Glossy vs Metallic vs special Fine Art Papers

sk66 said:
I could adjust that... That's just the color I got when I assigned the color profile of sRGB to the saved file...the "correct" proPhoto profile looked horrible.

I don't honestly know what's going on...I've used Safari and Firefox... updated both, enabled (verified) all of color management options (firefox). And checked several browser tests (i.e. http://www.color.org/browsertest.xalter http://petapixel.com/2012/06/25/is-your-browser-color-managed/ http://www.gballard.net/psd/go_live_page_profile/embeddedJPEGprofiles.html). I can't find a problem on my system but the 3 images in post 20 look distinctly similar (essentially identical) and they should look notably dissimilar (based upon your screenshot).
If you're seeing things differently than I am and you're having issues with printing/color space, then I have to assume you're doing something wrong.
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You can't see even the full sRGB spectrum on MBP and my test clearly exposed these limitations. That is exactly what is going on.

Anyway we are very far off-topic now. If I could afford to buy and constantly use Canon iPf 8400 I would do that today. As it stands now I either need to print images without too much red, orange or cyan - or find half-affordable pro lab that is happy to spend 1 min editing per file.
 
Ozei said:
What do you need the lab to do in the edit?
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Ideally - take my 16Bit ProPhotoRGB tiff (or 8bit aRGB in the worst case) and covert it properly to their printer profile. Nothing more, nothing less.
 
IE10/Chrome/Firefox are all color managed, but I *believe,* of those only firefox also uses the monitor's profile. They *should* all behave the same in those tests because the images are converted/tagged correctly (for the intended purposes). IE8 was the last version of IE to not have any color management.

Here's another series of tests; if your browser is correctly setup you shouldn't see anything weird...

And this page is pretty interesting.... http://regex.info/blog/photo-tech/color-spaces-page2
 
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daugirdas said:
Ideally - take my 16Bit ProPhotoRGB tiff (or 8bit aRGB in the worst case) and covert it properly to their printer profile. ....
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Why not choose a lab based on price and print quality, then ask if they'll do the above conversion at their end. If they say 'no' on the grounds of cost/extra work, ask them for the necessary profile so you can do the conversion at your end.
 
Ozei said:
Why not choose a lab based on price and print quality, then ask if they'll do the above conversion at their end. If they say 'no' on the grounds of cost/extra work, ask them for the necessary profile so you can do the conversion at your end.
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I've asked Loxley and DSCL (re their fine art papers). The answer was NO. OVI don't make what I want. WhiteHall is the only other [expensive] alternative I found on google so far.
 
Ozei said:
Did they say 'no' to you doing it at your end?
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As already stated, they told me to supply sRGB, or one of their lustre, glossy or metallic C-type profiles (and they only go up to 18x12" there)
 
daugirdas said:
As already stated, they told me to supply sRGB, or one of their lustre, glossy or metallic C-type profiles (and they only go up to 18x12" there)
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Yes, but you want to use their fine art papers. Are you saying they have profiles for these papers but won't supply them to you?
 
Ozei said:
Yes, but you want to use their fine art papers. Are you saying they have profiles for these papers but won't supply them to you?
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Correct, i.e. they "had too many issues with that before"
 
daugirdas said:
Correct, i.e. they "had too many issues with that before"
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So they'll apply the fine art profile at their end but only if you supply 8bit sRGB files (i.e. not if you supply 16bit ProPhoto files)?
 
Ozei said:
So they'll apply the fine art profile at their end but only if you supply 8bit sRGB files (i.e. not if you supply 16bit ProPhoto files)?
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Correct again. They will not accept 16bit, and would treat ProPhoto as if it was sRGB...
 
daugirdas said:
Correct again. They will not accept 16bit, and would treat ProPhoto as if it was sRGB...
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Have you actually spoken to DSCL by phone? If not, I'd ring the lab manager and explain the situation - ask if he'll either send you the fine art profiles or do the conversion their end. His name is Andrew Baker (or it was last year) - tel 0161 474 8680.
 
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daugirdas said:
I am looking for the following:
  • rich but fairly accurate colours
  • some wow factor
  • retain impact in a darker room
  • no harsh colour transitions / wide colour gamut
I can most likely use DSCL and One Vision Imaging (for most Zenfolio orders)

P.S. Do these accept AdobeRGB or ProRGB files? How about 16bit? Would that make a difference to colour gradations and deeper reds? Use colour correction or not (I just had my lesson with Photobox slapping ultra vivid profile, but will DSCL fare better)?

P.P.S. With so many variables I need some clear idea before I can really benefit from just ordering a sample pack. Thanks for help.
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well so called fine art paper is out of the question as they have none of your prerequisites

uploading adobeRGB or proRGB to DSCL will result in drab images also neither will be able to make use of the full colour gamute afforded by adobe RGB or proRGB so upload 8bit sRGB or with embedded with a supplied profile.

what you really want is a decent inkjet print on a fibre based paper not some crapy laser print on Fuji archive paper anyway lol
 
Ozei said:
Internet Exploder 10 shows no discernible difference between the three pics. Chrome and Firefox both show the difference - particularly in the middle pic.
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I can see the difference pretty well using IE10
 
POAH said:
....what you really want is a decent inkjet print on a fibre based paper not some crapy laser print on Fuji archive paper anyway lol
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If DSCL's Fuji Frontiers are so crappy which lab do you recommend?
 
Ozei said:
I'm not sure what you meant then.
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Fuji frontiers are fine but inkjets are better that's all - gloss or even semigloss prints on Fuji frontiers and alike are fine for snap shots or holiday pics but they don't have the look that you can get from the various FB papers. obviously this is personal preference.

pigment inkjets also have better light fastness too
 
POAH said:
Fuji frontiers are fine but inkjets are better that's all - gloss or even semigloss prints on Fuji frontiers and alike are fine for snap shots or holiday pics but they don't have the look that you can get from the various FB papers........
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I'd agree with you there - but I suspect the Fuji Frontier is the only reason DSCL can supply prints so cheaply. If they used inkjets their prices would surely be far more expensive.

Do you know of a lab that supplies inkjet prints anywhere near these prices? http://www.dscolourlabs.co.uk/photo-printing-prices.cfm
 
Ozei said:
I'd agree with you there - but I suspect the Fuji Frontier is the only reason DSCL can supply prints so cheaply. If they used inkjets their prices would surely be far more expensive.

Do you know of a lab that supplies inkjet prints anywhere near these prices? http://www.dscolourlabs.co.uk/photo-printing-prices.cfm
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DSCL large prints are inkjet but not with the fancy paper - what size are you wanting to print at?
 
Not reading all this, soorry but I have the profiles downloaded from DSCL and use them in Lightroom Print module.
I've used pearl before for some car prints, which worked really well.
 
POAH said:
DSCL large prints are inkjet but not with the fancy paper - what size are you wanting to print at?
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I only need approx 15-20 inch at the moment (longest side) - is that too small for DSCL's inkjet option? Ordinary lustre/satin paper would do.
 
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Ozei said:
I only need around 15-20 inch prints at the moment (longest side) - is that too small for DSCL's inkjet option? Ordinary lustre paper would do.
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Anything over 18x12 is inkjet. However you will be printing those from sRGB files...
 
daugirdas said:
Anything over 18x12 is inkjet.
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I must admit I have trouble telling what's what on their website. There appear to be three options for printing onto paper:
  1. ONLINE (5x3.5 to 36x12) - Fuji Frontier used for all sizes? http://www.dscolourlabs.co.uk/photo-printing-prices.cfm
  2. FINE ART (7x5 to 60x24) - Epson inkjet used for all sizes? http://www.dscolourlabs.co.uk/Poster-Prices.cfm
  3. LARGE FORMAT (14x14 to 60x24) - Epson inkjet used for all sizes? http://www.dscolourlabs.co.uk/Poster-Prices.cfm
Am I right about the printers used for each range?

daugirdas said:
.... However you will be printing those from sRGB files...
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You mean as opposed to a profile for a specific paper?
 
Ozei said:
I must admit I have trouble telling what's what on their website. There appear to be three options for printing onto paper:
  1. ONLINE (5x3.5 to 36x12) - Fuji Frontier used for all sizes? http://www.dscolourlabs.co.uk/photo-printing-prices.cfm
  2. FINE ART (7x5 to 60x24) - Epson inkjet used for all sizes? http://www.dscolourlabs.co.uk/Poster-Prices.cfm
  3. LARGE FORMAT (14x14 to 60x24) - Epson inkjet used for all sizes? http://www.dscolourlabs.co.uk/Poster-Prices.cfm
Am I right about the printers used for each range?



You mean as opposed to a profile for a specific paper?
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That sounds like the info on their website.

I wouldn't try to make out any difference between 2 and 3 - there probably is very little, apart from more textured paper.
I have also tried to work out which epson they use. There is a mention of a modern 7700 printer somewhere deep in FAQ (I hope this is something they forgot to update over the decade!), but the also mention Ultrachrome K3 inks (much better, and incompatible with much older 7700). For reference Epson's current line is mostly on Ultrachrome HDR (= K3 + 2 more colors).
 
daugirdas said:
That sounds like the info on their website.

I wouldn't try to make out any difference between 2 and 3 - there probably is very little, apart from more textured paper.
I have also tried to work out which epson they use. There is a mention of a modern 7700 printer somewhere deep in FAQ (I hope this is something they forgot to update over the decade!), but the also mention Ultrachrome K3 inks (much better, and incompatible with much older 7700). For reference Epson's current line is mostly on Ultrachrome HDR (= K3 + 2 more colors).
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Yes, it's info I gleaned from the website.

I think the 7700 mentioned in the FAQ is the Fuji Frontier LP 7700, not the Epson Stylus 7700.

http://www.dscolourlabs.co.uk/faqs.cfm
http://www.fujifilm.com/products/photofinishing/digital_minilabs/lp7700/
http://www.epson.co.uk/gb/en/viewcon/corporatesite/products/mainunits/overview/3674
 
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I've just had some Fuji Metallic prints back from DSCL and I am very happy with them indeed. Stunning finish.

I also had a gloss and a lustre version of one print included as a comparison to show the difference to the client - the Fuji Metallic was simply outstanding.
 
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