Lastolite HiLite Help

Thanks - that was the video Beth showed me and was pivotal in sorting mine out, as to the bottom I thought the same - either attach the train or even just pop something heavish on it - not a worry though and I'm a much happier bunny :D
 
Yip I've twisted it a few times :)
 
My first attempts using the Hilite + Train have gone well enough, I was just wondering what modifier people use for lighting the train?

I had a single strobe with a standard reflector at the side of the train (about 3 feet from the hilite), pointing to the opposite corner of train (where it meets the Hilite). I fashioned a flag using a cereal box + duck tape which I then taped around the reflector to stop it spilling light onto the legs of the subject..

What modifiers are others using? I was thinking of trying a grid, would that stop the need of a home-brew flag?
 
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Did you need the flag? A standard reflector may be all that's needed depending on the position of the subject.
 
EOS_JD said:
Did you need the flag? A standard reflector may be all that's needed depending on the position of the subject.
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With one light I did.. the light was 2 feet (maybe less, as close as towards the screen as I could get away with) , to one side of the train, aimed at the opposite corner where the train meets the hilite, the standard reflector was spilling onto their legs, if I angled it more away from the subject, I couldn't get the whole train 'seam' illuminated sufficiently..

If I had 2 lights for that part of the train, it'd have been easy to point them more towards the screen and avoided spill that way. I looked from the models position and you can see a bit of the internal reflective surface of the reflector, then realised it would need to be at an obtuse angle relative to the subject, but that create too acute an angle to the screen, and I can't seem to get good illumination..

I'll maybe try a grid since the flag worked really well, I can just about get away with almost zero PP when metered correctly with no real spill..
 
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phil-t said:
With one light I did.. the light was 2 feet (maybe less, as close as towards the screen as I could get away with) , to one side of the train, aimed at the opposite corner where the train meets the hilite, the standard reflector was spilling onto their legs, if I angled it more away from the subject, I couldn't get the whole train 'seam' illuminated sufficiently..

If I had 2 lights for that part of the train, it'd have been easy to point them more towards the screen and avoided spill that way. I looked from the models position and you can see a bit of the internal reflective surface of the reflector, then realised it would need to be at an obtuse angle relative to the subject, but that create too acute an angle to the screen, and I can't seem to get good illumination..

I'll maybe try a grid since the flag worked really well, I can just about get away with almost zero PP when metered correctly with no real spill..
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Show us a pic of the setup lighting the train please.
 
bustersdelight said:
Show us a pic of the setup lighting the train please.
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Sure,

The setup (front room)
Qx8Jm.jpg


Default RAW conversion
9Hgub.jpg



I'm just messing around at home at the moment.. the train light I think could be lower (I don't have a lower stand presently)..

Any advice welcomed..
 
Try getting the main light lower down so you get a catchlight in the eye and also angle it towards the floor more so that it brightens the floor - still very grey.

I see you only have one light inside the hilight too - looks a tad darker on the right (as we look) but a simple fix.

Not a bad job really - I might try and light my floor the next time. :thumbs:
 
phil-t said:
I was just wondering what modifier people use for lighting the train?
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Lightroom :D

phil-t said:
Sure,

The setup (front room)
Qx8Jm.jpg


Default RAW conversion
9Hgub.jpg



I'm just messing around at home at the moment.. the train light I think could be lower (I don't have a lower stand presently)..

Any advice welcomed..
Click to expand...

That looks pretty good to me, obviously just needs the PP doing on the rest of the background, but exposure looks good, and the shadows are falling in the right places.
 
TG. said:
Lightroom :D



That looks pretty good to me, obviously just needs the PP doing on the rest of the background, but exposure looks good, and the shadows are falling in the right places.
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Correct but there's no catchlight in the eyes cause the main light is too high
 
bustersdelight said:
Do you need two lights to light the subject?
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I used to use one. Going to two (using one as a fill light) made a massive difference to my images. Softer shadow side meant less editing in Lr/Ps.
 
EOS_JD said:
Try getting the main light lower down so you get a catchlight in the eye and also angle it towards the floor more so that it brightens the floor - still very grey.

I see you only have one light inside the hilight too - looks a tad darker on the right (as we look) but a simple fix.

Not a bad job really - I might try and light my floor the next time. :thumbs:
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Top advice!, I wanted the key-light lower, the settee was in the way, and I didn't realise the catchlight was missing (ruins the image IMO) until later!

I also added a bit more fill light later on the left, I kept moving this/trying new modifiers to see how it looked..

The background is lit with one light, but my colour picker shows 255,255,255 all accross it, the bottom left is 235-240ish accross the board according to the colour picker.. Although it looks OK on my calibrated monitor, it looks really grey on my laptop!,.. I never know what to adjust for, or if I've messed the colour profiles up..

Just to check, my first PP step is to try setting the white point to the bottom left, which gives.. does that look better?
oe7Gm.jpg


(Trying to keep it all default OOC)
 
phil-t said:
Top advice!, I wanted the key-light lower, the settee was in the way, and I didn't realise the catchlight was missing (ruins the image IMO) until later!

I also added a bit more fill light later on the left, I kept moving this/trying new modifiers to see how it looked..

The background is lit with one light, but my colour picker shows 255,255,255 all accross it, the bottom left is 235-240ish accross the board according to the colour picker.. Although it looks OK on my calibrated monitor, it looks really grey on my laptop!,.. I never know what to adjust for, or if I've messed the colour profiles up..

Just to check, my first PP step is to try setting the white point to the bottom left, which gives.. does that look better?
oe7Gm.jpg


(Trying to keep it all default OOC)
Click to expand...

I like the edit you did there :thumbs:
Laptops are not good to edit with as a slight adjustment in the angle can totally change the contrast and colours! Always go with the calibrated monitor. :)
 
TG. said:
Lightroom :D



That looks pretty good to me, obviously just needs the PP doing on the rest of the background, but exposure looks good, and the shadows are falling in the right places.
Click to expand...

Thanks,

Just for info, this is my simple workflow currently, takes under a minute

1. Rough mask around the subject, then invert, apply maximum brightness to make everything else white.. (seemed quicker then using a white brush)
2. Use a very large/soft brightness brush to just tweak any shadow regions you want to 'cull'..

That gets this far.. and obviously then you can adjust as you want..
wZ6hJ.jpg


I have a calibrated monitor, using an i1 Display Pro, but to be honest, it seems to be so different to uncalibrated monitors, I tend to have to brighten things up a notch and watch the whites, or they look pants on other peoples monitors.. I sometimes wonder if the calibration is good or not (despite the i1 software verification being spot on!)
 
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EOS_JD said:
I used to use one. Going to two (using one as a fill light) made a massive difference to my images. Softer shadow side meant less editing in Lr/Ps.
Click to expand...

Can I ask what the lights were set at? Dit you use a meter
 
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I didn't take the image :)

When I shoot I'll set the main lights to f8 (shooting aperture). Fill at anywhere between f2.8 and f5.6 (depending on what contrast I'm looking for) and background lights set to around f11
 
EOS_JD said:
I didn't take the image :)

When I shoot I'll set the main lights to f8 (shooting aperture). Fill at anywhere between f2.8 and f5.6 (depending on what contrast I'm looking for) and background lights set to around f11
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Also pretty close to that,

f/8 for Key, the fill light I hovered around f/5.6-f/7.1 and angled more towards the front left of the train by the end of the shoot..

Background actually anywhere from f/11 to f/16 seemed OK, I prefer to keep it as low as possible but still just saturating the background to reduce PP and any wrap around on the subject.
 
phil-t said:
Also pretty close to that,

f/8 for Key, the fill light I hovered around f/5.6-f/7.1 and angled more towards the front left of the train by the end of the shoot..

Background actually anywhere from f/11 to f/16 seemed OK, I prefer to keep it as low as possible but still just saturating the background to reduce PP and any wrap around on the subject.
Click to expand...

I actually leave a little wrap around with mine. If done just right removes the need for a fill light in certain circumstances and gives the subject less of a look that it has been cut and pasted onto white in Microsoft paint! :-)
 
dan_yorkshire said:
I actually leave a little wrap around with mine. If done just right removes the need for a fill light in certain circumstances and gives the subject less of a look that it has been cut and pasted onto white in Microsoft paint! :-)
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Have you got an example you could share?, I know what you mean about it being too clean can look cut n pasted!, I've only done two sessions with the lights/hilite, and I'd like to explore more styles, sometimes technically incorrect can look better to the eyes!
 
Got myself a lastolite background and some lighting off the classifieds and set it up tonight...

Think I'll need to get myself to get a light meter to avoid guesswork, as I've never used lighting before.

But was able to get pics out of it straight away. Haven't setup the train yet or even used the third light. Here's a quick and dirty shot of my daughter. 1 light in the background and one softbox.

I swore several times trying to fold it up though...found the instructions easier than the magic jedi's folding them up on video.


Lastolite background + light test by D3RON, on Flickr
 
Thats a lovely shot, much better than my attempts so far.
 
Deron said:
Got myself a lastolite background and some lighting off the classifieds and set it up tonight...

Think I'll need to get myself to get a light meter to avoid guesswork, as I've never used lighting before.

But was able to get pics out of it straight away. Haven't setup the train yet or even used the third light. Here's a quick and dirty shot of my daughter. 1 light in the background and one softbox.

I swore several times trying to fold it up though...found the instructions easier than the magic jedi's folding them up on video.


Lastolite background + light test by D3RON, on Flickr
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You don't need a light meter for this, in fact it's probably easier and more accurate without. Use blinkies - the highlight over-exposure warning on the LCD. They tell you when the background is blown, or just on the brink of blowing.

First thing to do is get the background as evenly lit as possible, no hot-spots. Shoot the background and adjust exposure so it's just around the threshold for blinkies, then click exposure up/down in third-stops increments as you adjust the lights and you'll see exactly where you are and when brightness is most even.

Then you need to set the background exposure carefully so it is blown, but only just, relative to the foregound exposure. Excessive over-exposure of the background is the most common fault - so long at it's blown, whether 1% over or 1000% over, it will be pure white. Go too far, and you'll get flare and the background will start to eat away at the subject outline. Common web-talk of two stops over-exposed for the background is rubbish, aim for half a stop if you can, but never let it go over one stop.

With the train, it's not so easy. Get the hang of mastering the background first. The problem is, if you light the train so that it's blown, the subject standing/sitting on it will also be over-exposed. So you have to get it as close as you can, then do the final tweaks to push it over with some 'grey mopping' in post processing. It's a fine art, though you can make things easier with a benign subject. With blond hair and a white top, well, best of luck with that. But darker hair and clothes allow you more lee-way.
 
Deron said:
Got myself a lastolite background and some lighting off the classifieds and set it up tonight...

Think I'll need to get myself to get a light meter to avoid guesswork, as I've never used lighting before.

But was able to get pics out of it straight away. Haven't setup the train yet or even used the third light. Here's a quick and dirty shot of my daughter. 1 light in the background and one softbox.

I swore several times trying to fold it up though...found the instructions easier than the magic jedi's folding them up on video.


Lastolite background + light test by D3RON, on Flickr
Click to expand...

How comes you had your iso at 400? I thought it would be 100 with flash lights.
 
I've had my highlight out a few times and I am starting to notice an issue with it.
Firstly I'm having trouble getting the setting right using a light meter. Can get the background to somewhere between f11 and f16, but can't seem to get the key light much higher than that. Thing is the photos don't come out too bad but I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong.

Also (as mentioned earlier in this thread) I'm noticing a yelow cast on all my photos. Show's a bit in this one.
IMG_82421.JPG

It's variable in different shots but particulary bad when the light haven't fully charged from the last shot.
I also noticed phil-t set up the hilite looks bright white where mine's more of a light cream colour. Is this normal and anything I can do about it?

I got the hi-lite and lights cheaply second hand so I'm not sure if it's just me, incorrectly metering or something with the kit.
Any advice is welcome on where I'm going wrong is most welcome.
 
How many lights have you got in the hilite , as it looks to be lit uneven .
 
bustersdelight said:
How comes you had your iso at 400? I thought it would be 100 with flash lights.
Click to expand...

I had the backlight at 1/2 power and the soft box at 1/4 power. I'd initially tried in av mode at f8. But the camera looked at the scene and knew it would need a longer shutter, so blurred my picture.

So I just whacked it it in manual, and picked iso 400 at f8. That was the first shot I got out of it. To be honest I approached it as I would using a flash.

Did I mention I've never used lights before?

:)

I'm also quite new to photography, but in the absence of knowledge go for the suck it and see route. I tend to learn a lot by my mistakes.

Next time I try I'll increase flash power and change iso. Obviously there are a lot of variables I can change, to get the right results.
 
bustersdelight said:
I tried with 2 lights in the hilite and 1 shoot through umbrella, I think my hilite was too bright, comments please.
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Yes and also the main light wasn't bright enough
 
Deron said:
I had the backlight at 1/2 power and the soft box at 1/4 power. I'd initially tried in av mode at f8. But the camera looked at the scene and knew it would need a longer shutter, so blurred my picture.

So I just whacked it it in manual, and picked iso 400 at f8. That was the first shot I got out of it. To be honest I approached it as I would using a flash.

Did I mention I've never used lights before?

:)

I'm also quite new to photography, but in the absence of knowledge go for the suck it and see route. I tend to learn a lot by my mistakes.

Next time I try I'll increase flash power and change iso. Obviously there are a lot of variables I can change, to get the right results.
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You HAVE to work in MANUAL with studio flash. In Av mode (aperture priority) the camera is ONLY working out the AMBIENT light levels and doesn't see the flash at all.

So set the ISO to 100 and adjust the aperture/flash power to suit (chimp the screen or use the histogram).
 
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Fulhair said:
One to the left, small reflector inside on the right.

Ony have 2 lights at work with at the moment
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A reflector? What colour is it? That could be causing the colour shift - either that or perhaps the cheap lights (if theyt are cheap ones).

Set the background to around f11 - where are you measuring the light reading from? I turn the dome towards the hilight and from about 1" away measure the light. I measurethe background left, centre and right and try to get it even as possible. The darkest part at least will always be 1 stop over the working aperture.

Main light to f8 (or 1 stop under the background) should be plenty to make the background white.
 
Fulhair said:
One to the left, small reflector inside on the right.

Ony have 2 lights at work with at the moment
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Reflector on the right?

Is that what's causing the yellow cast? Have you tried it without?

I have the 6x7 and had one light about half way through angled to the front. In all shots I've taken it's white all across.

(Oops on iPad, hadn't seen previous response)
 
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bustersdelight said:
Thanks I metered the main light at F8 maybe I should use 2 lights at the front.
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Did you have the background lights on when you metered the main light? You don't "need" two at the front (although can be better) but this is not a problem of not having 2 lights.
 
bustersdelight said:
Yes I had the lights on the background when I metered.
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That's your problem. They need to be OFF. The light coming from the background will be interfering with the reading so switch off the background lights (and any other strobes) or shield the meter better.

Normal lights in the room should be fine but switch off all the strobes apart from the one you are metering.
 
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EOS_JD said:
A reflector? What colour is it? That could be causing the colour shift - either that or perhaps the cheap lights (if theyt are cheap ones).

Set the background to around f11 - where are you measuring the light reading from? I turn the dome towards the hilight and from about 1" away measure the light. I measurethe background left, centre and right and try to get it even as possible. The darkest part at least will always be 1 stop over the working aperture.

Main light to f8 (or 1 stop under the background) should be plenty to make the background white.
Click to expand...

The reflector is a just a sheet of tin foil on the other side to try to balance the sides. I normally don't use this and have the colour issue regardless of the using a reflector or not.
I meter to the centre about an inch away from the surface, with the light meter facing the hilite.

When I can't get this to work I just try adjust so as not to get too much spill onto the subject.

Regarding the lights, they are an older model of Lencartas. Do lights change colour over time and is there any way to check this?

Also I held a white piece of paper against the hilite and there was a noticeable difference in colour with the hitlite being more 'cream'. Without a point of comparison it's difficult to know if this is right. But the colour seems to be consistent across it both inside and out so I didn't notice before.
 
How old is your Hi-Lite? It's very possible that the front diffuser has yellowed over time. I would expect a noticeable difference after a couple of years.
 
Garry Edwards said:
How old is your Hi-Lite? It's very possible that the front diffuser has yellowed over time. I would expect a noticeable difference after a couple of years.
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Not sure how old it is. Was told it hadn't been used much but could have been toldme porkies. I got it cheap so can't be too unhappy if this is the case.
If this is the case is there a way to work around it and make it less noticeable? Brighter lights, white balance, photoshop????:thinking:

As for the lights, is there a way of checking their output for consistency beyond a light meter? I'm having a devil of a time getting the metering right and trying to eliminate all variables or understanding what the meter is telling me.:bonk:
 
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