In vogue, but set to annoy when overdone?

Steve

Steve

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Recently I'm seeing more and more landscapes and architectural shots using very long exposures enabled by the 10 stop ND filters.

I like them very much....dramatic moving skies, beautifully calm seascapes....there is a lot to like about the results.

BUT, is there a danger that this could go the way of HDR with everyone and her dog having a go to the extent they become an overused cliche?
 
HDR
b&w with selective colouring
micro-planets

Things gain popularity, get overdone and put a lot of people off. If you like it then stick with it, maybe you'll manage to convince someone that it is valid and can be enjoyable even at it's height of public disdain
 
True.

I do like the results from this, so tried to buy a Lee big stopper and found they were out of stock everywhere, so I guess lots of others have seen the results and fancied a go themselves.

So although I like the effects at the moment, I'm not sure if I will still when (or if) it is everywhere and overused.

I really liked the first few HDR photos I ever saw a few years back. Now I can barely look at one.
 
It's already overdone! I like moving skies but I absolutely hate water shots so blurred it just looks like a cloud.
 
Yikes....overdone already and I haven't even managed to do my first attempt at one :)
 
I too, quite like the effects that can be gained by the 10 stoppers. For me, I think the only thing that will be overdone, is the silky water (not that I dont appreciate it when done well). Id like to see it used more in other situations; an urban landscape with movement in the sky, or used to create oil painting type effects of trees in full autumn colour...for example. Im sure there are many more, but my point is, i donr think it would be seen as overdone or annoying if used in more varied situations.
 
MWHCVT said:
Is there anything in photography that is not done to death though...it's like anything some love it, some will loath it and many will have passing infatuations with it :)
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Yes, remember those starburst filters that crept in to every other shot.
 
It's overdone because it's easy. But to do it well is much more difficult, such as carefully selecting the shutter speed to give just the right amount of blur rather than the usual total washout, blending a blurred exposure with a sharp one, or doing both that and also blending in a third image with streaked clouds that usually need an even longer exposure time, plus ND grad effect. That's not overdone yet.
 
Steve said:
Recently I'm seeing more and more landscapes and architectural shots using very long exposures enabled by the 10 stop ND filters.

I like them very much....dramatic moving skies, beautifully calm seascapes....there is a lot to like about the results.

BUT, is there a danger that this could go the way of HDR with everyone and her dog having a go to the extent they become an overused cliche?
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ND filters in one form or another have been around for years and years and I guess depending on when and where you look you can find them in abundance.

Is it because you now have an interest in this area that you think you are seeing more of these around I wonder?

At the end of the day, do what is right for you.

If you enjoy it, what does it matter?
 
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HoppyUK said:
It's overdone because it's easy. But to do it well is much more difficult, such as carefully selecting the shutter speed to give just the right amount of blur rather than the usual total washout, blending a blurred exposure with a sharp one, or doing both that and also blending in a third image with streaked clouds that usually need an even longer exposure time, plus ND grad effect. That's not overdone yet.
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This is oh so true, I live and breath long exposure photographer in particular night time photography, and as well as seeing some over the very best of the genre you also see a lot of really awful stuff, but this again is the same with pretty much every genre of photography or for that mater any particular creative you can think of
 
graphilly said:
ND filters in one form or another have been around for years and years and I guess depending on when and where you look you can find them in abundance.

Is it because you now have an interest in this area that you think you are seeing more of these around I wonder?

At the end of the day do what is right for you.

If you enjoy it, what does it matter?
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Very long exposure times running into several seconds is basically a digital technique, and has only been really popular for the last few years. With film, reciprocity failure makes long exposure times unpredictable and in colour you get uncorrectable colour casts as the different colour layers react differently.

Another mostly digital thing is strobist flash techniques with multiple remote guns, as it's so difficult with film nobody bothered much.
 
No harm in exploring all avenues yourself to see how well you can do them and how much you like your own results. The problem could be when sharing your results with people who have seen the same idea too often!

The multiple gun strobism thing has risen in popularity with digital, IMO because on digital it's possible to see the result instantly and reshoot with different settings while the setup is in place. It was possible with film but largely a matter of guesswork (and experience!)
 
HoppyUK said:
Very long exposure times running into several seconds is basically a digital technique, and has only been really popular for the last few years. With film, reciprocity failure makes long exposure times unpredictable and in colour you get uncorrectable colour casts as the different colour layers react differently.

Another mostly digital thing is strobist flash techniques with multiple remote guns, as it's so difficult with film nobody bothered much.
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Well like photography I guess definitions are subjective too, as is how long somethings been popular and overdone but my point was that the OP thinks it is becoming overdone now when I would have said that point, for the long exposure stuff with NDs, was 'overdone' maybe as far back as 3-4 years ago.
 
graphilly said:
Well like photography I guess definitions are subjective too, as is how long somethings been popular and overdone but my point was that the OP thinks it is becoming overdone now when I would have said that point, for the long exposure stuff with NDs, was 'overdone' maybe as far back as 3-4 years ago.
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Lee Big Stopper was only introduced in 2010, and before that the B&W was pretty much the only other ten stopper ND available. Both expensive, and both in short supply, with the Lee still on back-order now. Plenty of boredom yet to come :D

I think that just adding a ten-stops effect to a mundane landscape doesn't make it special any more, but it can still make a good landscape better.
 
HoppyUK said:
Lee Big Stopper was only introduced in 2010, and before that the B&W was pretty much the only other ten stopper ND available. Both expensive, and both in short supply, with the Lee still on back-order now. Plenty of boredom yet to come :D

I think that just adding a ten-stops effect to a mundane landscape doesn't make it special any more, but it can still make a good landscape better.
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Yes I know when the 10 stopper was introduced , I got one not long after. Weaker ND filters have been around for longer and you can get the same effect with these in a lot of cases. You will know that stacking the weaker ones can give you the same effect as the 10 stop.
 
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I guess the problem arises when the technique becomes more important than the subject.

When someone goes out determined to use their 10 stopper, the technique takes priority and the results could be forced and formulaic.

But when the subject takes priority, and the photogrpaher assessing the scene decides that their vision could be realised by using a 10 stopper then the results should be better.
 
Steve said:
I guess the problem arises when the technique becomes more important than the subject.
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Agreed, I see shots, particularly with HDR, where the photographer has gone out to use HDR and has used it on a crap subject, and tries to turn it into a good photograph, rather than using it on an interesting subject to enhance it.

I use HDR from time to time, and 10 stop filters, and 3 stop NDs, and all sorts of other techniques, it is about choosing the right tool from the box.
 
Steve said:
True.

I do like the results from this, so tried to buy a Lee big stopper and found they were out of stock everywhere, so I guess lots of others have seen the results and fancied a go themselves.

So although I like the effects at the moment, I'm not sure if I will still when (or if) it is everywhere and overused.

I really liked the first few HDR photos I ever saw a few years back. Now I can barely look at one.
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Lee are in andover hants and have been banging out the big stopper and can not keep up with demand, thousands of photographers want them. you could try b+w 10 stop from america they seem to have a better supply hope that helps, mike.
 
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dinorock said:
Lee are in andover hants and have been banging out the big stopper and can not keep up with demand, thousands of photographers want them. you could try b+w 10 stop from america they seem to have a better supply hope that helps, mike.
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B&W are German not American :)
 
MWHCVT said:
B&W are German not American :)
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oh right but sell highly in america? as you can find the 10 stop b+w on lots of american sites.
pretty sure adorama in NY sell them and advertise them on there utube vids.
 
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dinorock said:
oh right but sell highly in america? as you can find the 10 stop b+w on lots of american sites.
pretty sure adorama in NY sell them and advertise them on there utube vids.
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I really wouldn't know how they sell over the other side of the pond :)
 
dinorock said:
oh right but sell highly in america? as you can find the 10 stop b+w on lots of american sites.
pretty sure adorama in NY sell them and advertise them on there utube vids.
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B+W are in free supply over here and IMHO their MC ten stopper is the best available. Lee Big Stopper is made for them in East Asia and still has a short waiting list. It's the best of the square slot-in variety.

But there are loads of very good alternatives now, at least the screw-in type, with the Haida MC probably being the best value. Also Hoya, LightCraftWorkshop, Heliopan.
 
I think if done right then it's effective. I do like long exposure photography. More so than HDR. A lot of things are now cliche in photography as someone has said already but I think if you enjoy it and it's something that works for you then carry on.

I think with HDR, the first couple of times you see it you can be impressed but after that everything does tend to look overcooked. Arguably though, you can apply it in a more subtle way which can work quite well, especially with architecture I think.
 
Steve said:
Recently I'm seeing more and more landscapes and architectural shots using very long exposures enabled by the 10 stop ND filters.

I like them very much....dramatic moving skies, beautifully calm seascapes....there is a lot to like about the results.

BUT, is there a danger that this could go the way of HDR with everyone and her dog having a go to the extent they become an overused cliche?
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Then don't do it.

Either you shoot stuff that is a cliché because you like doing it; or you're bothered about producing derivative work... which is it? :) If it's the former, carry on and to hell with everyone... if the latter... just stop doing it.
 
Pookeyhead said:
Then don't do it.

Either you shoot stuff that is a cliché because you like doing it; or you're bothered about producing derivative work... which is it? :) If it's the former, carry on and to hell with everyone... if the latter... just stop doing it.
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I'm not doing it.
I don't own a 10 stopper.
It's an observation that I like the effects others are achieving by using it. Some may have been doing it for ages, but I've only relatively recently started to notice the effects and now they are becoming more commonplace. I'm just not sure if I will continue to enjoy the effects if and when everyone is doing it and their results are all over the forum.

By the way, great to see you back David....have missed your observations on issues over the last few weeks :)
 
Never really went away... I just get busy... I come.. I go :)
 
If anyone is looking for a big stopper dale photographic have some in stock
 
Just popped back in to add, as photographers our perceptions of what is overdone and what is cliche etc will differ greatly from Joe Public. We are looking at images day in day out, they're not.

Just this week I've been contacted by 2 outfits I sold images into at the beginning of the summer, with reorders. My mono 'big stopper' seascapes by far outweigh the others they have asked for. In fact if I break it down quickly I'd say these alone are more than twice my original summer order.
 
graphilly said:
Just popped back in to add, as photographers our perceptions of what is overdone and what is cliche etc will differ greatly from Joe Public. We are looking at images day in day out, they're not.

Just this week I've been contacted by 2 outfits I sold images into at the beginning of the summer, with reorders. My mono 'big stopper' seascapes by far outweigh the others they have asked for. In fact if I break it down quickly I'd say these alone are more than twice my original summer order.
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I'm not surprised.

The results I've seen are beautiful and I really like the effect.

Just makes me sad that such a potentially photo enhancing technique could go the way of HDR... ruined by over use to the extent that even when skillfully and appropriately done gets dismissed.
 
I think as long as you are happy doing it at the time and enjoy the results then go for it. If you look back in 10 years and don't like the images then does it really matter? All that matters is you enjoyed it when you did it, that's why we all take photos isn't it?
I'm sure people look back at fashion and think the cloths they wore in the past are now horrible and dated. Who cares, it was right at the time.
 
Tunbridge said:
I'm sure people look back at fashion and think the cloths they wore in the past are now horrible and dated. Who cares, it was right at the time.
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Apart from those pink flares I tried once in 1977....they were never right at any time or place. :)
 
I've always liked the long exposure effects on water, and as someone has pointed out, people have been creating them since they found the 'B' setting. HDR is taking a while to become visually acceptable to me, provided dark objects don't have a light halo round them. The one effect that I wish caused automatic camera-confiscation is tilt-shift for the instant-miniature look. If something was ever over-done, that's it.
 
Have owned a 10 stop for a good 4 years now. As said, it can get overdone like everything else but it's more about using it [& other 'tools'] to improve a scene rather than using it for the sake of it on every shot!!

Each to their own & all that ;)
 
The key, as with everything that's "overdone", is to use the effect subtly. The best HDR images are the ones where you can barely even tell it's been done using HDR and it's the same with using ND filters. Seascapes, for instance, look best when there's a long enough exposure to show some movement but not so long that it's all just a smooth mess.
 
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