Film development gear

andy1868

andy1868

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Andy
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So i apologise in advance if this has already been covered elsewhere. I've found the tutorials very useful on how to develop films on here and also looked through some youtube videos which were handy. However the time has come to actually buy some developing kit for myself and wanted to run some items past you guys to make sure i'm buying the right stuff and not wasting money.

Now i like shooting colour and black and white and as a result i was looking at C41 stuff to allow me to do both (if possible) It's also worth mentioning that it's mostly going to be 35mm but also some 120 too (hopefully more in the future) so obviously i'll need different reels for 35mm and 120, this is something i'm aware of :)

I'll list below the stuff i've picked out from watching videos etc and see if i've missed anything out! :) Any advice is greatly accepted, especially on the chemical front as i know different chemicals give different results etc so if you feel this one isn't a good line to go down i'll heed anyones advice :)

C41 Developer. Bleach and Fix
http://www.firstcall-photographic.co.uk/products/5157/firstcall-c41-prediluted-kit-3x-500ml-softpack

Chemical Storage bottles x3
http://www.firstcall-photographic.co.uk/products/850/ap-chemical-storage-bottle-3395z-1-litre

Developing Tank
http://www.firstcall-photographic.co.uk/products/811/paterson-developing-tank-universal

Thermometer
http://www.firstcall-photographic.co.uk/products/4867/adox-thermometer-dial-with-8-inch-probe

Changing bag (I don't really have anywhere to shut off into complete darkness, even under the stairs isn't completely dark)
http://www.firstcall-photographic.co.uk/products/818/firstcall-changing-bag-small

I know i'll need something to clip up the films to dry and probably something to contain the water while i heat chemicals up (something like a washing up bowl). I've practised taking the cap off 35mm canisters with a bottle opener with surprising ease so may carry on with that method if it comes to it. Is there anything i've missed?

Thanks in advance
Andy
 
The Patterson reels are adjustable to fit both 35mm and 120.
 
Oh and good luck, its great fun and adds immeasurably to the whole process of obtaining an image.
 
Personally I would buy both black and white and colour chemicals or you will be restricted to shooting just Ilford XP2 in b&w (I think this is the only one you can dev in C41 chems). It means a little more expense to begin with but it gives you more scope in the long run.
I haven't used those C41 chems you have linked to so I can't comment personally but I seem to remember reading that there were some issues with them...I can't remember what the issues were either. :confused:
I've been using the Tetenal Colotec C41 kits and I really like the results.

Andy
 
you might be better off with a changing tent rather than a bag. Loading 35mm onto reels is a real pain in the bum, especially the last 6 or 7 inches, having more room to work your hands around in a tent might be better. Or just invest in a few meters of black cloth to close the understairs cupboard off. Having a dark room to load things in makes life so much more bearable and worth the effort in setting up.
 
andy1868 said:
I know i'll need something to clip up the films to dry and probably something to contain the water while i heat chemicals up (something like a washing up bowl). I've practised taking the cap off 35mm canisters with a bottle opener with surprising ease so may carry on with that method if it comes to it. Is there anything i've missed?
Click to expand...

I'd recommend that you don't take the cap off, instead wind the film out back through the cassette's slit. It's a lot easier, particularly in a changing bag and you don't have to wrestle with a 4ft long snake in the bag. If you get into trouble you can always wind it back in to the cassette. If you are using a Paterson tank, then you can start the film off in daylight by engaging the prepared end of the film under the steel balls at the start of the reel, then put the reel and film in the bag. Remember not to wind the leader back in when you unload the camera. If you do, then it's worth buying a leader retriever.
Andysnap said:
The Patterson reels are adjustable to fit both 35mm and 120.
Click to expand...

Some are, some aren't. The reel from the 35mm tank just takes that size, the reels from the Universal tank are adjustable.
 
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^^^ Didn't know that, I've only ever seen the adjustable ones. (y)
 
Andysnap said:
Personally I would buy both black and white and colour chemicals or you will be restricted to shooting just Ilford XP2 in b&w (I think this is the only one you can dev in C41 chems).
Click to expand...

In addition to XP2, there's also Fuji Neopan 400CN, which is a fantastic film. That said, I too would want to have the option of traditional black and white, if developing at home.
 
Andysnap said:
^^^ Didn't know that, I've only ever seen the adjustable ones. (y)
Click to expand...

My apologies! You were correct in the first instance. I've just been down to look at my two tanks and the reels look the same. If I twist the one from the 35mm tank very hard, it can be pulled out to 120 spacing. It won't fit in the 35mm tank of course but it's the same reel as from the Universal one.
 
You might want to consider using 24-exposure rolls for the first few attempts to reduce the difficulty of loading the reels.

C41 is much more critical than black and white as regards temperature, and while it's not difficult once you are used to all the other processes (loading the tank, pouring the chemicals in the right order, and rinsing) I think you may find the path smoother if you process b&w first.

I use the Rollei Digibase chemicals which are the same as sold by firstcall, but in different packaging. The only real issue is that the instructions don't mention that you need to rinse with water both before and after the bleach stage. The softpacks don't include a stabiliser as the final step; there have been many threads on this issue but there seems to be a consensus that stabliser is not essential with modern films.

If you do jump straight to C41 processing I suggest using Poundland Agfa Vista film rather than something more expensive, to start with.
 
Wow what a response, thanks guys!

Andysnap said:
Personally I would buy both black and white and colour chemicals or you will be restricted to shooting just Ilford XP2 in b&w (I think this is the only one you can dev in C41 chems). It means a little more expense to begin with but it gives you more scope in the long run.
I haven't used those C41 chems you have linked to so I can't comment personally but I seem to remember reading that there were some issues with them...I can't remember what the issues were either. :confused:
I've been using the Tetenal Colotec C41 kits and I really like the results.

Andy
Click to expand...

I see where you're coming from with the black and white argument, i'll see about both kinds especially if B+W is easier it might be best to start there. Variety is the spice of life!

AshleyC said:
you might be better off with a changing tent rather than a bag. Loading 35mm onto reels is a real pain in the bum, especially the last 6 or 7 inches, having more room to work your hands around in a tent might be better. Or just invest in a few meters of black cloth to close the understairs cupboard off. Having a dark room to load things in makes life so much more bearable and worth the effort in setting up.
Click to expand...

I'll see what i can do, i could potentially get away with this at my mum and dad's where i am living at the moment. Hoping to move soon, but the under the stairs cupboard has windows in the door so might be less suitable. As somebody said using a retriever might be an idea to get it started :)

NickT said:
I'd recommend that you don't take the cap off, instead wind the film out back through the cassette's slit. It's a lot easier, particularly in a changing bag and you don't have to wrestle with a 4ft long snake in the bag. If you get into trouble you can always wind it back in to the cassette. If you are using a Paterson tank, then you can start the film off in daylight by engaging the prepared end of the film under the steel balls at the start of the reel, then put the reel and film in the bag. Remember not to wind the leader back in when you unload the camera. If you do, then it's worth buying a leader retriever.
Click to expand...

Duly noted, i feel this might be best for me, especially being a n00b to it so might make it easier for me!

skysh4rk said:
In addition to XP2, there's also Fuji Neopan 400CN, which is a fantastic film. That said, I too would want to have the option of traditional black and white, if developing at home.
Click to expand...

I do have some Neopan in 120 at the moment, one of the films i was hoping to try developing. I also have a couple of old rolls of Kodak Professional Black and White 400CN in 135 which is also C41.

Kevin Allan said:
You might want to consider using 24-exposure rolls for the first few attempts to reduce the difficulty of loading the reels.

C41 is much more critical than black and white as regards temperature, and while it's not difficult once you are used to all the other processes (loading the tank, pouring the chemicals in the right order, and rinsing) I think you may find the path smoother if you process b&w first.

I use the Rollei Digibase chemicals which are the same as sold by firstcall, but in different packaging. The only real issue is that the instructions don't mention that you need to rinse with water both before and after the bleach stage. The softpacks don't include a stabiliser as the final step; there have been many threads on this issue but there seems to be a consensus that stabliser is not essential with modern films.

If you do jump straight to C41 processing I suggest using Poundland Agfa Vista film rather than something more expensive, to start with.
Click to expand...

I think i may get some black and white chemicals too and start there if it is easier (i need some film then too, which is always a nice purchase :lol:)
 
andy1868 said:
I do have some Neopan in 120 at the moment, one of the films i was hoping to try developing. I also have a couple of old rolls of Kodak Professional Black and White 400CN in 135 which is also C41.
Click to expand...

Just double check that your Neopan is definitely the C-41 process 400CN, if you haven't already, as most of the Neopan emulsions are traditional black and white films. The 400CN is a great film, if that's the one that you have.
 
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Other bits you may find useful:

- Rubber gloves, so your hands don't stink, and more importantly, you don't end up with skin irritations...a lot of tanks leak a bit.
- Old tea towels to cover work surfaces, if you are working in a kitchen etc.
- Measuring cylinders (check the instructions for your chemicals and work out what you need). I use syringes for chemicals where you only need very small amounts. (note: the Rollei Digibase C41 kit is supplied with syringes).
- Funnels to help get your chemicals back in the bottles.
- Bottles of filtered or spring water to make up your chemicals if you live in a hard (or dodgy) water area like me.
- I use a salad spinner to remove most of the surface water from the film before hanging - helps to reduce water marks (counter-balance it with an empty reel if you're only processing one film).
- I know I'm going to get laughed at for saying this, but I now wear safety specs when mixing my chemicals from the concentrates. A couple of weeks ago I crouched down so my eyes were level with the beaker and a tiny bit of the fluid splashed on my face (thankfully not in my eyes) when I poured the water in too quickly. It gave me a bit of a scare, so on go the specs now. I don't bother during processing because my face is well away from the tank and there's nothing splashing around.
- Storage files for your negatives. I use the plastic Kenro ones, which are fine for 120 film, but I find them a pain to get 35mm in and out. Anyway, I have loads to use, so it's tough luck! LOL. I also use a Kenro binder to store the sheets.
- A bit of string to hang over the bath.
- Beer.
- Understanding wife/partner/housemates.

Also, have a look on eBay before you spend a ton of money on developing equipment. You can pick up job lots containing everything you need for peanuts, whereas new items like beakers and thermometers can be really expensive.

Have fun!
 
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Thanks RJ and J :)

I checked my Neopan, and it's definitely C41 which is nice :)

Thanks for the other list J, they're all little things i probably never thought about. And safety is never something to be laughed at, i managed to get hot oil in my eye earlier this week making some fajitas and my eye was a good 2 feet away. That was sore enough, i'd hate to get chemicals in there too.

I'm working on the last one, she supports my photographical endeavours but in the past that's never meant potent chemicals stinking up the kitchen/bathroom. I've got planning permission from her for an office/photography "effing about" room after we eventually get a place for ourselves :D
 
I've just done some processing with Ilfosol, Ilford Stop Bath and Ilford Rapid fixer, and it was almost odour-free (the stop bath smelled a bit, not much). I did for a while have possession of a leaky Rollei Digibase kit and that was a bit more smelly, but nowhere near stinky.
 
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