Great Day today for the wind farms :-) and Solar :-)

[Mr Bump]

I do wonder if the real issue with fracking, small reactors and renewables to cover all our power needs is 'God forbid we give the public cheap energy'

i don't think so is more not investing in old school but to find better solutions in new school green energy and renewables

 

[Mr Bump]

 

[Mr Bump]

epic evening
massive over production of wind....parp
selling a chunk to europe

 

[Mr Bump]

EPIC!

 

[Mr Bump]

wow scary milestone stuff

nearly 80% on wind AND exporting 6% AND using 3% to pump for tomorrow
it doesn't get much better

 

[vintageman]

So why are we paying through our noses!

 

[Mr Bump]

So why are we paying through our noses!

playing catch up for NOT investing over the last decade
blame the tories oh we are getting even better....

 

[gman]

So why are we paying through our noses!

This

 

[Nod]

To pay the shareholders...

 

[Mr Bump]

To pay the shareholders...

they are called investors in the bigger picture.
moving to renewables is needed but its expensive
some of them are probably in my pension scheme

 

[Mr Bump]

This

View attachment 441533

This doesnt help

Low gas reserves - The UK has some of the lowest gas reserves in Europe, which means there's almost no way of stockpiling gas to use it when needed. Capacity is equivalent to roughly 2% of the UK's annual demand, compared with 25% for other European countries and as much as 37% in Europe's four largest storage holders.8 Oct 2024

 

[JonathanRyan]

This

View attachment 441533

It's not really though, is it?

Obviously energy prices are pegged to the gas price. This made sense while renewables were getting going - it was a HUGE financial incentive for firms to build solar and wind farms. (I've said before that whether you believe that was prudence from a canny government or a cynical ploy to make their chums a fast mega buck probably depends more on your opinion than the facts.) But now that 70+ % of power is renewable we could easily flip it and peg it to (say) renewable + 20%. People would get out of gas awfully fast if they were selling it at a loss.

It would cut bills very fast - but would also lead to short term power cuts as the industry figured out how to plug the gap at a lower price.

 

[gman]

It's not really though, is it?

Obviously energy prices are pegged to the gas price. This made sense while renewables were getting going - it was a HUGE financial incentive for firms to build solar and wind farms. (I've said before that whether you believe that was prudence from a canny government or a cynical ploy to make their chums a fast mega buck probably depends more on your opinion than the facts.) But now that 70+ % of power is renewable we could easily flip it and peg it to (say) renewable + 20%. People would get out of gas awfully fast if they were selling it at a loss.

It would cut bills very fast - but would also lead to short term power cuts as the industry figured out how to plug the gap at a lower price.

I think there have been some rumblings of getting away from the link with gas, something about having two billing systems I think, one for renewables and then one for fossils - but I may not be remembering it correctly. Maybe that wouldn't be a bad thing to highlight the difference in costs, that is if the renewables are actually cheaper. I'm not really sure about the levies etc.

 

[Mr Bump]

Nice windy night

 

[Mr Bump]

 

[Mr Bump]

nice almost 70% from wind a tiny help from EU nuclear , pumping 4% into storage and a nice helping of our own nuclear and a bit of biomass
means a tiny bit of fossill 8%

 

[gman]

Whilst it's nice to see some good results from wind on selectively reported days, it's still a very inconsistent source of power when you look at the bigger picture. I'm not sure if we will ever be able to have enough wind farms to make up for those days. Perhaps if batteries become a viable mass storage solution then it might work.

 

[Mr Bump]

Whilst it's nice to see some good results from wind on selectively reported days, it's still a very inconsistent source of power when you look at the bigger picture. I'm not sure if we will ever be able to have enough wind farms to make up for those days. Perhaps if batteries become a viable mass storage solution then it might work.

View attachment 442160

it has never been about "meeting all" our needs always working towards a target
you have to remember where we were 10 years ago and look at it year on year since

Red=fossill
renew=Green
blue=nuke+bio
grey=hydro
black=demand

 

[Mr Bump]

Holy Epic Smoke

 

[gman]

it has never been about "meeting all" our needs always working towards a target
you have to remember where we were 10 years ago and look at it year on year since

Red=fossill
renew=Green
blue=nuke+bio
grey=hydro
black=demand

View attachment 442161

What's the target?

 

[JonathanRyan]

Perhaps if batteries become a viable mass storage solution then it might work.

I think we need to look elsewhere than traditional batteries. Pump water up hill, spilt water to store as hydrogen, wind up big springs etc.

Meanwhile octopus are basically paying to rent my batteries. Glad I got the fuse upgraded to 100a

 

[Mr Bump]

What's the target?

as close as we can get to net zero i guess
the question is more how do we do it and how long will it take
we have more offshore wind coming on this year and also more solar so it will
be interesting where we are in 12 months
we need to look at every day we work harder to get there to lower pollution in our towns and cities
our urban areas , to move to electrification and renewables

 

[gman]

I think we need to look elsewhere than traditional batteries. Pump water up hill, spilt water to store as hydrogen, wind up big springs etc.

Meanwhile octopus are basically paying to rent my batteries. Glad I got the fuse upgraded to 100a

I did look at things like Hydro power seeing as it's so successfully used in Norway, but was immediately presented with a raft of environment issues it can cause. I'm not sure how much that would apply to other types. I think there will always be caveats with energy production, I guess we just have to find the right balance.

 

[gman]

as close as we can get to net zero i guess
the question is more how do we do it and how long will it take
we have more offshore wind coming on this year and also more solar so it will
be interesting where we are in 12 months
we need to look at every day we work harder to get there to lower pollution in our towns and cities
our urban areas , to move to electrification and renewables
View attachment 442234

As I said, I don't think it will be possible to have enough wind farms to compensate for days when there's hardly any wind, Solar in this country? It might be ok for a domestic house, but for industrial demand I think it's never going to achieve much, but happy to be proved wrong because at least solar panels don't pose a threat to birds. Hydroelectric I believe has local environmental concerns, so that will be difficult to expand.

So how are we going to achieve Net Zero when the wind barely blows but demand is still the same? Or perhaps more accurately, real net zero because I believe it can be offset, therefore is a bit of a fallacy.

 

[Mr Bump]

As I said, I don't think it will be possible to have enough wind farms to compensate for days when there's hardly any wind, Solar in this country? It might be ok for a domestic house, but for industrial demand I think it's never going to achieve much, but happy to be proved wrong because at least solar panels don't pose a threat to birds. Hydroelectric I believe has local environmental concerns, so that will be difficult to expand.

So how are we going to achieve Net Zero when the wind barely blows but demand is still the same? Or perhaps more accurately, real net zero because I believe it can be offset, therefore is a bit of a fallacy.

we will for the forceable future have a lot of gas powered stations on standby which is fine and run them when we need but we will still use and burn a lot less gas
you need to alter your perspective better is still better it may not be perfect but its better.

 

[gman]

we will for the forceable future have a lot of gas powered stations on standby which is fine and run them when we need but we will still use and burn a lot less gas
you need to alter your perspective better is still better it may not be perfect but its better.

Which will mean continued high prices regardless of how little we use gas, unless they remove the link.

 

[Mr Bump]

Which will mean continued high prices regardless of how little we use gas, unless they remove the link.

maybe they will when we reduce our gas usage and maybe we wont
much as energy prices are higher than we would like them to be it needs to be understood
we will never have cheap energy investment in renewables will be expensive for the next 20-30 years until we are finally in a better position.

case in point look at the chart in 2012 and look at it on 2022

then look at the two next years

leaps and bounds

look how far in 10 years
so just imagine another 10

 

[gman]

maybe they will when we reduce our gas usage and maybe we wont
much as energy prices are higher than we would like them to be it needs to be understood
we will never have cheap energy investment in renewables will be expensive for the next 20-30 years until we are finally in a better position.

case in point look at the chart in 2012 and look at it on 2022

then look at the two next years

leaps and bounds

look how far in 10 years
so just imagine another 10

View attachment 442272

A better position how? Wind turbines and solar won't be able to do it on their own.

The only other thing I can think of in the renewables side that could offer up a solution is tidal because it's guaranteed.

 

[Mr Bump]

A better position how? Wind turbines and solar won't be able to do it on their own.

The only other thing I can think of in the renewables side that could offer up a solution is tidal because it's guaranteed.

you just keep coming back with the round and round and round
I have said quite a few times "I don't know" all we can do is move forward and see how much renewable we can build and what kind of impact it has
we will also continue for a while with GAS and see what the graphs say in a few years, forward, better, greener...

i am sure someone somewhere will sell you a crystal ball
drop me a line with what it says

 

[gman]

you just keep coming back with the round and round and round
I have said quite a few times "I don't know" all we can do is move forward and see how much renewable we can build and what kind of impact it has
we will also continue for a while with GAS and see what the graphs say in a few years, forward, better, greener...

i am sure someone somewhere will sell you a crystal ball
drop me a line with what it says

That's because I disagree with your preference that we just move forward at great expense for the next 20-30 years and hope that we are in a better position, but still not necessarily a solution.

There are alternative solutions we could start working on now to reduce energy costs, whilst still working on renewables. Crystal ball comment demonstrates a rather narrow minded attitude.

Here's today, seeing as you probably won't post it.

 

[Mr Bump]

That's because I disagree with your preference that we just move forward at great expense for the next 20-30 years and hope that we are in a better position, but still not necessarily a solution.

There are alternative solutions we could start working on now to reduce energy costs, whilst still working on renewables. Crystal ball comment demonstrates a rather narrow minded attitude.

He's today, seeing as you probably won't post it.

View attachment 442309

no you are wrong i see every day and i actually post up a lot of bad days in other threads the issue is you only seem to want absolute answers and go round and round
trying to get me to give you them so i will reiterate agian (for about the 7th time)

All we can do is move forward, build more renewables and see what the numbers say , smarter, greener
We can see how this affects our reliance on GAS and other sources as the YEARS move on as I said look at the graphs but you want me to carve tennents in stone like moses.

its taken 10 years to get to where we are now
wait another 10 years

you just seem utterly unable to grasp the fact that there are no absolutes with this
you cannot accept it is all trial and error in energy at the moment but the graph below shows we are going the right way

my comment about the crystal ball was meant to say but it must have gone over your head that nobody knows. is that a close enough explanations for you?

I will not engage with you any further

you have made it on to my IGNORE list

 

[Mr Bump]

An interesting day for the renewables but mainly because its Jan 2nd and 9% from Solar lol

3.52GW that is impressive !

in fact looking at the stats Solar has provided 5% of all energy over the last year and that includes night time so if someone can tell me how many daylight hours in a year we can do some more maths

 

[gman]

no you are wrong i see every day and i actually post up a lot of bad days in other threads the issue is you only seem to want absolute answers and go round and round
trying to get me to give you them so i will reiterate agian (for about the 7th time)

All we can do is move forward, build more renewables and see what the numbers say , smarter, greener
We can see how this affects our reliance on GAS and other sources as the YEARS move on as I said look at the graphs but you want me to carve tennents in stone like moses.

its taken 10 years to get to where we are now
wait another 10 years

you just seem utterly unable to grasp the fact that there are no absolutes with this
you cannot accept it is all trial and error in energy at the moment but the graph below shows we are going the right way

my comment about the crystal ball was meant to say but it must have gone over your head that nobody knows. is that a close enough explanations for you?

I will not engage with you any further

you have made it on to my IGNORE list

View attachment 442311

I've addressed your points and suggested various strategies with plenty of thinking out loud, but it is you who is just bleating out the same one dimensional thought process and repeatedly posting the same chart. This is why it's going round and round, because you aren't willing to look beyond "fingers crossed".

You still aren't listening and you don't seem to understand the marginal cost issue. Unless that is changed, then even 1% gas will keep the prices at their highest no matter how many wind farms are built and running.

If pricing could be calculated more frequently then that could potentially mitigate the high costs when/if renewables are providing enough, but I would think that market energy bulk buying prohibits this.

Ignore all you like, it only serves to demonstrate your poor attitude and lack of rational thinking.

 

[Mr Bump]

Another curious day when solar is realy holding up well very bright sunshine pulling almost 10%

 

[Mr Bump]

Bad Day, wind not blowing much and that sun we had for a few days has dipped in :-(
buying a chunk of nuclear from EU and got the biomass (Canadian woodland) on full chat also :-(

 

[Nod]

Can't help wondering how green that biomass is since it involves chopping down trees and shipping the sawdust/pellets across the ocean. Good job we've still go the gas capability!

 

[gman]

Can't help wondering how green that biomass is since it involves chopping down trees and shipping the sawdust/pellets across the ocean. Good job we've still go the gas capability!

Drax is terrible in my opinion.

I'm wondering where EfW plants are represented in these charts? On another dashboard they are shown and I initially thought maybe in the Biomass section above, but that already seems to be complete. It's a small number, although similar to solar on a moderate day, and there's plenty of builds in the pipeline. I believe they are far cleaner now and helps somewhat offset the landfill problems we have. It's a fairly reliable source of energy as well.





EfW not yet built

 

[Mr Bump]

Can't help wondering how green that biomass is since it involves chopping down trees and shipping the sawdust/pellets across the ocean. Good job we've still go the gas capability!

its not clean at all realy, the pundits will say its green becaude its burning stored carbon and a new tree will absorb carbon but i think its pure b*****ks
i agree with you at the moment gas is cleaner than biomass

 

[Mr Bump]

Bit of late night love for the green

 

[Mr Bump]

Still pretty decent for this time of the year i think.
hopefully more offshore wind coming on line in 2025 should see this rise a bit