Help on a silhouette idea

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Benbo

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Ben Temperton
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My wife is currently 8 months pregnant and I thought it would be cool to do just a backlit silhouette of her in profile. I was playing around with lighting and came up with this



However, I struggled to achieve the same result with any full body shot.

The kit I have available is a single SB600, a snoot, a 50mm lens and a 18-200mm lens. The shot above was taken using the SB600 snooted around 5ft behind the head, with the camera about the same distance in front, on the same plane.

All attempts at doing a full body shot were either snooted (and thus lighting a small part of the body) or unsnooted in which case light seemed to reflect off the body (me) and light the background and/or splash off the walls.

Any ideas how I could achieve a full body shot with this equipment, or would I need multiple lights to get a silhouette around the whole body?

Many thanks!
 
You don't need multiple lights, although it would make life a bit easier.
All you need is a honeycombed light, so that the light can point more or less towards the lens without spilling where it isn't wanted and without causing flare.
 
Might be worth doing the head and body separate, then joining them in photoshop?
 
This is where my knowledge of lighting falls down, but what would a honeycomb do that a snoot wouldn't? I know they must have different properties, I'm just not sure what those properties are.

With a honeycombed flash, would you just set the flash perpendicular to the target, and aim for the bump to get even light coverage across the body?
 
If the problem is light spilling around the place and filling in the front, and I can see that it might, some bits of black card held to the sides of the flash head with Blu Tak could be used to control that, barn door style.

Experiment with flash to subject distance (longer will give the best outline) and control the beam with the zoom head and black card.

And experiment with exposure levels a bit, maybe go for some under exposure.

Or shoot outside at night ;)
 
HoppyUK said:
If the problem is light spilling around the place and filling in the front, and I can see that it might, some bits of black card held to the sides of the flash head with Blu Tak could be used to control that, barn door style.

Experiment with flash to subject distance (longer will give the best outline) and control the beam with the zoom head and black card.

And experiment with exposure levels a bit, maybe go for some under exposure.

Or shoot outside at night ;)
Click to expand...
Agreed.
This isn't really a silhouette shot as such, a silhouette is simply having all the light behind or on the background (like the so-called 'high key' portraits) but with no light reaching the subject. This is halo lighting with no light on the front of the subject. It will need a fair bit of PS work to get it right, but it's easy to do if the basic lighting is also right.

Benbo This is where my knowledge of lighting falls down, but what would a honeycomb do that a snoot wouldn't? I know they must have different properties, I'm just not sure what those properties are.

With a honeycombed flash, would you just set the flash perpendicular to the target, and aim for the bump to get even light coverage across the body?
Click to expand...
A Snoot controls the spread of light. So do flags, barn doors, honeycombs and spotlights. But honeycombs also control the direction of the light. Imagine shining a light along a tube. The tube will 'train' the light to go in one direction only, and by the time the light emerges from the end of the tube it will only be able to go in that one direction. A honeycomb is simply a tool that consists of hundreds of short tubes. The advantage is that if the honeycombed light is behind the subject pointing more or less towards the camera, none of the light will strike the lens, so there will be no/less risk of lens flare.
Honeycombs are sold in various 'flavours' - I have them ranging from 5 - 45 degrees. 45 degrees provides less control but a bigger circle of light. If for example I use the 5 degree one, the circle of light will be very small but the light direction will be very tightly controlled, and if the lights is at an angle of more than 5 degrees from the axis of the lens then there will be no flare.

So, if a honeycomb is used it can point more or less towards the camera to produce that halo lighting effect without causing flare. A snoot would also create the same effect, but would cause flare.
 
I would get your wife to shave before you take the shot. Oh. wait thats your head in the practice shot:-)

Seriously though, I would try and frame the shot around her as tightly as possible then expand the canvas on photoshop afterwards. That way you only have to worry about the rim lighting around he body and not any stray light reflecting off walls etc. I would do as has been said before, get that flash a good distance away and zoom it in so you have just the coverage you need. Some flags to control the spill should work okay, its just a case of fiddling around to keep the lighting clean.

Good luck.
 
Garry Edwards said:
A Snoot controls the spread of light. So do flags, barn doors, honeycombs and spotlights. But honeycombs also control the direction of the light. Imagine shining a light along a tube. The tube will 'train' the light to go in one direction only, and by the time the light emerges from the end of the tube it will only be able to go in that one direction. A honeycomb is simply a tool that consists of hundreds of short tubes.

So, if a honeycomb is used it can point more or less towards the camera to produce that halo lighting effect without causing flare. A snoot would also create the same effect, but would cause flare.
Click to expand...

Er.. what?

A snoot is also just a tube, so by your own reasoning they 'train' the light to go in one direction only.

Admittedly they're larger than the tubes of a honeycomb, but the effect on light direction is the same.

The only real difference is that a snoot will have a harder, more defined edge to the spot it makes and is more contrasty - it's roughly evenly lit the whole way across and cuts off sharply, whereas a grid or honeycomb makes a spot with a hotspot in the centre and falls off towards the edges.

With either modifier, you can make the beam tighter by making the tubes longer or narrower.
Conversely, making the tubes shorter or wider makes the beam wider and cover a larger area.

Also, for the same reasons, if you have a flash set up with a honeycomb that gives no flare, if you switch to a snoot that gives the same spread of light, you'll still have no flare.
 
thebovrilmonkey said:
Er.. what?

A snoot is also just a tube, so by your own reasoning they 'train' the light to go in one direction only.

Admittedly they're larger than the tubes of a honeycomb, but the effect on light direction is the same.

The only real difference is that a snoot will have a harder, more defined edge to the spot it makes and is more contrasty - it's roughly evenly lit the whole way across and cuts off sharply, whereas a grid or honeycomb makes a spot with a hotspot in the centre and falls off towards the edges.

With either modifier, you can make the beam tighter by making the tubes longer or narrower.
Conversely, making the tubes shorter or wider makes the beam wider and cover a larger area.

Also, for the same reasons, if you have a flash set up with a honeycomb that gives no flare, if you switch to a snoot that gives the same spread of light, you'll still have no flare.
Click to expand...

No. In theory they do a similar job but in practice they don't. In practice, a snoot is far too wide and far too short relative to their width to prevent flare. That's why we use honeycombs
 
Garry Edwards said:
No. In theory they do a similar job but in practice they don't. In practice, a snoot is far too wide and far too short relative to their width to prevent flare. That's why we use honeycombs
Click to expand...

So with a flash behind a subject that completely obscures the flash, you're going to get flare from using a snoot instead of a honeycomb?
Why isn't there any in the photo in the first post?
 
thebovrilmonkey said:
So with a flash behind a subject that completely obscures the flash, you're going to get flare from using a snoot instead of a honeycomb?
Why isn't there any in the photo in the first post?
Click to expand...
With respect, that isn't what I said. If you read my forum posts you'll see that I use words precisely, just as I use light precisely.

What I actually said is
All you need is a honeycombed light, so that the light can point more or less towards the lens without spilling where it isn't wanted and without causing flare.
Click to expand...
and

So, if a honeycomb is used it can point more or less towards the camera to produce that halo lighting effect without causing flare. A snoot would also create the same effect, but would cause flare.
Click to expand...

In the example shot, the light wasn't pointing more or less towards the camera, it was positioned behind the subject and blocked by it, and the only visible light was the light catching the edges/hair/stubble. If the light had been behind/off to each side then flare would almost certainly have been visible, depending on the angle of the light, the angle of the lens and even the type of lens.

Rather than argue about it, why not just try it for yourself? That's how we all learn.

Wayner What about a snoot with a honeycomb grid?
Click to expand...
Yes, that's why many snoots have honeycombs. The only problem with that is that sometimes the light from a snoot is too narrow for the amount of space available and the shot is easier/better with the honeycomb but without the snoot.
 
thebovrilmonkey said:
So with a flash behind a subject that completely obscures the flash, you're going to get flare from using a snoot instead of a honeycomb?
Why isn't there any in the photo in the first post?
Click to expand...

Welcome to TP bovrilmonkey. I can see you are going to be an entertaining contributor :)
 
Garry Edwards said:
Rather than argue about it, why not just try it for yourself? That's how we all learn.
Click to expand...

Well, I'm going to admit that I was indeed wrong.
I got the protractor out and had a quick test - there's about 10 degrees difference between the angles at which my snoot and my honeycomb start causing flare.


However, I would maintain that your comments are not entirely precise, as you've only recently made any mention of moving the flash out from behind the subject to make the honeycomb necessary.
Still, I imagine any further comments on my part are going to be seen as fairly petty and just being argumentative for the sake of it, so I think I'll leave it there.



Benbo, if you're happy spending the time to cut and glue all the parts, these work pretty well..
http://www.instructables.com/id/Black-Straw-Grids-for-the-Vivitar-285HV/
 
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