Is the gap between a mobile phone image and a DSLR Image so great?

Ricardodaforce said:
Welcome to the forum Jambonier! :lol:
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Thank you...I'm happy that you took my tongue in cheek comment in the way it was intended :)

I have to say the images that Ricardo and Gordon have produced on camera phones (I wont say iphones in case I'm accused of prejudice) are stunning.

I would be proud to be able to take photographs of that standard on my DSLR, and they are proof if any was needed that in the hands of a skilled photographer, gear doesnt matter.

Sadly, my mediocre DSLR efforts would be even sadder if I used a cameraphone.
 
I took this early in the day on a bike ride quite a while ago on a Nokia N95, clearly with a little enhancement afterwards! The view from Seaham Harbour never looked as good.......;)

SEAHAM2.jpg
 
Gordon F said:
in my case it was the DSLR that couldn't fulfill my vision.
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Given that the operational envelope (if you like) of a camera phone is inferior to that of a conventional camera, are you saying that the camera phone is a vehicle for a specific approach to photography that the SLR interferes with ?
 
ChrisGilbert said:
Given that the operational envelope (if you like) of a camera phone is inferior to that of a conventional camera, are you saying that the camera phone is a vehicle for a specific approach to photography that the SLR interferes with ?
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Would you reject a customer who only has a Camera-Phone and applies to join one of your advertised Photography Tuition Courses, here in the UK or abroad, or do you have a fixed idea on what equipment a person should have.

Let's say this customer only wants to take pictures for his own pleasure, not intending to photograph plates of food or Business people shaking hands over a Keyboard for Flickr, not intending to be a Wedding Photographer, not intending to buy a Verturesome Franchise shop, not intending to run Photography Courses for others, just taking pictures that please him or her.
 
Rankbadyin said:
Would you reject a customer who only has a Camera-Phone and applies to join one of your advertised Photography Tuition Courses, here in the UK or abroad, or do you have a fixed idea on what equipment a person should have.

Let's say this customer only wants to take pictures for his own pleasure, not intending to photograph plates of food or Business people shaking hands over a Keyboard for Flickr, not intending to be a Wedding Photographer, not intending to buy a Verturesome Franchise shop, not intending to run Photography Courses for others, just taking pictures that please him or her.
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Erm, I asked a perfectly valid question out of curiosity. You are seeing criticism where there isn't any :shrug:
 
I didn't notice any criticism in your post.
Given that today, everyone who used to earn some kind of living from Photography now offer themselves as teachers, I just wanted to find out if there is an entry level in equipment from someone who is engaged in teaching Photography.Would you turn away a Camera Phone? does the pupil need the same equipment as you.
 
Is there a great difference between the 2 pics posted by the op?

No.

Is there a great difference between mobile phone cameras and DSLRs?

Of course.

Embrace the difference.
Accept the challenge.
Learn the capabilities of any and all methods of capturing images.
Use those capabilities to your benefit.
Produce the best those methods can provide, to the limit of your abilities.

Experiment, play, learn, learn, learn.

Accept all possibilities, reject nothing.
 
The Greek said:
I once mentioned a BMW I was contemplating on buying on a Mercedes forum, which I was/am a long time member, didnt go down to well, at first I couldnt understand why I received such a negative response, Then the penny dropped, these guys live and breath Mercedes, not interested in BMW. even tho its got four wheels and an engine.

I guess, its the same with you Iphone, yes takes pictures, but it doesn't interest me, I live and breath Digital camera .....SLR
M
As already mentioned, just my opinion. If your happy taking pictures with your phone, thats all that really matters.
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Absolutely agree its a personal thing love using my dslr and sure that for some situations a good phone camera would be perfectly ok

Edit next time I'm out photographing landscapes and waterfalls I will try the camera on my HTC phone maybe I am blinkered! And it will be interesting to compare with slr shots of the same subjects
 
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Well, I have a 5dmk2 and a iPhone 4s. They are both cameras to me, and both tools for different jobs.

The great thing about the iPhone is that it goes everywhere with me. I was at the beach yesterday running around with my son and had my iPhone with me ready to take photos whenever i felt like it. If I had the 5d with me, it would have been a really heavy pain in the backside that I need to keep an eye on at all times.

The argument of printing isn't there for me either, as I snap with the iPhone and upload it directly to Facebook for my family to see, thats it. Same with the video too.

Plus, I am still in love with hipstamatic for a bit of instant fun.

Each is a good tool in its own right for the situation at hand. Heck, I even use the iPhone when I am out shooting in remote parts of the world... its just handy to have alongside my main dslr for behind the scenes photos/videos etc.

Anyone who tries to argue that a mobile phone is not a camera is deluded.
 
Ricardodaforce said:
Careful, you've just insulted a lot of this forum :lol:
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meh, its just a stupid argument.

A camera is a device that records light onto a medium, correct me if I am wrong but my iPhone has a lens and a sensor and works in pretty much the same way as most point and shoot cameras.

I fail to see why people argue that a camera is not a camera :shrug:

Its pretty much like the people who argued that digital cameras were "not real cameras" and would never catch on... yeah, see how that argument panned out ;)
 
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Gordon F said:
in my case it was the DSLR that couldn't fulfill my vision.
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ChrisGilbert said:
Given that the operational envelope (if you like) of a camera phone is inferior to that of a conventional camera, are you saying that the camera phone is a vehicle for a specific approach to photography that the SLR interferes with ?
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I'd like to hear more from Gordon (or others) on this point.

I don't think anybody with half a brain doubts that a DSLR does have a superior operational envelope, though that's really not the issue here. Can we all simply agree that DSLRs have advantages in flexibility and (most of the time) image quality, and camera phones have advantages in portability and (perhaps) spontaneity, and move on from there?

Gordon seems to be saying, however, that he was more able to take the kinds of photos he wanted to take when using a camera phone. Is that because the (relative) lack of flexibility forces you to work harder and think more about what you want the picture to look like? I've heard some people say similar things about shooting with primes instead of zooms - the process forces them to work harder, and they find themselves taking photos which they *could* have taken with a zoom, but *wouldn't* have. Is that the issue here, or am I barking up the wrong tree altogether?
 
I think you could take that further Stewart and in my experience limiting myself to film has forced me to think more about the shot. With digital I was guilty of taking any old picture without enough thought as it wouldn't really matter if it was rubbish as I would just delete it. I am too tight to do that with film...
 
Any time I see a good photo taken with a Nokia N8, you could knock me down with a feather. I was considering buying one when they were 'cheap' just to use as a communication enabled point 'n' shoot.

As the saying goes "the best camera is the one that's with you", means whoever thought of putting a camera on a phone is a bit of a genius.

But I'd never replace my 5D with one. Different tool for a different job.
 
ChrisGilbert said:
Given that the operational envelope (if you like) of a camera phone is inferior to that of a conventional camera, are you saying that the camera phone is a vehicle for a specific approach to photography that the SLR interferes with ?
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Yes, in my case I am. I am not a photoshop god. If you look at my 500px stuff. A lot if it involves post processing. When i had my DSLR I used photoshop but I never really did compositing and layering multiple images or stitching stuff together. With my iphone I do and I find it simple. The apps cost me around 99cents to nothing. I would pretty much have no idea how to do alot of the stuff I do with photoshop. Also apps get updated and those updates are generally free while I have yet to see Adobe offer a free upgrade from my old CS3 to CS5.I now find that I can imagine an image in my head and pretty much get there with the apps in my phone.

Also i have an app for taking images on the phone that I am going to use for a specific art project. I have yet to see any digital camera, let alone slr, that will capture images the way this app does. I suspect that you could hack a G9 to do it if you were a programming/camera god, but I am not. I found this app purely by chance. I saw it was free in app store for a day and got it to try. Interestingly this app is a lo-fi one and the fact the iphone has a worse operational envelope, as you put it, is a benefit.

I also enjoy the fact I can basically do this post processing anywhere. I've created images while lying in the bath and while waiting for a take away curry, sitting in the hotel bar while on the road on business and lying in the garden drinking beer in the summer.

Hope that helps your understanding of where I am at.
 
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StewartR said:
I'd like to hear more from Gordon (or others) on this point.

I don't think anybody with half a brain doubts that a DSLR does have a superior operational envelope, though that's really not the issue here. Can we all simply agree that DSLRs have advantages in flexibility and (most of the time) image quality, and camera phones have advantages in portability and (perhaps) spontaneity, and move on from there?

Gordon seems to be saying, however, that he was more able to take the kinds of photos he wanted to take when using a camera phone. Is that because the (relative) lack of flexibility forces you to work harder and think more about what you want the picture to look like? I've heard some people say similar things about shooting with primes instead of zooms - the process forces them to work harder, and they find themselves taking photos which they *could* have taken with a zoom, but *wouldn't* have. Is that the issue here, or am I barking up the wrong tree altogether?
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Stewart,

yes that is partly it. I found that when i started using the iphone (for a photo a day for a month) just after i got it. I quickly developed a style. Similar to the one I had with my dslr stuff but perhaps more graphic and bold. The limited capabilities helped me in that regard. However the bit that folk seem to not get is the post processing part. The app'ing. When folk look at images, even here, they seem to often consider the final image as a sole consequence of the camera used to take the initial image. In virtually every case of course there is post processing involved and in some cases a lot of post processing. The methods used to do that processing, the software and the vision and competence of the user have a big effect on that final image. In my case above my own incompetence at post processing affected my ability to try to achieve some of the ideas in my head. In talks i've given about my photographic endeavors I've mentioned this "creative gap". The difference between what you want to achieve and what you can actually achieve. This has become much smaller for me with my use of the iphone.

Thanks for asking
 
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jamesoliverstone said:
Well, I have a 5dmk2 and a iPhone 4s. They are both cameras to me, and both tools for different jobs..
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Exactly the same for me. My iPhone 4S is, first, a phone but I use photography apps on it every day. Whilst I shoot with my 5D MKII for 'photography' purposes, the camera in my iPhone is impressive & it can produce wondeful photographs. It'll never compare to a DSLR in my world but it's not bad for personal use. I'd say the gap is still large.
 
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I'd say a very big gap. Particularly on my phone. Now settings for shutter speed, white balance, ISO, aperture etc etc. Very boring.
 
doublem1 said:
I'd say a very big gap. Particularly on my phone. Now settings for shutter speed, white balance, ISO, aperture etc etc. Very boring.
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The question in the title was about the "image" you are talking about functionality aspects of a piece of hardware. :bang:.....but i get where you are coming from none the less
 
jamesoliverstone said:
meh, its just a stupid argument.

A camera is a device that records light onto a medium, correct me if I am wrong but my iPhone has a lens and a sensor and works in pretty much the same way as most point and shoot cameras.

I fail to see why people argue that a camera is not a camera :shrug:

Its pretty much like the people who argued that digital cameras were "not real cameras" and would never catch on... yeah, see how that argument panned out ;)
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:thumbs:
 
jamesoliverstone said:
I fail to see why people argue that a camera is not a camera :shrug:
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this

arguing that a camera phone isnt a camera is like arguing that a compact is not a camera - a camera phone is essentially a compact with built in phone.

is it as 'good' as a DSLR , probably not in terms of IQ bor flexibility imo for the same reason that a fixed lens compact isnt ie the DSLR/CSCs principle advantage is the interchageablity of lenses.

On the other hand the strength of a compact or camera phone lies in portability and likelihood of having it on you - a ten grand DSLR doesnt help if its in a cupboard at home when something amazing goes down

at the end of the day its not about better or worse, they are different tools for diffeent jobs and arguing that one is better is like arguing that a saw is 'better' than a screwdriver
 
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Gordon F said:
In talks i've given about my photographic endeavors I've mentioned this "creative gap". The difference between what you want to achieve and what you can actually achieve. This has become much smaller for me with my use of the iphone.
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Gordon F said:
When i had my DSLR I used photoshop but I never really did compositing and layering multiple images or stitching stuff together. With my iphone I do and I find it simple.
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That's really interesting. It's not that the iPhone is a replacement for a DSLR, but more that the [iPhone+apps] is a replacement for [DSLR+Photoshop]. I would never have thought of that.

Gordon F said:
I also enjoy the fact I can basically do this post processing anywhere. I've created images while lying in the bath and while waiting for a take away curry, sitting in the hotel bar while on the road on business and lying in the garden drinking beer in the summer.
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Hmm. I wouldn't want to do that for work where the colour balance or other details had to be spot-on, but then I have no creativity and my photography tends to be very representational. For work like yours which is much more artistic, it's got to be better than locking yourself away in a dark room in front of a big screen.

Gordon F said:
Also i have an app for taking images on the phone that I am going to use for a specific art project. I have yet to see any digital camera, let alone slr, that will capture images the way this app does. I suspect that you could hack a G9 to do it if you were a programming/camera god, but I am not. I found this app purely by chance. I saw it was free in app store for a day and got it to try. Interestingly this app is a lo-fi one and the fact the iphone has a worse operational envelope, as you put it, is a benefit.
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That's sort of what I expected, but again - interestingly - it's the [iPhone+apps] system which is important.

Gordon F said:
Hope that helps your understanding of where I am at.
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Absolutely. thanks.
 
I'd like to know what the app is and what it does. Sounds intriguing :)
 
Never seen his work. His website is dreadful. Gave up trying to navigate it!
 
srichards said:
Never seen his work. His website is dreadful. Gave up trying to navigate it!
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yes it seems to have gone a bit random since last time I looked. His portraits were great, as are many of the shots from the film series...ig you can find that part of the site!
 
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