Freddie the seal mauled by a dog...

[ancient_mariner]

Are there many salmon in the Thames ?

Only if someone drops their shopping bag in the water, and by that time it's probably smoked anyway.

 

[sphexx]

Are there many salmon in the Thames ?

There used to be of course until the seals (& the London apprentices) ate them all along with the oysters and lately the seals have gobbled up all the reintroductions:

Millions wasted on Thames salmon stock

Schemes costing millions to reintroduce salmon to the Thames are a waste of money, researchers claimed today.

www.standard.co.uk

 

[boyfalldown]

I don't suppose that they could prove she was hunting with the dog - which is an offence, so there could well be a gap in the law that needs closing.

She was hunting seals with a dog while with her children in London in a Sunday afternoon. Seems unlikely

 

[boyfalldown]

Apparently the dogs owner is a QC, and her Lawyer says she has committed no crime.
(She also lives in a £6m house)

Woman in charge of dog that savaged Freddie the seal is top QC

Rebecca Sabben-Clare QC, 49, lives in a £5.8million house with her husband William, 57, not far away from Hammersmith Bridge, where the incident took place.

mol.im

I'm not really sure how her house is relevant (or there is another report this morning naming her father (what)). How she'll ever get a reasonable trial is beyond me

 

[boyfalldown]

Nasty gash on the seal's flipper but I find myself wondering why it was necessary to have it put down ... probably more to it than I have observed but we do have seal sanctuarys etc for injured and displaced seals.

Rightly or wrongly British Divers Marine Life Rescue (I may have the name slightly wrong) have a policy that they euthanise any animal they rescue that they can't return straight away after treatment to the wild

 

[sphexx]

Rightly or wrongly British Divers Marine Life Rescue (I may have the name slightly wrong) have a policy that they euthanise any animal they rescue that they can't return straight away after treatment to the wild

Good policy. I wish the RSPCA & others did the same with some of the poor creatures they rescue rather than keeping them to feature in their adverts. Seal ‘sanctuaries‘ are particularly problematic since they are liable to infect seals with bugs they never come across in the sea .

 

[darkroom12]

I'm not really sure how her house is relevant (or there is another report this morning naming her father (what)). How she'll ever get a reasonable trial is beyond me

No offence = no trial!

What I said before was. there is no proof she was hunting with a dog, if there was that would be an offence!

Read the posts properly. Wars have been started because someone didn't read information properly.

 

[boyfalldown]

No offence = no trial!

What I said before was. there is no proof she was hunting with a dog, if there was that would be an offence!

Read the posts properly. Wars have been started because someone didn't read information properly.

I’ll remember that next time I go hunting with mine. I’ll go straight to the nearest police station when I’m done.

My reading and comprehension is fine, would you like a lesson?

 

[sphexx]

No offence = no trial!

What I said before was. there is no proof she was hunting with a dog, if there was that would be an offence!

Read the posts properly. Wars have been started because someone didn't read information properly.

My dog hunts every day on private land with permission. The police are not interested .

 

[boyfalldown]

My dog hunts every day on private land with permission. The police are not interested .

Last time I trained mine to hunt on public land they were very interested. They were fascinated and previously had no idea as to the things that were possible. We had a really good chat about what I was doing

 

[sphexx]

Last time I trained mine to hunt on public land they were very interested. They were fascinated and previously had no idea as to the things that were possible. We had a really good chat about what I was doing

One of the (many) problems with the Hunting Act 2004 is that ‘hunting’ is not defined (nor is defined who has to have the ‘intention’) and there are some daft inclusions and exemptions .

 

[Mozziephotography]

I had a guy come out to me once effing and blinding telling me to pick up the dogs crap.
I said he tried to do a crap, but he's constipated and nothing came out. I told him to come and check.
He said "pick it up or I'm calling the cops"...I told him to crack on and I'd wait for them to turn up....
He swore at me again and I told him to eff off....

Willow often does "phantom poos" in the hope that she'll be rewarded with a biscuit.

 

[sphexx]

Willow often does "phantom poos" in the hope that she'll be rewarded with a biscuit.

i had someone complain my dog when was sniffing at something invisible on the ground — he claimed it meant he was about to crap because “dogs sniffing the ground means they are about to crap” .

 

[SimplyGreatShots]

Why people just can't leave a dog on the lead when there are wild animals around is beyond me.
Because on an irresponsible dog owner, everyone else has been denied the opportunity to see such a gorgeous creature now.
Such a shame for the seal.

 

[sphexx]

Why people just can't leave a dog on the lead when there are wild animals around is beyond me.
Because on an irresponsible dog owner, everyone else has been denied the opportunity to see such a gorgeous creature now.
Such a shame for the seal.

Because there are wild animals everywhere? And what about the 5 Freedoms?

 

[SFTPhotography]

Because there are wild animals everywhere? And what about the 5 Freedoms?

And what about other people who are intimidated by them. Do they not have the freedom and right to not be intimidated in public.

Dogs in public places should be on the lead. It allows the owner to control the dog and prevent it harassing, intimidating and hurting other people and other animals - including other dogs. It's not a huge ask either, keep the dog on a lead and pick up its poop. With the privilege (if you can call having a dog that) of dog ownership comes responsibility to. One, to ensure the dogs welfare, secondly, to ensure the welfare of others who encounter your dog

Quite frankly I find dogs at best a mild annoyance, especially their poops. I'm far from alone on holding that view - many see them as a malign thing in society. After all we have strict laws, obligations and responsibility on motoring, gun ownership so why not pet ownership?

 

[SFTPhotography]

Well, what the dog did to the seal is rather mild in comparison to what the human race does to one-another.

Yes random muggings and feral attacks are all too common, although most frequently when I'm out walking its not people I'm concerned about but dogs which the owner can barely control.

Maybe I'm fortunate, I've never been involved in a violent altercation with a human, but plenty near misses with other dogs. In my experience dogs are a more malign thing than our own species

 

[Gremlin]

Dogs in public places should be on the lead. It allows the owner to control the dog and prevent it harassing, intimidating and hurting other people and other animals - including other dogs. It's not a huge ask either, keep the dog on a lead and pick up its poop.

There have been several cases locally of dogs on leads lashing out and attacking people
walking past.
It's going to get worse with all these dogs acquired during lockdown. it's not the dog's fault it's the owners not socialising or training them.
Many people seem to think one evening spent at classes is all they need and just don't do anything in between.
It's such a shame because at the end of the day it's the good owners that bear the brunt of any
legislation, no one checks up on dog owners anyway.

 

[Deleted member 34016]

I have seen this too @Gremlin in our local park

I have 2 x Springer Spaniels (My Ex- Gun Dogs) and I say sit- they sit I say stop and they stand still - and look to me all the time awaiting a command to continue doing what I stopped them for lol

why can't owners take responsibilty for their animals is beyond me

Les

 

[sphexx]

And what about other people who are intimidated by them. Do they not have the freedom and right to not be intimidated in public.

Dogs in public places should be on the lead. It allows the owner to control the dog and prevent it harassing, intimidating and hurting other people and other animals - including other dogs. It's not a huge ask either, keep the dog on a lead and pick up its poop. With the privilege (if you can call having a dog that) of dog ownership comes responsibility to. One, to ensure the dogs welfare, secondly, to ensure the welfare of others who encounter your dog

Quite frankly I find dogs at best a mild annoyance, especially their poops. I'm far from alone on holding that view - many see them as a malign thing in society. After all we have strict laws, obligations and responsibility on motoring, gun ownership so why not pet ownership?

To mark National Puppy Day, Elizabeth Lo’s acclaimed film Stray gives humans rare insight into the canine gaze, courtesy of homeless mutts in Istanbul

Since 2004, it has been illegal to euthanise or capture any stray dog in Turkey. The result, in Istanbul, is that dogs now eat, sleep, defecate and mate wherever they choose. The authorities merely vaccinate, sterilise, tag and provide medical attention to the strays.
...
We think that we treat dogs better in the west. But really the fact that New York, London, LA don’t have dogs on the street is indicative of how intolerant we actually are. Unless a dog is property, it has no rights at all. Which is insane if you think about it. We’ve somehow reframed the insanity of killing millions of dogs every year or letting them languish in cells as the moral thing to do when in fact it’s the opposite

View: https://youtu.be/u8iiIbVYPYI

'What appointments did these dogs have to keep?': long lunches and brief liaisons in a radical new dogumentary

To mark National Puppy Day, Elizabeth Lo’s acclaimed film Stray gives humans rare insight into the canine gaze, courtesy of homeless mutts in Istanbul

www.theguardian.com

 

[mstphoto]

Tragic news!! Staffies, as an example, were once so placid dogs. Just goes to show what happens when they are unfortunate to get the wrong owners. Up here in NE Scotland we have seals that kill dogs. A few years ago, a seal killed a Labrador!!


REPLY

 

[Gremlin]

I have seen this too @Gremlin in our local park

I have 2 x Springer Spaniels (My Ex- Gun Dogs) and I say sit- they sit I say stop and they stand still - and look to me all the time awaiting a command to continue doing what I stopped them for lol

why can't owners take responsibilty for their animals is beyond me

Les

When I was taking my GSP to gundog classes (first HPR I had) there was another lady there
with a lovely but useless Spinone,
My boy a 1yr old rescue was almost as bad, she said she had be going for a year
Think I would have given up.
A month later the trainer couldn't believe the change in my boy and used him for the demo
hard work spending time training but paid off
I spoke to him after the previous class and seem my problems were that I was treating him
wrong, he wasn't a lab or a GSD

 

[sphexx]

There have been several cases locally of dogs on leads lashing out and attacking people
walking past.

I think when some dogs are retrained restrained on a lead they feel insecure in some way. I had a dog that was perfectly OK with other dogs when off the lead, in fact fairly uninterested in dogs or people, but on the lead would bite anything within reach (the leash, my leg etc) if another dog was even on the other side of the road in some circumstances ;(.

Edit: restrained!

 

[sphexx]

I have seen this too @Gremlin in our local park

I have 2 x Springer Spaniels (My Ex- Gun Dogs) and I say sit- they sit I say stop and they stand still - and look to me all the time awaiting a command to continue doing what I stopped them for lol

why can't owners take responsibilty for their animals is beyond me

Les

Not all breeds/dogs are trainable in the same way. Also maybe not all people are capable of doing the training .

 

[Sky]

To train a dog takes time, love and lots of patience. The reward/result is a fantastic and most rewarding relationship that only those that have experienced it can appreciate.

Sadly, most dog owners just can't be bothered and can't even manage to get their dog to sit or come back when called. It just shouldn't be allowed to happen.

Still, it's the same with kids. The majority of parents let them remain almost feral - a pest in society that will grow up to be disliked by all - except maybe their feral dogs.

People shouldn't be allowed kids or dogs unless they have had the necessary training . . .

 

[Bobsyeruncle]

Still, it's the same with kids. The majority of parents let them remain almost feral -

I'd say it's a minority. I've never come across any almost feral kids.
Maybe it's like that where you live but certainly not here...sure, you get some that are cheeky etc, but the majority are great.

 

[Gremlin]

I'd say it's a minority. I've never come across any almost feral kids.
Maybe it's like that where you live but certainly not here...sure, you get some that are cheeky etc, but the majority are great.

But as with dogs, no one notices the well behaved kids

 

[Sky]

I'd say it's a minority. I've never come across any almost feral kids.

You're probably right Bob, it just feels like the majority at times. Luckily, not where I am now . . .

 

[darkroom12]

There have been several cases locally of dogs on leads lashing out and attacking people
walking past.
It's going to get worse with all these dogs acquired during lockdown. it's not the dog's fault it's the owners not socialising or training them.
Many people seem to think one evening spent at classes is all they need and just don't do anything in between.
It's such a shame because at the end of the day it's the good owners that bear the brunt of any
legislation, no one checks up on dog owners anyway.

Some folk don't seem to know how to treat an animal and would not even know where to start if they wanted to. Living to one side of me (actually my partners sister) has a GSD/Border collie cross about 2 yrs old now and a really nice animal. Daft as they come, just a big puppy actually. They have given it attention all the time. I take it out occasionally when I go for my walks and it is so obedient if I let it off the lead it never strays or gets attracted by other dogs or cats (rabbits are another matter though!). It is a pleasure to walk with. (It is also a damn good house dog as well - cheaper than an alarm!) Otherwise he is so laid back and relaxed about anything except travelling by car - he hates it.

The other side of me, when I moved here about 6 years ago the people who live there had a massive overweight American Labrador that was only rarely taken out for a run, just up the tracks at the back and back again. perhaps 10 mins max (hence it's weight problem that was responsible for a heart attack that killed it just over 3 years ago. Then there was a gap of about 6 months than 2 new lab pups arrived one black and the other golden. They are going the same way as the other one. They never get taken for a long walk, Just the same as the other one they had just a quick trot off up the track and back home. They are a little older than the GSD/collie cross but have absolutely no discipline. They are taken out each with a harness and pull on the way out and on the way back. I doubt if they have been allowed to run together where they would get exercise. Hells teeth I live right on the edge of the open Durham hills they would have a terrific life if they were allowed to run, the dogs would basically exercise themselves.

They are both showing signs of being overweight now so how long before they too suffer from heart disease?

 

[Bobsyeruncle]

They are both showing signs of being overweight now so how long before they too suffer from heart disease?

Labradors are prone to obesity due to some kind of defective gene apparently.
Lack of exercise only makes it worse....

 

[Marc]

Labradors are prone to obesity due to some kind of defective gene apparently.
Lack of exercise only makes it worse....

Yes, I grew up with a Labrador. She was well exercised. Walked at least twice a day and taken to a large park every weekend (and yes, let off the lead). She was never overweight and lived to 15 years old.

 

[SFTPhotography]

There have been several cases locally of dogs on leads lashing out and attacking people
walking past.
It's going to get worse with all these dogs acquired during lockdown. it's not the dog's fault it's the owners not socialising or training them.
Many people seem to think one evening spent at classes is all they need and just don't do anything in between.
It's such a shame because at the end of the day it's the good owners that bear the brunt of any
legislation, no one checks up on dog owners anyway.

Dog ownership is a big issue, and one that can't be avoided by the big political parties fir too much longer.

A dog on a lead is more easily avoided and if things get frisky the dog can be reigned in. It also means it can't take off or go after you. Because I keep a wide berth I've been spared this very outcome, and I've seen many a dog go berserk just when you approach on the lead. I'll always cross the road when I see a dog, lead or no lead, coming towards me on the pavement.

People in general are far too complacent about the dangers other peoples dogs pose them, and the dangers/upset their dogs pose other people.

In this case had the dog been on the lead this seal attack wouldn't happen. Such a simple thing that should be mandatory would save a lot of trouble

 

[LCPete]

I must admit although I’m not anti dog, family members have happy well trained sociable dogs , I do believe that in public dogs should be on a lead just for people’s safety.
On a recent walk to our local nature reserve we had two big aggressive dogs run at us barking and the owners were not interested at all didn’t even attempt to call them back
Most dog owners are responsible but I still believe that all dogs should be on a short lead in public

 

[sphexx]

I take it out occasionally when I go for my walks and it is so obedient if I let it off the lead it never strays

But a lot of that is a breed characteristic of both collie & GSD . Though a GSD is ‘guarding‘ and the collie ‘herding’ probably but the result is the same .

 

[sphexx]

I must admit although I’m not anti dog, family members have happy well trained sociable dogs , I do believe that in public dogs should be on a lead just for people’s safety.
On a recent walk to our local nature reserve we had two big aggressive dogs run at us barking and the owners were not interested at all didn’t even attempt to call them back
Most dog owners are responsible but I still believe that all dogs should be on a short lead in public

Post #61

 

[Gremlin]

Labradors are prone to obesity due to some kind of defective gene apparently.
Lack of exercise only makes it worse....

Usually the bred for showing variety, working labs are stunning and rarely overweight

 

[boyfalldown]

I'll always cross the road when I see a dog, lead or no lead, coming towards me on the pavement.

The dogs are very happy about that. Saves them the embarrassment of having to do the same

 

[Bobsyeruncle]

Usually the bred for showing variety, working labs are stunning and rarely overweight

Apparently the most overweight ones are assistance dogs....
My neighbour has 2 labs and they are semi retired working dogs but he takes them for extremely long walks/exercise and neither are overweight....the fattest ones I see tend to belong to oap's who obviously aren't able to provide enough exercise....

 

[sphexx]

Apparently the most overweight ones are assistance dogs....
My neighbour has 2 labs and they are semi retired working dogs but he takes them for extremely long walks/exercise and neither are overweight....the fattest ones I see tend to belong to oap's who obviously aren't able to provide enough exercise....

I think the point is that labs (and some others) are particularly prone to getting overweight but don’t have to be with a controlled diet & exercise — like some people .

 

[SFTPhotography]

The dogs are very happy about that. Saves them the embarrassment of having to do the same

I'm more than happy to get further away from a dog and I'm proud to show the owner I'm not keen on their choice of companion

But leads should be mandatory imho. Saves the owner the embarrassment of trying to retrieve their dog should it take an interest in a random public member.