Last minute wedding - advice!

cymruchris said:
How do you know this for sure?

Have they booked a lovely reception?

A meal for all the family and friends?

A nice wedding dress?

Etc.

Etc.

Etc.

Unless it's a Wedding with 5 guests in a registry office, the chances are that as much as they may not be 'rolling in it' - they should be able to squeeze to a little more than £60.

You should of course point out that images are edited after the Wedding day, and that all in all you may spend several days on the Wedding images..

As a result you believe you should be paid more than the minimum wage.
Click to expand...


Well said Chris. There was a thread on another forum a few years ago, where the "bridezilla" wanted someone to shoot the wedding for free (because she wanted to give them the experience:thinking:), because she hadn't any money left - after paying for the honeymoon to Las Vegas, the one carat diamond ring, the hog roast at the reception etc.

I think that I may have commented at the time, that photographers are so far down the "food chain", they are even lower than a barbequed pig:(
 
paul_g said:
That some of the worst advice I've ever read. Maybe its different in Ireland but in this country Vicars/Priests generally will not allow flash & don't even think of moving up behind the Vicar/Priest on the alter unless you want the embarrassment of being told to clear off or at worst being thrown out.
Click to expand...

Well, you must be an expert then, as I said I certainly was not. I said Priest btw, not Vicar - there must obviously be a difference. No priest here would pull you up on it.

In Ireland they never say a word about flash, or rambling about on the altar, I should have said to ask first of course. Agree on that front.

Worst advice ever though? get a grip. :bang: I think some people who post here only do so to pick apart anyone else's posts. Where's your golden advice? You could have just said "I would definitely ask first about flash" instead of being a bit of a dick about it. Onelook at yourweb site shows you do weddings for a living[?] - so why not offer some really good adviceinstead of merely slating other's - we are just trying to help!

I see worse advice in here, but I'm not going to mouth about what others suggest. Like only giving 10-20 watermarked images, without telling them that's what to expect beforehand - you'll never get one other job out of it.

The best actual advice would be to tell OP not to do it really. As if they're not prepared by now, it'll be a mess on the day, going into it blind like this. But I can't see them backing out, so we give the best advice we can.
 
Last edited:
This is the stuff of nightmares !
FWIW, I think you should have run a mile, I know I would.

The problem is, as a few have said, even though they are paying you almost nothing for doing the job, they are paying you. Because of this fact, they are going to have expectations on what they are going to get from it. And those expectations will be far higher than you expect, even if they say they don't expect a lot.
These sort of people want everything for nothing, and when they don't get it, they will kick off.
Some-one mentioned that if they sued you, that the judge would almost certainly throw it out. I wouldn't bank on it, stranger things have happened. As far as I can see, you are entering a into contract (Albeit a verbal one) with them to photograph their wedding. If you have no contract which they can sign to say they agree with your terms, then anything these cheapskates say to a court will almost certainly go against you. Even if you were doing it for free, I would want something signed by them outlining EXACTLY what they will get.

As for what to give them, well, you have committed to it now, so you may as well give them every decent shot you take. Make sure you give them small, low res copies, and hope to sell them some "proper" ones some time down the line to re-coup some of you costs.

I hope it goes well for you on the day, and you learn from the experience.

Cheers,
Gary
 
paul_g said:
That some of the worst advice I've ever read. Maybe its different in Ireland but in this country Vicars/Priests generally will not allow flash & don't even think of moving up behind the Vicar/Priest on the alter unless you want the embarrassment of being told to clear off or at worst being thrown out.
Click to expand...

I think that is a bit of a sweeping statement, to be honest.
I have assisted on a few weddings, and whilst some said no to flash, about a third didn't mind.
Obviously varies by area/church/vicar/official etc.
 
They certainly would not "throw you out" or tell you to "clear off" mid ceremony! At worst you'll be given a 'quit' sign by the priest, a few cross looks ... photographers take chances, if they're not allowed, they'll be told so ...
 
OptimusBri said:
That's what I would have thought too. I won't get a chance to ask until I actually get to the ceremony though...
Click to expand...

This was my experience the few weddings I shot. I didn't have time to go look for the priest beforehand, so I just started in gently with some flash shots of the ring bearer/bridesmaids etc walking up the aisle. Once I seen the priest was ok, I used it whenever I felt the need. They are not going to tell you off for trying to get the best quality images for the bride possible, especially if the church is badly lit [they oft are]


You obviously have to use some of your own intuition ;) You don't go up in front of them banging off full power flash into their faces. Which is why I said they are usually ok with you going behind, to the side at least. You don't get in the way! Simple. That's what zooms are for.

I would take alot of posts on here with a big fistful of salt anyhow.
 
Briony, do you have any-one you can ask to help out?
If it were one of my friends in this situation I would offer to go along, although there's no money in it for me.
Isn't that what friends are for?
 
GHP said:
Briony, do you have any-one you can ask to help out?
If it were one of my friends in this situation I would offer to go along, although there's no money in it for me.
Isn't that what friends are for?
Click to expand...

Not really! My boyfriend is visiting for the weekend and said he would be more than happy to help me. He doesn't do photography at all but said he'd be happy to assist if he can.

This is just all seeming like a lot more effort than it's worth I think.
 
I turned a wedding down late last year - it was for a friend, and I was doing it on the cheap. I had told her exactly what i would do for it - Shoot the whole day, give her a DVD with about 100 full res, fully processed images, and she could go ahead and print herself. She was happy with this .... initially. But as the wedding came closer she was ringing and texting me with details on the wedding album I was apparently doing, and wondering how many large prints she was getting on top!

In the end, after she badgered me for a bit, I quit, told her to get someone else.

A written contract is a great idea because of times like that. Or, of course, saying no to begin with.

Having a chat with the bride is a must for you I think, maybe write up a contract, with details of what you will do, and have her sign.
 
OptimusBri said:
Again, thanks for all of the advice. I am definitely regretting saying yes to this now - I've half a mind to say I can't do it, as I only found out about it yesterday anyway...! :thinking:
Click to expand...

Do you know the people at all Briony, because from my experience people who expect something for nothing can often be very difficult to please.
You are going to be very stressed about it, you will be lucky to break even and the job will not be finished at the end of the day.
I have done a couple of jobs for relations (absolutely free of course), and rather than thank me for it, they went back on their word regarding what I can/cannot do with the images.
If you had time to prepare for this (which in my opinion is one of the most important aspects of a job like this), and they were paying you a decent amount, then you could just get on with it.
I just think jobs like this one can leave one feeling very resentful.
 
andy700 said:
Do you know the people at all Briony, because from my experience people who expect something for nothing can often be very difficult to please.
You are going to be very stressed about it, you will be lucky to break even and the job will not be finished at the end of the day.
I have done a couple of jobs for relations (absolutely free of course), and rather than thank me for it, they went back on their word regarding what I can/cannot do with the images.
If you had time to prepare for this (which in my opinion is one of the most important aspects of a job like this), and they were paying you a decent amount, then you could just get on with it.
I just think jobs like this one can leave one feeling very resentful.
Click to expand...

I don't know them at all, I have know idea what they look like and have never met them! I'm not sure what connection my friend has with the mother of the bride, though I think he has done photography work for her before. I think it is the lack of preparation and time that is stressing me out. Even if I had another week, at least I'd have more time to go through a contract and what they expected of me.
 
Last edited:
Cagey75 said:
They certainly would not "throw you out" or tell you to "clear off" mid ceremony! At worst you'll be given a 'quit' sign by the priest, a few cross looks ... photographers take chances, if they're not allowed, they'll be told so ...
Click to expand...

I've known of photographers being asked to leave the church mid-ceremony because of their behaviour and at a recent wedding I was severely restricted in where I could stand and when I could shoot. This was because of the behaviour of a photographer the week before who insisted on using flash, getting too close, moving around and machine-gunning. He was asked to leave the ceremony and his behaviour had a direct consequence on my (and presumably others) ability to provide a comprehensive coverage.

I have been seeing this for some time now where relative newcomers do not use any common sense, think only of themselves and disregard the wishes of the vicar/priest/officiant which is a big no no in my book - it's their house, their rules.


Cagey75 said:
This was my experience the few weddings I shot. I didn't have time to go look for the priest beforehand, so I just started in gently with some flash shots of the ring bearer/bridesmaids etc walking up the aisle. Once I seen the priest was ok, I used it whenever I felt the need. They are not going to tell you off for trying to get the best quality images for the bride possible, especially if the church is badly lit [they oft are]


You obviously have to use some of your own intuition ;) You don't go up in front of them banging off full power flash into their faces. Which is why I said they are usually ok with you going behind, to the side at least. You don't get in the way! Simple. That's what zooms are for.

I would take alot of posts on here with a big fistful of salt anyhow.
Click to expand...

Your last post really displays supreme arrogance, some of the wedding photographers on here are very experienced and have a lot to offer in the way of advice but you obviously know better as a result of the "few weddings you shot".
 
OptimusBri said:
I don't know them at all, I have know idea what they look like and have never met them! I'm not sure what connection my friend has with the mother of the bride, though I think he has done photography work for her before. I think it is the lack of preparation and time that is stressing me out. Even if I had another week, at least I'd have more time to go through a contract and what they expected of me.
Click to expand...

Then in my opinion, don't do it.
If they can't be bothered to organise and pay for a photographer, then they don't deserve a second thought from you.
I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.
 
OptimusBri said:
Again, thanks for all of the advice. I am definitely regretting saying yes to this now - I've half a mind to say I can't do it, as I only found out about it yesterday anyway...! :thinking:
Click to expand...

You need to talk to the bride ASAP & find out what is expected of you. The mother, if thats who it is, is being unreasonable with her requests re video etc.
You're obviously confident to shoot the wedding or you wouldn't have said yes in the first place, the kit you can get hold of will be good enough but you have to know what you are required to shoot through the day & the timings need clarifying so that you can plan the day.
I'm basing that on my way of shooting weddings as a traditional wedding photographer because I need to know the time I have to do the work I am contracted to do. If your style is reportage & the bride wants this style then you can be more relaxed about the day although some more information than you currently have is still needed.

I'm not going to get into the pricing discussion though thats for you to decide & the taxi bit I find very worrying!

I'd say that if your questions haven't been answered so that you can make a rational decision by tonight then walk away
 
Last edited:
OK, let me offer my way on handling the situation.

You've agreed to help a friend out and are receiving a very low rate of pay as a result. Those have been decided to nothing further about those in this thread will really help - they are just very useful learning points for the future.

I've had a sneaky peek at your website and you appear competent enough to me to be able to pull this off, so deep breath and plan it all.

Make sure the bride is fully aware of what you will produce. To me, that would be somewhere in the region of 30-40 sharp, well exposed photos that tell the story of the day. Don't try and emulate some of the photos produced by the top end pro's on here - keep it simple.

Also make sure you speak to the vicar/registrar beforehand if you plan on shooting inside, and get their rules. Remember, that you're shooting with gear that won't naturally produce great images using natural light at high ISO's, so this may be one area where you take a break, gather yourself and think about the post wedding shots don't get stressed about the service shots if you can't use flash - if they wanted everything then they should have paid and hired appropriately.

Don't try to use any techniques you've not tried before, stick to what you know.

Keep calm and you'll be fine.

Mike
 
pooley said:
OK, let me offer my way on handling the situation.

You've agreed to help a friend out and are receiving a very low rate of pay as a result. Those have been decided to nothing further about those in this thread will really help - they are just very useful learning points for the future.

I've had a sneaky peek at your website and you appear competent enough to me to be able to pull this off, so deep breath and plan it all.

Make sure the bride is fully aware of what you will produce. To me, that would be somewhere in the region of 30-40 sharp, well exposed photos that tell the story of the day. Don't try and emulate some of the photos produced by the top end pro's on here - keep it simple.

Also make sure you speak to the vicar/registrar beforehand if you plan on shooting inside, and get their rules. Remember, that you're shooting with gear that won't naturally produce great images using natural light at high ISO's, so this may be one area where you take a break, gather yourself and think about the post wedding shots don't get stressed about the service shots if you can't use flash - if they wanted everything then they should have paid and hired appropriately.

Don't try to use any techniques you've not tried before, stick to what you know.

Keep calm and you'll be fine.

Mike
Click to expand...

I was about to post something very similar so you have saved me the time. :thumbs:

Briony, Mike has posted great advice. As he said, try and stay calm and I am sure everything will be fine.
 
I know what you are saying and think most people would have steered you away from from it but thats a by the bye. I think most folk sympathise with your situation based on the reponses thus far. Personally, and don't take this the wrong way I'd inclined to bump it back in the direction of your friend - you seem to have been lumbered with it by virtue of someone else being inadequately equipped.

However if you feel safe from any comeback and are helping out a friend just continue with it and do your best.

I'd also agree with not limiting the numbers or quality of pics as a form of quid pro quo. Shoot it like it it was paying top dollar, use it to find weaknesses in your kit, your own skills and learn from that in the future.

Did you get anywhere with basic contract help or you can just search for real world examples.

Good luck with it :thumbs:
 
I just rung the mother of the bride and made the decision to cancel. Needless to say, she wasn't happy, but I hope some part of her understands that it is so last minute and she was lucky to get someone to say yes in the first place. I did explain that I haven't seen the church, reception venue, or even spoken to the bride and groom and haven't been told what they expect from me at all.

I definitely should have said no at the beginning, but just wanted to help out a friend and get a bit of experience and money as well - who knew it could be so much trouble?! Thank you so much for all your advice :)
 
I think in this instance, you've done a wise thing Briony. Whilst it could have gone beautifully, the cards were stacked heavily towards a difficult day that would cause you stress and resentment, possibly the family too, all because you were initally trying to do the right/kind thing in helping them out.

As an enthusiast I've shot 2 weddings (one on the fly at a family wedding because the chap organised to do it turned up with 2 350D's with kit lenses, faffed about for 30 minutes then announced to the father of the bride that he does a bit of product photography for an engineering firm and actually has no idea what to do, the other for a lady who was our bridesmaid and was on a very tight budget, so I shot the wedding as a gift). I found the whole things very stressful, although they were quite a success, thankfully both in perfect weather conditions, people and family we knew, understanding vicar's, etc. I take my hat off to the guys and gals who do this week in and week out to put food on the table, I'd be a nervous wreck!
 
Last edited:
Have to say well done for having the cojones Briony. IMO, it was unacceptable for your friend to dump you into the situation in the first place. It would be interesting to know his reasons for not wanting to do it or was the camera he's sent off for repair his only body? It sounds to me rather like he's a bit of an uncle Bob or weekend warrior who realised that after expenses, there was not enough in it for him to be worth bothering with and took advantage of your good nature by palming them off onto you!

Once your friend gets his camera back, maybe you could either second for him or just non-shooting assist? Handy experience for you either way and I know at least one pro (here) who started in just that way, seconding for another (here) until he/she felt competent enough to fly solo.

Wishing you all the luck in the future.

Nod.
 
Hacker said:
I've known of photographers being asked to leave the church mid-ceremony because of their behaviour and at a recent wedding I was severely restricted in where I could stand and when I could shoot. This was because of the behaviour of a photographer the week before who insisted on using flash, getting too close, moving around and machine-gunning. He was asked to leave the ceremony and his behaviour had a direct consequence on my (and presumably others) ability to provide a comprehensive coverage.

I have been seeing this for some time now where relative newcomers do not use any common sense, think only of themselves and disregard the wishes of the vicar/priest/officiant which is a big no no in my book - it's their house, their rules.




Your last post really displays supreme arrogance, some of the wedding photographers on here are very experienced and have a lot to offer in the way of advice but you obviously know better as a result of the "few weddings you shot".
Click to expand...


No, it doesn't. If anything yours does though, having a pop because I already admitted to only shooting a few weddings?? Even those shooting all through the year only had 2-3 under their belt at one point. Gotta start somewhere. I'm not a wedding photographer, doesn't mean I haven't been to dozens of them, or that I know nothing about shooting them. That plus OP clearly stated:

OptimusBri said:
Any advice would be welcomed :)
Click to expand...

Not specifically from long term wedding photographers.


But, If they have the experience, and top advice, why not give it instead of nit-picking others who are clearly just trying to help in the first place?. Did you even read my post fully? For one, I stated clearly that I'm certainly no expert, but I'll offer what advice I can - and on the flash front I agreed that it might be better ask, and most certainly keep out of the way ... If you're going to attack someone and call them arrogant, at least get it right. In the end I said best advice here may well be to say "don't do it" after all. Which in the end, is what OP decided.
 
Last edited:
I think you made a wise decision.

Equipment, transport, experience, liabilities were all against you. Potentially it could have tarnished your reputation.


Andy :thumbs:
 
Agree, good choice to cancel. And who cares if the mother of someone you don't know is not happy.
She went for a cheapskate approach and it backfired and she will now have to pay over the odds if she can find anyone at all.

Still, as long as the flowers on the tables look good as that was probably where more money went that on any photographic spend.
 
OptimusBri said:
I just rung the mother of the bride and made the decision to cancel. Needless to say, she wasn't happy, but I hope some part of her understands that it is so last minute and she was lucky to get someone to say yes in the first place. I did explain that I haven't seen the church, reception venue, or even spoken to the bride and groom and haven't been told what they expect from me at all.

I definitely should have said no at the beginning, but just wanted to help out a friend and get a bit of experience and money as well - who knew it could be so much trouble?! Thank you so much for all your advice :)
Click to expand...



Wise move!


Have seen your work and there's no doubt you have the talent to take on something like this in the future, had you been given more time and info, I am sure this would have been a walk in the park for you.
 
Thanks everyone, I feel like I definitely made the right decision :)

Nod said:
Have to say well done for having the cojones Briony. IMO, it was unacceptable for your friend to dump you into the situation in the first place. It would be interesting to know his reasons for not wanting to do it or was the camera he's sent off for repair his only body? It sounds to me rather like he's a bit of an uncle Bob or weekend warrior who realised that after expenses, there was not enough in it for him to be worth bothering with and took advantage of your good nature by palming them off onto you!

Once your friend gets his camera back, maybe you could either second for him or just non-shooting assist? Handy experience for you either way and I know at least one pro (here) who started in just that way, seconding for another (here) until he/she felt competent enough to fly solo.

Wishing you all the luck in the future.

Nod.
Click to expand...

Thank you very much. I'm pretty sure that I'm much more experienced than my friend actually haha, I have done quite a lot over the past few years! He's assisted me before. He has a football tournament on Saturday, and only got asked to do the wedding 2 days ago so couldn't really cancel. I think that camera is his only body too. He had been given absolutely no info about the wedding, so it's not his fault in the slightest, he didn't know what to expect :)

The Greek said:
Wise move!


Have seen your work and there's no doubt you have the talent to take on something like this in the future, had you been given more time and info, I am sure this would have been a walk in the park for you.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot :) I would have liked to think so. Having two days to try and organise something like this doesn't work well for me!
 
Don't fret and don't bother replying. Odds on she is angry her cheapskate plan has backfired and wants to take it out on someone - you - and get you back on the job.

I know I said you're capable of doing the job and I stand by that based on your website but I'm also impressed you had the guts to say no.

Just don't say no too often once you turn pro!!
 
Her daughters big day, she tried to scrimp on it - I wouldn't worry about it.

She probably took bad advice on getting a cheap photographer and for which she shouldn't be paying any more than x,y or z for pro.

When you cost it out, using this blog example its clear why wedding photographers charge what they do.

Unfortunately you more often than not, get what you pay for.
 
pooley said:
Don't fret and don't bother replying. Odds on she is angry her cheapskate plan has backfired and wants to take it out on someone - you - and get you back on the job.

I know I said you're capable of doing the job and I stand by that based on your website but I'm also impressed you had the guts to say no.

Just don't say no too often once you turn pro!!
Click to expand...

:plusone:
 
OptimusBri said:
Just got a text from the mother of the bride saying that she's very disappointed about me going back on my word after I said yes and it's really bad etc... Oh dear!
Click to expand...

Try not to get into a text war if possible. I think you have done the right thing by cancelling as it sounds like there was a lot of pressure on your for such little return.

If you really want to do weddings it is best to do them on your own terms. I guess it is so easy to go into something if you think you may want to do it in the future without properly thinking about it first. < I presume but I could be wrong. :shrug:
 
freefall said:
Try not to get into a text war if possible. I think you have done the right thing by cancelling as it sounds like there was a lot of pressure on your for such little return.

If you really want to do weddings it is best to do them on your own terms. I guess it is so easy to go into something if you think you may want to do it in the future without properly thinking about it first. < I presume but I could be wrong. :shrug:
Click to expand...

From what experience I've had, I do quite enjoy wedding photography but it's not something I want to go in to. This would have just been a bit of extra experience to help in general.

Oh don't worry, I'm not getting in to a text war at all. I just replied saying something along the lines of that I'm sorry to have made the decision to cancel, but I barely received any details about the day or what was expected of me, and I wish her luck in finding another photographer and I hope she has a wonderful day.

I'm leaving it at that :)
 
Good. Plus it kind of makes her think that they have messed you about with little details and hopefully she will think not to scrimp and get a pro.
 
OptimusBri said:
Just got a text from the mother of the bride saying that she's very disappointed about me going back on my word after I said yes and it's really bad etc... Oh dear!
Click to expand...

I wouldn't worry. You don't know these people personally and you are in fact doing it for the greater good although they don't see it for themselves. The fact is it was a favour and if they wanted something more solid then they should've paid for it. I can understand people who don't have big budgets for weddings but its like every other trade in that if you don't pay the going rate then risk rises and you can't expect the same quality of service as someone 10x that rate. They can't have it all ways.
 
Wouldn't lose sleep over it, I'm sure with her 60 quid budget, she'll have no problem finding a replacement.
 
Think you done the right thing. I have only done 3 weddings and they do get stressful, I have decided to only do them if I get asked. Have had a look at website and your Facebook page and your more than capable, but even the best wedding photographers need the information and planning time you clearly weren't given.

Don't worry about the mother of the bride, if she is that worried she has 60 quid to buy a compact to see if she can do a good job.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top