Hamiltons penatly fair?

[Yv]

There is also an argument floating around that after the incident, Kimi's running wide onto the grippier outside of the circuit runoff a few corners later, catching him right back up to LH was deliberate and therefore also illegal.

As for permanent Stewards, they had one, Tony Scott-Adams, who lasted 1 season then left very abruptly, for reasons never fully explained. One has to wonder if his idea of 'fair and consistent' differed to what was expected by his paymasters.


As for MikeyB's comments, whilst I can see where he is coming from, a few laps in a fast car on a dampening circuit with someone racing him might just help him understand the circumstances a little better. Had LH have brake harder from where he was, the most likely scenario would have been a massive accident, probably taking kimi out too. He couldn't actually do anyhting BUT take to the escape route he did. Remember he was already alongside, indeed had his nose infront as the came though the first apex of the chicane - previous examples of such rulings say that once a car is fully alongside, you have to give them room, kimi didn't. LH did give him the place back, it was good hard racing from both guys in worsening considitions and the stewards should be ashamed of themselves for this sorry episode.

 

[Nod]

^^^
WSS

LH had 3 options;

#1 Lift off completely - result, rear lock up and plough into KR.
#2 Brake hard - result, see above.
#3 Cut the chicane THROUGH THE ESCAPE ROAD PROVIDED FOR JUST SUCH AN EVENTUALITY then allow KR past - result, get butt****ed by the stewards.


As an aside, does anyone know a bookmaker well enough to ask if F1 is though to be as crooked in those circles as it now seems to be to the man-on-the-street?

 

[parish]

in the drivers briefings they are instructed to give a place back fully if it is necessary to cut a corner on a chicane. To me, fully means allow the other car to get back in front completely not partially which is what Lewis did.

How do you define "fully"? Hamilton let Kimi back on one side, then switched sides and re-passed him on the other so he was clearly fully behind him in order to do that.

 

[mikeyb]

Sadly, your argument is tainted by a lack of understanding of the rules of F1. You are fully entitled to think Hamilton was at fault, but your reasons do not justify that belief. However you look at it, Raikkonen squeezed Hamilton off the track at the second apex.

Here is an extract on the rules of overtaking in Formula 1:

The FIA Formula One World Championship Sporting Regulations cover overtaking under "incidents":

"Incident means any occurrence or series of occurrences involving one or more drivers, or any action by any driver, which is reported to the stewards by the race director (or noted by the stewards and referred to the race director for investigation) which:

- caused an avoidable collision;
- forced a driver off the track;
- illegitimately prevented a legitimate overtaking manoeuvre by a driver;
- illegitimately impeded another driver during overtaking.

The stewards may impose a 10 second time penalty on any driver involved in an Incident."

This quite clearly bans using physical contact to overtake and prohibits blocking a driver attempting to overtake. That second point applies directly to Raikkonen's actions through the corner in question. Taking the racing line is not a defence. The cars were side by side going into the corner (the first bend) and in fact Hamilton was arguably slightly ahead. Both cars applied brakes, and during the move around the second apex, Raikkonen clearly edged across Hamilton's line forcing him off the track in order to avoid a collision.
In doing so, he:

- forced a driver off the track (Hamilton)
- illegitimately prevented a legitimate overtaking manoeuvre by a driver (Hamilton was perfectly entitled to overtake on the inside since entering the corner the cars were level, or Hamilton was slightly ahead on the outside)
- illegitimately impeded another driver during overtaking (Raikkonen could, and should have given Hamilton the space on the inside to turn the corner with him)...

Everything the happened after the initial incident is irrelevant to an extend as it was a result of illegal driving by Raikkonen. Even so, Hamilton applied the letter of the law in respect of surrendering the lead he had gained by using the escape lane in so far as his car moved from Raikkonen's left, across behind him (impossible to do unles you've allowed the car to get back in front of you) and over to his right where he (again legitemately) overtook Raikkonen on the inside to regain the lead. Nowhere in the rules does it say that you have to allow the car to get a certain distance ahead of you before you challenge again...

I'm not knocking Raikkonen's driving since it made for an extremely exciting finish to a tight race, but I absolutely do not condone the decision to penalise Hamilton. It's a rediculous decision which hopefully will not affect Hamilton winning the championship this year should he continue to drive as well as he has been.

What's an Apex?

I bow to your greater knowledge I was only looking at the vid and openly admit to knowing **** all about the rules.... rules eh, that's maybe why the sport has become sooooo boring.

I hope Hamilton does get the result overturned but it's a sad day when it needs lawyers and the like to sort out sporting results, not that I am implying lawyers in this case but you know what I mean.

I have looked at the video again and I see where I've gone wrong, Hamilton's car isn't the bright red one, I thought HE was on the outside coming to the first apex thingymacallit, oh well you live and learn.

Mike.

 

[Battlestar]

Am i the only one that thinks that maybe Hamilton WAS in the wrong.

Ok he had to CUT the chicane, no doubt about that. But after that he seemed to stay very close to the racing line, and stayed hard on the throttle. This meant that Kimi had to go round Hamilton to a certain degree. The fact that Hamilton was still fast and close to the racing line meant that he then had an ideal position to out brake Kimi on the next corner.

Hamilton should have stayed behind Kimi for a bit longer after letting him pass (Hamilton has got the better car and would have past him anyway) OR made a more obvious movement to let Kimi past on the straight.

I can't really say much on this particular occasion because as an Italian you guys would crucify me on this.

And all of you are all still sore about last year's occurrence where McLaren was proven to steal inside info's from Ferrari and the decision taken back then. ANYTHING Ferrari does now would be wrong in your eyes. I would do the same the other way!

But I certainly agree with many of you who argue the Ecclestone band should give way to something new. For the sake of F1

 

[G2EWS]

Hi All,

This just goes to show the stewards have got it totally wrong and have obviously been pressured from somewhere?

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70443

Regards

Chris

 

[CaptainPenguin]

That has got to be one of the most biased and disgusting decisions in the history of the FIA's poor decision list.

Hamilton was forced off into the run-off area, came back ahead of Kimi and then yeilded the place back.


It just goes to show that Ferrari being nice and quiet and never saying a bad word about the FIA pays off in the end.

Hamilton drove a blinding final 5 laps and coped with the changing conditions better than Kimi - end of story.

And Nikki Lauda has said exactly the same thing

 

[tjc]

I can only agree with everything that`s been said...

As a McLaren man myself I`m gutted. What was wrong with anything that Hamilton did???

It`s a FARCE!

That penalty is just rediculous!!!

:thumbsdown:

 

[will69]

Am i the only one that thinks that maybe Hamilton WAS in the wrong.

Ok he had to CUT the chicane, no doubt about that. But after that he seemed to stay very close to the racing line, and stayed hard on the throttle. This meant that Kimi had to go round Hamilton to a certain degree. The fact that Hamilton was still fast and close to the racing line meant that he then had an ideal position to out brake Kimi on the next corner.

Hamilton should have stayed behind Kimi for a bit longer after letting him pass (Hamilton has got the better car and would have past him anyway) OR made a more obvious movement to let Kimi past on the straight.

How could LH have been "hard on the throttle" and behind KR?

This was a good old fashioned racing incident that should have been treated as such .... the FIA have done nothing but harm to the sport.

 

[Smiffy]

And all of you are all still sore about last year's occurrence where McLaren was proven to steal inside info's from Ferrari and the decision taken back then.

A wind up??? :shrug::shrug::shrug:

I'm a big F1 fan and it's great to see a British driver challenging for the title.
If McLaren were guilty as charged, then they deserved everything that was thrown at them. What's done is done, and they paid the penalty.
But this incident on Sunday was completely different, and a total farce.
If Kimi had finished the race in second place, then maybe (maybe) I could see a reason for this controversy......I still wouldn't agree with it but could see a reason for it.
The fact the Kimi didn't even finish the race due in no fault at all to what had gone on beforehand???
The whole thing stinks......
When the incident happened on Sunday I (along with millions of others I suspect) was on the edge of my seat. This was F1 as we used to know it, and it was great TV. When Lewis got in front of Kimi by going "off track" I was shouting at him to give the lead back to Kimi, as I knew he would get penalised if he didn't. He must have heard me...

As far as I (and again millions of others) are concerned he did nothing wrong. If the situation had been the other way round, and Kimi had done the same as Lewis, I would be on his side.
It's just a shame that all the rules and regulations that go to make up this great sport are ruining it for the spectator.
Oh for the days when they just let the guys out there to race without all the bloody politics.

 

[Caledonia]

I think this quote from Martin Whitmarsh, sums it up for me.

"From the pit wall, we then asked Race Control to confirm that they were comfortable that Lewis had allowed Kimi to repass, and they confirmed twice that they believed that the position had been given back in a manner that was 'okay'.

"If Race Control had instead expressed any concern regarding Lewis's actions at that time, we would have instructed Lewis to allow Kimi to repass for a second time."

It shows that McLaren were not 100% sure and so asked for confirmation, which was given, twice. I have no doubt that with the pace Hamilton was showing compared to Raikkonen, he could have allowed Kimi to pass again by a couple of car lengths and still get by him in no time at all.

But if Race Control confirm twice that the move was OK, then, why should he.

So although it is in the rules that a drive through penalty, given by the stewards, cannot be appealed against. Surely they have a case, not against the stewards but against Race Control, who are FIA representatives.

After all Race Control are there to control the race, they and not the stewards decide on almost all safety issues during the race, wether to stop the race, bring out the safety car, what flags should be waved etc. Is all down to Race Control.

All the teams are in direct contact with Race Control throughout the race and, as far as I am aware, not with the stewards. So naturally this would be their first contact.

This I think backs up Jackie Stewart's statement asking for permanant stewards appointed by the FIA to attend al GP's, at the moment the whims of the stewards seems to be totally random from country to country and racetrack to racetrack.

Still seething :annoyed::annoyed::annoyed:

 

[spannerdude]

A wind up??? :shrug::shrug::shrug:

I'm a big F1 fan and it's great to see a British driver challenging for the title.
If McLaren were guilty as charged, then they deserved everything that was thrown at them. What's done is done, and they paid the penalty..

I've got a stable full of Italian cars so it would be hard for anyone to prove I'm biased against Ferrari
But all McLaren were guilty of last year was opening their e-mail. The only people who were proven to have used the ill gotten dossier were Alonso and De La Rosa, who both got off completely unscathed.

 

[Comfortably Numb]

I've got a stable full of Italian cars so it would be hard for anyone to prove I'm biased against Ferrari
But all McLaren were guilty of last year was opening their e-mail. The only people who were proven to have used the ill gotten dossier were Alonso and De La Rosa, who both got off completely unscathed.

Also, most interestingly, all charges against Nigel Stepney were dropped after he claimed he "knew where Ferrari's secrets were buried"!

He had all but admitted sending the info, there was no shortage of evidence against him but the FIA decided he had no case to answer...spooky:rules:

 

[Jelster]

Hamilton's having his car painted red for the next GP, just in case....

Steve

 

[Battlestar]

A wind up??? :shrug::shrug::shrug:

Yes! :razz:

Oh for the days when they just let the guys out there to race without all the bloody politics.

Absolutely right!


Now for FIA to decide .... again!

 

[nilagin]

Hamilton's having his car painted red for the next GP, just in case....

Steve

Ferrari would probably claim McLaren stole the idea off their car, from last years fiasco, if they did.

 

[Battlestar]

Unfortunately people have short memories.

How many remember that Schumacher's first championship was only won after deliberately running into Hill ?:shake:

Funny, everybody remembers this which happened MANY moons ago, but everyone has forgotten Hamilton running in the back of Kimi IN THE PITLANE?

I understand and really uphold patriotism (like I like to see Ferrari and Ducati win), but a short memory ...!

 

[Foggy]

Funny, everybody remembers this which happened MANY moons ago, but everyone has forgotten Hamilton running in the back of Kimi IN THE PITLANE?

I understand and really uphold patriotism (like I like to see Ferrari and Ducati win), but a short memory ...!

That wasnt a season winning incident though was it?

I think he also paid the price pretty heavily and don't think he would have done it by choice.

 

[nilagin]

Funny, everybody remembers this which happened MANY moons ago, but everyone has forgotten Hamilton running in the back of Kimi IN THE PITLANE?

I understand and really uphold patriotism (like I like to see Ferrari and Ducati win), but a short memory ...!

No one has forgotten it, a fair penalty in the circumstatnces. M
He messed up he was penalised.
Onboard footage from Kimi and Lewis of the last few laps, which we never got to see on the TV.
http://www.f1sa.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=6461&Itemid=219
If you watch closely, Kimi breaks lots of regs. and doesn't rectify one of them. Lewis breaks a couple and rectifies them both.
Kimi forced Lewis off track at the chicane, against regs. Lewis has to cut the chicane and although not his fault hands the place back.
Lewis has very little chance to slip stream Kimi, he holds the line and Kimi weaves across his path. Kimi weaves twice when watching the TV footage. Against the regs, you're only allowed to weave once to defend a position.
Kimi overtook Lewis when they came upon Rosberg rejoining the track, this was under waved yellows which was visible on the TV footage as they approached the bend. Kimi did not hand the place back having forced Lewis off track yet again, although this manouvre was to avoid the collision with Rosberg. But he should have handed back the position all the same.
Both Lewis and Kimi ran wide on a bend due to lack of grip on a wet track.
Lewis rejoins the track from the run off area asap. The run off area has more grip than the track to help cars slow down and not crash. Kimi however drives down almost the full length of the run off area at the side of the track allowing him to gain time. The regs. state that a driver can use the track only not the run off areas.
A lot of people in F1 are right in what they are saying that this decision has made it look bad on Ferrari and the FIA and strengthened peoples views that they are in colusion to beat McLaren at whatever cost.
McLaren asked the race director twice during the closing stages of the race if Lewis' handing back the position was satisfactory and both times they were told he had acted properly.

 

[russdaz]

Lets just ban racing full stop, what Kimi done on that chicane isnt any different to any-one would have done, Hamilton has done excatly the same to Massa, Kimi, Alsono his own team mate this season at various different tracks. Kimi still had the racing line for the chicane, for example Hamilton in Germany went up the inside of Kimi (or possibly Massa) kept the racing line forcing the Ferrari wide on the exit, thats racing.

I still think that if Hamilton had waited one more corner before getting past he'd have been left alone. As it stood he had the racing line for much longer down the straight, would have better traction as a result into the braking area, and possible more speed then if he had followed Kimi through the chichane on the normal line. It was only a matter of time unfortunantly until Hamilton would have easily got past, id dare even say it on the approach to corner up the top of the hill, that Ferrari was a pig in those conditions.

As for Kimi passing under a yellow flag, wake up Hamilton was well off the track, you'l find under those conditions theres nothing to stop this, something that Kimi was cought out on before in France one year himself, infact even worse for him as the safety car was out then too so he went from first to last, if Kimi was wrong for maybe being too fast then soo was Hamilton, because if he slowed enough to need to runn of on to the grass to avoid the spinning car then he was dangerious driving to. Maybe they both should have 10 place grid drop next race for that one? Hamilton has also used that to his favour last year too.

As for using the run off to get better traction, you'l see Hamilton also run of the track many times too, again maybe both drivers get a 10 place grid drop too. but again i remember a Mclearn using the run off in Germany to over take M Schumacher in the Ferrari to win the race, that was in dry conditions and upsolutely nothing was said then, not even a protest was made.

Race director is just one man, they dicided to have stewards to dicide these things, so although the director may have been happy its actually not the directors choice, the sport decided as a whole they wanted these dicesion to be made by more then one person to keep them fair. Now i do think and always have thought it should be an elected board that follows the sport, to prevent bias to any-one i.e French being bias to french cars, Italy being bias to Italian, English to English.

As for the pitlane thingy in spain all teams push the rules to the max, i have seen far closer things happen in the past including Coultard and Hill to name just a few that have been released into the paths of cars forcing them to have brake where nothing has been done. Infact some of the teams didnt have any objections to that incident,

I think threads like this just show how very boring the whole sport is at the moment, there is only really a couple of points worth debating through the whole season so far.

 

[whiteflyer]

Go back to the days when the run offs were soft sand or grass, make sure that if you leave the race track you lose time, the idea is to follow the track not keep cutting corners, your supposed to slow down for a corner not just say ****** this I'll just keep my foot down and cut the corner, I'd be in favour of a 24" concrete wall round the edge of every track.

 

[neo2810]

Thanks for that, excellent viewing and it clearly confirms what I was saying. LH outbraked Kimi twice to overtake him and Kimi impeded him both time, unsuccessfully at the second. As a result, LH gets penalised???

 

[russdaz]

Go back to the days when the run offs were soft sand or grass, make sure that if you leave the race track you lose time, the idea is to follow the track not keep cutting corners, your supposed to slow down for a corner not just say ****** this I'll just keep my foot down and cut the corner, I'd be in favour of a 24" concrete wall round the edge of every track.

Couldnt agree more on that point, they sight driver safety for doing it, yeah right, give them a safety net to recover if it goes wrong. Get rid, make any pay for getting wrong by not finishing, it may even have forced both of them to make a pit stop for the right tyres, or just drive slower to within the limits,

Personally at the end i think they were both driving like complete idiots on them slicks, an acident waiting to happen.

The other thing about tarmac run offs, as good as they may be at time to slow down cars, they useless at slowing fallen riders on bikes.

 

[Jimmy_Lemon]

Personally at the end i think they were both driving like complete idiots on them slicks, an acident waiting to happen.

Yeah because all the cars going into the pits on the last lap would really have made that an exciting race

As for the run off areas I think it makes it much fairer, the amount of times someone messing up somewhere like Monaco and messing up so many other peoples races is high, granted it can still happen with these big run off areas, but at least it means the cars can carry on and actually have a race.

 

[russdaz]

Has there been an exciting race then in the last couple years?

The odd lap of drama seems abit it.

Both where well over the limits of the cars, by a long way, both where simply too fast for those conditions, in awat it just become who was the luckist not to hit the wall. At the end of the day the drivers are not affraid to push past these levels as they now if there cought out its tarmac they can rejoin.

Mr senna was very good at driving on the wrong tyres, but knowing if he'd push it too far he be out, both Hamilton and Kimi would have been out of the race back then due to gravel traps, wheres the skill in being lucky?

 

[rookies]

I honestly think the Penalty for Lewis is WRONG..... As said Race control gave the clear... although if lewis backed off by a few more sec i think he still would of won the race head on....

Why did Massa did not get a penalty for the pit lane drama i know nothing happened but could of..

Are the Red car back handing the judge with some cash....

 

[Smiffy]

Are the Red car back handing the judge with some cash....

I think his wife and two kids all drive Fiat Puntos

 

[rookies]

So.... Who think the judge will lift the penalty then?????

 

[bookwyse]

Has there been an exciting race then in the last couple years?

The odd lap of drama seems abit it.

Both where well over the limits of the cars, by a long way, both where simply too fast for those conditions, in awat it just become who was the luckist not to hit the wall. At the end of the day the drivers are not affraid to push past these levels as they now if there cought out its tarmac they can rejoin.

Mr senna was very good at driving on the wrong tyres, but knowing if he'd push it too far he be out, both Hamilton and Kimi would have been out of the race back then due to gravel traps, wheres the skill in being lucky?

Agreed,Senna, Mansell and Piquet would all have outdriven Hamilton and Kimi in those conditions as they knew the limits of the cars and didnt have the luxury of the hard run off's.

At the enbd of the day there is nothing we can say or do that will change what has happened though!

 

[Battlestar]

This is now turning into a "knock Italian" thread and not worth pusuing anymore. Thanks for the fun. :shake:

FIA will judge whenever, and whoever was ACTUALLY (not OPINIONATEDLY) wrong will be judged accordingly.

 

[apkent]

The fact is though, that this 'decision' has done major damage to the sport.

Whether or not Hamilton gained an advantage, he appeared to correct his illegal overtake and gave us a thrilling end to the race. Indeed if he did gain an advantage it was so minor as to not matter IMO,

The damage done however means that in future races drivers will have to play well inside the boundaries to safeguard a position, rather than battling for that extra position as they should.

I also struggle to understand why people think that run-off areas damage the sport, they're there for the drivers and spectators safety and to allow a margin of error - we all saw what happened to Sutil at Monaco when Raikonnen could do nothing but smash into the back of him ruining his best race of the season.

 

[neo2810]

Has there been an exciting race then in the last couple years?

Quite a few if you're a true F1 fan...

Both where well over the limits of the cars, by a long way, both where simply too fast for those conditions, in awat it just become who was the luckist not to hit the wall. At the end of the day the drivers are not affraid to push past these levels as they now if there cought out its tarmac they can rejoin.

Mr senna was very good at driving on the wrong tyres, but knowing if he'd push it too far he be out, both Hamilton and Kimi would have been out of the race back then due to gravel traps, wheres the skill in being lucky?

That's probably the most rediculous thing I've read so far in this thread (and this applies to the quote below as well). Where in the last 20 laps did you see Lewis ever lose control?? He was pushed off the road by Kimi, and then turned off again to avoid a collision with another spinner. Apart from one or two little wobbles (which happen even the dry since they have no traction control) he drove a majestic last 5 laps in extremely difficult and changing driving conditions.

Agreed,Senna, Mansell and Piquet would all have outdriven Hamilton and Kimi in those conditions as they knew the limits of the cars and didnt have the luxury of the hard run off's.

At the enbd of the day there is nothing we can say or do that will change what has happened though!

Apart from Senna, who is the only driver I hold in as high regard as Lewis, no one in the last 20 years has come close to the showing the raw skill and determination to win that Lewis Hamilton is showing right now. Mansell, Piquet, Schumacher... None of them were as good (bring on the flame )

 

[russdaz]

Agreed,Senna, Mansell and Piquet would all have outdriven Hamilton and Kimi in those conditions as they knew the limits of the cars and didnt have the luxury of the hard run off's.

At the enbd of the day there is nothing we can say or do that will change what has happened though!

Can name a few more too, i think the drivers have found it a bit of culture shock losing TC, and thank god they have.

This is now turning into a "knock Italian" thread and not worth pusuing anymore. Thanks for the fun. :shake:

FIA will judge whenever, and whoever was ACTUALLY (not OPINIONATEDLY) wrong will be judged accordingly.

Me i am a Ferrari fan have been for aslong as i can remember, even the other drivers from articals on different websites agree that Hamilton gained an advantage that he didnt fully hand back, and that he should have made the overtake another corner futher down.

It pains me to say it the Ferrari (or there current drivers) are not upto racing fully on those condition's, Hamilton would have gotten him at some point.

Weather the ultimate punishment fits the crime i still not 100% on, but what else can you do to try and force to keep the guys racing properly on the track, and get this oh if i make a mistake its ok i have a tarmac runoff there. You simply can not run right around the outside of a car into that chicane, even other drivers have said that, you need the inside line there.

Just hope Ferrari fully support Massa to win the champ Kimi in my opinion dosnt deserve it this year.

 

[russdaz]

Quite a few if you're a true F1 fan...



That's probably the most rediculous thing I've read so far in this thread (and this applies to the quote below as well). Where in the last 20 laps did you see Lewis ever lose control?? He was pushed off the road by Kimi, and then turned off again to avoid a collision with another spinner. Apart from one or two little wobbles (which happen even the dry since they have no traction control) he drove a majestic last 5 laps in extremely difficult and changing driving conditions.

Some body here hasnt been watching the onboard video then have they from Kimi's car?

Wasnt ever played on the tv, but is availalbe via a website, go view then tell me Hamilton did not spin.

 

[nilagin]

Lets just ban racing full stop, what Kimi done on that chicane isnt any different to any-one would have done, Hamilton has done excatly the same to Massa, Kimi, Alsono his own team mate this season at various different tracks. Kimi still had the racing line for the chicane.

As for Kimi passing under a yellow flag, wake up Hamilton was well off the track, you'l find under those conditions theres nothing to stop this, something that Kimi was cought out on before in France one year himself, infact even worse for him as the safety car was out then too so he went from first to last, if Kimi was wrong for maybe being too fast then soo was Hamilton, because if he slowed enough to need to runn of on to the grass to avoid the spinning car then he was dangerious driving to. Maybe they both should have 10 place grid drop next race for that one? Hamilton has also used that to his favour last year too.

As for using the run off to get better traction, you'l see Hamilton also run of the track many times too, again maybe both drivers get a 10 place grid drop too. but again i remember a Mclearn using the run off in Germany to over take M Schumacher in the Ferrari to win the race, that was in dry conditions and upsolutely nothing was said then, not even a protest was made.

Race director is just one man, they dicided to have stewards to dicide these things, so although the director may have been happy its actually not the directors choice, the sport decided as a whole they wanted these dicesion to be made by more then one person to keep them fair. Now i do think and always have thought it should be an elected board that follows the sport, to prevent bias to any-one i.e French being bias to french cars, Italy being bias to Italian, English to English.

As for the pitlane thingy in spain all teams push the rules to the max, i have seen far closer things happen in the past including Coultard and Hill to name just a few that have been released into the paths of cars forcing them to have brake where nothing has been done. Infact some of the teams didnt have any objections to that incident,

Kimi wasn't on the racing line for the chicane as he entered from the middle of the track unlike Lewis who entered from the left. The nearest that Kimi had to the racing line was being inside Lewis nearer the kerb, but Lewis was in front. Because Kimi entered at the wrong angle He wouldn't have been able to approach the next apex at the racing line angle.

The only reason drivers don't get penalised for forcing others over the kerbs is because it would spoil the racing. If a driver keeps repeating the move through out a race however he will be investigated and probably penalised.

When Lewis took evasive action to avoid Rosberg he was on the kerb, not off track, if anything he was giving room to an out of control Kimi who was trying desperately to slow down. The position of Kimis car prevented Lewis from driving on the track and forced him onto the grass.

When Lewis hit a wet spot in the braking area for a bend he was forced to take the run off area but rejoined the track straight away. Kimi hit the same wet spot, ran onto the run off area but then proceeded to drive almost the full length of the run off area before rejoining. In doing so he more than halved the gap between himself and Lewis before the bend. Thus gaining an unfair advantage.

I'm not saying Kimi should have been penalised for his indiscretions. But Lewis has been penalised for something caused by Kimi breaking a regulation.

The Race Director may be one man but he knows the regs. and would be aware if someone has done something wrong or not, whats more he is there to advise the race stewards also.

As far as the Pit Lane incident with Massa, There is no provision in the regs. for a fine as a penalty, only a stop go, drive through or if it occurs during the last 5 laps a 25 second penalty. The 10 place deficit on the next race if the driver doesn't finish the race. Yet the stewards having decided to hold the inquiry into the incident then issue a penalty which doesn't appear in the regs.

With inconsistencies such as this, people can't help but think there is favouritism for Ferrari from the FIA.

 

[neo2810]

Some body here hasnt been watching the onboard video then have they from Kimi's car?

Wasnt ever played on the tv, but is availalbe via a website, go view then tell me Hamilton did not spin.

Russ.. youre seeing what you want to see. He didnt spin, end of. I'm not starting an arguement with you since you're a self confessed Ferrari fan and apart from being completely biased towards the red, your agruments so far have lacked so much substance it's almost not worth the effort.

I don't support a car, I support the drivers I want to support regardless of which car they drive. Therefore I couldn't give a flying **** for all the constructor politics... A driver has been penalised unfairly, and that's the way it is.

 

[nilagin]

Russ.. youre seeing what you want to see. He didnt spin, end of. I'm not starting an arguement with you since you're a self confessed Ferrari fan and apart from being completely biased towards the red, your agruments so far have lacked so much substance it's almost not worth the effort.

I don't support a car, I support the drivers I want to support regardless of which car they drive. Therefore I couldn't give a flying **** for all the constructor politics... A driver has been penalised unfairly, and that's the way it is.

The only time Lewis spun was at the start of the race which allowed Kimi to overtake him.

 

[neo2810]

The only time Lewis spun was at the start of the race which allowed Kimi to overtake him.

Yes, I guess I should have clarified I was referring to the last 5 laps as per my previous post.

 

[nilagin]

Yes, I guess I should have clarified I was referring to the last 5 laps as per my previous post.

I guessed that. I've watched all the on board footages I can find, all the same but of slightly different length, and no spin in the last 5 laps.

 

[Matt Sayle]

Clciky