Kingfisher secrets?

wippers

wippers

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Gareth
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Having recently spent a great day in a hide photographing Kingfishers, I have to say I'm hooked on these beautiful little birds. The hide I visited was about 1 1/2 hours away and would be expensive to visit on a regular basis, so it got me thinking about whether I could find somewhere myself a bit closer to home.
I live fairly near a river which has a vertical mud bank on one of its bends so I thought this could be a good spot so off I trotted. Amazingly, within about 3 minutes of arriving, I spotted a little fleck of blue land on a branch on the other side of the river. Next thing was to find the landowner and check I was OK to sit and photograph the birds. I thought there'd be no problems as I would not be disturbing anyone as this is in the middle of nowhere. The Estate Manager was a really nice guy but I had a job to convince him to let me pop onto the land from time to time. He has now agreed as long as I inform him first, which is fine.
Since then, I have chatted to one of the local fisherman who said there had been a bit of a turf war with the Kingfisher photographers/Bird spotters and no-one wanted anyone else near to their "patch".
I know I am not allowed to photograph near the nest site, but has anyone else had similar?
I think perhaps I have been a bit naive in thinking a local landowner wouldn't have any issues with me popping into one of his fields every now and again. :shrug:

Thanks for looking. :thumbs:

Gareth
 
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think there is always the the chance that some could abuse the privilege of the arrangement maybe that's why there is uncertainty there. Think that time and continued good practice will build on this.

so when it the next TP meet at your newly acquired site, maybe limit numbers to under 150 and only the 4 spotlights (hee hee hee hee)
 
Been a birder which does a spot of photography as well I have heard of birders keeping Kingfisher sights to themselves due to a few photographers getting a little too close to the nesting area which caused the birds to leave that area totally. So a few either over keen or bad eggs has caused a bit of anger towards photographers from birders.
With the land owners it depends what other activities they do, if they do fly fishing on that bit of the river they wouldn't just anyone asking to get alongside the river in case it turned out you wanted to help yourself to a few trout with out a licence/permit for that patch of river, along the Wye in Derbyshire I have found a few traps set by poachers to bag the odd trout or two. So maybe they have had a bit of a bad experience.

I am sure once you have shown your attentions are honourable the land owner will be quite relaxed with you being there, so happy snapping looking forward to seeing your shots.

Tim.
 
Gronk08 said:
Been a birder which does a spot of photography as well I have heard of birders keeping Kingfisher sights to themselves due to a few photographers getting a little too close to the nesting area which caused the birds to leave that area totally. So a few either over keen or bad eggs has caused a bit of anger towards photographers from birders.
With the land owners it depends what other activities they do, if they do fly fishing on that bit of the river they wouldn't just anyone asking to get alongside the river in case it turned out you wanted to help yourself to a few trout with out a licence/permit for that patch of river, along the Wye in Derbyshire I have found a few traps set by poachers to bag the odd trout or two. So maybe they have had a bit of a bad experience.

I am sure once you have shown your attentions are honourable the land owner will be quite relaxed with you being there, so happy snapping looking forward to seeing your shots.

Tim.
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You might well be right about their past experiences which is not something I considered to be honest. Hopefully when they're happy that I'm not poaching the odd trout or getting in anyone's way etc, they might relax a bit and give me a bit more freedom. I suppose that comes with trust.:thumbs:
 
wippers said:
Since then, I have chatted to one of the local fisherman who said there had been a bit of a turf war with the Kingfisher photographers/Bird spotters and no-one wanted anyone else near to their "patch".
Gareth
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There is always going to be tension between bird watchers and bird photographers. This is just me generalising but...

Bird Watchers
Are happy to see a bird (any will do) from a zillion miles away, it may only be a dot with a high magnification spotting scope but they are happy.
Have the same level of excitement when they see a Mallard or a Bittern (or in this case a Kingfisher).
Usually wear bright coloured clothing.
Talk loudly so that when a bird does appear, they shout out its name (sometimes incorrectly) at the top of their voice scaring the said bird away.

Bird Toggers
Believe that because they have spent a lot of money on kit they are allowed to act as they please.
Push in.
Can hog a seat in a hide from sunrise until sunset.
Wear full camo, be it going to the shops, or going to bed.
Need to get so close to the bird that they can see the microscopic mites on the bird's feathers.

And last but not least...the Twitchers
Travel 100's of miles to see a dot, either tick off in a scraggly book or mental tick and then leave (sometimes even before confirming ID).
Usually smell bad.
Are just plain weird.

Do you see where the tension comes from?

:exit:
 
A bottle of Whiskey for him and some chocolates for his other half quite often helps relations ;)
 
I haven't had to many problems getting access to land. Only times I have been refused is when they have shooting going on which is understandable or more recently I found a great site and was then told by the land owner that he already has a resident photographer, although I have never bumped in to him.

Mostly I just give them a set of postcards I had printed and let my work speak for itself. They often seem all to willing if you offer to record the other wildlife on their land and let them have prints of anything good you find.

Try looking at the 3d ariel shots on Bing maps. Look for streams running through woodlands. Most sites I have found seem to be near or in woodlands. The banks in woodlands are unmanaged so contain more possible sites for the kingfishers. Golf courses are another good spot if they have streams and they often have ponds full of little fish. Check with the club house and they are usually ok for you to have a little wander.

Good luck, let us know how you get on.
 
wippers said:
I know I am not allowed to photograph near the nest site


Gareth
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This is very true but I've seen several on here which obviously have been and know for a fact some have been.
 
The Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 (as amended by the Environmental Protection Act 1990) makes it a criminal offence to "intentionally or recklessly" disturb a Schedule 1 protected species "while it is building a nest or is in, on or near a nest containing eggs or young" or to disturb dependent young of such a bird. You'll note that it is not photography in itself that creates the offence, but intentional or reckless disturbance. Having said that, a Schedule 1 licence can be obtained from Natural England and this authorises the holder to disturb the birds at or near the nest, etc for the purpose of photography.

The legislation does not define NEAR but I very much doubt that in this context the term could possibly mean the whole of the bird's nesting territory. To say you are not allowed to photograph a kingfisher near a nest site is not true,more knowledge on the matter is needed if you decide to go down the route of photographing a kingfisher in the breeding season which obviously gives you a better success rate at getting shots .
 
Nuff said.

It must be remembered that ignorance of the law is no defence. If in doubt, don't.
 
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SLRUser said:
There is always going to be tension between bird watchers and bird photographers. This is just me generalising but...

Bird Watchers
Are happy to see a bird (any will do) from a zillion miles away, it may only be a dot with a high magnification spotting scope but they are happy.
Have the same level of excitement when they see a Mallard or a Bittern (or in this case a Kingfisher).
Usually wear bright coloured clothing.
Talk loudly so that when a bird does appear, they shout out its name (sometimes incorrectly) at the top of their voice scaring the said bird away.

Bird Toggers
Believe that because they have spent a lot of money on kit they are allowed to act as they please.
Push in.
Can hog a seat in a hide from sunrise until sunset.
Wear full camo, be it going to the shops, or going to bed.
Need to get so close to the bird that they can see the microscopic mites on the bird's feathers.

And last but not least...the Twitchers
Travel 100's of miles to see a dot, either tick off in a scraggly book or mental tick and then leave (sometimes even before confirming ID).
Usually smell bad.
Are just plain weird.

Do you see where the tension comes from?

:exit:
Click to expand...


:clap::clap::clap:
 
den said:
The Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 (as amended by the Environmental Protection Act 1990) makes it a criminal offence to "intentionally or recklessly" disturb a Schedule 1 protected species "while it is building a nest or is in, on or near a nest containing eggs or young" or to disturb dependent young of such a bird. You'll note that it is not photography in itself that creates the offence, but intentional or reckless disturbance. Having said that, a Schedule 1 licence can be obtained from Natural England and this authorises the holder to disturb the birds at or near the nest, etc for the purpose of photography.

The legislation does not define NEAR but I very much doubt that in this context the term could possibly mean the whole of the bird's nesting territory. To say you are not allowed to photograph a kingfisher near a nest site is not true,more knowledge on the matter is needed if you decide to go down the route of photographing a kingfisher in the breeding season which obviously gives you a better success rate at getting shots .
Click to expand...

Some good and interesting points in there Den. I'll certainly be doing some more homework before attempting any more KF photography, particularly during the breeding season. :thumbs:
 
SLRUser said:
There is always going to be tension between bird watchers and bird photographers. This is just me generalising but...

Bird Watchers
Are happy to see a bird (any will do) from a zillion miles away, it may only be a dot with a high magnification spotting scope but they are happy.
Have the same level of excitement when they see a Mallard or a Bittern (or in this case a Kingfisher).
Usually wear bright coloured clothing.
Talk loudly so that when a bird does appear, they shout out its name (sometimes incorrectly) at the top of their voice scaring the said bird away.

Bird Toggers
Believe that because they have spent a lot of money on kit they are allowed to act as they please.
Push in.
Can hog a seat in a hide from sunrise until sunset.
Wear full camo, be it going to the shops, or going to bed.
Need to get so close to the bird that they can see the microscopic mites on the bird's feathers.

And last but not least...the Twitchers
Travel 100's of miles to see a dot, either tick off in a scraggly book or mental tick and then leave (sometimes even before confirming ID).
Usually smell bad.
Are just plain weird.

Do you see where the tension comes from?

:exit:
Click to expand...


Brilliant. :thumbs::D
 
wippers said:
You might well be right about their past experiences which is not something I considered to be honest. Hopefully when they're happy that I'm not poaching the odd trout or getting in anyone's way etc, they might relax a bit and give me a bit more freedom. I suppose that comes with trust.:thumbs:
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Trust,it is! Such a big word especially after their past experienced. But then,if you showed sincerity,the possibility is also big! :thumbs:
 
on the subject of kingfishers......i live in staffs and near the river dove. We have a lot of small pools and streams and alongside them are public public footpaths. However during the breeding season these are not closed and i know for a fact that the kingfishers nest in the banks below as i have seen them. So my question is this.....Am i breaking the law by taking pictures if i am on the footpath, which is a public right of way that many fishermen and dog walkers use, during the breeding season?
 
wrecker1971 said:
on the subject of kingfishers......i live in staffs and near the river dove. We have a lot of small pools and streams and alongside them are public public footpaths. However during the breeding season these are not closed and i know for a fact that the kingfishers nest in the banks below as i have seen them. So my question is this.....Am i breaking the law by taking pictures if i am on the footpath, which is a public right of way that many fishermen and dog walkers use, during the breeding season?
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No you're not. If the path is open and you're on it taking photographs you're no more of a disturbance to the birds, arguably less, than someone walking their dog and standing there watching them.

Common sense needs to prevail. The law is designed to protect the birds in it from idiots not sensible people who consider what they are doing.
 
Be careful - we went to the sea eagle hide on Mull in the summer, which is currently adjacent to a public right of way. The RSPB warden made it very clear indeed that walking along the path and stopping to look is perfectly legal, but the moment you take out a camera you are breaking the law. He admitted it might not be logical, but was adamant that was correct.
 
Sorry to jump in on this thread, but I have never seen or even photographed the Kingfisher, I have only recently got into nature photography...so when I heard that a local area not far from me had a regular visitor, I was well up for it, http://www.wildlifetrusts.org/reserves/feckenham-wylde-moor

Have been visiting this place now for two weeks, over different days, one thing I will say, dont go there expecting action...its dead as a door nail...

But in the log in the Hide, the Kingfisher doe's visit....but clearly when I am not there...so after a lot of hair pulling and serious bordom...I am still going to carry on...does anybody know in the worcestershire area, that they are regularly seen?
 
They are regulars at Upton Warren, and I have also seen one at Knapp and Papermill.
 
I know of two sites locally that you can spot a Kingfisher, one is a lake on a golf course with public right of way and the other a small pool on the local RSPB reserve

Did once see a photographer set up on the golf course, but never at the pool which is right next to a footpath

Dabbled with bird photography, but came to the conclusion to get the photos I wanted it would need quite an investment in a long lens (e.g. 500mm f/4 IS) so now just observe occasionally
 
MadWoman said:
stopping to look is perfectly legal, but the moment you take out a camera you are breaking the law. He admitted it might not be logical, but was adamant that was correct.
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Even though he was wrong.
 
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Indeed, he was wrong, but my point was that he was an official and is probably not the only one who has misinterpreted the regulations - personally I would sooner be very wary and not be accosted at all, than have to prove I was right and the official wrong afterwards!
 
wrecker1971 said:
on the subject of kingfishers......i live in staffs and near the river dove. We have a lot of small pools and streams and alongside them are public public footpaths. However during the breeding season these are not closed and i know for a fact that the kingfishers nest in the banks below as i have seen them. So my question is this.....Am i breaking the law by taking pictures if i am on the footpath, which is a public right of way that many fishermen and dog walkers use, during the breeding season?
Click to expand...

In fact a public right of way is just that. It gives you the right to pass along its route through privately owned land. The landowner is within his rights to move you on if you loiter, although doing so is trespass and therefore not a criminal offence.

Disturbance of Schedule 1 species is another thing altogether. I doubt if holding a camera in the vicinity of a nest would be considered illegal, but staying there could be, and if the bird is showing agitated behaviour then it almost certainly would be. Birds will often get used to passers-by passing by but if someone hangs around they might get upset. An experienced birder will recognise from the birds' behaviour whether they are disturbed and if they were, would move on.
 
My secret for Kingfisher pictures is find a stretch of river without over hanging branches or perches, set up your hide and stick a branch into the bank for them to sit on.
When the next passing kingfisher flies up the river he will be drawn straight to the new perch. If you don't believe me give it a try!
 
stevetheroofer said:
My secret for Kingfisher pictures is find a stretch of river without over hanging branches or perches, set up your hide and stick a branch into the bank for them to sit on.
When the next passing kingfisher flies up the river he will be drawn straight to the new perch. If you don't believe me give it a try!
Click to expand...

Well I am pretty sure it is not applicable to all river? Unless otherwise you know that there are kingfishers scouting along the river for food?
 
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