Kiva - support a 'tog?

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woadrage

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Folks

Do you have a paypal account and $25 (or more) to spare at present? If so, are you willing to lend it to a photographer in Azerbaijan to buy a new video camera?

This chap, whose business is the recording of weddings and other social events, is currently listed on Kiva and is asking to borrow $1,200, to be repaid over 12 months, to replace his old video camera:

http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=37049

Basically, Kiva allows ordinary people around the world to club together and collectively lend funds to entrepreneurs in the developing world and follow the progress of their businesses and the repayments. When the loan is fully repaid (and the vast majority of them are) the funds you lent are refunded to your paypal account so you can either withdraw or relend them.

From time to time other photography related businesses come up, including these in Nigeria, Togo and Nicaragua.

http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=18553
http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=16395
http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=47392

Go on - it's worth a punt for the price of a decent bottle of wine!
 
woadrage said:
Folks

Do you have a paypal account and $25 (or more) to spare at present? If so, are you willing to lend it to a photographer in Azerbaijan to buy a new video camera?

This chap, whose business is the recording of weddings and other social events, is currently listed on Kiva and is asking to borrow $1,200, to be repaid over 12 months, to replace his old video camera:

http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=37049

Basically, Kiva allows ordinary people around the world to club together and collectively lend funds to entrepreneurs in the developing world and follow the progress of their businesses and the repayments. When the loan is fully repaid (and the vast majority of them are) the funds you lent are refunded to your paypal account so you can either withdraw or relend them.

From time to time other photography related businesses come up, including these in Nigeria, Togo and Nicaragua.

http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=18553
http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=16395
http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=47392

Go on - it's worth a punt for the price of a decent bottle of wine!
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You've got to be joking if you believe that, you'll believe anything.:nono::nono::nono:
 
Not sure if this is legit or not. Being the sceptical person I am, I think its wise that I / we / TP insert a "Buyer beware" thought here.

This could be completley legit, and having a quick cursory scoot around the site, it certainly does look it. However, there are many scams on the net, and without researching further, I think anyone thinking of giving money away just like that should exercise a bit of caution :)
 
What an absolute crock, I really hope nobody seriously believes this.

I'm sure theres many people that have old video cameras and need knew ones, why in another country?

Not being funny, but a lot of scams come from other countries such as the ones you're suggesting, so i woulden't be offended if people tend to be sceptical.

If this is legit, how does he intend to pay back $1200 in 12 months? I'm guessing by using the camera to make money doing what he currently does, weddings and so on, making a living from it. If thats the case, wheres the money gone that he's earn't by doing previous weddings, birthdays etc?

I call bulls**t.
 
25.00 USD = 12.8494 GBP according to xe currency converter therefore I have donated the £13 to TP ... a much more worthy cause ;)
 
I have some land for sale if anyone is interested?... Viewing is this friday blackpool beach 3pm (low tide) bring your cheque book :)
 
RobertP said:
Found this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiva.org

which adds to the genuine argument.
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I still wouldn't believe in it. A similar organisation giving funds to people in Nigeria and based in Amsterdam helped themselves to 800 Euro from my credit card account. After tracking down who the payment was made to I got it reimbursed - but it makes you wonder. By the way any donations towards my new wide angle lens would be gratefully appreciated please.
 
No I am sorry. I just dont trust things like this. Call me cynical
 
I'd rather give £25 to Great Ormond Street Hospital and not get it back.
 
I was reading up on these types of things last night, it appears that this one is genuine. However the argument is if the income per year in these countries is around $300 how can they afford to pay back a $1200 loan in 12 months? Thats a third of their yearly salary per month.

Almost worth a punt to see if its paid back and restore your faith in humanity.
 
BOM said:
I was reading up on these types of things last night, it appears that this one is genuine. However the argument is if the income per year in these countries is around $300 how can they afford to pay back a $1200 loan in 12 months? Thats a third of their yearly salary per month.

Almost worth a punt to see if its paid back and restore your faith in humanity.
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I reckon you'll be disappointed.:bang:
 
Hmmm, yeah. At first I thought this was some run of the mill con. That said, even with various sources of backup indicating the validity of the claim, I still remain warey of the whole idea.

<dragons den> "I'm out" </dragons den>
 
woadrage said:
Folks

Do you have a paypal account and $25 (or more) to spare at present? If so, are you willing to lend it to a photographer in Azerbaijan to buy a new video camera?
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No , get their own governments & people to pay up not other countries!! :razz:

I'll stick to my own country support , THANKYOU!. Why does this country always have to bail you lot out , damn... RANT RANT
 
hillwalkinggirl said:
I reckon you'll be disappointed.:bang:
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I reckon you won't.

So far I've made 96 loans.

71 are currently active, ie disbursed and paying back on schedule.

19 have paid back completely.

3 loans have been raised but not yet disbursed.

2 have been refunded because a deterioration in the local situation meant that the funds could not be disbursed.

1 has defaulted. This was a Kenyan loan where the microfinance organisation did not disburse the full loan to the borrower. However $20.94 out of $25.00 was refunded.

1 more is likely to default, also in Kenya. This was a loan to a Masai widow with young children which was paying back on schedule until the riots in Kenya last autumn. There has been no news of her since then.
 
Pirate Neilsouth said:
Neither my money goes towards charities at home , two which i currently support - Cancer Research & The National Autistic Society
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Good for you. Charity begins at home, we have lots of needy people in this country, but people seem to be more concerned with helping other countries than they do about improving the lives of their own countrymen/women. I am not racist but I think that only funds surplus to our countries needs should be given away.
 
woadrage said:
I reckon you won't.

So far I've made 96 loans.

71 are currently active, ie disbursed and paying back on schedule.

19 have paid back completely.

3 loans have been raised but not yet disbursed.

2 have been refunded because a deterioration in the local situation meant that the funds could not be disbursed.

1 has defaulted. This was a Kenyan loan where the microfinance organisation did not disburse the full loan to the borrower. However $20.94 out of $25.00 was refunded.

1 more is likely to default, also in Kenya. This was a loan to a Masai widow with young children which was paying back on schedule until the riots in Kenya last autumn. There has been no news of her since then.
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Well I am glad you haven't been robbed, but maybe you have local knowledge of the country, and this is why you have been so generous to the cause.
 
Good on ya woadrage :) glad that it isnt a scam and that things like that exist and work! Shame the amount of scams around on the net will have scared so many people off from ideas like this. I am not going to even comment on the whole "Charity begins at home thing"...really cant see how it being someone from a different country make it any less of a worthwhile donation :thinking:
 
Jimmy_Lemon said:
really cant see how it being someone from a different country make it any less of a worthwhile donation :thinking:
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To play devil's advocate: for the same reason that you'd presumably put more effort into helping your own mother than a stranger? Distance (emotional and geographical) breeds apathy, it's pretty natural.

Objectively all lives are of equal worth, but it would be nonsense to say that's true on a personal level.
 
hillwalkinggirl said:
Well I am glad you haven't been robbed, but maybe you have local knowledge of the country, and this is why you have been so generous to the cause.
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No, that's not the case. I have loans in 32 countries and the only one of them I have any personal knowledge of is Ghana, and that only from going there on holiday some years ago. Of my 4 loans in Ghana, 2 have paid back.

Can I point out that this is NOT about charity. These are formal loans which are fully expected to be paid back. Obviously there are times when that doesn't happen but it's surprisingly rare. Also the vast majority of loans are for business purposes. A small number, mostly in Mexico, are for house building, expansion or improvement and a very few are for personal purchases such as a domestic fridge.

In the case of the Azerbaijani cameraman, having a better camera and being able to produce a better recording may means that he can charge more for his services, or may attract more work, and that's essentially how he will be able to repay the loan, but he can't generate the investment capita from his present earnings. After all, a pro tog in the UK wanting to re-equip his studio or upgrade his kit may well do so with a bank loan. Why should an Azerbaijani (or Togolese or Nigerian) pro tog not do the same? The difference is that the Kiva loans are coming from ordinary people rather than multinational banking conglomerates.

Also, a loan paid back can be re-lent to another business of the lender's choosing. A charity donation can be donated only once.

Not wanting to preach, but just to clarify the situation.
 
woadrage said:
No, that's not the case. I have loans in 32 countries and the only one of them I have any personal knowledge of is Ghana, and that only from going there on holiday some years ago. Of my 4 loans in Ghana, 2 have paid back.

Can I point out that this is NOT about charity. These are formal loans which are fully expected to be paid back. Obviously there are times when that doesn't happen but it's surprisingly rare. Also the vast majority of loans are for business purposes. A small number, mostly in Mexico, are for house building, expansion or improvement and a very few are for personal purchases such as a domestic fridge.

In the case of the Azerbaijani cameraman, having a better camera and being able to produce a better recording may means that he can charge more for his services, or may attract more work, and that's essentially how he will be able to repay the loan, but he can't generate the investment capita from his present earnings. After all, a pro tog in the UK wanting to re-equip his studio or upgrade his kit may well do so with a bank loan. Why should an Azerbaijani (or Togolese or Nigerian) pro tog not do the same? The difference is that the Kiva loans are coming from ordinary people rather than multinational banking conglomerates.

Also, a loan paid back can be re-lent to another business of the lender's choosing. A charity donation can be donated only once.

Not wanting to preach, but just to clarify the situation.
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Well it is nice to know that there are still generous and caring people still in this world. I can only applaud your kindness, but I am afraid that life makes most of us cynical. Keep up the good work.:thumbs:
 
it's about time we started looking after people in the uk and not fund the rest of the world everytime.

shame about the lenders getting stung by paypal for 3% each time they lend money...
 
it's about time we started looking after people in the uk and not fund the rest of the world everytime.
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Tosh... and the fact that we can discuss it from behind the keyboards of our expensive computers in our warm and dry houses proves it.

What it is about time for is an acceptance that issues of education, poverty and health can be a global responsibility and that there is plenty of resource to go around if we stop putting up walls and making excuses.
 
sportysnaps said:
it's about time we started looking after people in the uk and not fund the rest of the world everytime.
.
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:thumbs:

Their OWN Government should help their own people , time and time again we bail out other countries when their government prefers to spend money on millitary hardware and the like..
 
maybe we should set up a system in this country for people who can't get on the housing market, or get the funds needed to start a good business idea. I agree too much charity money from the uk is sent aboard. Look in the urban comp enteries if you don't think this country needs help.

I don't think there is anything wrong with the idea, and if thats what you want to do then go ahead.
 
Tosh... and the fact that we can discuss it from behind the keyboards of our expensive computers in our warm and dry houses proves it.
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so does the guy needing $1200 of digital video equipment do it from a hut? - no he uses a computer with lights etc


this is not about poverty.. - i have no problem giving for starving people...he is not
 
Toothie said:
maybe we should set up a system in this country for people who can't get on the housing market, or get the funds needed to start a good business idea. I agree too much charity money from the uk is sent aboard. Look in the urban comp enteries if you don't think this country needs help.

I don't think there is anything wrong with the idea, and if thats what you want to do then go ahead.
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Well said that man :)
 
:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:
 
When i work there was a child that was very sick and was in hospital for months. Her mother was too poor to pay for transport to the hospital which was about 10miles from her house so she walked everyday regardless of the weather. Just because we are behind computers doesnt mean the whole of the uk is. A lone so so could buy a bike would have helped no end. it would have cost about £100 for a cheep bike, which she could have paid back a few pounds a month out of her small income. Just to stress a system like this could be used in the uk. Its so easy to see the poverty in other countries, as it is so desprate in some places. But remember there are people in most counteries that are well off and sat in front of expensive pcs.
 
woadrage said:
Folks

Do you have a paypal account and $25 (or more) to spare at present? If so, are you willing to lend it to a photographer in Azerbaijan to buy a new video camera?

This chap, whose business is the recording of weddings and other social events, is currently listed on Kiva and is asking to borrow $1,200, to be repaid over 12 months, to replace his old video camera:

http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=37049

Basically, Kiva allows ordinary people around the world to club together and collectively lend funds to entrepreneurs in the developing world and follow the progress of their businesses and the repayments. When the loan is fully repaid (and the vast majority of them are) the funds you lent are refunded to your paypal account so you can either withdraw or relend them.

From time to time other photography related businesses come up, including these in Nigeria, Togo and Nicaragua.

http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=18553
http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=16395
http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=businesses&action=about&id=47392

Go on - it's worth a punt for the price of a decent bottle of wine!
Click to expand...


I just want to make a quick comment. Whilst it may be all "good and above" board, I work in a jewellers and pawnbrokers currently, and we do money tranfers via western union. Nigera is one of the "hot-spots" for money laundering.
I know you will, but I'd just like to re-add, if you do decide to do this, please be extra extra vigilant!
 
Pirate Neilsouth said:
:thumbs:

Their OWN Government should help their own people , time and time again we bail out other countries when their government prefers to spend money on millitary hardware and the like..
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Given that their governments most likely can't afford to, but our government is spending £28bn renewing Trident, I think that other countries have a more pressing need for private contributions.
 
Wow! We are a cynical lot aren't we?!

I get so many "scam" emails that I would have passed over such a request assuming it was on the same level. It obviously isn't and I thank you woadwage for bring it to our attention.

As far as donations go that should be the reserve of the individual however some of the comments here condemning gifts abroad stand up to less scrutiny than some of the requests we receive from dubious African countries.

The reason many in this country can afford the toys we have is because we do not pay the real cost for much of our goods. We use the cheapest labour to provide our goods and often exploitation results. We can blame governments (and there are some shabby ones) but there are real people out there who don't need much of our assistance - and in this case it is a transaction rather than a donation per se. If you have it consider it, if you don't save it for your own.

For the record I support a number of local charities (Come and do the Williamson Across Ross walk in May in support of Children First!) in favour of international ones (I do believe that charity begins at home) however do not brand all from foreign shores as scammers.
 
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