Good reason for driving a 4x4

I hate to see this, :'( but we only drive 4 x 4 (also needed on the farm) and also would not say, No to a Volvo estate, used to have these and love them.
 
Driving something disproportionately large that can cause horrendous damage to the other car in such a collision is a good idea? :thinking:
 
Simmotino said:
Driving something disproportionately large that can cause horrendous damage to the other car in such a collision is a good idea? :thinking:
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It could have been a lorry though :shrug:

We only have 4 x 4 because of the farm use. :shrug:

I used to drive a mini clubman estate a long time ago, but would not go back to one now. not enough room for us :lol:
 
Simmotino said:
Driving something disproportionately large that can cause horrendous damage to the other car in such a collision is a good idea? :thinking:
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Better someone else than you or yours, wouldn't you say?
 
So I take it you are against all 4 x 4 drivers and they should not be on the road :thinking: but they are needed to get about in Scotland because of the adverse weather conditions and at the end of the day it was an accident and could have been any other car, van truck, lorry etc just happened to be a well built 4 x 4:shrug:
 
Simmotino said:
Better no-one at all, actually.
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Granted, but **** happens, if it's going to happen to me I'd much rather be able to walk away from it. My own car is a Fiat Panda which does me fine but in that situation ^ it would have been obliterated along with me.
 
4X4 are a common requirement here and are obviously used both on and off road.

Road tests have always shown that the 'stiffness' of off road 4X4 vehicles and their lack of 'crumple' zone can cause problems of their own. If I was wanting a car for a family of 5 that needed to overcome some wet leaves in Essex - I wouldn't bother with one.

MPV v 4X4 crash test

http://motorkwik.co.uk/media/2010/02/18/4x4-vehicles-as-crash-test-victims-2899
 
4x4 in a city environment is pointless i would say. Just used for one-up-manship!
 
Simmotino said:
Better no-one at all, actually.
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Right, so just stay at home and hide under the bed, 'cause that's the only place you can avoid traffic accidents...

Wake-Up Simmo: **** happens, so it pays to protect yourselves accordingly.

You cannot fully mitigate against pure accidents (or stupid idiots on the road)...

If you want to risk your family in a cheap flimsy car, fine. Mine will be in the tank you accidentally drive into...
 
Chris Eubanks must have issues over his mortality.
 
Bite me...
Luchs_ArmyRecognition_01.JPG
 
Geez Neil, that's the school bus many young mums seem to want.
 
How do you know both vehicles weren't single occupants and are both dead? 4x4s aren't crash tested to the same standards as passenger cars so they can actually be worse in an accident as they transfer the collision energy to the passengers instead of through the vehicle.

If they hit head on 60 ish they're both going to be toast as the deceleration involved would be massive.

It looks like the other car was an old astra so that would stand no chance against anything much.

Bulk helps but so does vehicle design and driving defensively to avoid a collision in the first place!
 
Nothing wrong with 4X4s - they're the tool for the job if you need one although they have become something of a fashion statement on the school run.

What I will say is back in the day when I used to attend a lot of RTAs we could pretty well guarantee that in bad weather 4X4s driven by people who thought that the laws of physics no longer applied to them would be among the first to come to grief.

The roads were treacherous here first thing and I had a rear view mirror full of Range Rover grill for abouit 2 miles - trying to intimidate me into going quicker and about 4 feet off my back bumper. I loved the way the fat git driving had one elbow up on the door with that supreme air of confidence which only comes when you know you've reached the pinnacle of driving excellence.
 
I have noticed that 4x4 drivers tend to forget they can't stop any faster.... my car is 4x4 but I have a brain. It's great in snow and without abs you can actually stand a chance of stopping. Diffs make sure you don't spin when you brake on differentially slippy surfaces too. Wouldn't be without it any time of year. What amazes me continually is just how big 'super minis' are now. A corsa is now bigger than my car which was a mid sized hatch back when it was made.

My road is slightly slopey so during the winter I have endless entertainment when it is slightly slippy. Watched some prat in a megane do a 180 into a rut last year as he was incapable of waiting for someone else to come through as they were in difficulty. How I laughed!
 
dinners said:
Road tests have always shown that the 'stiffness' of off road 4X4 vehicles and their lack of 'crumple' zone can cause problems of their own. If I was wanting a car for a family of 5 that needed to overcome some wet leaves in Essex - I wouldn't bother with one.
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Yup, looking at the photo in that link (OP), the "normal" car appears to have absorbed a LOT of energy and used it to crumple quite effectively while the front of the Shogun (?) has relatively little deformation so has passed on a lot more of the energy to the occupants.
 
Briony said:
... would not say, No to a Volvo estate, used to have these and love them.
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:thumbs:

Simmotino said:
Driving something disproportionately large that can cause horrendous damage to the other car in such a collision is a good idea? :thinking:
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Hell, YES, but fuel's a consideration ... so Volvo estate it is.

Arkady said:
...If you want to risk your family in a cheap flimsy car, fine. ...
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Exactly.
you don't have to go all RangeRover to be just that little bit safer in an accident compared to the other guy... you just have to be that much heavier.
 
Gigabyte said:
4x4 in a city environment is pointless i would say. Just used for one-up-manship!
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Good job I use my Porsche in the city and my 4x4 elsewhere then! :naughty:. Although I have it with me at work today in Bristol, as the Porsche is getting a new clutch.

Here is my 4x4:

4x4.jpg


Taken on a Kodak DX3700, since this is a photography forum. Obviously a 23 year old Volkswagen is just the job for one-upmanship, I can see people in their two year old saloons and hatches looking suitably cowed and overcome by inferiority as I lumber along in my £1000 rusting shed of a vehicle that barely makes it to 60mph flat out :D.

It is also very good for getting to work in the snow. Last winter I was the only person that lived outside walking range that made it to the office when it snowed. I pulled it away from stationary around a stranded car up a steep hill that the police were in the process of closing as impassable. The police woman that told me I'd never get to the top had a genuine "gobsmacked" expression on her face as just I drove off without spinning the wheels!
 
Nod said:
Yup, looking at the photo in that link (OP), the "normal" car appears to have absorbed a LOT of energy and used it to crumple quite effectively while the front of the Shogun (?) has relatively little deformation so has passed on a lot more of the energy to the occupants.
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That Shogun is an old car. Newer 4X4's have lower crash beams now to be more "friendly" to smaller cars instead of riding over the top. The major part of the deformation or crumple zone in these old 4x4's is actually the passenger compartment, hence the lovely crease in the roof by the B pillar shown in the picture. Had the 4x4 hit something with a bit more resistance the occupants would have been alot more at risk of serious injury, as the bend in the middle of the vehicle would have been alot more serious .
 
srichards said:
How do you know both vehicles weren't single occupants and are both dead? 4x4s aren't crash tested to the same standards as passenger cars so they can actually be worse in an accident as they transfer the collision energy to the passengers instead of through the vehicle.
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It's not confirmed on this particular story but on other Scottish news sites it was confirmed that both occupants of a Corsa were killed.
 
Briony said:
So I take it you are against all 4 x 4 drivers and they should not be on the road :thinking: but they are needed to get about in Scotland because of the adverse weather conditions and at the end of the day it was an accident and could have been any other car, van truck, lorry etc just happened to be a well built 4 x 4:shrug:
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You make Scotland sound like some third world nation without tarmac! :lol:

Nothing wrong with 4x4's as like you say people need them for off-road purposes. Shame most people never take them off-road. I don't see many tractors taking the kids to school :shrug: Sod it, I'm gonna take one of our 37 tonne excavators to work in future and that shouldn't be a problem because we also need it for going off-road ;)

True that it could be a truck or some other large vehicle but they are build at that size for road going purposes. If only people who needed 4x4's bought them then it reduces the odds of others coming across them.

Besides, it's not just being in a crash with them that's a problem. They are generally not environmentally friendly, prevent you seeing past them clearly which causes a danger to others and are very annoying when they drive past you on that ice covered hill with a big stupid grin on their face as you steadily slide backwards into the unmarked traffic police car behind.....
 
Arkady said:
Right, so just stay at home and hide under the bed, 'cause that's the only place you can avoid traffic accidents...
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You're not even safe there :p

CT said:
The roads were treacherous here first thing and I had a rear view mirror full of Range Rover grill for abouit 2 miles - trying to intimidate me into going quicker and about 4 feet off my back bumper. I loved the way the fat git driving had one elbow up on the door with that supreme air of confidence which only comes when you know you've reached the pinnacle of driving excellence.
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You could substitute Range Rover for almost any marque you want. I'm guilty of it occasionally and I drive a Skoda FFS!
 
Christ, I can't even tell what the car on the left was - the shogun is relatively intact in comparison.
 
gman said:
You make Scotland sound like some third world nation without tarmac! :lol:

No :lol: :D

Nothing wrong with 4x4's as like you say people need them for off-road purposes. Shame most people never take them off-road. I don't see many tractors taking the kids to school :shrug: Sod it, I'm gonna take one of our 37 tonne excavators to work in future and that shouldn't be a problem because we also need it for going off-road ;)

True that it could be a truck or some other large vehicle but they are build at that size for road going purposes. If only people who needed 4x4's bought them then it reduces the odds of others coming across them.

Besides, it's not just being in a crash with them that's a problem. They are generally not environmentally friendly, prevent you seeing past them clearly which causes a danger to others and are very annoying when they drive past you on that ice covered hill with a big stupid grin on their face as you steadily slide backwards into the unmarked traffic police car behind.....
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Arkady said:
Right, so just stay at home and hide under the bed, 'cause that's the only place you can avoid traffic accidents...

Wake-Up Simmo: **** happens, so it pays to protect yourselves accordingly.

You cannot fully mitigate against pure accidents (or stupid idiots on the road)...

If you want to risk your family in a cheap flimsy car, fine. Mine will be in the tank you accidentally drive into...
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:agree:
I have a LWB pajero, my beast of a car - i need mine for my business (well the space anyway)

However, let me tell a little story
5 years or so ago I was driving down a main road, 40mph limit, me doing about 35mph. I see a car pull out of a street about 1/4 mile ahead of me, turn towards me, start speeding up at a rate of knots, then start snaking all over the road before he spun it and hit me head on (police estimate he was doing about 70mph)

I remember it in slow motion now which is strange - i was knocked out and when i came round i was surrounded in glass and very little leg space at all. I was panicing but managed to climb over to the passenger seat and let myself out. The car that hit me (a mitsubishi hatchback) was obliterated and i was so scared that the other person might be dead but when i looked in the car there was nobody - the sods had only got out and run off and for all they know, left me for dead.

I passed out again and woke up in an ambulance - the police said i was so lucky to be alive, if I were in anything smaller than my frontera i wouldnt be here now - the truck was a total write off and even the photos the witnesses took now make me feel sick - but i thank my lucky stars i was driving it.

I now protect me and my young son by driving another 4x4, and I am a very careful driver.
 
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The A9 should be dual all the way. It is criminal for it not to have been done seeing how much of a busy road it is.

Not surprised there's little left of a corsa. They're about as strong as tin foil.
 
The problem with the A9 is simply some of the people who drive along it. Everytime I drive Perth > Inverness I see atleast two insane drivers overtaking coming up to bends etc.

Thankfully I've never seen an accident happen infront of me but its been close several times. I can see a bend just infront of the police car in the article so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was overtaking someone.
 
I drive a 4x4 because I want to. I dont need to justify it to anyone. I pay for the tax and fuel and the tyres.
 
Briony said:
and also would not say, No to a Volvo estate, used to have these and love them.
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You'd think they were all safe wouldn't you

[YOUTUBE]qBDyeWofcLY[/YOUTUBE]
 
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