. electric suits the taxi trade very well. Given that most taxi trade is in cities where electric excels. The MG5 estate car is very popular with taxi drivers, earlier it was the Nissan Leaf.
Click to expand...

This gets back to my point about electric and cities and the taxi driver I asked saying he wouldn't consider electric due to range and charging issues. This is in the Cleveland (Teesside) area.
 
JonathanRyan said:
Yes. I wondered if we could move on to the bit where we discuss which ones are a good buy.
Click to expand...

Depends on your needs and budget really though a car with 200+ miles range is normal these days even at the cheaper end of the market.

2nd hand electric just now is not a good market, the chip shortage is keeping prices very high. And even new you're going to have to be prepared for a long wait regardless of make.

My company car is electric (MG5 Standard Range) and I do about 1000 miles a week in it (currently nearing 31k). It's good to drive even for longer periods though not too long, very quiet of course and very responsive. I say not too long because it's an electric conversion of an ICE car so the floor is a bit higher than I would like. This only becomes an issue after hours of driving.
At this time of year I can get 220 miles on a charge without much effort and this is often enough to get me to my jobs and home again. Charging at home, I plug it in and it's fully charged the next morning.

You can buy an MG5 for £24-26k ? the shorter range model is no longer sold and even the long range is on hold for now as there's a face lift model due out.. The Chinese are coming (MG is Chinese) and prices should begin to drop or at least value for money should go up.
 
woof woof said:
This gets back to my point about electric and cities and the taxi driver I asked saying he wouldn't consider electric due to range and charging issues. This is in the Cleveland (Teesside) area.
Click to expand...

Dundee is electric city and loads of taxi drivers use EVs, there's a Youtube channel from an Irish guy who's a taxi driver in Dublin and he loves it. Re range, again it depends what they are looking for but 200 miles plus should be plenty for most taxi drivers most of the time, if they run short then a 20 minute top up is probably enough.
 
Nod said:
We have a 14 plate Leaf as the town car. Range isn't huge (70-75 miles per full charge, possibly more if we didn't live at the top of a steep hill which chews through the charge!!!) Usually charge at home but plug in to the free points (there's usually one available) when we go to Sainsbury's and after an hour or so, we've got more charge than the trip there and back uses. Performance is about the same as a 1600 petrol, if not a bit quicker, especially away from the lights. Driving experience is very similar to any automatic but with more "engine" braking. Carries 3 people and a week's shopping with room to spare. More comfortable than a similar age A Class Merc.
Most routine, shorter round trips get done in it rather than the MX-5 because it's so much cheaper per mile. Can't give any specifics on costs because it costs what it costs, just like petrol/Diesel so we don't look at it too closely - life's too short!
It would be nice to have more range but we don't need it at the moment.
Click to expand...

That to me is just appalling range and given that a round trip to Leeds, Newcastle or even York or Durham wouldn't be possible without worry. You know, the more I read and ask about electric the more I'm convinced that in some parts of this country and for some people this just isn't real world feasible.

Steep said:
Depends on your needs and budget really though a car with 200+ miles range is normal these days even at the cheaper end of the market.

2nd hand electric just now is not a good market, the chip shortage is keeping prices very high. And even new you're going to have to be prepared for a long wait regardless of make.

My company car is electric (MG5 Standard Range) and I do about 1000 miles a week in it (currently nearing 31k). It's good to drive even for longer periods though not too long, very quiet of course and very responsive. I say not too long because it's an electric conversion of an ICE car so the floor is a bit higher than I would like. This only becomes an issue after hours of driving.
At this time of year I can get 220 miles on a charge without much effort and this is often enough to get me to my jobs and home again. Charging at home, I plug it in and it's fully charged the next morning.

You can buy an MG5 for £24-26k ? the shorter range model is no longer sold and even the long range is on hold for now as there's a face lift model due out.. The Chinese are coming (MG is Chinese) and prices should begin to drop or at least value for money should go up.
Click to expand...

Back when I was doing 1k miles a week plus "often enough" would have meant complaining customers and massive hassles.

I'll stop commenting now as all this is convincing me that electric is simply a no go for me now and indeed probably in the near future but I'm interested in he debate and will read this thread but not add to the negativity :D
 
Last edited:
Steep said:
Dundee is electric city and loads of taxi drivers use EVs, there's a Youtube channel from an Irish guy who's a taxi driver in Dublin and he loves it. Re range, again it depends what they are looking for but 200 miles plus should be plenty for most taxi drivers most of the time, if they run short then a 20 minute top up is probably enough.
Click to expand...

Great. It works in Dundee but possibly not in the Middlesbrough / Redcar area.
 
woof woof said:
That to me is just appalling range and given that a round trip to Leeds, Newcastle or even York or Durham wouldn't be possible without worry. You know, the more I read and ask about electric the more I'm convinced that in some parts of this


Back when I was doing 1k miles a week plus "often enough" would have meant complaining customers and massive hassles.

I'll stop commenting now as all this convincing me that electric is simply a no go for me now and indeed probably in the near future but I'm interested in he debate and will read this thread but not add to the negativity :D
country and for some people this just isn't real world feasible.
Click to expand...

You would know best what suits you. Question though, in your 1000 mile a week days did you stop for lunch?
I'm the first to admit that it's easier for me since I'm actually an EV charger service tech so my job is driving from one to the next, though it is an incentive to fix them lol.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nod
e208 here. Real world range about @160 from a stated 220, depending on temperature and driving. Cold on the motorway, you probably won't get that, warm on B roads with regenerative braking you'll get more.

Cost of ownership: Well, you'll need to do the calculations but mine worked out cheaper than the diesel I run taking into account depreciation and petrol. On that basis and because electric cars are so new, I leased, partly for cost reason, partly because I didn't know what to expect and partly because things are moving on quickly and I didn't want to be stuck with a car not as good as new cars coming out.

Cost of charging on some sort of overnight tariff at home, a few quid for a 160 miles. Cost of charging on the network for what is normally a top up charge, anything from 6-12 quid so far, plus the cost of the coffee, while you wait!

Ease of charging: It varies. Rural areas, not so good, motorway, good but often busy, supermarkets, increasingly common and generally available and working. I also have a normal mains lead I take on holiday for slow overnight charging.

How does it drive: It's great. Super responsive, no slouch, handles well but you can feel that extra weight.

I do still fret a little about range but not as much and the next one, there will be a next one, will have more range. Mostly it doesn't matter though as it's journeys are short, only once habe we taken the diesel for a holiday and that's because I couldn't get the bikes in the back of the 208. Should have got the 2008.
 
woof woof said:
Great. It works in Dundee but possibly not in the Middlesbrough / Redcar area.
Click to expand...

There's no reason why it wouldn't, one urban area is much like another.
 
We bought it as a town car, to keep as much pollution out of the city centre as possible. Very few of OUR journeys are longer than its range and if they are longer, we use a different vehicle.
 
Steep said:
You would know best what suits you. Question though, in your 1000 mile a week days did you stop for lunch?
I'm the first to admit that it's easier for me since I'm actually an EV charger service tech so my job is driving from one to the next, though it is an incentive to fix them lol.
Click to expand...

Often not, no.

I worked for a 3rd party computer maintenance company and covered an area from Hull or beyond to beyond Newcastle and as far west as there was faulty kit and eating sandwiches if I had time was done whenever and wherever I could and as fast as I could. Faffing about looking for a charging point would have been impossible most of the time and charging at many customers premises, impossible.

Times have changed for me as I've given up paid employment so an electric car with limited range which might leave me stranded is an outside possibility as an ownership experience as I'm not going to lose my livelihood or spend the day dealing with a screaming customer if I can't get from A-B and back again without phoning for a tow truck. Even so, I don't think I could sell both my ICE cars if I got an electric one as I'd have to keep one for the occasional trips which could be a problem with an electric car.

PS.
Dundee v M'bro/Redcar.
I'd imagine that Dundee is better served than east Cleveland which is a relatively deprived industrial area. If I do get more interested in electric I'll do more research.
 
Last edited:
Nod said:
We bought it as a town car, to keep as much pollution out of the city centre as possible. Very few of OUR journeys are longer than its range and if they are longer, we use a different vehicle.
Click to expand...
That's what I'd need to do. And now I'll just read and leave this to you guys :D
 
woof woof said:
PS.
Dundee v M'bro/Redcar.
I'd imagine that Dundee is better served than east Cleveland which is a relatively deprived industrial area. If I do get more interested in electric I'll do more research.
Click to expand...

Scotland in general is better served I think. Scotgov set out to make it easier for councils to go electric quite a few years ago and set up a nationwide charging network that doesn't really exist in England.
 
I've had several over the years. Had a first generation Soul EV in 2016. I now have a 200 mile range early Model S. I was going to wait but thought sod it and got one least year. The tesla supercharger network makes it so easy to own. I can go pretty much anywhere and just tap the destination into the sat nav and not have to concern myself with charging being an issue. I can't say the same about any of the other electric cars I've had, even ones with a similar range.

The main issue at the moment is availability. Waiting lists are daft.

For price/performance on non Tesla cars you can't beat the MG facelift ZS or the MG5. Everything else is massively over priced for what it is. Kia/Hyundai have gone ridiculous and want £40k for most of theirs. It's mental. KateFantom on Youtube has an MG5 for work and does about 1000-1500 miles a week in it week in and week out. He is Cleevely Mobile which does EV mobile servicing so he is constantly going up and down the country and to new places so that's the biggest challenge.

If you have a drive at home it's a no brainer now.
 
srichards said:
I've had several over the years. Had a first generation Soul EV in 2016. I now have a 200 mile range early Model S. I was going to wait but thought sod it and got one least year. The tesla supercharger network makes it so easy to own. I can go pretty much anywhere and just tap the destination into the sat nav and not have to concern myself with charging being an issue. I can't say the same about any of the other electric cars I've had, even ones with a similar range.

The main issue at the moment is availability. Waiting lists are daft.

For price/performance on non Tesla cars you can't beat the MG facelift ZS or the MG5. Everything else is massively over priced for what it is. Kia/Hyundai have gone ridiculous and want £40k for most of theirs. It's mental. KateFantom on Youtube has an MG5 for work and does about 1000-1500 miles a week in it week in and week out. He is Cleevely Mobile which does EV mobile servicing so he is constantly going up and down the country and to new places so that's the biggest challenge.

If you have a drive at home it's a no brainer now.
Click to expand...
I follow them on YT, good videos.

How was the Soul to drive? I have a diesel soul now and fancied changing to an EV version. price is silly though.
 
Steep said:
I follow them on YT, good videos.

How was the Soul to drive? I have a diesel soul now and fancied changing to an EV version. price is silly though.
Click to expand...

It was well built but not that fun to drive and the nexen tyres on it were awful. I think the later ones are a bit better. I think the Niro because they're a lot more about will be a bit cheaper to buy.
 
Another Peugeot e208 owner here - to me, it's really a no brainer (especially given 250 miles per week commuting) - 1.3p/mile in fuel costs versus 15p in the petrol or diesel equivalent, zero road tax versus £140/£150.

Personally I'm saving in the region of £180/month in fuel [August 2021 prices] (and spending £20 on charging) - no longer thinking "that trip's going to cost £20" when it costs me £1.50 tops in electricity.

I did the calculation that on between 5 and 7 occasions per year I will drive further than the real world range of the car - for those handful of days, I can live with the "inconvenience" and expense of public charging (especially as someone in the car in those occasions usually wants to stop for a wee every 90-120 mins)

Sure, it's not for everyone but fuel is only going to go up (and probably dramatically so) from here.

Range anxiety is a thing, I get that - I had it in the first month, but it really is a non-event.

Anyway, remember that in 2020 (according to the IMF, that well-known bastion of treehugging) governments around the world gifted fossil fuel companies $6 trillion just to allow them to keep us all polluting the atmosphere, accelerating global warming and essentially killing us all. I think that works out to be something like 8% of world GDP as a gift with essentially no strings attached
 
I am hanging on to my petrol vehicle until there are no more second hand replacements available or there are charging points on every street, motorway etc.
 
Nod said:
We have a 14 plate Leaf as the town car. Range isn't huge (70-75 miles per full charge, possibly more if we didn't live at the top of a steep hill which chews through the charge!!!) Usually charge at home but plug in to the free points (there's usually one available) when we go to Sainsbury's and after an hour or so, we've got more charge than the trip there and back uses.
Click to expand...

I was pretty shocked to read a range of 70 miles but then I looked at some numbers - that would actually cover at least 80% of my driving. Really interesting solution. If only they had a booster battery you could rent and add on when you wanted to go further. The more I think about it, the more my current car choice is determined by about 20% of my driving. Maybe it's time to rethink.
AndrewFlannigan said:
Off you go then. Just bear in mind that they'll get round to charging you for, err, charging at some time. Assuming that the chargers are actually working...

View attachment 355351
Click to expand...

Ah that's no problem. The closest one to here I wouldn't be able to use as it's beyond check in for the Eurotunnel :D The second closest is actually in France so I couldn't rely on their network.
Steep said:
You'd be thinking wrong re taxis. electric suits the taxi trade very well. Given that most taxi trade is in cities where electric excels. The MG5 estate car is very popular with taxi drivers, earlier it was the Nissan Leaf.
Click to expand...

Wow - shows just how wrong I can be when I make assumptions. I guess I have no real idea how far a taxi drives in an average day.
srichards said:
For price/performance on non Tesla cars you can't beat the MG facelift ZS or the MG5. Everything else is massively over priced for what it is. Kia/Hyundai have gone ridiculous and want £40k for most of theirs.
Click to expand...

Yes, head says MG, but I just don't like the MG. Heart says Tesla S but I don't really drive enough to justify it. Hyundai looks nice - last time I tried to buy a hybrid I very nearly bought an Ioniq. Now they have pure plug in they look nice but the money just seems a lot for a Hyundai.
 
JonathanRyan said:
Wow - shows just how wrong I can be when I make assumptions. I guess I have no real idea how far a taxi drives in an average day.
Click to expand...

I did a quick google and found reference to average 110 miles a day but between 50 and 250. For a taxi driver the long range MG5 should be able to cover that easily. Town driving is really efficient for an EV too.
 
electric cars are great maybe some days they run on eleccy from biofuels or even gas but some days all there charging leccy will be wind and solar and up the line that will only get better.
ICE cars will only ever run on filthy fuel and pollute and expecially diesel drivers giving young children lung diseases
 
JonathanRyan said:
I was pretty shocked to read a range of 70 miles but then I looked at some numbers - that would actually cover at least 80% of my driving. Really interesting solution. If only they had a booster battery you could rent and add on when you wanted to go further. The more I think about it, the more my current car choice is determined by about 20% of my driving. Maybe it's time to rethink.


Ah that's no problem. The closest one to here I wouldn't be able to use as it's beyond check in for the Eurotunnel :D The second closest is actually in France so I couldn't rely on their network.


Wow - shows just how wrong I can be when I make assumptions. I guess I have no real idea how far a taxi drives in an average day.


Yes, head says MG, but I just don't like the MG. Heart says Tesla S but I don't really drive enough to justify it. Hyundai looks nice - last time I tried to buy a hybrid I very nearly bought an Ioniq. Now they have pure plug in they look nice but the money just seems a lot for a Hyundai.
Click to expand...

Cheapest Model S are around £30k now. I don't drive enough to justify one really but got it anyway. Now oddly enough I'm going all over the place as it's so easy to do longer journeys in it. It's a land yacht.

I don't really like the MG either but compared to the others it's such good value. Next best is probably the Kia e Niro electric but that's still £30k+ which is a lot for an ordinary car.
 
JonathanRyan said:
I was pretty shocked to read a range of 70 miles but then I looked at some numbers - that would actually cover at least 80% of my driving.
Click to expand...

Yes, it's not ideal! BUT, one of my bikes has a little over 100 miles in the tank so limited range isn't a massive problem for me to compute and mainly, the Leaf was bought as a town car rather than a long distance tool so the limited range is not a problem for us. Even when the hungry light comes on (at 20% capacity) we have plenty to get us to and from town a couple of times but we usually plug in overnight when it gets down to 30% or so.

If your heart says Tesla S but you can't justify one to yourself, maybe a 3 would suit your needs? Slightly odd looking but aren't we all?!!!

Talking to another EV owner (another older Leaf), he said that for the few times he needed to do out of range trips, he rented ICE cars, Like us, he has the Leaf to keep as many emissions out of town but motorways etc. tend to avoid city centres!
 
Model 3 is even more to buy than the model S. They're more like £40k.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top