Grey Imports - What are our current feeling?

[Deleted sulking member 63079]

Surely two issues are being conflated here? I have always thought "grey" does not equal not tax evasion or smuggling - which is clearly wrong. It means it is sourced from somewhere other than the official country of sale distributor - which is clearly not.

Lots of companies and traders - irrespective of where they source their goods - don't pay enough tax either legally or otherwise. The law. needs to be tightened re large scale corporate tax avoidance Smugglers and tax thieves steal from the rest of us and no amount of rationalisation about the ethics of government will change that. They should be prosecuted. Annoyingly, they are often the type of hypocritical freeloaders who complain about "benefit scroungers" etc. Unfortunately it is widespread. Do you use Vodafone? BT? How's your local plumber? Do you get a VAT invoice from him?

Back to grey. In any country, the official distributor is only a group set up by the manufacturer to deal with their business there. It enables them to carry out operations locally while at the same time charging a premium to cover repairs, admin etc. This is a private arrangement by the company. If you choose to step outside this protected network, you're on your own, but you're most certainly not a criminal or immoral: well, except in internet forums!

Two examples.

In the UK, HDEW are a grey importer with a physical building in the UK. You can go there, you can speak to them on the phone etc. They support a local football team and they give you a VAT receipt. They aren't shady operators hiding in the shadows fiddling their taxes. They're a local UK business. Support them.

In the US B&H or Adorama advertise (or used to, I haven't looked lately) two choices when purchasing: you can either buy "official" goods sourced via the distributor or "gray". The latter are cheaper but don't carry manufacturers back up. These shops aren't criminals either.

Don't drink the corporate Kool Aid. You pays your money and you take your choices. What's the big deal?

HDEW do not give you a valid VAT receipt. The VAT number doesn't match the company you've paid.

 

[gramps]

HDEW do not give you a valid VAT receipt. The VAT number doesn't match the company you've paid.

and from their T&C's...

HDEW Cameras As Agent​

When you buy a product from our website, you are buying direct from our supplier.
HDEW Cameras will act as an agent between you and the supplier and your contract will be directly with them. The name and contact details of the supplier will be provided on your invoice.

If you come to collect the product from our UK premises or you are a business requiring UK vat supply then you can request this service and buy from HDEW Cameras. Further details are listed below under Intellectual Property Rights.

INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS.

Please note that by making a purchase on this website you will be acting as the importer of the product for all purposes including all customs regulations, copyright and trademark laws.You accept that the role of HDEW Cameras is limited to sourcing products and making them available for you to import directly from the country of origin.By purchasing a product through this website you authorise us to make arrangements for clearance of customs on your behalf for the products you have ordered.

Italics mine.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

eBay pays them - they collect the duty and pass it to the relevant authorities.

If you've bought stuff from oversea's on eBay you'll understand.

Imported Low price items are not subject to vat collection.
Duty is only chargeable on certain items. But it is very complex.Still digital cameras are mostly not.
You can Check the actual categories on HMRC. Cine cameras are dutyable.
Unlike vat, duty rates are usually very low, but can be boosted by an anti dumping surcharge.

I have bought lots of stuff from overseas from eBay but usually below the vat threshold. However AliExpress seems to add vat to everything.

 

[nandbytes]

Surely two issues are being conflated here? I have always thought "grey" does not equal not tax evasion or smuggling - which is clearly wrong. It means it is sourced from somewhere other than the official country of sale distributor - which is clearly not.

Lots of companies and traders - irrespective of where they source their goods - don't pay enough tax either legally or otherwise. The law. needs to be tightened re large scale corporate tax avoidance Smugglers and tax thieves steal from the rest of us and no amount of rationalisation about the ethics of government will change that. They should be prosecuted. Annoyingly, they are often the type of hypocritical freeloaders who complain about "benefit scroungers" etc. Unfortunately it is widespread. Do you use Vodafone? BT? How's your local plumber? Do you get a VAT invoice from him?

Back to grey. In any country, the official distributor is only a group set up by the manufacturer to deal with their business there. It enables them to carry out operations locally while at the same time charging a premium to cover repairs, admin etc. This is a private arrangement by the company. If you choose to step outside this protected network, you're on your own, but you're most certainly not a criminal or immoral: well, except in internet forums!

Two examples.

In the UK, HDEW are a grey importer with a physical building in the UK. You can go there, you can speak to them on the phone etc. They support a local football team and they give you a VAT receipt. They aren't shady operators hiding in the shadows fiddling their taxes. They're a local UK business. Support them.

In the US B&H or Adorama advertise (or used to, I haven't looked lately) two choices when purchasing: you can either buy "official" goods sourced via the distributor or "gray". The latter are cheaper but don't carry manufacturers back up. These shops aren't criminals either.

Don't drink the corporate Kool Aid. You pays your money and you take your choices. What's the big deal?

HDEW VAT receipt is bogus.

B&H (never purchased from Adorama) provided you the option of "being the importer" i.e. you took responsibility of your own tax.
As its been said a number of times, buy grey or importing is not illegal, evading tax on them is.

And as far this thread and to a great extent this forum most people buy grey to evade tax and save that money for themselves.

 

[Deleted sulking member 63079]

and from their T&C's...





Italics mine.

And all of the VAT receipts have a VAT number on them that does not match the name of the company on the receipt, and so does not meet HMRC requirements

 

[sphexx]

Surely two issues are being conflated here? I have always thought "grey" does not equal not tax evasion or smuggling - which is clearly wrong. It means it is sourced from somewhere other than the official country of sale distributor - which is clearly not.

Lots of companies and traders - irrespective of where they source their goods - don't pay enough tax either legally or otherwise. The law. needs to be tightened re large scale corporate tax avoidance Smugglers and tax thieves steal from the rest of us and no amount of rationalisation about the ethics of government will change that. They should be prosecuted. Annoyingly, they are often the type of hypocritical freeloaders who complain about "benefit scroungers" etc. Unfortunately it is widespread. Do you use Vodafone? BT? How's your local plumber? Do you get a VAT invoice from him?

Back to grey. In any country, the official distributor is only a group set up by the manufacturer to deal with their business there. It enables them to carry out operations locally while at the same time charging a premium to cover repairs, admin etc. This is a private arrangement by the company. If you choose to step outside this protected network, you're on your own, but you're most certainly not a criminal or immoral: well, except in internet forums!

Two examples.

In the UK, HDEW are a grey importer with a physical building in the UK. You can go there, you can speak to them on the phone etc. They support a local football team and they give you a VAT receipt. They aren't shady operators hiding in the shadows fiddling their taxes. They're a local UK business. Support them.

In the US B&H or Adorama advertise (or used to, I haven't looked lately) two choices when purchasing: you can either buy "official" goods sourced via the distributor or "gray". The latter are cheaper but don't carry manufacturers back up. These shops aren't criminals either.

Don't drink the corporate Kool Aid. You pays your money and you take your choices. What's the big deal?

Yes to most of that. I think I was the first to refer to “smugglers” it was intended to be a jokey way to get people to see what the process is realistically and not through a fog of self-justification, but hey, it’s the Internet so some take it as an insult!

Even if they are ‘smugglers’ it doesn’t make them criminals in my book. you break the law by speeding but don't necessarily become a criminal in the process. But really it’s up to HMG to regulate or enforce these things.

I just think people should understand the process and not delude themselves and that may avoid any nasty surprises. Also if someone comes here and asks about grey imports it seems to me to be misleading not to draw attention to the possible pitfalls as well as the upsides.

Quite a lot of useful info has surfaced in this thread. I think you are possibly wrong about HDEW if members here are correct — HDEW provide a VAT invoice but it’s not a valid one, but maybe HDEW are using a legal mechanism to do it. However, anyone who supports a football is definitely involved in a criminal activity in my book . Interestingly, at least in London, ‘real’ criminals owned football clubs as a hobby , not sure what that says.

 

[sphexx]

Imported Low price items are not subject to vat collection.
Duty is only chargeable on certain items. But it is very complex.Still digital cameras are mostly not.
You can Check the actual categories on HMRC. Cine cameras are dutyable.
Unlike vat, duty rates are usually very low, but can be boosted by an anti dumping surcharge.

I have bought lots of stuff from overseas from eBay but usually below the vat threshold. However AliExpress seems to add vat to everything.

It’s mainly about VAT and as that link to eBay T&C I posted earlier says, eBay collects VAT from 1.1.21.

Regarding foreign firms that charge VAT, it is I think, very difficult to check if they are actually transmitting the VAT to U.K. HMG don’t make it easy to relate VAT numbers to companies, at leat when I’ve tried in the past.

 

[sphexx]

and from their T&C's...





Italics mine.

I think HDEW T&Cs are a model of clarity and really cover all that needs to be said. You could wipe this whole thread and just reproduce them here instead. They even give you the option of buying from them and paying VAT, instead of importing it yourself where they write:

If ”you are a business requiring UK vat supply then you can request this service and buy from HDEW Cameras”

 

[Deleted sulking member 63079]

I think HDEW T&Cs are a model of clarity and really cover all that needs to be said. You could wipe this whole thread and just reproduce them here instead. They even give you the option of buying from them and paying VAT, instead of importing it yourself where they write:

If ”you are a business requiring UK vat supply then you can request this service and buy from HDEW Cameras”

They even say

"INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS.

Please note that by making a purchase on this website you will be acting as the importer of the product for all purposes including all customs regulations,copyright and trademark laws. You accept that the role of HDEW Cameras is limited to sourcing products and making them available for you to import directly from the country of origin. By purchasing a product through this website you authorise us to make arrangements for clearance of customs on your behalf for the products you have ordered."

But it's in smaller text than the rest of the page, and no mention of them paying VAT, just "arrangements for clearance of customs".

The only slightly dodgy thing they do, is if you ask for a VAT receipt without having paid the VAT, is they send you one, but if you run the VAT number through the VAT checker, it's for VALIDHIRST LTD. Which doesn't match the name of the company on the receipt, and both need to match for the receipt to be valid.

 

[SFTPhotography]

Imported Low price items are not subject to vat collection.
Duty is only chargeable on certain items. But it is very complex.Still digital cameras are mostly not.
You can Check the actual categories on HMRC. Cine cameras are dutyable.
Unlike vat, duty rates are usually very low, but can be boosted by an anti dumping surcharge.

I have bought lots of stuff from overseas from eBay but usually below the vat threshold. However AliExpress seems to add vat to everything.

Both my 645z lens (280 quid) and 5ds (1100 quid) got hit by eBay for duties

 

[sphexx]

Both my 645z lens (280 quid) and 5ds (1100 quid) got hit by eBay for duties

Was that since January when they said they will add VAT or longer ago?

 

[sphexx]

They even say

"INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS.

Please note that by making a purchase on this website you will be acting as the importer of the product for all purposes including all customs regulations,copyright and trademark laws. You accept that the role of HDEW Cameras is limited to sourcing products and making them available for you to import directly from the country of origin. By purchasing a product through this website you authorise us to make arrangements for clearance of customs on your behalf for the products you have ordered."

But it's in smaller text than the rest of the page, and no mention of them paying VAT, just "arrangements for clearance of customs".

The only slightly dodgy thing they do, is if you ask for a VAT receipt without having paid the VAT, is they send you one, but if you run the VAT number through the VAT checker, it's for VALIDHIRST LTD. Which doesn't match the name of the company on the receipt, and both need to match for the receipt to be valid.

Yes, I’m slightly giving them the benefit of the doubt there as they may have had a legal opinion on what they are doing but, if those were the t&c when when you bought, it does seem fishy . Perhaps they or their supplier coughed up the VAT on your behalf under the usual provisions when they are caught out.

 

[Retune]

The only slightly dodgy thing they do, is if you ask for a VAT receipt without having paid the VAT, is they send you one, but if you run the VAT number through the VAT checker, it's for VALIDHIRST LTD. Which doesn't match the name of the company on the receipt, and both need to match for the receipt to be valid.

HDEW seem to be operating under two systems - as an agent where the customer is the legal importer, and as a business that you can buy grey imports from, apparently with VAT paid. But there doesn't seem to be any mention of a difference in prices. What do you think is going on with Validhirst? Why have two companies? Which company takes your money if you go via this route? I came across this old thread, but I'm not sure I'm any the wiser:

HDEW / PortusDigital / Validhurst. A Bit of a tangled web??

I was looking online to buy a new body. I have dealt with HDEW Before and never had a problem with them, they have supplied VAT Receipts and I have been able to register the item for warranty in the UK. The item I was looking at was £1999 on HDEW. I then came across the same item from...

www.talkphotography.co.uk

 

[wooster]

Hmmm. This is interesting.

I confess I have taken the HDEW VAT receipts at face value as valid and I honestly don't know what their T&C translate to legally. They payment of customs part is worded fairly vaguely and so I'm reluctant to draw conclusions It seems to me though bizarre beyond belief, that the government would turn a blind eye to companies whether internet or physical who blatantly make their main source of income tax evasion. I mean it's their primary occupation?

I'm also wondering how that puts companies like WEX who advertise products as grey. I realise I'm assuming that grey is not illegal per se, and they are not directly involved in import fraud but surely if they are handling goods on which tax has not been paid they are in breach?

 

[wooster]

Yes to most of that. I think I was the first to refer to “smugglers” it was intended to be a jokey way to get people to see what the process is realistically and not through a fog of self-justification, but hey, it’s the Internet so some take it as an insult!

Even if they are ‘smugglers’ it doesn’t make them criminals in my book. you break the law by speeding but don't necessarily become a criminal in the process. But really it’s up to HMG to regulate or enforce these things.

I just think people should understand the process and not delude themselves and that may avoid any nasty surprises. Also if someone comes here and asks about grey imports it seems to me to be misleading not to draw attention to the possible pitfalls as well as the upsides.

Quite a lot of useful info has surfaced in this thread. I think you are possibly wrong about HDEW if members here are correct — HDEW provide a VAT invoice but it’s not a valid one, but maybe HDEW are using a legal mechanism to do it. However, anyone who supports a football is definitely involved in a criminal activity in my book . Interestingly, at least in London, ‘real’ criminals owned football clubs as a hobby , not sure what that says.

LOL @ the football

I wasn't actually offended by the use of the word "smugglers" and I wasn't referring to your post. I might well be wrong about HDEW but who really knows? Unless we have a tax lawyer posting I'm none the wiser.

I'm not a fan of tax evaders but we should be starting with the corporate criminals not Joe Blogs buying his R6.

 

[Retune]

I'm also wondering how that puts companies like WEX who advertise products as grey. I realise I'm assuming that grey is not illegal per se, and they are not directly involved in import fraud but surely if they are handling goods on which tax has not been paid they are in breach?

Presumably these are secondhand? I suppose I'd assumed that the responsibility still lies with the original purchaser, who may have dodged tax on import and then profited from this by selling on the item to a dealer.

 

[sphexx]

HDEW seem to be operating under two systems - as an agent where the customer is the legal importer, and as a business that you can buy grey imports from, apparently with VAT paid. But there doesn't seem to be any mention of a difference in prices. What do you think is going on with Validhirst? Why have two companies? Which company takes your money if you go via this route? I came across this old thread, but I'm not sure I'm any the wiser:

HDEW / PortusDigital / Validhurst. A Bit of a tangled web??

I was looking online to buy a new body. I have dealt with HDEW Before and never had a problem with them, they have supplied VAT Receipts and I have been able to register the item for warranty in the UK. The item I was looking at was £1999 on HDEW. I then came across the same item from...

www.talkphotography.co.uk

Curiouser and curiouser .

 

[nandbytes]

HDEW seem to be operating under two systems - as an agent where the customer is the legal importer, and as a business that you can buy grey imports from, apparently with VAT paid. But there doesn't seem to be any mention of a difference in prices. What do you think is going on with Validhirst? Why have two companies? Which company takes your money if you go via this route? I came across this old thread, but I'm not sure I'm any the wiser:

HDEW / PortusDigital / Validhurst. A Bit of a tangled web??

I was looking online to buy a new body. I have dealt with HDEW Before and never had a problem with them, they have supplied VAT Receipts and I have been able to register the item for warranty in the UK. The item I was looking at was £1999 on HDEW. I then came across the same item from...

www.talkphotography.co.uk

Hmmm. This is interesting.

I confess I have taken the HDEW VAT receipts at face value as valid and I honestly don't know what their T&C translate to legally. They payment of customs part is worded fairly vaguely and so I'm reluctant to draw conclusions It seems to me though bizarre beyond belief, that the government would turn a blind eye to companies whether internet or physical who blatantly make their main source of income tax evasion. I mean it's their primary occupation?

I'm also wondering how that puts companies like WEX who advertise products as grey. I realise I'm assuming that grey is not illegal per se, and they are not directly involved in import fraud but surely if they are handling goods on which tax has not been paid they are in breach?

the fact that its vague, unclear, twisted and tangled should be enough to show that it's not legit. In fact the only thing not vague is the part where you are importer and liable to pay tax and not them. So if anyone is evading tax its the buyer not HDEW which is really the only bit that's clear.

Presumably these are secondhand? I suppose I'd assumed that the responsibility still lies with the original purchaser, who may have dodged tax on import and then profited from this by selling on the item to a dealer.

yeah Wex, MPB etc will sell secondhand grey imports. but you normally sign their T&Cs part of which says you accept that all tax dues has been cleared for the item you are trading in.

 

[sphexx]

s It seems to me though bizarre beyond belief, that the government would turn a blind eye to companies whether internet or physica

I think the possible tax evasion on cameras must be tiny compared with that via eBay or Amazon etc and they evidently (from the ebay t&c) have taken steps there from 1.1.21.

 

[wooster]

the fact that its vague, unclear, twisted and tangled should be enough to show that it's not legit. In fact the only thing not vague is the part where you are importer and liable to pay tax and not them. So if anyone is evading tax its the buyer not HDEW which is really the only bit that clear.



yeah Wex, MPB etc will sell secondhand grey imports. but you normally sign their T&Cs part of which says you accept that all tax dues has been cleared for the item you are trading in.

Surely if WEX sells goods that tax hasn't been paid on, they are also in breach though? I sold them a grey 7D and they never asked me to sign anything though they knew it was grey and advertised it as such.

Now, I know of no more reputable company than WEX and I'd trust them to follow the law to the letter so either I'm wrong and they have no responsibility for non - payment on goods they have bought used or else duty is normally paid on grey?

I know MPB didn't take grey in the past but are fine now. Again I assumed this was because most grey was legitimate.

As I say, without a tax lawyer advising me, I'm still confused.

 

[wooster]

I think the possible tax evasion on cameras must be tiny compared with that via eBay or Amazon etc and they evidently (from the ebay t&c) have taken steps there from 1.1.21.

Maybe, but I bet ( though, possibly in my naiveté ) if I set up a website offering to smuggle stuff into the UK for a few grand a year, HMRC would be on to me pronto

 

[Phil V]

Both my 645z lens (280 quid) and 5ds (1100 quid) got hit by eBay for duties

There is no UK duty on digital cameras.

 

[nandbytes]

Surely if WEX sells goods that tax hasn't been paid on, they are also in breach though? I sold them a grey 7D and they never asked me to sign anything though they knew it was grey and advertised it as such.

Now, I know of no more reputable company than WEX and I'd trust them to follow the law to the letter so either I'm wrong and they have no responsibility for non - payment on goods they have bought used or else duty is normally paid on grey?

I know MPB didn't take grey in the past but are fine now. Again I assumed this was because most grey was legitimate.

As I say, without a tax lawyer advising me, I'm still confused.

you accept their T&Cs (checkbox) when you accept the trade-in.

and their T&Cs state:
"In offering second-hand products to Wex, you confirm and warrant that: (i) you have full and legal title to the products being offered or are lawfully authorised to dispose of the products; (ii) the products are not encumbered by any debts, whether arising from a hire-purchase agreement or otherwise; (iii) the products were originally purchased inside the EU (and you acknowledge that we reserve the right to require documentary evidence to confirm that this was the case); (iv) unless expressly agreed with Wex in writing to the contrary, VAT is not chargeable in respect of the purchase of the second-hand products; and (v) you are over the age of 16 or, if not, that you have obtained consent from your parent or guardian to sell the products. You indemnify us from any claims that may arise if you send items to us in breach of this warranty. You acknowledge that, in the event that we become aware that any products sent to us are registered or reported as lost or stolen, we may contact the appropriate authorities."

not sure if they need to change the EU part from EU to just being UK now but basically everything is on your for lying if you haven't paid the tax.

Again I assumed this was because most grey was legitimate.

As I say, without a tax lawyer advising me, I'm still confused.

Once again, as its been said a number of times, buying grey or importing is not illegal, evading tax on them is.

 

[Deleted sulking member 63079]

Hmmm. This is interesting.

I confess I have taken the HDEW VAT receipts at face value as valid and I honestly don't know what their T&C translate to legally. They payment of customs part is worded fairly vaguely and so I'm reluctant to draw conclusions It seems to me though bizarre beyond belief, that the government would turn a blind eye to companies whether internet or physical who blatantly make their main source of income tax evasion. I mean it's their primary occupation?

I'm also wondering how that puts companies like WEX who advertise products as grey. I realise I'm assuming that grey is not illegal per se, and they are not directly involved in import fraud but surely if they are handling goods on which tax has not been paid they are in breach?

I think it's impossible for them to track, it's not shipments going from one place to one other. It's thousands of individual orders going to individual addresses, so there's no pattern really to watch for.

It might be that HDEW is all fine and their VAT receipts aren't valid due to incompetence rather than anything fishy (doesn't take a lawyer to determine whether a VAT receipt is correct or not, the requirements are pretty clear)

 

[wooster]

Once again, as its been said a number of times, buying grey or importing is not illegal, evading tax on them is.

I have read that, but what I'm saying is that without more authoritative advice, I'm unclear about the status of HDEW in all of this or indeed Panamoz et al

EDIT For clarity, I mean vis a vis evading tax

 

[Deleted sulking member 63079]

I have read that, but what I'm saying is that without more authoritative advice, I'm unclear about the status of HDEW in all of this or indeed Panamoz et al

EDIT For clarity, I mean vis a vis evading tax

HDEW make it quite clear tbh in their terms and conditions. They state that YOU are the importer if you buy from them. Therefore, you are responsible for the correct declaration of the import and payment of VAT and Duty (if any).

So they can't get into any trouble, as they're not evading any tax.

 

[wooster]

I think it's impossible for them to track, it's not shipments going from one place to one other. It's thousands of individual orders going to individual addresses, so there's no pattern really to watch for.

It might be that HDEW is all fine and their VAT receipts aren't valid due to incompetence rather than anything fishy (doesn't take a lawyer to determine whether a VAT receipt is correct or not, the requirements are pretty clear)

I guess though, my point is that it would take a lawyer to determine the legal status of the company re VAT.

I am going to assume ( maybe wrongly ) that they are a legit company and that perhaps merging with other companies or for whatever reason they have made arrangements causing confusion in their invoicing and therefore to us. I might be way off beam of course

 

[wooster]

I wonder if we should ask them?

 

[SFTPhotography]

There is no UK duty on digital cameras.

So what was I hit for? Unless were confusing VAT with duty here (my bad) but I was certainly whacked for something I could have done without paying.

 

[nandbytes]

I guess though, my point is that it would take a lawyer to determine the legal status of the company re VAT.

I am going to assume ( maybe wrongly ) that they are a legit company and that perhaps merging with other companies or for whatever reason they have made arrangements causing confusion in their invoicing and therefore to us. I might be way off beam of course

VAT is pretty simple actually as mentioned above and requirements are clear for a valid VAT receipt (anyone can look it up including you). Its kept simple enough for a reason because you should be able to manage your own end of year tax claims (I have done in the past, my mum still does at the moment). We don't hire lawyers every year (normally you'd hire an accountant if anything).

they are all legit companies, they are not evading tax. In all cases the buyer is seen as the importer (that's pretty much the only thing HDEW are clear about lol) and buyer is the only one evading or liable to pay the import charges or taxes etc.

 

[Phil V]

So what was I hit for? Unless were confusing VAT with duty here (my bad) but I was certainly whacked for something I could have done without paying.

VAT would be due on both items, duty on lenses only

 

[nandbytes]

I wonder if we should ask them?

go for it and let us know how it goes

 

[wooster]

go for it and let us know how it goes

I have. I will. I'm interested

 

[Deleted sulking member 63079]

I guess though, my point is that it would take a lawyer to determine the legal status of the company re VAT.

I am going to assume ( maybe wrongly ) that they are a legit company and that perhaps merging with other companies or for whatever reason they have made arrangements causing confusion in their invoicing and therefore to us. I might be way off beam of course

VALIDHIRST LTD and HDEW is owned by the same people. HDEW Cameras LTD is listed as Dormant.

The VAT receipt states HDEW Cameras, but with the reg number of VALIDHIRST on it (making it non-valid). HOWEVER, this could just be a mistake. But I don't really buy it tbh.

 

[Mr Perceptive]

VALIDHIRST LTD and HDEW is owned by the same people. HDEW Cameras LTD is listed as Dormant.

The VAT receipt states HDEW Cameras, but with the reg number of VALIDHIRST on it (making it non-valid). HOWEVER, this could just be a mistake. But I don't really buy it tbh.

Technically HDEW Cameras could be a trading name of Validhurst Ltd - you can have as many trading names as you want for a given Ltd company

But if this is the case, the formal VAT invoice 'should' have the the words "HDEW Cameras trading as Validhust Ltd" on it along with trading address, registered office number and the VAT number for Validhurst Ltd

Not having seen one of these invoices I can neither confirm nor deny!!

 

[Deleted sulking member 63079]

Technically HDEW Cameras could be a trading name of Validhurst Ltd - you can have as many trading names as you want for a given Ltd company

But if this is the case, the formal VAT invoice 'should' have the the words "HDEW Cameras trading as Validhust Ltd" on it along with trading address, registered office number and the VAT number for Validhurst Ltd

Not having seen one of these invoices I can neither confirm nor deny!!

The receipts make no mention of validhirst. Or didn't, maybe they do now. It's not a trading name though, separate LTD companies.

 

[Retune]

HDEW make it quite clear tbh in their terms and conditions. They state that YOU are the importer if you buy from them. Therefore, you are responsible for the correct declaration of the import and payment of VAT and Duty (if any).

So they can't get into any trouble, as they're not evading any tax.

Since their Terms and FAQ mention two methods of buying - from their mysterious 'supplier' with them acting as agent, and (I think) from them directly, does this only apply to the former?

Technically HDEW Cameras could be a trading name of Validhurst Ltd - you can have as many trading names as you want for a given Ltd company

But if this is the case, the formal VAT invoice 'should' have the the words "HDEW Cameras trading as Validhust Ltd" on it along with trading address, registered office number and the VAT number for Validhurst Ltd

Not having seen one of these invoices I can neither confirm nor deny!!

From the thread linked above:

"Checking back on the 2 companies you get
VALIDHURST Ltd T/A HDEW Cameras
PortusDigital don't mention any links but the Credit Card transaction comes up as
VALIDHURST Ltd T/A Portus Digital"

Could 'HDEW Cameras' be a trading name of Validhirst (or is it Validhurst?), separate from 'HDEW Cameras Ltd'? I assume 'T/A' is 'trading as'.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

It’s mainly about VAT and as that link to eBay T&C I posted earlier says, eBay collects VAT from 1.1.21.

Regarding foreign firms that charge VAT, it is I think, very difficult to check if they are actually transmitting the VAT to U.K. HMG don’t make it easy to relate VAT numbers to companies, at leat when I’ve tried in the past.

Aliexpress is part of Alibaba. and is like a vast Chinese Ebay but mostly from traders rather than individuals, and like Ebay it now adds Vat to UK sales.

Both my 645z lens (280 quid) and 5ds (1100 quid) got hit by eBay for duties

were they hit for duty or vat? they can charge for customs clearance anyway

 

[sphexx]

Technically HDEW Cameras could be a trading name of Validhurst Ltd - you can have as many trading names as you want for a given Ltd company

You can, but I doubt it’s legal to put “ltd” after your trading name and somewhere on the paper it should say “HDEW LTD T/A Validhurst” or similar.

 

[Mr Perceptive]

You can, but I doubt it’s legal to put “ltd” after your trading name and somewhere on the paper it should say “HDEW LTD T/A Validhurst” or similar.

or Validhurst Ltd T/A HDEW Cameras