EU Immigrants to the UK add more to the economy than they take out

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ST4 said:
Well that is just it. I believe in the case of those on JSA etc, you can. They need to be told to apply and that supervised in the job centre. Ok its seasonal work, but its work, it fills the CV and makes getting other jobs easier. If people who are on benefits who can pick fruit, they should be effing well made to pick fruit rather than be on benefits.
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Time to invoke Godwin ;)

Steve, you would have fitted in really well in '30s-40's Germany with your love of forced labour.

Work makes you free? Forced work even better?
 
cambsno said:
So the Romanians you see around park lane came here because they had jobs? How many Brits go abroad to work without either a job to go to or a chunk of money to live off and invest.
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That's not what I said though. I am suggesting that the intent is to work.


Steve.
 
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Dave1 said:
Time to invoke Godwin ;)

Steve, you would have fitted in really well in '30s-40's Germany with your love of forced labour.

Work makes you free? Forced work even better?
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Some very familiar words at the bottom there.
 
Steve Smith said:
That's not what I said though. I am suggesting that the intent is to work.


Steve.
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Really, you come to this country and can't speak the lingo, what job can you do, how can you get by, what benefit are you to the country/economy?

While many Brits go abroad and can't speak the lingo, english is a universal language so it a bit one sided.
 
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Nikon_Nick said:
Some very familiar words at the bottom there.
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That seems to be his attitude lately.

I'm beginning to suspect @ST4 's current posting manner is a complicated trolling of the forum just to see what reactions it can provoke. No one could really have that mix of opinions and attitudes he appears to have and still be a normal member of society, not even Paul Dacre is that bad ;).
 
Dave1 said:
That seems to be his attitude lately.

I'm beginning to suspect @ST4 's current posting manner is a complicated trolling of the forum just to see what reactions it can provoke. No one could really have that mix of opinions and attitudes he appears to have and still be a normal member of society, not even Paul Dacre is that bad ;).
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Indeed. Wasnt the 'Work makes you free' phrase on a gate at Auswitz? (Sp)
 
Nikon_Nick said:
Indeed. Wasnt the 'Work makes you free' phrase on a gate at Auswitz? (Sp)
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Arbeit Macht Frei, yes, it was above the gates.

It would Steve seem wants us to think he considers a toned down version of the principle is what the UK needs to implement on the poor of the nation.

Work camps of forced labour for the farms, and probably work houses for the urban poor to work in factories.
 
Dave1 said:
Arbeit Macht Frei, yes, it was above the gates.

It would Steve seem wants us to think he considers a toned down version of the principle is what the UK needs to implement on the poor of the nation.

Work camps of forced labour for the farms, and probably work houses for the urban poor to work in factories.
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Oh well...as long as its toned down eh? :D
 
ST4 said:
So people that disagree with you are Nazi's. Jeez we have hit new lows. What is wrong with wanting the best chances for your own people and having a sense of national pride about ones own country.
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You weren't advocating "the best chances for your own people", you were advocating forced labour camps for the unemployed, ex-convicts and prisoners.

Pretty much what the Nazis did before their system twisted the labour camps into death camps.

So, as I said, you are advocating a toned down version of stage 1 of the National Socialist plan of Arbeit Mach Frei.
 
Dave1 said:
You weren't advocating "the best chances for your own people", you were advocating forced labour camps for the unemployed, ex-convicts and prisoners.

Pretty much what the Nazis did before their system twisted the labour camps into death camps.

So, as I said, you are advocating a toned down version of stage 1 of the National Socialist plan of Arbeit Mach Frei.
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Not forced labour camps, just no benefits. Its more of a stick if the carrot doesn't work.
 
ST4 said:
Not forced labour camps, just no benefits. Its more of a stick if the carrot doesn't work.
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So you have now changed your tune since your previous posts? Like this one, for example:

ST4 said:
They should be effing well made to pick fruit rather than be on benefits.

Jobs like this are ideal for ex cons out of jail starting over too.
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So, if they should "effing well be made" to do it, what is that but forcing them to do it? Forcing them to do it equals forced labour?

Do you get the concept now?
 
Dave1 said:
So you have now changed your tune since your previous posts? Like this one, for example:



So, if they should "effing well be made" to do it, what is that but forcing them to do it? Forcing them to do it equals forced labour?

Do you get the concept now?
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Well, effing well made to to me means no benefits, no money. If that doesn't make them, let them starve. We IMHO do not need dead weight in Britain.
 
ST4 said:
Well, effing well made to to me means no benefits, no money. If that doesn't make them, let them starve. We IMHO do not need dead weight in Britain.
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For someone who is such a proud little Englander your grasp of English is pretty poor as you seem to be struggling to make the words you write actually mean what you now try and say you mean.

"Effing well make them" certainly bears no resemblance to "stopping benefits".

So your manifesto has now changed to say that the "best chances for your own people" means you want to kick people into the gutter by cutting off all benefits if they refuse the forced labour? So, the "best chances for your own people" is to make them homeless, hungry and destitute?

What happens to their children when the parent refuses the forced labour and lose all benefits? Do they go to the poor house with the parents? Or do we become like India and allow people to live on the pavement where they beg?
 
Still waiting for the world to be continentally altered by Steve @ST4
 
Dave1 said:
You weren't advocating "the best chances for your own people", you were advocating forced labour camps for the unemployed, ex-convicts and prisoners.

Pretty much what the Nazis did before their system twisted the labour camps into death camps.

So, as I said, you are advocating a toned down version of stage 1 of the National Socialist plan of Arbeit Mach Frei.
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Not really. It was us Brits that invented concentration camps and I know soviet Russia had labour camps too.
 
cambsno said:
Not really. It was us Brits that invented concentration camps and I know soviet Russia had labour camps too.
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The old British camps were more prison camps than labour camps, but, yes, the Soviets did refine the labour camps of the Nazis. I would still think the Nazis were the forerunners of industrialised forced labour camps/factories in modern times.

They had forced labour operating across Germany and the occupied countries of Europe, not just the concentration camps, but industry, mining and the military all used forced labour. Some famous name companies still in business today used forced labour in Germany, right through the war.
 
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Dave1 said:
So you have now changed your tune since your previous posts? Like this one, for example:



So, if they should "effing well be made" to do it, what is that but forcing them to do it? Forcing them to do it equals forced labour?

Do you get the concept now?
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So what is your solution, if someone decides they will not work but they are going to just accept benefits is that ok

I really have zero issue with those who are looking for work or indeed will do a three month contract while seaking a job they would prefer even having something on the CV

I had an occasion I was made redundant following a union calling strikes in a company that actually was looking after its workforce. I tried getting back into the career path I had followed and could not find a job. I took a job that was below my benefits after a full month I got paid after paying my essentials I could afford a transistor radio aprox £16 that included overtime. After six months I had got ahead again and was back in credit. I still have the radio as a reminder of tough times.

If I could take a job less than dole why should people not do the same, I think most want a job will work for poor pay the option has almost gone because so many will work for very little as its a fortune where they came from.
 
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Dave1 said:
You weren't advocating "the best chances for your own people", you were advocating forced labour camps for the unemployed, ex-convicts and prisoners.

Pretty much what the Nazis did before their system twisted the labour camps into death camps.

So, as I said, you are advocating a toned down version of stage 1 of the National Socialist plan of Arbeit Mach Frei.
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Talk about a tenuous link and trying to make someone say that firstly they really didn't. And secondly clearly didn't have any intention of saying.

I've got to admit, yes sure @ST4 choice of words is crude at times, disagreeable very often. But come on the pack mentality that is being displayed here and in other threads actually, ironically, show up many of you in an even worse light in my opinion.
 
Dave1 said:
For someone who is such a proud little Englander your grasp of English is pretty poor as you seem to be struggling to make the words you write actually mean what you now try and say you mean.

"Effing well make them" certainly bears no resemblance to "stopping benefits".

So your manifesto has now changed to say that the "best chances for your own people" means you want to kick people into the gutter by cutting off all benefits if they refuse the forced labour? So, the "best chances for your own people" is to make them homeless, hungry and destitute?

What happens to their children when the parent refuses the forced labour and lose all benefits? Do they go to the poor house with the parents? Or do we become like India and allow people to live on the pavement where they beg?
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Pot and kettle there @Dave1

You've taken that one but totally out of context of a discussion that was very clear what it was about. Well my apologies I misrepresent that. Obviously it wasn't clear since you can't get it and go off on some tangent accusing a fellow forum member of being a Nazi.

His comments that you get so hung up on were none of the kind when you apply basic comprehension and read all of it and the other peoples comment in that discussion.

Whilst I disagree with them from an employers perspective as I stated then, to link them to the Nazis is just plain ridiculous.

Perhaps if you have direct experience like myself where my grand mothers estate was commanded in the war. Where my father as a little boy was made to witness the executions. Where they saw first hand what happened. Where I had to perform many a time official duties at Belsen with those who were survivors and those who had lost people. Perhaps then you can learn to grow a bit more tolerance, comprehension and wind your neck in with tenuous links.
 
If there is a job that someone is capable of doing and they don't have a job and they do not wish to take the job then I'm sorry the state should wash their hands of them.

People are too concerned about force, the wrong doings of the. 30s and 40s rather than the present. Basic common sense is out the window as people pussyfoot about the wrongs of yesteryear of which there are only a few living persons remaining.

Widen up, cutting someone's benefits when there's a job out there for them isn't Hitlerism it's basic sense. The person needs to take the job, it's better for them and the tax payer and the country. The job centre needs to be getting these people into work and building relations with employers like a private sector agency, not this farce we have.
 
dejongj said:
I've got to admit, yes sure @ST4 choice of words is crude at times, disagreeable very often. But come on the pack mentality that is being displayed here and in other threads actually, ironically, show up many of you in an even worse light in my opinion.
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And that seems like a good place for a group hug and go put the kettle on
 
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