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farrance

farrance

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I'm interested in using some off camera flashes for my work but I'm quite new to the concept of it. I'm planning to buy a 430exII to go alongside a jessops flashgun as a slave and some radio triggers but the whole load confuses me..

Will the triggers transmit iTTL? Correct exposures etcetc, what to go for.. what to do.. how to do..

:help:
 
I am positive you can't use a canon 430 ex11 as a master :suspect: you need a canon 5 series ex flash...If you want to retain E-TTL, get a Yongnuo ST-E2 or go manual/radio with RF-602. not sure which Jessops one you have...:)
 
farrance said:
I'm interested in using some off camera flashes for my work but I'm quite new to the concept of it. I'm planning to buy a 430exII to go alongside a jessops flashgun as a slave and some radio triggers but the whole load confuses me..

Will the triggers transmit iTTL? Correct exposures etcetc, what to go for.. what to do.. how to do..

:help:
Click to expand...

Short answer for an E-TTL trigger is Yongnuo 622. Excellent, and a quarter the cost of anything similar, like £80 a set. Some long threads on this here. Check compatibility for guns.

If it's just manual triggering only you want, then almost any cheap trigger with any gun will do. Most folks seem to go Yongnuo for that too, but loads of others about.
 
farrance said:
I'm interested in using some off camera flashes for my work but I'm quite new to the concept of it. I'm planning to buy a 430exII to go alongside a jessops flashgun as a slave and some radio triggers but the whole load confuses me..

Will the triggers transmit iTTL? Correct exposures etcetc, what to go for.. what to do.. how to do..

:help:
Click to expand...

Your 430ex2 cannot act as a master. It only works in slave mode. I don't know much about your jessops gun but it may have an optical trigger that can be used. You will have to check. Generally speaking if you want the full capability of the Canon flash system, then stick with Canon flashes.

That said, you need the following as a minimum to get started.

1. A transmitter to fit on your camera.
2. A receiver for each of your flash guns.

If you want to get started with basic manual flash there are a variety of cheap and cheerful triggers from people like Yongnuo, Phottix, Pixel King etc. Using these, you will have to set the power of your flash guns manually and shoot in manual mode on your camera.

As you spend more and more on your triggers you will gain more and more functionality and other things like ETTL. Its really up to you how much you want to spend. What ever you end up buying make sure it is compatible with your flashguns.

Although you didn't ask for this, I would advise you to start in manual mode. Its not terribly difficult and it allows for maximum control.

Also, read the following website. It provides an excellent introduction to what you want to do.

www.strobist.com

On the right hand side of the screen you will see dropdown controls with 'Lighting 101 archive and Lighting 102 archive' in them. Read all of the articles in those two archives in order. Might take you a while but its the best introduction to flash out there.

Regards...
 
The strobist article is crazy informative, I'm needing to get my kit in as soon as I can to try all the new things I've learned out!

I've been hearing some really good things about Yonguo flashes, are there any with eTTL support? Which are some good ones to go for?
 
farrance said:
The strobist article is crazy informative, I'm needing to get my kit in as soon as I can to try all the new things I've learned out!

I've been hearing some really good things about Yonguo flashes, are there any with eTTL support? Which are some good ones to go for?
Click to expand...

Yes, they do flashes and triggers with ETTL support.
 
Phil V said:
Yes, they do flashes and triggers with ETTL support.
Click to expand...

Do you know which ones? I'm looking on amazon and can only find the 560.

I'm really confused by the majority of flash designations.. I used to think all I would need is a 430exII but I don't! I can save alot of money in consideration.\

Is there a Yongnuo flash which can be used in place of a 430 but it's also decent for off camera flashing?
 
By 'support', what do you want it to do?

Your 5d II doesn't control an external flash wirelessly. So you'll need a wireless trigger, either IR or radio:

For IR control there's the Canon ST E2 (there's a YN equivalent) or you need to mount a flash that has a Master mode, the Canon 550ex, 580ex, or YN565.

For ETTL radio triggers, there's many options, but the latest YN 602's are probably the best value, coupled with a YN 565 (add more YN 560's later). A set of PW flex for one Canon or Nissin flashgun costs more than a 430ex:gag: but is the best option :thumbs:

For full on strobist mode, YN manual guns and manual triggers will give the best bang for buck, and whilst it's fiddlier to set them up, it's what I'd recommend for someone that wants to get truly creative. 2 or 3 YN 560 guns and a pair of triggers for less than the cost of a 430 ex II.

Of course if money is no object, an STE3 wireless trigger from Canon and 3 600 ex guns will only cost you around £1600 and offer great control from the camera to your guns. Awesome in use, I've seen a guy controlling 6 of these in 3 groups from the camera menu with a variety of modifiers - total control from the camera position:clap:
 
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so if I had a budget of say.. £250 for a couple of flashes and some ability to use that off camera, what would you recommend?
 
farrance said:
Do you know which ones? I'm looking on amazon and can only find the 560.

I'm really confused by the majority of flash designations.. I used to think all I would need is a 430exII but I don't! I can save alot of money in consideration.\

Is there a Yongnuo flash which can be used in place of a 430 but it's also decent for off camera flashing?
Click to expand...

Yes. Yongnuo range is very confusing, not helped by often nonsense translations from Chinese.

Top model is the new 568EX - it's basically like a Canon 430EXII, including high speed sync, plus a few more features - about £110. YN 560EX and YN 565EX will also act as E-TTL remote slaves, and cheaper, but no HSS (very well worth having IMHO) http://www.lightingrumours.com/yongnuo-yn-568ex-is-first-speedlight-in-china-with-hss-2718

Best bit is they also work with the Yongnuo 622 E-TTL triggers (not 602 as Phil says above - typo) for a totally sorted radio system, auto or manual. However, the advantages of full auto control (mainly speed of set up, and ability to react immediately to changing situations) are reduced with remote units as you have to take time to fix them all up anyway, and usually have some control over what's happening. In which case many folks prefer manual, as you know the flashes won't change unless you change them.
 
farrance said:
so if I had a budget of say.. £250 for a couple of flashes and some ability to use that off camera, what would you recommend?
Click to expand...

Does your budget include stands and modifiers?
 
Phil V said:
Does your budget include stands and modifiers?
Click to expand...

stands yes, compact ones preferably. Modifiers yes, umbrellas definitely. I do mainly band portraits and automotive work and I think I've only hit the tip of the flash modifier iceberg
 
I think I can skip on the E-TTL/iTTL stuff.. by the sounds of the 101 and everyone on here they are saying manual is a much easier option to do.
 
If you say £50 for stands brollies and reflectors (no quality stuff)

YN 603 triggers = £20
leaving £180 which will get you 3 YN 560's and one of these and some batteries.

You might have to go over for a decent charger - don't think about using Alkaline batteries in flashguns.
 
Dont want to confuse you any more but id recommend getting at least one flash with ettl and then if you ever need to stick a flash on camera for a quick shot youll have that option, i can recommend the 565 as ive got one and its a great flash for the money :-)
 
eddyc said:
Dont want to confuse you any more but id recommend getting at least one flash with ettl and then if you ever need to stick a flash on camera for a quick shot youll have that option, i can recommend the 565 as ive got one and its a great flash for the money :-)
Click to expand...

I can't argue with that.
So that's a 565 and a 560, a softbox, 2 stands and one of those fancy doo-dads.
a pair of wireless triggers and a brolly and bracket.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
 
Phil V said:
I can't argue with that.
So that's a 565 and a 560, a softbox, 2 stands and one of those fancy doo-dads.
a pair of wireless triggers and a brolly and bracket.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
Click to expand...

That sounds pretty good.. would the 565 effectively replace the 430? it would be important and I wouldn't be using it all the time but if I ever needed a flash for automatic use, I assume it would be up to use?
 
The Yongnuo flashes have a patchy reputation for reliability, some say they're trouble free and some users saying they're rubbish.

Unfortunately, if you want build quality, you generally have to pay for it. But the YN 565 will go straight on your camera and communicate in exactly the same way the Canon flashes do, better than the 430 as it acts as a master not just a slave.

This would be a very flexible solution, especially if you add a long ettl cable.
On camera ettl flash
On camera ettl flash with manual slave
On camera ettl flash with ettl slave
Off camera ettl flash with manual slave (cabled)
Off camera ettl flash with ettl slave (cabled)
2 off camera manual wireless flashes.

Now all you need is to learn the hard stuff, controlling the quality of the light.
 
Phil V said:
The Yongnuo flashes have a patchy reputation for reliability, some say they're trouble free and some users saying they're rubbish.

Unfortunately, if you want build quality, you generally have to pay for it. But the YN 565 will go straight on your camera and communicate in exactly the same way the Canon flashes do, better than the 430 as it acts as a master not just a slave.

This would be a very flexible solution, especially if you add a long ettl cable.
On camera ettl flash
On camera ettl flash with manual slave
On camera ettl flash with ettl slave
Off camera ettl flash with manual slave (cabled)
Off camera ettl flash with ettl slave (cabled)
2 off camera manual wireless flashes.

Now all you need is to learn the hard stuff, controlling the quality of the light.
Click to expand...

Not 100% certain on this, but I don't think Yongnuo makes an auto-TTL master/commander enabled gun, though several can act as slaves. Also, only the YN 568EX can do high speed sync, whereas all current Canon flashes do HSS.

IMHO it makes sense to have at least one top spec gun.

Edit: if some kind person can explain YN's confusing range and model numbering system, I'd be grateful!
 
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Phil V said:
The Yongnuo flashes have a patchy reputation for reliability, some say they're trouble free and some users saying they're rubbish.

Unfortunately, if you want build quality, you generally have to pay for it. But the YN 565 will go straight on your camera and communicate in exactly the same way the Canon flashes do, better than the 430 as it acts as a master not just a slave.

This would be a very flexible solution, especially if you add a long ettl cable.
On camera ettl flash
On camera ettl flash with manual slave
On camera ettl flash with ettl slave
Off camera ettl flash with manual slave (cabled)
Off camera ettl flash with ettl slave (cabled)
2 off camera manual wireless flashes.

Now all you need is to learn the hard stuff, controlling the quality of the light.
Click to expand...

I must say a thank you first of all for all your information, you are proving to be exceedingly helpful in my quest for light control.. that said.. I am still infinitely confused at the kit I should be buying. I won't need to have a flash on permanently but I would like for atleast one of the flashes to be eTTL incase I needed it. If a 430 can't act as a master there not much point me using it. Which YN flashes use a eTTL and can also act as a master, or is eTTL just a feature of flashes that can be masters?
 
I was recently in the same situation as you, (I am on the nikon path so my options are somewhat different but either way yongnuo's range is horrendous to understand).
The site www.speedlights.net has lists of all the current options. - http://speedlights.net/flash-for-canon-ettl-speedlites/

If I may interject: multiple ettl units, I intended to go manual with all my off camera flashes, am I missing something?
 
farrance said:
I must say a thank you first of all for all your information, you are proving to be exceedingly helpful in my quest for light control.. that said.. I am still infinitely confused at the kit I should be buying. I won't need to have a flash on permanently but I would like for atleast one of the flashes to be eTTL incase I needed it. If a 430 can't act as a master there not much point me using it. Which YN flashes use a eTTL and can also act as a master, or is eTTL just a feature of flashes that can be masters?
Click to expand...

No, Canon 430 is not a master unit, but the smart way of getting around that is to use YN 622 E-TTL triggers - their transceivers work as both masters and slaves, and use radio of course.

Personally, I'd get one YN 568EX, then you have one fully specced unit for use on-camera - it does everything except mastering. To save cash, back that up with 565 guns, with YN 622 triggers to match.
 
So how does this sound then..

YN 565EX
YN 560 as a slave.
RF-602/622(?) triggers
2x compact stands
2x Umbrellas
Some Sanyo Eneloop batteries (or should I just do lithiums?)
A banging charger.
Flash shoe to diffuser adapter..

Comes to just over £150 all in on amazon Thats not bad, but I'm just seeing as to whether I would need the extra flash just yet, if so it goes up to a pint over £200
 
That would work, though you need to be clear about YN RF-602 and 622 triggers. They're not the same at all and there was a typo in one of Phil's earlier posts, #9.
 
HoppyUK said:
Not 100% certain on this, but I don't think Yongnuo makes an auto-TTL master/commander enabled gun, though several can act as slaves. Also, only the YN 568EX can do high speed sync, whereas all current Canon flashes do HSS.

IMHO it makes sense to have at least one top spec gun.

Edit: if some kind person can explain YN's confusing range and model numbering system, I'd be grateful!
Click to expand...

Sorry Richard, I'm no expert on YN gear, from reading the specs on Amazon the flash looked like it acts as Master, we could use an actual YN expert round here.

Although I'll be buying Nissins next to go with the Canon and PW flexes.
 
What are the better ones to go for considering my uses for it? What are the prime differences between the 602 and the 622's?
 
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