Has P.C gone to far

the black fox

the black fox

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Just watching the film ,the dam busters on channel 5 .. and they have altered the sound track of guy gibsons dog to TRIGGER .. and also the call sign for a successful dam breach ..


This is not just being P.C correct it’s altering bloody historical facts , how much longer have we got to pamper to this offended rubbish ..makes my blood boil
 
the black fox said:
Just watching the film ,the dam busters on channel 5 .. and they have altered the sound track of guy gibsons dog to TRIGGER .. and also the call sign for a successful dam breach ..


This is not just being P.C correct it’s altering bloody historical facts , how much longer have we got to pamper to this offended rubbish ..makes my blood boil
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Last year it was a disscalimer that it contained racially offensive language or some such thing.. which we all know it doesnt... But yeagh this yr I noticed the change,.. re wound it for the missus as she missed it...

Juts rediculous IMHO and sad to see :(
 
the black fox said:
Just watching the film ,the dam busters on channel 5 .. and they have altered the sound track of guy gibsons dog to TRIGGER .. and also the call sign for a successful dam breach ..


This is not just being P.C correct it’s altering bloody historical facts , how much longer have we got to pamper to this offended rubbish ..makes my blood boil
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I have a vague memory of a recent 'ish showing of Dambusters where they (appropriately) covered the material & language with a 'forewarning notice'.
 
Language changes over time and unfortunately some words and phrases become unacceptable, maybe only for a while.

I remember seeing a map once and the names on it would be thought to be highly offensive these days but at the time they were acceptable and I suppose it's possible that they were even respectul.
 

guy+gibson%27s+dog%27s+grave+stone | Lukol

guy+gibson%27s+dog%27s+grave+stone | Lukol
www.lukol.com www.lukol.com

The dog's name on it's gravestone at RAF Scampton has also been removed. When 617 squadron flew Lossie based Tornados the squadron's Ops call sign was also the never to be used "N" word (eventually changed to Black Dog).
Like it or not, everything associated with 617 sqn is part of British heritage. I do not want any of it erased or altered.

Remember the western movies that masses of people enjoyed. What were the cowboys and indians called. ............. "palefaces and redskins". Just a matter of time until someones wants that muffled out.
 
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the black fox said:
Just watching the film ,the dam busters on channel 5 .. and they have altered the sound track of guy gibsons dog to TRIGGER .. and also the call sign for a successful dam breach ..


This is not just being P.C correct it’s altering bloody historical facts , how much longer have we got to pamper to this offended rubbish ..makes my blood boil
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Cut dialogue in Back To The Future the other day

hypocritical woke cretins
 
the black fox said:
Just watching the film ,the dam busters on channel 5 .. and they have altered the sound track of guy gibsons dog to TRIGGER .. and also the call sign for a successful dam breach ..


This is not just being P.C correct it’s altering bloody historical facts , how much longer have we got to pamper to this offended rubbish ..makes my blood boil
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I was sorry to read this from you as normally you are such a gay chap.

(y)
 
Simple answer? Yes!

It's a bloody disgrace. :mad:
 
Whether people here want to admit it or not, times have changed and that name is extremely offensive to a lot of people.
Changing the name in the film in no way negatively impacts the story, nor denies the heroism involved.
Anger, for the sake of it.
 
Ricardodaforce said:
Whether people here want to admit it or not, times have changed
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When I fllled out the form to volunteer in a local Charity shop, one of the questions was "What did I identify as" and went on to list male female, bi sexual, trans-sexual, gay and a load of other things has no idea what they were !
I replied "human" which apparently made that guy approving the appllication laugh as he had to google them to find out what some meant, I was accepted without having to change anything.
TBH I think a lot of these things cause far more problems, I don't care what people are, if I like them and are ok with me, WTF does it matter
 
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i suspect the main reason for the change was more the times the film went out there are plenty of TV shows that use the F word the C word and the N word also just not at 2pm on a boxing day afternoon.
 
Ricardodaforce said:
Whether people here want to admit it or not, times have changed and that name is extremely offensive to a lot of people.
Changing the name in the film in no way negatively impacts the story, nor denies the heroism involved.
Anger, for the sake of it.
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Until the replacement word becomes offensive and it all has to start again.

Best just ditch the fake outrage (usually from unaffected white people) and scrap the bonus social credit points for achieving victimhood status and all those people just waiting to be offended can find a new hobby.
 
woof woof said:
Best just ditch the fake outrage (usually from unaffected white people) and scrap the bonus social credit points for achieving victimhood status and all those people just waiting to be offended can find a new hobby.
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Or, we could simply accept that for some it is extremely offensive, wear out empathy hat, shrug our shoulders and just move on.
 
jakeblu said:
Or, we could simply accept that for some it is extremely offensive, wear out empathy hat, shrug our shoulders and just move on.
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What's offensive varies so much though with some people / groups freely using offensive language not only within their own social circles but with outsiders too and apparently that's perfectly ok. Only some people are banned from using words and phrases which some others feel is offensive. Who's to know who?

Things change and even when they don't some are offended by what comes to be accepted language. There's a poster on here who doubtless considers himself to be bang on message who repeatedly used POC in one thread, my wife finds this extremely offensive and I believe it is indeed on the way to being unacceptable.

Maybe all this isn't as bad a pronouns but it is likely to be transitory in the scheme of things.

Intent seems very relevant to me but no one seems willing to consider intent. I am sure that there was no intent to insult, belittle or offend in the Dam Busters so why can't people who may feel offended or more likely why can't people who may feel that others may be offended just take a breath, accept that no offence was meant and just move on? Why is it always wider society that has to change to accomodate what is usually a complaint from white saviour activists attempting to speak on behalf of a group that very likely hasn't asked them to?

This is all rhetorical, just things to think about.
 
the black fox said:
Just watching the film ,the dam busters on channel 5 .. and they have altered the sound track of guy gibsons dog to TRIGGER .. and also the call sign for a successful dam breach ..


This is not just being P.C correct it’s altering bloody historical facts , how much longer have we got to pamper to this offended rubbish ..makes my blood boil
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Triggered!
 
This is not aimed at anyone, just a heads up.
Just because no staff have posted up till now, its doesn't mean we haven't been following it.
Maybe some of you missed THIS POST
Everyone, think before you post, and keep it civil.


jakeblu said:
Or, we could simply accept that for some it is extremely offensive, wear out empathy hat, shrug our shoulders and just move on.
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But Steve, You've been around long enough to know that isn't how TP works. :D
 
I know very little about planes and almost nothing about modern military history but......do they actually use the right planes in the film? A teacher of mine swore they had been changed to fit with American sensibilities. In that context, changing the name of a dog hardly spoils the historical accuracy.
 
JonathanRyan said:
I know very little about planes and almost nothing about modern military history but......do they actually use the right planes in the film? A teacher of mine swore they had been changed to fit with American sensibilities. In that context, changing the name of a dog hardly spoils the historical accuracy.
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Real Avro Lancasters!
 
I can understand why such word’s aren’t used in modern times and I don’t believe it ruins the ‘historical context’ either.

If it were a documentary about the dog or squadron then absolutely it should remain intact but it’s a drama based on a historical raid. I’ve seen the film and some of it is embellished for the ‘movies’ so don’t get wound up about the dogs name!
 
Brazo said:
I can understand why such word’s aren’t used in modern times and I don’t believe it ruins the ‘historical context’ either.

If it were a documentary about the dog or squadron then absolutely it should remain intact but it’s a drama based on a historical raid. I’ve seen the film and some of it is embellished for the ‘movies’ so don’t get wound up about the dogs name!
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In any such movie based on real life there will be 'artistic license' but the dog's name is of historical record........so where does historical accuracy end and artistic license begin.

There have been many older movies shown with a disclaimer that 'language of that time...may offend....". Why in broad terms is Dambusters treated differently today compared to even just a couple/few years ago?

FWIW I do find the word offensive....but it was (sadly) of its time!

PS AFAIK the US made movie U571 about the capture of the first Enigma machine by any forces is historically inaccurate.....as British Forces captured the first one but why let a movie and artistic license get in the way of fact ;) NB without drilling down was the submarine one, one of the early Enigma's before the German Navy got wind of that the code may have been broken or the latter Enigma machine with the additional wheel???

PPS the purely fictional movie Shaft IIRC used the 'N' word, so is context all (or not) as the case may be???
Edit ~ movie released in 1971 and the language was used in the trailer here please do not watch if this will offend
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDNqCad6DtI
 
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It is a few years since I last watched the Dambusters, and they had not changed the name of the dog then. I agree that we cannot change history but leaving the name the same tends to distort modern viewing of the film so the discussion is about the use of a word in 1943 rather than the historic raid. When originally viewed in the late 1950's I doubt that many would have noticed the name of the dog but now it is headlines.
 
My aunt and uncle had a black Cocker-Spaniel by the same name back in the sixties. It was a common name for a black dog at the time and was never intended to be (or taken as) offensive.
 
Fire bombing Dresden a city of civilians with no military importance would now be seen as a war crime, ok at the time though.
 
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actually this is a recently uncovered photo from the raid, it appears I was mistaken and the dog was central to bombings and any attempts to change its name in the 1955 film directed by Michael Anderson (who also directed the historically accurate Logan’s Run) starring Michael Redgrave, screenplay by R. C. Sherriff, music by Eric Coates and Leighton Lucas, Gilbert Taylor on special effects photography is obviously an attempt to REWRITE GREAT BRITISH HISTORY

dogs-might-fly-4.jpg
 
tijuana taxi said:
Fire bombing Dresden a city of civilians with no military importance would now be seen as a war crime, ok at the time though.
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It didn’t have to happen, Hitler had the option to stop the war. We didn’t. Important difference.

Plus this was total war. No such things as civilians. Only bomb makers, fuel distributors, army caterers etc etc
 
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Ricardodaforce said:
As you have seen here, white men get offended being called white men by a white man.
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It seems that the problem is white men using unapproved words to describe others. However if you have a different skin then it's open season.
 
Brazo said:
It didn’t have to happen, Hitler had the option to stop the war. We didn’t. Important difference.

Plus this was total war. No such things as civilians. Only bomb makers, fuel distributors, army caterers etc etc
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I have seen recent analysis which suggested that, while the raid had no military value and should not have happened, Bomber Harris was following his previous orders and no one thought to tell him to stop.

Dave
 
Dave Canon said:
I have seen recent analysis which suggested that, while the raid had no military value and should not have happened, Bomber Harris was following his previous orders and no one thought to tell him to stop.

Dave
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It was a bit more complicated than that it was a favour for Stallin but that’s a whole other story!
 
The whole point is as far as possible at the time the film was historically pretty accurate , real lancasters , actual footage of the bouncing bombs being tested , the dog existed , it’s name existed ,it was used as the coded word for success of the mission .. let those offended remember if it wasn’t for the likes of guy Gibson and the crews we would possibly be living under the nazis today
. It’s not fictional so should not be altered to appease a few dogooders , very often slang terms used in the context of race ,creed or religion only offend if being used directly against a individual . And if your on the receiving end it’s fairly easy to assess whether it’s meant as a general term or being used to degrade you .. it’s then up to the individual to decide on what action to take .
 
The reason that the dogs name has been changed is nothing about being woke it is about the media types are now trying to push the belief that the English were less racist than the Germans when we all know the opposite is true. Even the royals supported Hitler then.
 
the black fox said:
The whole point is as far as possible at the time the film was historically pretty accurate , real lancasters , actual footage of the bouncing bombs being tested , the dog existed , it’s name existed ,it was used as the coded word for success of the mission .. let those offended remember if it wasn’t for the likes of guy Gibson and the crews we would possibly be living under the nazis today
. It’s not fictional so should not be altered to appease a few dogooders , very often slang terms used in the context of race ,creed or religion only offend if being used directly against a individual . And if your on the receiving end it’s fairly easy to assess whether it’s meant as a general term or being used to degrade you .. it’s then up to the individual to decide on what action to take .
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It sounds like you have been on the receiving end of hate. Sorry to hear that, are you willing to say what it was? (Assuming it was a general term and not being used to degrade you)
 
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