Leica M3 Shutter speeds

BillN_33

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Is there a method to test the shutter speeds on my M3 - I read that there is an iPhone app that can do this but it uses sound to determine the speeds

apparently the SLOW shutters speeds on my M3 are "off" which reading on the internet can be normal because of the age

or is there anyone out there that can still CLA the camera, (apart from Leica, that is)
 
Is there a method to test the shutter speeds on my M3 - I read that there is an iPhone app that can do this but it uses sound to determine the speeds

apparently the SLOW shutters speeds on my M3 are "off" which reading on the internet can be normal because of the age

or is there anyone out there that can still CLA the camera, (apart from Leica, that is)
It is very easy to get a cheap "scope" kit, and use a photo transistor and LED
Means you can check the speed across the frame too.

Most old mechanical shutters will not adjust precisely, but should be within half a stop or better.

I have checked cameras that have been serviced and adjusted, and they are miles out

The sound apps may or may not give a good result, but there are apps that you can use a phototransistor on.

I used one of these, and it works well https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/14581176...3H3dV+zSGFEIRnMzF2Yvasnvw=|tkp:Bk9SR8bPr_KEZA
 
It is very easy to get a cheap "scope" kit, and use a photo transistor and LED
Means you can check the speed across the frame too.

Most old mechanical shutters will not adjust precisely, but should be within half a stop or better.

I have checked cameras that have been serviced and adjusted, and they are miles out

The sound apps may or may not give a good result, but there are apps that you can use a phototransistor on.

I used one of these, and it works well https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/145811760493?itmmeta=01J0KJBWYX1ZGTTDESCBS6D3J3&hash=item21f30ee56d:g:t38AAOSwE4JmXVsd&itmprp=enc:AQAJAAABAL05KrBFG3HZhyjBNAXbwaLkGXzmrVGQBgeEnT+LiRC8nM3Od4pJ8yQepqFMYQ61buog4KQ9QbJyTcwHHoAi3pyBbUZE4BXHL+47yDK9AioWOoEGtXu+Er/HMvBSPAMM1zuVg5Faw7IjhqMaiaB+y8BQ8VwgEOsP16DtpaK/cHOzvVlLadDvlQ8G--aFFtXBqi36PA/nRB8Wz6xm20FTocyGPZrH8PY8NK4GyuwQBb1ncAnXgtCdaiu0f6aNRd/iJAePttrfCaHM2aljSJTXC+FVRITorplDDucyI9skKcCM+Sxk9zEgcerYLq3cg+e3H3dV+zSGFEIRnMzF2Yvasnvw=|tkp:Bk9SR8bPr_KEZA

thanks Steve - but the link does not seem to work?

could you post it again please

OK now - but I haven't a clue on how to use that "scope" kit
 
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is there anyone out there that can still CLA the camera
Give Ffordes a ring and ask them who they use. I did this for my Rollei CLA and a Hasselblad lens, but they were both done a long while ago and I can't remember who it was. This would probably be quick and as it's a CLA, straightforward.

I took my Leica to the Leica store in Manc because I think a bit of film broke off from my hand rolled (and badly trimmed) film and got stuck in the shutter button transport. They have a guy who is ex-Leica who does their "don't need to send it to Leica" repairs for speed & expense. They told me it would be at least a couple of months though... That was back in May. They did give me a lot of confidence around everything apart from speedy turnaround. It's not likely to be cheap either...
 
The simplest way of testing your shutter speeds involves a roll of film, an exposure meter and little else.

Choose an indoor setting such as your living room with the curtains drawn and the lights on. Meter for the widest aperture on your lens and set the shutter to the reading. Then take your pictures, closing down the aperture for each frame and decreasing the shutter speed to keep it constant. e.g. f2 - 1/60th, f2.8 - 1/30th, f4 - 1/15th, f5.6 - 1/8th .. and so on. Develop and inspect the film. If all the frames have much the same density, then your shutter is good enough.
 
Give Ffordes a ring and ask them who they use. I did this for my Rollei CLA and a Hasselblad lens, but they were both done a long while ago and I can't remember who it was. This would probably be quick and as it's a CLA, straightforward.

I took my Leica to the Leica store in Manc because I think a bit of film broke off from my hand rolled (and badly trimmed) film and got stuck in the shutter button transport. They have a guy who is ex-Leica who does their "don't need to send it to Leica" repairs for speed & expense. They told me it would be at least a couple of months though... That was back in May. They did give me a lot of confidence around everything apart from speedy turnaround. It's not likely to be cheap either...

Thanks Ian,

apparently it just needs a drop of lighter fluid to clean the mechanism and then a couple of very very small drops of sewing machine oil - taking the top off the camera looks straightforward but of course has to be done care.
The last time I had a CLA I am sure it was around £100, certainly less than £150, but that was over 20 years ago and it could have been longer - it is probably 4 or 5 times that now

The problem is that the slow speeds 5, 2, 1 are inconsistent, (but I cannot remember ever using ½. 1 or 2 seconds), - there are a few utube vids on the subject so it must not be unusual and of course the M3 is years old so it can be expected
 
The simplest way of testing your shutter speeds involves a roll of film, an exposure meter and little else.

Choose an indoor setting such as your living room with the curtains drawn and the lights on. Meter for the widest aperture on your lens and set the shutter to the reading. Then take your pictures, closing down the aperture for each frame and decreasing the shutter speed to keep it constant. e.g. f2 - 1/60th, f2.8 - 1/30th, f4 - 1/15th, f5.6 - 1/8th .. and so on. Develop and inspect the film. If all the frames have much the same density, then your shutter is good enough.

Thanks Andrew
 
Thanks Ian,

apparently it just needs a drop of lighter fluid to clean the mechanism and then a couple of very very small drops of sewing machine oil - taking the top off the camera looks straightforward but of course has to be done care.
The last time I had a CLA I am sure it was around £100, certainly less than £150, but that was over 20 years ago and it could have been longer - it is probably 4 or 5 times that now

The problem is that the slow speeds 5, 2, 1 are inconsistent, (but I cannot remember ever using ½. 1 or 2 seconds), - there are a few utube vids on the subject so it must not be unusual and of course the M3 is years old so it can be expected
From what you say, it sounds like the lighter fluid is to soften old gummed up lubricant, and the oil is to try and make it move freely again.

Doesn't sound like a complete or long lasting repair though.

I have never worked on a Leica, but I believe it is pretty similar to the Zorki etc.
The shutter speed accuracy is dependent mainly on three things. The free movement of the curtains, the tension on the curtain springs, and the free movement and accuracy of the release cams/pawls on the speed control assembly.

If the curtains do not move freely, it is usually the high speeds that are affected, ie 1/1000 will be nearer to 1/500, which probably would not even be noticed by most.
If the curtains are not free to the extent they affect the slow speeds, then the high speeds will certainly be out too.
Some people increase the curtain spring tensions a bit, which may help, but then often makes the speeds below 125 to fast.

The lighter fluid and oil repair would probably apply to the delay control under the top cover, in which case if done carefully, and no lighter fluid or oil gets anywhere except where it is supposed to, it shouldn't do any harm, but as the gummed up lubricant will still be in place, just softened, I can't see it being a 100% repair. If it works OK for another few years, then I guess it would be OK.
I think if you are going to try it, more research on peoples opinions of it and how effective it is would be worthwhile, otherwise it would be best to pay to have it done properly.

On the Zorki/Zenit it takes 2-3 hours to remove the curtain assembly, clean completely, lubricate and fit new curtains or curtain tapes and do the speed control, so that may give an indication of the cost.

There is a big difference in the current and future values of the Leica compared to a £20 Zorki though :)
 
The simplest way of testing your shutter speeds involves a roll of film, an exposure meter and little else.

Choose an indoor setting such as your living room with the curtains drawn and the lights on. Meter for the widest aperture on your lens and set the shutter to the reading. Then take your pictures, closing down the aperture for each frame and decreasing the shutter speed to keep it constant. e.g. f2 - 1/60th, f2.8 - 1/30th, f4 - 1/15th, f5.6 - 1/8th .. and so on. Develop and inspect the film. If all the frames have much the same density, then your shutter is good enough.
:agree: I do this with every film camera I buy, I use slide film as it has less tolerance to exposure errors and is easy to "read". It is expensive film but I feel it is worth the expense for the peace of mind.


I used Cameraworks for my M2 when I first got it a few years ago, they are very thorough but the lead time was around 6 months back then.

The thing with these old cameras is they don't fair well if left unused the best medicine for them is to use them regularly, I rarely use my 35mm cameras anymore (preferring my M9s) but I regularly put an old sacrificial film through them to keep them active.
 
Thanks Fraser - I'll give them a try, but I just want to test the speed before I do as I have a couple of M3's and just want to get one of them sorted

The repaint jobs look really "cool"

I used them to service and repaint my M3 (and install some other little upgrades), they're great.
 
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