Idiots on the motorway

[Marcus Geezer]

My dad, who was a copper in the sixties and did all the advanced driving stuff, taught me many common sense lessons about motorway driving, and always said, on a three lane motorway, there is really only one lane with two overtaking lanes. It's a shame a lot of people think that lane is either the middle or the outside though.

I do circa 25k miles a year, lots of it on motorway and am sick to my back teeth with middle and fast lane hoggers, tailgaters, people holding phones who invariably drive in their own little world, and people who seem to think it is ok to be very rude and aggresive, when outside of a car they wouldnt probably say boo to a goose.

 

[ChrisH]

I do circa 25k miles a year, lots of it on motorway and am sick to my back teeth with middle and fast lane hoggers, tailgaters, people holding phones who invariably drive in their own little world, and people who seem to think it is ok to be very rude and aggresive, when outside of a car they wouldnt probably say boo to a goose.

Ever notice how those on the phone drive very expensive cars

Sorry though I do get rude when I can't get past someone doing 65 in the outside lane.

Just recently I came up behind a white VW polo on the M60, he was doing 60 in the outside lane. I flashed him from well back, not a load just a couple of quick flashes. He continued his conversation on the phone, so after a mile I flashed him again.

His reaction

He slammed his brakes on and slowed me down to 20 in the outside lane, lucky I drive a Passat tank with good brakes. I avoided the back of him by inches. The guy in a Merc behind me narrowly avoided hitting me, and the transit behind him the same.

I got on my handsfree and phoned the police, then talked the traffic car in to where he was and he got pulled.

Thats the mentality of some people these days on the roads, he could not only have lost his own life, he could have killed 3 other people because of his stupidity.

Who was in the wrong, me for flashing him or him for doing 65 in the outside lane WITH 2 CLEAR inside lanes :bang:

 

[odd jim]

We should all just take the americans rule. No fast or slow lane, just learn to use your mirrors and change lanes as required. Also it is great over there when you are driving at 70mph and a 60FT wagon passes you. I miss those days.

We don't have 'fast' or 'slow' lanes in the uk either, simply overtaking lanes. Its a simple system - stay left unless overtaking.

It's this 'fast/slow' lane mentality that can cause lane hogging, with some ignorant people thinking that because they are not driving 'slowly' they shouldn't use lane 1 (as it's correctly called) even if the lane is completely empty.

 

[RacingSnake]

fwiw, certainly in the morning, I make better progress in Lane 1 at 55mph than either of the other 2 lanes
it is invariably 'empty' in Lane 1

 

[boliston]

Ever notice how those on the phone drive very expensive cars

Sorry though I do get rude when I can't get past someone doing 65 in the outside lane.

Just recently I came up behind a white VW polo on the M60, he was doing 60 in the outside lane. I flashed him from well back, not a load just a couple of quick flashes. He continued his conversation on the phone, so after a mile I flashed him again.

His reaction

He slammed his brakes on and slowed me down to 20 in the outside lane, lucky I drive a Passat tank with good brakes. I avoided the back of him by inches. The guy in a Merc behind me narrowly avoided hitting me, and the transit behind him the same.

I got on my handsfree and phoned the police, then talked the traffic car in to where he was and he got pulled.

Thats the mentality of some people these days on the roads, he could not only have lost his own life, he could have killed 3 other people because of his stupidity.

Who was in the wrong, me for flashing him or him for doing 65 in the outside lane WITH 2 CLEAR inside lanes :bang:

The short answer is you were driving TOO CLOSE! If you came anywhere near hitting a car in front (however hard they brake) then you were almost certainly not following the life saving "2 second rule".

 

[custodian]

The short answer is you were driving TOO CLOSE! If you came anywhere near hitting a car in front (however hard they brake) then you were almost certainly not following the life saving "2 second rule".

I suggest you do the sums. If the person in front deliberately slams his brakes on, 2 seconds will still be barely enough to avoid a collision. Simple enough sums for an accountant todo, factoring in reaction time, braking distance and speed differential. IF the driver behind was tailgateing, there would have been a serious collision.

 

[boliston]

I suggest you do the sums. If the person in front deliberately slams his brakes on, 2 seconds will still be barely enough to avoid a collision. Simple enough sums for an accountant todo, factoring in reaction time, braking distance and speed differential. IF the driver behind was tailgateing, there would have been a serious collision.

That assumes he stops instantly - the 2 seconds is essentially the "thinking time" as both vehicles will probably decelerate at similar rates unless one has very good braking compared with the other.

I normally see typical gaps of LESS than HALF a second, and my 2 seconds seems like a massive distance in comparison.

 

[ChrisH]

The short answer is you were driving TOO CLOSE! If you came anywhere near hitting a car in front (however hard they brake) then you were almost certainly not following the life saving "2 second rule".

Sorry this made me laugh, I take it you haven't driven nearly a million miles in the last 30 years without an accident then.

I nearly hit him means had I reacted a little slower I would have probably tail ended him. Then I would have been tail ended by what was behind me.

Seems to me your blaming me for some idiot possibly causing the death of 3 drivers by what ammounts to gross stupidity.

Believe me I've been tested and have faster than normal reaction times, but when someone slams the nose of their car into the ground unexpected then your sphincter will twitch a little.

The Police certainly didn't think it was funny.

Hey you don't drive a Y reg VW Polo and live near Stockport do you

 

[boliston]

Sorry this made me laugh, I take it you haven't driven nearly a million miles in the last 30 years without an accident then.

I nearly hit him means had I reacted a little slower I would have probably tail ended him. Then I would have been tail ended by what was behind me.

Seems to me your blaming me for some idiot possibly causing the death of 3 drivers by what ammounts to gross stupidity.

Believe me I've been tested and have faster than normal reaction times, but when someone slams the nose of their car into the ground unexpected then your sphincter will twitch a little.

The Police certainly didn't think it was funny.

Hey you don't drive a Y reg VW Polo and live near Stockport do you

If someone is driving very close behind you then the only answer is to leave even MORE space between yourself and the vehicle in front.

A two second gap is a starting point for driving in IDEAL conditions, and anything else should INCREASE this gap, such as a tailgater behind you, or rain etc.

One thing I have never really understood is this whole driving too close thing, as at the end of the day driving close does not get anyone anywhere any quicker and it's just not worth it.

 

[Splog]

Believe me I've been tested and have faster than normal reaction times, but when someone slams the nose of their car into the ground unexpected then your sphincter will twitch a little.

The Police certainly didn't think it was funny.

I doubt the Police would have thought it funny if you had rear ended and killed him because you were driving too close :shrug:

faster than normal reaction times

 

[munch]

Great ChrisH you have faster than normal reaction times. Is that in all circumstances or just in controlled conditions?

The problem with believing you have faster reaction times than Mr average is you end up in the sh!te if the driver in front has even faster reaction times than you.

 

[Big Andy]

The short answer is you were driving TOO CLOSE! If you came anywhere near hitting a car in front (however hard they brake) then you were almost certainly not following the life saving "2 second rule".

I always find if I leave a sensible gap between me and the vehicle infront some prat will just pull into it meaning you have to slow down to restablish to gap. Then some prat will just pull into it etc. etc. etc. :bang::bang:

 

[Gremlin]

I always find if I leave a sensible gap between me and the vehicle infront some prat will just pull into it meaning you have to slow down to restablish to gap. Then some prat will just pull into it etc. etc. etc. :bang::bang:

Was just gonna say that

 

[wibbly]

A two second gap is a starting point for driving in IDEAL conditions, and anything else should INCREASE this gap, such as a tailgater behind you, or rain etc.

Two seconds, yeah right! Leaving two seconds gap on a busy motorway and you end up going backwards..

I'm sorry, but theory is fantastic reality is somewhat different. Two seconds maybe ideal, sadly we don't live in an ideal world. I leave a sensible gap giving me enough time to react given the conditions of the day. I don't profess to have the best reactions in the world, and hopefully not the worst, I just keep a gap that gives me enough time to react comfortably and this has served me pretty well to date!

 

[boliston]

Two seconds, yeah right! Leaving two seconds gap on a busy motorway and you end up going backwards..

I'm sorry, but theory is fantastic reality is somewhat different. Two seconds maybe ideal, sadly we don't live in an ideal world. I leave a sensible gap giving me enough time to react given the conditions of the day. I don't profess to have the best reactions in the world, and hopefully not the worst, I just keep a gap that gives me enough time to react comfortably and this has served me pretty well to date!

OK @custodian says I should leave far more than 2 seconds and you say 2 seconds is way too much so I guess nobody is going to agree on the ideal gap.

 

[Splog]

Two seconds, yeah right! Leaving two seconds gap on a busy motorway and you end up going backwards..

I'm sorry, but theory is fantastic reality is somewhat different. Two seconds maybe ideal, sadly we don't live in an ideal world. I leave a sensible gap giving me enough time to react given the conditions of the day. I don't profess to have the best reactions in the world, and hopefully not the worst, I just keep a gap that gives me enough time to react comfortably and this has served me pretty well to date!

Just out of interest! .... What do you consider a sensible gap? and what is 'enough time to react' .......

 

[wibbly]

Just out of interest! .... What do you consider a sensible gap? and what is 'enough time to react' .......

I don't believe a 'sensible gap' or 'enough time to react' can be quantified easily by time on a forum.

It's more simply judged according to the prevalent road conditions at the time, all I can say is I've never been anywhere with people in the car who have complained at the white knuckle ride or as yet not left sufficient space or time to run into the back of someone on a motorway, whilst still making good progress which for someone driving over 30k miles a year I like to do.

I guess it's a judgement call with regards to the the gap you leave as to how comfortable you are, perhaps if your car is not a modern example then 2 seconds is sufficient given braking distances etc. personally I have no issues with the gap I leave...

 

[Splog]

I don't believe a 'sensible gap' or 'enough time to react' can be quantified easily by time on a forum.

It's more simply judged according to the prevalent road conditions at the time, all I can say is I've never been anywhere with people in the car who have complained at the white knuckle ride or as yet not left sufficient space or time to run into the back of someone on a motorway, whilst still making good progress which for someone driving over 30k miles a year I like to do.

I guess it's a judgement call with regards to the the gap you leave as to how comfortable you are, perhaps if your car is not a modern example then 2 seconds is sufficient given braking distances etc. personally I have no issues with the gap I leave...

So... How do you judge the distance :shrug:

 

[custodian]

And how do yorecncile e differentapprach betweenUK and German motorways?

Being tailgated wilst driving at 170 is interesting.

 

[ChrisH]

I'm just going to agree to disagree.

As far as I'm concerned it seems to be an argument over distances now which doesn't get past the fact that the dick in the car in front of me did something so stupid as to NEARLY cause an accident.

Seems I must have been in the wrong not him for his stupidity.

The 2 second rule on motorways just doesn't happen. As has been said, leave a gap it gets filled, pull back it gets filled.

I drive defencively but when does that become just a case of back peddling all the time.

Maybe I should just take up driving in the outside lane on a clear motorway whilst on the phone instead.

 

[custodian]

I'm just going to agree to disagree.

As far as I'm concerned it seems to be an argument over distances now which doesn't get past the fact that the dick in the car in front of me did something so stupid as to NEARLY cause an accident.

Seems I must have been in the wrong not him for his stupidity.

The 2 second rule on motorways just doesn't happen. As has been said, leave a gap it gets filled, pull back it gets filled.

I drive defencively but when does that become just a case of back peddling all the time.

Maybe I should just take up driving in the outside lane on a clear motorway whilst on the phone instead.

I agree with that.

If the prat ahead jams on the anchors from 70mph, you will have to be way back if you are not going to hit him.

There are two reaction times in play. First is you braking in response to his braking, expecting a normal reduction in speead. Second (maybe 2 seconds later) is the panic application of your brakes when you realise that you have a suicidal moron driving the car in front.

Whilst not condoning tailgating, you would need a 5 second gap to be safe in those conditions and that is clearly impracticable, becuase then a queue of idiots would be tailgating you.

We are in a real world (most of the time!) and we have to drive in recognition of that fact.

 

[RacingSnake]

I always find if I leave a sensible gap between me and the vehicle infront some prat will just pull into it meaning you have to slow down to restablish to gap. Then some prat will just pull into it etc. etc. etc. :bang::bang:

This is absolutely spot on, invariably the guy who has just shoe-horned his way in front of you will then hit his brakes because his closing speed was too fast - and thus starts the 'wave' of heavy braking resulting in my god damned awful commute to work every day

 

[RacingSnake]

I'm conscious I did say 'his', it of course could be a her too, but I guess the majority of BMW/merc/audi drivers are blokes so it's probably correct.


*runs and hides