I am not inclined towards revolution but...............

Mark Johnson

Mark Johnson

Suspended / Banned
Messages
2,049
Edit My Images
Yes
Revolt.jpg

As one is approaching retirement after 50 years of hard graft, I would give revolution a second thought now..................
 
yes well we don't know the facts fior certain...

but think the daily telegraph wont be too far wrong is my guess....

mj
 
Nice pension if you can get it :) And I bet it is not actually underwritten (if that is the right term) so it is us so coughing up. This is just one civil servant, how many more?
 
dejongj said:
Nice pension if you can get it :) And I bet it is not actually underwritten (if that is the right term) so it is us so coughing up. This is just one civil servant, how many more?
Click to expand...
With pensions that size - you can work it out.

But it'll be in the dozens (if that) considering that the standard terms would allow for 50% of salary after 40 years service, And the average salary of a civil servant is less than £30k - but you know all that, so let's not take this out of proportion.

It's a disgrace:mad: - and not enough public servants are sacked for failure; but then that's the same in many private sector jobs too - a few failed bankers and football managers will make her look like a pauper, and in many ways - that's our money too ;)
 
Phil V said:
With pensions that size - you can work it out.

But it'll be in the dozens (if that) considering that the standard terms would allow for 50% of salary after 40 years service, And the average salary of a civil servant is less than £30k - but you know all that, so let's not take this out of proportion.

It's a disgrace:mad: - and not enough public servants are sacked for failure; but then that's the same in many private sector jobs too - a few failed bankers and football managers will make her look like a pauper, and in many ways - that's our money too ;)
Click to expand...
But we have a choice to spend our money elsewhere, something too few of us actually do.

Oh no, a lot more than dozens, well technically it will still be dozens, 27 dozen to be exact earning more than £150K. Many more on more than £100K. It really isn't that badly paid :)
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa.../file/492289/150K_senior_salaries.csv/preview

And if you prefer a more interactive model, I like data.gov.uk
https://data.gov.uk/organogram/cabinet-office
 
dejongj said:
But we have a choice to spend our money elsewhere, something too few of us actually do.

Oh no, a lot more than dozens, well technically it will still be dozens, 27 dozen to be exact earning more than £150K. Many more on more than £100K. It really isn't that badly paid :)
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa.../file/492289/150K_senior_salaries.csv/preview

And if you prefer a more interactive model, I like data.gov.uk
https://data.gov.uk/organogram/cabinet-office
Click to expand...
She was allegedly on £250k, How many of them?
it seems 2 dozen on more than £240k ;)

Although the highest paid are a bit of a scandal - vanity projects (who'd have guessed)
 
Last edited:
We also have a choice as to where to donate our money to charity. How anyone can justify some of the charities' CEOs salaries is beyond me and that really is was our money!
 
Phil V said:
She was allegedly on £250k, How many of them?
it seems 2 dozen on more than £240k ;)

Although the highest paid are a bit of a scandal - vanity projects (who'd have guessed)
Click to expand...
Well considering that £150K marks the mean for the top 1% of earners I thought that was a pretty good evidence supported link to highlight it is a lot more that have a huge pension pot. But hey if you want to make you point and limit to £240K and above then fair enough. Have it your way. What did you say originally? That I shouldn't take this out of context as the average is £30K. Well funny that as this feels like a role reversal but I think there are still a lot of people who are very well paid.

However I do think they should be paid well to attract the best, unfortunately there is still a lot of promotion beyond capability culture going on. And this bit about jumping a grade or two leading up to retirement.
 
dejongj said:
Well considering that £150K marks the mean for the top 1% of earners I thought that was a pretty good evidence supported link to highlight it is a lot more that have a huge pension pot. But hey if you want to make you point and limit to £240K and above then fair enough. Have it your way. What did you say originally? That I shouldn't take this out of context as the average is £30K. Well funny that as this feels like a role reversal but I think there are still a lot of people who are very well paid.

However I do think they should be paid well to attract the best, unfortunately there is still a lot of promotion beyond capability culture going on. And this bit about jumping a grade or two leading up to retirement.
Click to expand...
You're twisting my response, my original point was that not many are paid close to what she was paid, and my complete guess was quite close. That was my only point, trying to make it something else is a little trite. But we agree about your last point - it's ridiculous to complain that the public sector pays a lot, then demand that they perform well. If we had the choice of 2 jobs and the private sector paid twice as much, then why would anyone work for the public sector?

But as you mentioned it
dejongj said:
£150K marks the mean for the top 1% of earners
Click to expand...
, and you found 324 (ish) earning over £150k (the 1%), I estimate the civil service to be over 400,000 people - interesting that the 1% figure is only about .1% of all civil servants ;)
 
I've never accepted you get the best people when you pay crazy amounts best connected maybe. A private company should be allowed to pay what they like but PLC's and public sector has to have some limits put in imho.
 
Last edited:
dejongj said:
But we have a choice to spend our money elsewhere, something too few of us actually do.

Oh no, a lot more than dozens, well technically it will still be dozens, 27 dozen to be exact earning more than £150K. Many more on more than £100K. It really isn't that badly paid :)
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa.../file/492289/150K_senior_salaries.csv/preview

And if you prefer a more interactive model, I like data.gov.uk
https://data.gov.uk/organogram/cabinet-office
Click to expand...
Nothing to say on the Philip Green thread JP, or are you too busy kicking the public servant.
 
rjbell said:
I've never accepted you get the best people when you pay crazy amounts best connected maybe. A private company should be allowed to pay what they like but PLC's and public sector has to have some limits put in imho.
Click to expand...
It's certainly not a perfect system.
However the principal of rewarding hard work isn't the issue.
 
I like the idea of a percentage above the lowest earner in the company. that way if they want a pay rise everyone gets a pay rise.
 
Last edited:
rjbell said:
I like the idea of a percentage above the lowest earner in the company. that way the if they want a pay rise everyone gets a pay rise.
Click to expand...
Trouble is, there's quite often a few lazy people doing the bare minimum or less. Why should they get rewarded if someone else is working very hard
 
jakeblu said:
Nothing to say on the Philip Green thread JP, or are you too busy kicking the public servant.
Click to expand...
I wasn't actually kicking Lin. Don't know what gave you that idea? What I was kicking is that the pension isn't funded, but that is nothing bad or ill wished towards Lin. As I mentioned as well, they need to be paid well to attract good candidates, and that means also to attract people from outside the civil service, and stop the grade jumping to boost the final salary pension pot.
 
Byker28i said:
Trouble is, there's quite often a few lazy people doing the bare minimum or less. Why should they get rewarded if someone else is working very hard
Click to expand...
Don't use a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

Because it will ensure that those who are working hard will also get a salary increase. There will always be freeloaders, either those who don't do their fair share or those who work the benefit system, but it doesn't mean that everyone has to suffer. Hopefully proper management practices will help weed out those who are not pulling their weight.
 
jakeblu said:
Don't use a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

Because it will ensure that those who are working hard will also get a salary increase. There will always be freeloaders, either those who don't do their fair share or those who work the benefit system, but it doesn't mean that everyone has to suffer. Hopefully proper management practices will help weed out those who are not pulling their weight.
Click to expand...
What if they are the managers?
 
I don't like the idea of external interference within a private company telling anyone what to pay anyone. The organisation should make those decisions themselves based upon how they value their organisation, their staff, what they can afford, and what their own moral compass is that is justifiable to those who work there. It is nobody else's business in my opinion.
 
dejongj said:
I don't like the idea of external interference within a private company telling anyone what to pay anyone. The organisation should make those decisions themselves based upon how they value their organisation, their staff, what they can afford, and what their own moral compass is that is justifiable to those who work there. It is nobody else's business in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Like sports direct you mean?
 
jakeblu said:
Like sports direct you mean?
Click to expand...
One great example of how not to do it. Many thousands, millions of great companies out there. Don't use a sledgehammer to crack a nut ;)
 
dejongj said:
One great example of how not to do it. Many thousands, millions of great companies out there. ;)
Click to expand...
And there are plenty of companies like sports direct too. If left solely to the market to regulate itself then there will be more and more companies like SD.
dejongj said:
Don't use a sledgehammer to crack a nut ;)
Click to expand...
Touché
 
Last edited:
dejongj said:
I don't like the idea of external interference within a private company telling anyone what to pay anyone. The organisation should make those decisions themselves based upon how they value their organisation, their staff, what they can afford, and what their own moral compass is that is justifiable to those who work there. It is nobody else's business in my opinion.
Click to expand...
I did say private companies should be allowed to do what they like. PLC's and public sector should be fair game.
 
Last edited:
rjbell said:
I did say private companies should be allowed to do what they like. PLC's and public sector should be fair game.
Click to expand...
I would say PLC's are responsible to their share holders, and decent shareholders will take well being of the employs as part and parcel of all the due diligence to mitigate the risks of their investments. So no, I wouldn't class PLC's in the same category.
 
dejongj said:
I would say PLC's are responsible to their share holders, and decent shareholders will take well being of the employs as part and parcel of all the due diligence to mitigate the risks of their investments. So no, I wouldn't class PLC's in the same category.
Click to expand...
I've heard cases where shareholders have voted against senior management pay rises and they've gone ahead and given themselves one anyway. If I was a shareholder I'd prefer a happy workfore seeing their wages going up when the big cheese gets one.
 
Last edited:
rjbell said:
I've heard cases where shareholders have voted against senior management pay rises and they've gone ahead and given themselves one anyway. If I was a shareholder I'd prefer a happy workfore seeing their wages going up when the big cheese gets one.
Click to expand...
All depends on the situation. I know one thing though, I would not be happy when a bunch of people with no investment would start interfering with my investment. If they invest, then great, otherwise back off.
 
Byker28i said:
In an ideal world. Rarely happens though
Click to expand...
I know plenty of managers not scared to sack people and one of my mates sons has been sacked loads of times. He is a tit though.
 
Phil V said:
I know plenty of managers not scared to sack people and one of my mates sons has been sacked loads of times. He is a tit though.
Click to expand...
My brother in law works for Three phones network. He's now back in a store as a manager but his job was sacking people. He would cover the South West and just go to stores sacking people. I don't imagine that was 100% of the job but it took up a large percentage of it.
 
Last edited:
Mark Johnson said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-dream-holiday-department-plunged-crisis.html

Does not help her case either..............

Its the pension angle that gets my tits up. Pay the hi fliers well, no problem, but why wrap them up for the rest of their lives. If they paid well, they should be looking after their own future, like me and you...
Click to expand...
You do know she contribute to her pension, yeah, at her salary point its probably 8-9% of her salary, so while she's lucky to be in a final salary scheme, as am I, she still has to contribute.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top