Is criticism a positive thing? (mini rant)

antihero

antihero

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Apart from here and the the obvious Devart and Flickr, how many of you put your images on other sites too?

I'm just curious as to how many other sites offer feedback that is as honest as here? If there is something wrong with an image, at least you guys (and gals :p) will point it out and provide a helpful solution. The reason why I say this is that another site that I post images on (which I won't name) is really starting to wind me up. I actually joined the site in question before here, on the advice of one of my wifes work colleagues. Now....I don't profess to come out with the best shots or have the greatest technical ability, but some of the images posted on there are at best OK (compared to here), and the C&C doesn't really go anymore in-depth than "lovely picture, well done :)"

When a friend of mine joined there too, I got laughed at for giving constructive criticism (from wifes colleague who is a long term member on there)! WHAT? Because I happened to say something like "Nice colours and composition, but...." rather than the preferred "YEAHHH...love itttt :D". Pffft, it must be where the oldies from devart go to comment. :bonk:

Their picture of the week is just as bad sometimes. I must have some weird perversion entering it every time, as the 90 or so entries are whittled down to 10 by one guy who seems to have glaucoma). Guess what though...the ones with the most votes will be OOF pictures of blue tits or something that look like they have been compressed with a lump hammer. I know how people perceive photo's is highly subjective...but only to a certain level surely? :bang:

Well, I can't really see where my rant is going, but I suppose I must ask if people get upset with criticism or do they use it to their advantage? :shrug:
 
Aaaaaand..............breathe. ;)
 
:naughty:i know where your coming from ..
personally i would rather people tore my pics apart at least then if i do get one right and i get some good feedback the feeling is so much better imho anyhow

md:thumbs:
 
yeah but no but yeah but no but
what was the question? :nuts:
 
I honestly want constructive criticism on my photos. A lot of the folk on here are flippin fantastic photographers and I really do want to learn how to improve and one of the best ways of doing this is people giving feedback.
 
Totally agree with you.:thumbs:
Criticism can be a fine line to walk though and some peeps will err tooo far on the side of caution because they're scared of offending and they like to be liked.:D
 
I agree with Foggy, have learnt a lot so far and so much more to learn and the excellent feedback from this sites members helps no end.:)
 
I joined this site exactly because the criticism / critique recieved is constructive and helpful. I get as much out of reading opinions on others photos as I do from those kind enough to comment on those I post.:)

In the short time I've been here my knowledge and confidence has improved dramactically.

Gushing praise over, off to learn some more:D
 
I think there was a compliment in there for tp somewhere :)

I've never posted on more than one forum but i know lots of people do. Honest comment has always been the way here and long may it continue. Comments from people of all skill levels add a lot to the site - not just those that that have been here 'more than a while'
 
This is a great site for learning.

You can rely on me to be nice and gushing always..... :D
Methinks I'd be banned umpteen times over on other sites. :exit:
 
I agree with Susane. :thumbs:

even here the critique is far too kind for me personally. But then I think if you can be easily offended by words typed on the interweb you may just be too easily offended, period.

(obviously not withstanding offensive comments generally IYSWIM)
 
RobertP said:
I think there was a compliment in there for tp somewhere :)

I've never posted on more than one forum but i know lots of people do. Honest comment has always been the way here and long may it continue. Comments from people of all skill levels add a lot to the site - not just those that that have been here 'more than a while'
Click to expand...

Well 'ave anuvver one then :D
I only post on this site I get all I need from here and don't feel the need to have an "affair" elsewhere :rules:
With constructive C&C I really think I have gone from bleeding awful to just plain crap, but at least its in the right direction thanks TP!
 
It should be a positive thing, as long as it's given constructively and not destructively or vindictively. Having said that it can be the most difficult thing to accept for people not used to having their shots picked apart, but apart from time actually spent clicking the shutter, good honest critique will advance your photography in leaps and bounds more than anything else.

I suppose when we really like a shot, we're all guilty of saying "Great shot" "fantastic shot" etc etc, rather than " I really like this because...." which I suppose we should try to do more often, but I suppose it's a case of concentrating the help where it seems to be needed. :)
 
I caused a huge argument on a forum once because someone posted an under-exposed photo. Some guy said he thought it was great and moody. The photographer was happy someone liked his photo because he thought it was too dark. I commented that it was a bit under-exposed. This caused the biggest argument I've ever seen. Worse than any Mac vs PC debate here. Why? Because I agreed with someone. People were slagging me off for being overly critical. It all went to hell. It got very very bad. I tried to point out to people that I spent a lot of time helping photographers, and pointed them here. A couple did join here, however the main guy on this forum kept ranting saying that TP was for "pros" only. Basically what ever I said he twisted. It wasn't fun. Its months later and having a forum constantly tell you how great you are has only done one thing, increased peoples ego's. The original person who went off at me for being critical, photoshopping and using a stupidly big camera all my photos now uses photoshop, does hdr and owns a dslr. He's even setup a site calling himself a photoman. Its a pretty interesting social experiment. You could study the personalities and see how things have turned out. Only having positive commentary has meant that this guy has gone from a digital compact to a dslr with no real sign of improvement. His photos don't look any better than before, yet of course he's a "better" photographer because a group of people who are too afraid to be honest or quite simply don't know photography have inflated his ego. I've always believed that its better to be honest. Sure it may be a bit mean, but in the long run its going to be beneficial. Whats the point in telling people that their rubbish photos are great? Obviously you need to sugar coat things because its constructive criticism. You've got to make them feel like they did good but that theres a bunch of ways to improve on it. Then they take it on board and progress.
 
Ratty said:
I agree with Susane :thumbs:
Click to expand...

Not being funny but...:D...I get this a lot here at TP, people agreeing with me that is...I feel special. :lol:
Not that everybody else here isn't special, cos they are!
* says Susane while digging a hole for herself!*
 
Well, on most sites I've been to, people who comment seem to be either jealous b****es or people who get impressed easily. The latter is nice, even though it's not helpful at all. On sites where members can rate photos, many do throw in comments just to make you go visit their pages there, vote and drop a comment to let them know you've been there. Of course, I always tell them what I think, which sometimes puts me in the first category according to some, even though I always try to mention what I like, not only what I dislike about that particular piece.
Those sites would be deviantart.com, photosig.com and gfxartist.com.
This is probably the only site with a reasonable amount and combination of both and many seem to comment in the same way I do (or the way I try to comment).
I got only a few comments on Flickr. Less than five, I think.

Hm. I went on a mini rant. Meh... sorry.
 
Aside from Flickr, I only post my pictures on here and one other site (AV related ;)). I will sometimes post the same images on both just to get as many different opinions as possible, especially if its a new technique or suchlike that I want to gauge response to.

I use the same signature on both forums .................
 
I think CONSTRUCTIVE criticism is great, it's when it gets destructive that it becomes a problem. ALL of the c&c on here has been positive and I've not seen anything I haven't liked.

We're all here for one reason, and that is to become a better photographer (well I assume we are ;), thats why I'm here anyway). That and to meet with other likeminded people of course.

Thats my 2p's worth anyway
 
Susane said:
Not being funny but...:D...I get this a lot here at TP, people agreeing with me that is...I feel special. :lol:
Not that everybody else here isn't special, cos they are!
* says Susane while digging a hole for herself!*
Click to expand...

the few people on here that know me will testify that it actually makes you very special.
I rarely get accused of being agreeable. ;)
 
I have not been on this site for long, so not sure if I am qualified to say anything, but so far this site has taught me quite a few techniques and also constructive critiscism. I felt shy at first about putting some of my photos on here but soon felt it was friendly enough to get good and bad feedback and learn from the comments from far more experience photographers than myself.

My only down side is I wish I had found this site sooner :)
 
I have to say that without the feedback and constructive critique I have received here, from all members on tp, I simply would not have learned so much - and in such a short time too.

I feel totally comfortable posting any images I wish to receive feedback on.

From a novices point of view i.e. mine - if I really do want to learn and improve my photography skills, then there's absolutely no point whatsoever in either not posting any of my images, or only posting them on sites where the feedback is going to be so predictable, and glowing... when I know, as a newcomer to DSLR's, that my images aren't of that caliber. This is why I post them; to obtain feedback, and to receive comments that will help me learn, grow, and gain knowledge.

I don't tend to post my images for critique elsewhere, only here. I do post some of my images on my non tog related site, and on some sites where I know that the members will perhaps appreciate the image... but for critique - just here. It's all that is needed.

There's only two forums where I have experienced this level of camaraderie; my own brass musicians forum, and here on talk Photography.
 
i only really post the photos that i want C+C on. I take quite a few shots that i like and i dont bother posting them because i already like them. But some shots i take especially just to see what people say about them.
TP is excellent for that.

the other forum you speak of isnt. (assuming this forum is on the net and about photography ;) )
 
positive criticism and genuine critique is a useful thing, just saying "your image sucks" doesnt help anyone, helpful advice does.

this forum is very good for critique, ive noticed places like flickr and deviantart are very good at "WOO YEH I LOVE YOUR WORK" and "dat pictures ace, shes well fit" which doesnt really help anyone
 
I cannot add anything new to this debate but agree with what most people are saying in this thread. As a noobie to photography, TP as been an invaluable source of information and support. C&C is well structured and appreciated with none of this "thats crap" or "don't like that". All negative comments are qualified which makes them justifiable in my book.

I have only ever used flickr, only really to share photo's with friends, but have received a view positive comments on there. In flickr's defense I don't think it is designed to have the discussions that are held on TP and is geared more to photo sharing rather than discussing photography.
 
Honest feedback all the way for me :p It is nice to be told your images are nice but even better to feel that you've earned it through actually putting in the effort to learn.
As has already been said, I fail to see the point in not saying what you think about an image - it may well be something that the OP missed.

I think that the point is a difficult one however because if I was to look at an image that everyone had said was too dark or badly composed, etc. but I genuinely liked the image then I'd say so - others may not understand what I liked about it though :shrug:

There is a massively diverse mix of styles & opinions here (maybe a bit of photographers talent thrown in too :lol:) & I find that a great deal of the time I'll agree with the groups opinions & it has allowed me to improve/save a lot of images & develop a style as a photographer (well, start to develop a style anyway :lol:)
 
I looked at a few forums before joining here and sometimes there was yeah! great shot, sometimes they were but if someone didnt agree they got hammered for it. I liked this forum because even if long standing members have posted photo and others haven't liked they have given an honest opinion usually with reasons behind liking or disliking photo. Constructive criticism can be better than a 100 pats on back in wrong direction.
 
moomike said:
Honest feedback all the way for me :p It is nice to be told your images are nice but even better to feel that you've earned it through actually putting in the effort to learn.
As has already been said, I fail to see the point in not saying what you think about an image - it may well be something that the OP missed.
Click to expand...

I agree with you 100%. It is nice to be told your images are nice, but to also be told why or how it could be more improved is beneficial to everyone. The same goes for if a pic doesn't go down well....

Whoever said TP is for "pro's" is purely missing out...yes, there are many experienced 'togs here, but also many novices (me included). With the interaction, guidance and helpful critique that gets passed around TP you can see peoples work progress and get better as they take the advice onboard...i can see clearly now...

And to the ones I was poking a stick at with this thread;

You stay over there in with your back-slapping chums churning out endless images of blurry wildlife, and i'll stay on the greener side....PROGRESSING! TP RULES! :woot:
 
A while ago when I moved house I joined the local camera club as a way of getting to know a few people.

I put a few pics up at a critique night and they were slammed. Questions were asked about the kit I owned, which was condemned as nowhere near enough if I was to aspire to their standards.

When I pointed out that I made my living (at that time, now retired) as a photographer and that all the exhibited photos had been sold for decent amounts of money it all went quiet.

I didn't go back. Not because I was criticised, but because they all thought the only way out was to buy more kit. When I reminded them of the comment by Edward Weston (the worst camera is better than the best photographer) they all thought I was nuts.
 
That sounds like almost every account I've heard(and been subjected to) of any local camera club tbh.
Cliquey doesn't do them justice.
 
I can stand up for both this forum AND my local camera club. Before tinternet there was only magazines (see various threads here about them) and camera clubs. When I joined first they all looked about 90. Now they are about 90! :lol:

Getting back into photography recently has been easier as I have a variety of sources. I quickly got back on the horse here because of the CONSTRUCTIVE criticism I received. I now go back to the camera club and help beginners where I can. They do see us as cliquey but to be honest I know some of the members here better than the senior members of our club.

Be it Club or Fora make sure you get what you want from it. And if you can give a little back;)

:thumbs:
 
I've only been here for a few months, but it all seems very friendly. :D And I've even met quite a few people from here at various events around the city. It helps that there are so many of us from Liverpool, ;) :lol:

I haven't posted many images, as I've been going through a low spell, and it's of little use posting pictures I know already suck. :( :lol:

When I comment on pictures, I try to be honest and constructive (if saying something negative ;)) otherwise, what's the point.

I've posted images for critique on other sites, but they are either too cliquey, with some members praising certain members pictures whether they are good or bad. :shrug: Or another site has so many pictures going through its gallery, that you're lucky if you get a comment, never mind anything constructive, because nobody sees your pictures. And you see average pictures getting loads of comments as friends comment on each others pictures, usually praising.

This site seems to strike the healthy balance of active members/amount of posts, and people trying to help. Also people new to photography don't seem intimidated to ask questions, and the professionals (which are nice to have around btw ;)) seem happy to share their knowledge and experience(s).

I also try enter an online photo competition every couple of weeks, as the site I visit seems to have the best setup I've found, of anonymous voting/commenting on images, and no huge prize (just choosing the next challenge) for people to take it too seriously, and so they just enjoy it. Receiving no votes on a picture leaves you in little doubt how people feel about your picture. In competition, you are reasonably sure people have looked at your picture, not something that can be guaranteed on a quick moving forum. The competition can be a kick up the bum though when the creativity/will is not strong, or just a good reason to try something different.

Sorry for the long post, but I didn't set out to write this much. ;) :lol:
 
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