Into landscape AND wildlife photography - help moving forwards with body upgrade.

dinners

dinners

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Phil
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I like to shoot wildlife and also landscapes - in equal measure.

Before I ramble - I have a 40D and a 1D Mark2 and my findings are:

40D:
I like 1.6 crop for wildlife and birds
Would like better AF for wildlife and birds in flight
ISO is always a challenge to retain shutter speeds for agile wildlife and birds.
Know fine well full frame could see me progress with landscapes.

1D2
Modest resolution is limited for cropping small birds on larger 1.3 sensor.
The AF is fantastic for wildlife and birds in flight.
ISO is a challenge to retain shutter speeds for wildlife and birds
Gets me a bit more with landscapes than the 40D

When the 5D2 and 7D came out I was excited about what both offered but the only way I could afford either, was to flog both the 1D2 and the 40D.
I knew fine well the 7D would see me better off with the wildlife and birds but deep down I knew I wanted the 5D2 for the landscapes.

I felt Canon went for 2 very 'dedicated' cameras. Nothing wrong with that but I think I said at the time that if the Nikon D700 had been a Canon - I'd have bought one like a shot for it's full frame ISO / AF combo ability. Torn between the 7D and 5D2 - I went for neither.

At the time (staying with Canon) I started to think that a 1D3 might be the answer. I'd get better ISO, keep the AF for birds, gain a little in the way of resolution for 1.3 cropping compared to my 1D2 yet retain a smidge of width for landscapes.

Cut a long story short - I never found a 1D3 back then at the right price so here I am with the same 40D and 1D2 and the same dilemma however the camera market (and my finacial circumstances) have since changed....

So....(hope you stayed with me and took it all in)....I'm at the point where I'm ready to 'upgrade' but I'm undecided and need a little help and advice...

5D3 probably ticks all the boxes now but I'm not sure I want to spend that much unless it's what I've been waiting for. 7D / 5D2 / 1D3 prices are now really attractive and the 6D just has me scratching my head.

I hate claiming that I've maxed my gear but all in all - I do feel I'm ready to move on as I know the limitations (esp with ISO limiting wildlife shutter speed in duff light) but hopefully there's enough said to fire up a some opinions or discussion that will help me.

Thanks in advance :bonk:
 
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Although I am a Nikon shooter, I empathise with you.
I have a D700 (FF) and a D7000 (DX) I want to get a 2nd FF camera, but the D800 is probably overkill, whereas the D600 is enough pixels, but I don't personally like the feel and size of it.
When there is a fair wedge of cash involved it is important to get the buying decision right first time.
Good luck in your quest !!
 
I have been using 7D in capturing wildlife pictures lately and I got contended by the result. I also try capturing landscapes using the same camera, and it satisfies me as well.
 
Difficult choice :)
It depends on what landscape lenses you have , would they work with full frame? (Ive got the tamron 17-50 and tokina 11-16 so would not be able to go full frame)
It would be very expensive long lens wise to get the same reach on a full frame as the 7D
The 7D is perfect for wildlife and still excellent for landscapes :)
 
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Should have mentioned lenses.

EF 17-40 mm f/4.0 L USM
EF 24-105mm f/4 L IS USM
EF 50mm f/1.8
EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS USM

I got rid of all my EF-S lenses when I started using the 1D2 so there would be no costs in moving to full frame other than the outlay on the body.
 
dinners said:
Should have mentioned lenses.

EF 17-40 mm f/4.0 L USM
EF 24-105mm f/4 L IS USM
EF 50mm f/1.8
EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS USM

I got rid of all my EF-S lenses when I started using the 1D2 so there would be no costs in moving to full frame other than the outlay on the body.
Click to expand...

I've got exactly that setup, plus a 135 f2 and a 1.4x exii converter, all work well on the 5D3 and from the new firmware in the new year I'll still be able to AF at f8 with the converter on the 100-400

It really is very good, and with prices dropping they're looking much better value than when they were first launched.
 
If you're happy with a 2 body setup, then you will probably be best investing in some mint 2nd hand bodies, namely a 7D and a 5D Mk2. Bought right (£700ish for the 7D and £900ish for the 5D) you could satisfy all your needs for about the same price as a 2nd hand 5D Mk3.

I have exactly this setup and whilst I used to use my 7D for landscapes before I got my 5D2 (using my Tokina 12-24), now it doesn't get a look in. Yes the 5D3's AF is miles better than the 5D2's, but if you're shooting landscapes, you don't really need it. The 7D's AF on the other hand is one of its strongest points and despite quite a few people complaining about low light performance/high ISO noise on it, in reality (or at least with my body) it's not a problem and even if it were LR4 can work miracles!!!
 
Thanks folks

Did any of you move from a 40D to a 7D

I'd be interested to know how much further you're prepared to push the ISO to keep the shutter speeds up for the birds.

I normally call it a day with the 40D when anything over ISO800 is needed to keep me over 1/400.

Yesterday I was resigned to max aperture and ISO1600 to even maintain 1/100.
 
dinners said:
Yesterday I was resigned to max aperture and ISO1600 to even maintain 1/100.
Click to expand...

But you got some good shots. ;)

I feel your pain phil.

I have used a 7D for nearly two years 90% birds & wildlife and to be honest I dont think you would be happy with one for long.

the 7D itself is a cracking wildlife camera but its auto focus does get very inaccurate / llazy / lost when the light level drops

I have just traded up to a 5D3 but hav'nt had chance to use it properly for wildlife yet but from the AF tests I have done using dark places it knocks the spots off the 7D's AF.

So that just means the loss of the crop factor. :shrug:
wide angle from a 17-40 is awesome though :love:
 
As you know ive seen your work on another site, i enjoy your wildlife images, but i feel your landscape work was a class above, so for me thats the body you should go for, still life in the 40D for a while, i would be gutted if mine failed, but i would happily go for the 7D if it did.

regards brian.
 
Thanks again guys

Plenty to mull over.
 
..............
 
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Dinners,
I have been using a 7D for wildlife and 5D3 came along and now the 7D sits in bag with 100-400 bolted on whilst 5D3 has 500f4. IMHO the 5D3 wins on low light, A/F and the various custom functions which set the A/F for birds in flight.
The full frame sensor is not an issue and it just feels faster.
Worth talking to Azule finance for leasing deals, if you dont want to pay cash
 
Thanks folks

I'm not looking to other brands at the moment but I will have a read up on than Pentax


davecurley said:
Dinners,
I have been using a 7D for wildlife and 5D3 came along and now the 7D sits in bag with 100-400 bolted on whilst 5D3 has 500f4. IMHO the 5D3 wins on low light, A/F and the various custom functions which set the A/F for birds in flight.
The full frame sensor is not an issue and it just feels faster.
Worth talking to Azule finance for leasing deals, if you dont want to pay cash
Click to expand...

Cheers

If the 500 f4 was bolted to the 7D - would the 7D stay in the bag ? ;)

Joking aside:

AF and ISO aside - with a like for like lens (100-400) how do you find the the 5D3 images compare when cropped down to match the 7D image ?
 
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I'm watching this thread with interest.
Was thinking of getting a 7D, but a couple of people have tried to convince me it's worth spending the extra for a 5DMk2... I'd lose the use of one lens (Sig 10-20), but like you I photograph either wildlife or landscapes.
 
"The 7D is perfect for wildlife and still excellent for landscapes" exactly! That's what I found out as well.
 
Cheers Hugh

It's been a while since I started this thread.

Nothing has changed other than my budget (which is better) but I'm still wanting to be sensible.

7D certainly floats my boat and I think that's what I'll go for.
 
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Having used all the cameras you mention the best one so far is the 5d3, haven't touched my 7D since getting it back in July so will be getting shot of it this month

Even though the 5d3 is probably the best all round camera/price canon has ever made I'm still wanting more fps for extreme fast action and flappy birds in flight so will be going down the route of 1d4 or 7D2 when it comes out this year, crop would help with the wildlife as well.

All that said 5d3 is good enough for fast situations thanks to the amazing AF, just needs some more FPS. But if it did then no-one would pay double for the 1dx in that case :)

Drew
 
p.s 7D is a far better camera than the 5d2 apart from high ISO noise control (obvious as its not FF)

5d2 produces some lovely pics but has the build quality and AF of a 30D
 
Thanks Drew

I think 7D will be the way forward but something still pulls me towards a 1D3
 
The wife just said get a 5D2 AND a 7D :D
 
Nitram said:
1D3
Click to expand...

I know, I know :bonk:

I love 1D bodies and everything feels like a step down even if they're not.

I've said it all earlier in the thread but as much as I'm tempted by a 1D3 I'm just not sure whether I'd be cropping too much with it's resolution for little birds.

I'm not convinced that the 7D is going to give me much more in terms of ISO capability over my existing bodies for retaining shutter speeds and the AF of my 1D2 is as good. resolution would be a step up.

5D2 would be good for the high ISO but I don't need high ISO for landscapes - it's the birds and wildlife I need the ISO for and I'd be struggling with the AF. That said I'd love it for my landscapes.

I don't really want to spend 1D4 / 1Ds3 / 5D3 money.
 
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dinners said:
I know, I know :bonk:

I love 1D bodies and everything feels like a step down even if they're not.

I've said it all earlier in the thread but as much as I'm tempted by a 1D3 I'm just not sure whether I'd be cropping too much with it's resolution for little birds.

I'm not convinced that the 7D is going to give me much more in terms of ISO capability over my existing bodies for retaining shutter speeds and the AF of my 1D2 is as good. resolution would be a step up.

5D2 would be good for the high ISO but I don't need high ISO for landscapes - it's the birds and wildlife I need the ISO for and I'd be struggling with the AF. That said I'd love it for my landscapes.

I don't really want to spend 1D4 / 1Ds3 / 5D3 money.
Click to expand...

I thought you would have got these ordered by now! :lol:


Heather
 
Hi Phil, youre obviously torturing yourself so I'll see if I can help :) As you've already said the 1D series are all beautiful cameras to use but they are also in a class of their own when it comes to quality and surviving the elements ( something that 7d's are not so good at) The focusing on the 5d2 is nothing short of abysmal compared to the 1D2 and as a wildlife camera does not work, they are however fantastic for macro work. If I was to find myself in your shoes again I would go 1d3 without hesitation examples in nearly new condition can be had for £800 to £1000. Maybe at a later date a 5d or 5d2. Buying some fast secondhand glass would probably be more beenficial to you. I have just posted a couple of high iso pics in the bird section which may be of interest to you.
 
Cheers Martin - I've just been looking at your Nuthatch shot.

It's the 1.3 crop that has me stalling on the 1D3

I hardly bother with my 1D2 now for small birds as I find it doesn't have the resolution for cropping so (better ISO aside) I wonder just how much of a difference the extra few MP would make on the 1D3

I guess a 1.4TC on my 100-400 @f5.6 might be an option.

I was also looking at HDEW prices for 7D/5D2/5D3
 
Hi Phil
You could probably sell the 100-400 and buy a siggy 300 2.8 or 120-300 2.8 for very little more money. That would instantly drop the iso you need. Shame youre so far away or you could have tried my kit.
 
Thanks for all the pointers and suggestions.

I managed to pick up a tidy 1D3 which I have to say I'm loving so far.
 
The other alterantive to me seems like it could have been a 1Ds2 although I spose your giving up FPS there.
 
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