I guess that's terminal then

[the black fox]

I believe curry’s do a very good deal on I.macs .cheaper in the long run

 

[Brentor]

Does this mean the PC is now fixed?

 

[woof woof]

Cheers Pete
And thanks also to everyone for their input


That's correct. It seems that everything that should be there is there. Plus stuff that I'm sure I deleted years ago.
And Thankfully ( Unfortunately for him ) My SiL is on holiday from work.

Once he got in there and laid it all bare, everything is there across the various storage devices,.
The problems it seems, is that the OS is corrupt, and the part that allows repair or system restore is just not there.

So that's mostly good news. He's trying to source a fresh W7 professional disc to reload.
Once its up and running, I can delete all the dross collected over the years, spec a new PC, and start afresh.

I used to fix computers but these days I just can't be bothered and getting someone to look at it for you is exactly what I was going to suggest on seeing this thread I'm sure you have better things to do with your time than fiddle with computers

 

[Cobra]

Does that mean you're now on the babysitting hit list?

for as long as I can avoid it anyway

Sorry missed that. I ~ Glad you're fixed.

cheers, not fixed but the problem has been identified, he's looking for a new OS disc. (W7 professional)
Failing that they aren't that expensive on the like of ebay.
Get that one running and take my time sourcing a new one.

I believe curry’s do a very good deal on I.macs .cheaper in the long run

I have absolutely no intention of learning a new OS not even at half the price of windows, let alone double.

Does this mean the PC is now fixed?

As above

I'm sure you have better things to do with your time than fiddle with computers

I have no idea, especially at that level

 

[gman]

RAM is usually the first place I'd look with a BSOD. What was the problem in end?

 

[Cobra]

RAM is usually the first place I'd look with a BSOD. What was the problem in end?

Post 29

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

Most large traditional companies in this country and especially government departments and the NHS are using ancient technologies. They are being ripped off by so-called expert consultants who only understand the MS/Intel world. The government needs to call in the very top engineers from somewhere like Google to do a full RESET of our national IT systems. I won't hold my breath.

I don't think you understand the real world of IT.

I worked on many legacy systems that were long out of date on paper but did work that was essential to the client's business. Often this code was rock solid and any problems were due to changes in data and requirements, which actually did not need to impact the existing system. Reworking or replicating the code for new operating systems, languages and hardware would be enormous tasks, frought with pitfalls. I've seen some of the gruesome disasters in that line, up close and personal.

That's why the modern approach is to put the original code straight into virtual machines and add new code completely outside the original system, typically using the legacy system as a feed into the new one. Because the legacy systems were designed for machines that were often slower than three legged tortoises, they receive a tremendous speed boost in the virtual environment, which is sometimes all that's needed to keep them useful.

The idea of calling "in the very top engineers from somewhere like Google to do a full RESET of our national IT systems", fills me with horror. It's exactly the sort of insane idea that Bogoff Johnson or the Trussbot would have and just as likely to cause chaos as their other daft plans.

 

[Pound Coin]

That description of Linux was written on September 18th, 1991...

Seriously, it is dead simple to install and use Linux. The only slightly annoying thing is when you want to install an app that is not officially supported, Skype for instance, can be a pain (better off installing it through Terminal than downloading the tar.gz from stupid MS which NEVER works).

However, I would never use Ubuntu again. They were caught farming user data (much like MS does), but forgot to tell anyone. Mint Debian, MX Linux or any of the many flavours of Linux are readily available and free from prying eyes. In fact, for ultimate security, use Tails on a USB key and boot it on any machine you want.

And, unless you used a disk imaging system, their instructions mean you lose ALL of your data. Where as TimeMachine (on a mac) makes recovering it / upgrading to a new mac incredibly easy. Some Linux distros come with a incremental file backup solution as well. Not too bad for a free OS.

Pictures of your beard or it didn’t happen.

 

[gman]

Post 29

Opps apologies, I missed that whilst skimming through. Any idea on what may have corrupted the OS? Hard resets maybe?

 

[Sangoma]

Are you guys finally getting some rain ?

15.8mm in the last 24 hrs here

 

[Sangoma]

Cheers Pete
And thanks also to everyone for their input


That's correct. It seems that everything that should be there is there. Plus stuff that I'm sure I deleted years ago.
And Thankfully ( Unfortunately for him ) My SiL is on holiday from work.

Once he got in there and laid it all bare, everything is there across the various storage devices,.
The problems it seems, is that the OS is corrupt, and the part that allows repair or system restore is just not there.

So that's mostly good news. He's trying to source a fresh W7 professional disc to reload.
Once its up and running, I can delete all the dross collected over the years, spec a new PC, and start afresh.

I should have a W7 pro disc, but it will a volume licence (or what ever they called it) so you would need the right key (I don't think an OEM key would work)
Don't know where you are, doubt if you are near me, and it would take forever to up/down load, but if he can't find one I could image it and post it if it is of any help.

 

[wornish]

I don't think you understand the real world of IT.

I worked on many legacy systems that were long out of date on paper but did work that was essential to the client's business. Often this code was rock solid and any problems were due to changes in data and requirements, which actually did not need to impact the existing system. Reworking or replicating the code for new operating systems, languages and hardware would be enormous tasks, frought with pitfalls. I've seen some of the gruesome disasters in that line, up close and personal.

That's why the modern approach is to put the original code straight into virtual machines and add new code completely outside the original system, typically using the legacy system as a feed into the new one. Because the legacy systems were designed for machines that were often slower than three legged tortoises, they receive a tremendous speed boost in the virtual environment, which is sometimes all that's needed to keep them useful.

The idea of calling "in the very top engineers from somewhere like Google to do a full RESET of our national IT systems", fills me with horror. It's exactly the sort of insane idea that Bogoff Johnson or the Trussbot would have and just as likely to cause chaos as their other daft plans.

Think you might find that I do understand I.T. that's why I made the post, but never mind.

It's got nothing to do with which party I vote for. Its the same Civil Service that needs to be sorted
The Luddites are in charge.

 

[Snapsh0t]

So that's mostly good news. He's trying to source a fresh W7 professional disc to reload.
Once its up and running, I can delete all the dross collected over the years, spec a new PC, and start afresh.

I ran off a copy from a downloaded iso and actually used it a few days ago and am enjoying using W7 again (but only on a test PC). I've finished with it now so shout if you need it.

There are a couple of KB files (KB3020369 and KB3172605) that need to be downloaded in advance and installed immediately after the main OS and before the network cable is plugged in. If this is not done W7 will update its updater to a version that doesn't work and you have to start again.

There are then over 200 update files to be downloaded and installed!

 

[seaodyssey]

Get your SIL to change the CMOS battery before he does anything else, It will most likely be a CR2032 which will cost a quid or so from your local Tescos.

He will need to go into the Bios settings and change it back to Legacy setting. Then restart
I have just had this happen to my laptop this weekend and I will need to take it apart to change the battery, Thank you HP for not making it easy.

I have done this so many times while working in a school IT department.

 

[Sangoma]

Get your SIL to change the CMOS battery before he does anything else, It will most likely be a CR2032 which will cost a quid or so from your local Tescos.

He will need to go into the Bios settings and change it back to Legacy setting. Then restart
I have just had this happen to my laptop this weekend and I will need to take it apart to change the battery, Thank you HP for not making it easy.

I have done this so many times while working in a school IT department.

post #19

Looks like he has found the problem and just looking for an OS disc now.

 

[seaodyssey]

post #19

Looks like he has found the problem and just looking for an OS disc now.

He should still change the CMOS Battery and chances are he won't need the OS Disc.

 

[Gav.]

The system crashed while running, that shouldn't be a fault with the battery they are on it anyway

 

[Sangoma]

He should still change the CMOS Battery and chances are he won't need the OS Disc.

Not necessarily, as I suggested in post 19, if he goes into setup, the clock can be checked, as is the battery has failed, it will be wrong.
Windows 7 64 supports UEFI, so what needs to be selected depends on what it was when that windows was installed, it may need to be UEFI and not Legacy.

But all irrelevant now he has someone knowledgable to look at it

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

Think you might find that I do understand I.T.

I simply can't believe that from what you wrote.

Its the same Civil Service that needs to be sorted The Luddites are in charge.

Again, you can't possibly know what you're talking about. I worked at three different departments and the IT staff were as good as at any private or public company.

 

[Cobra]

I ran off a copy from a downloaded iso and actually used it a few days ago and am enjoying using W7 again (but only on a test PC). I've finished with it now so shout if you need it.

There are a couple of KB files (KB3020369 and KB3172605) that need to be downloaded in advance and installed immediately after the main OS and before the network cable is plugged in. If this is not done W7 will update its updater to a version that doesn't work and you have to start again.

There are then over 200 update files to be downloaded and installed!

Cheers Jonathan I appreciate the offer
If he has no luck I'll drop you a pm.

 

[Cobra]

I should have a W7 pro disc, but it will a volume licence (or what ever they called it) so you would need the right key (I don't think an OEM key would work)
Don't know where you are, doubt if you are near me, and it would take forever to up/down load, but if he can't find one I could image it and post it if it is of any help.

Cheers Steve I appreciate the offer and as above I'm in MK btw

 

[lindsay]

Think you might find that I do understand I.T. that's why I made the post, but never mind.

It's got nothing to do with which party I vote for. Its the same Civil Service that needs to be sorted
The Luddites are in charge.

I'll wade in here, with a lifetime of IT experience programming and testing systems in private and public sectors (44 years and counting).
There are definitely some old tech systems out there still running and hard to maintain, but in some cases it's because they just work - I know of one critical national infrastructure system that was first put live in 1974 and is still running, on modern mainframes, because it is still faster and more usable than anything they have tried to replace it with.
OTOH I know of govt departments still using Windows XP machines because the rollout of newer desktops never reached them, or they run local apps that cannot be ported or replaced. Or staff that hated using Chromebooks instead of a fully featured laptop.
In all cases, the biggest problem of all is trying to devise a business case for the replacement: if service won't improve, the whole case is built on risk of failure, and if that can be mitigated, why spend the money?
In the private sector I have seen a reluctance to modernise tech for exactly the same reason, but with bells on.

As to getting eg Google to audit and modernise an organisation, especially government: do you really want to hand critical national infrastructure over to commercial control outside the country? HMG are already deeply dependent on Amazon (for AWS cloud hosting services) and Microsoft (Azure cloud hosting and multifarious software dependencies). Do we really need more offshoring?

 

[Jelster]

My general view is that Apple are great for people who don't know/don't care about how their computer works and don't mind conforming to the Apple way. I've a good friend who is both smart and clever but really just wanted machines that would just get on with doing their stuff, and has never looked back since I encouraged him to buy one. But I think many of us also prefer a little more freedom, and bit more individuality and would rather manage stuff for ourselves.

I have an iMac, a Win10 laptop, and a RPi 400, so have the best of all worlds. I have to say, our 2014 Apple laptop is still going strong. I just prefer how Mac's work. Windows has tried to become like a Mac, and failed in my opinion.

I was building PC's before we had Windows and were working on MS Dos. It's not that I can't or don't understand other systems, I just find the Mac desktop easier to use.

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

There are definitely some old tech systems out there still running and hard to maintain, but in some cases it's because they just work - I know of one critical national infrastructure system that was first put live in 1974 and is still running, on modern mainframes, because it is still faster and more usable than anything they have tried to replace it with.

Exactly so. I've been involved in some grade A cockups caused by "clever new managers" trying to fix what ain't broke!

 

[Faldrax]

I'll wade in here, with a lifetime of IT experience programming and testing systems in private and public sectors (44 years and counting).
There are definitely some old tech systems out there still running and hard to maintain, but in some cases it's because they just work - I know of one critical national infrastructure system that was first put live in 1974 and is still running, on modern mainframes, because it is still faster and more usable than anything they have tried to replace it with.
OTOH I know of govt departments still using Windows XP machines because the rollout of newer desktops never reached them, or they run local apps that cannot be ported or replaced. Or staff that hated using Chromebooks instead of a fully featured laptop.
In all cases, the biggest problem of all is trying to devise a business case for the replacement: if service won't improve, the whole case is built on risk of failure, and if that can be mitigated, why spend the money?
In the private sector I have seen a reluctance to modernise tech for exactly the same reason, but with bells on.

As to getting eg Google to audit and modernise an organisation, especially government: do you really want to hand critical national infrastructure over to commercial control outside the country? HMG are already deeply dependent on Amazon (for AWS cloud hosting services) and Microsoft (Azure cloud hosting and multifarious software dependencies). Do we really need more offshoring?

The biggest issue with such upgrades is that they need to be part of the continuous development of such systems - when each 'upgrade' change is comparatively small and easily managed, but instead such 'maintenance' upgrades are pushed down the line as any gains are hidden from the end users (often there will be a minor gain for the developers, where the newer compiler version makes a few tasks easier / quicker).
So instead of a series of small tasks, when some new functionality is required that is not possible with the old system, the choice becomes between a big upgrade, or making the old system 'legacy' and implementing the new function in a new system fed from the old - both of which are much larger tasks than the set of small updates.

 

[realspeed]

Thunder and lightning here and rain last 2 nights here in East Sussex UK

 

[Tori_T]

Here's the bug in Cobra's system:

 

[lindsay]

The biggest issue with such upgrades is that they need to be part of the continuous development of such systems - when each 'upgrade' change is comparatively small and easily managed, but instead such 'maintenance' upgrades are pushed down the line as any gains are hidden from the end users (often there will be a minor gain for the developers, where the newer compiler version makes a few tasks easier / quicker).
So instead of a series of small tasks, when some new functionality is required that is not possible with the old system, the choice becomes between a big upgrade, or making the old system 'legacy' and implementing the new function in a new system fed from the old - both of which are much larger tasks than the set of small updates.

Whilst that is absolutely true, it is not so straightforward when you are talking about architectural changes or re-platforming, which is what most current transformation projects are about in govt and big companies. Never mind the user change programmes that need to accompany IT transformation, which is often not planned for.

However, back on thread, Cobra is not going to re-platform to Mac or Linux by the look of it and is just looking at probably an overdue upgrade to hardware and OS