Elderly Drivers

dejongj said:
Thinking about that. Could be an interesting photo challenge for the next mega mega meet :) might even wear my Mr Motivator costume for it :)



Why is it impractical? Many other countries include it. I'm amazed today as much as when I learned 20 years ago that it isn't part of learning to drive and passing the exam in the UK.

As a general point I don't think actual driving standards are the issue. People and their righteous appealing attitudes is what make driving standards seem bad. People don't want to let anyone out, especially if they go faster or drive a German car or a big 4x4 or a small car or are old or are young or whatever. So many reasons and so little forgiving.
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Maybe because it would mean a nigh on 3-4 hour driving test for some people,given the distance to the nearest motorway?
Instructors and examiners and indeed the DVSA won't do it.
It's been shot down many times.
 
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Judging by what they have written there are quite a few commenters in this thread who ought not to be driving so not wanting to offend anyone I shall not comment ...
 
viv1969 said:
Maybe because it would mean a nigh on 3-4 hour driving test for some people,given the distance to the nearest motorway?
Instructors and examiners and indeed the DSA won't do it.
It's been shot down many times.
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Oh dear. And what is wrong with that. It's only once in a lifetime. Either you want that license or not. A pathetic excuse in my opinion.
 
viv1969 said:
Maybe because it would mean a nigh on 3-4 hour driving test for some people,given the distance to the nearest motorway?
Instructors and examiners and indeed the DSA won't do it.
It's been shot down many times.
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What about including a night driving slot too, which could only start after about 11pm or later in midsummer? Should people who take their test in smaller towns, where there isn't much traffic, have to take a further test before being allowed to drive in large cities? This would add a few hours more...just getting there.
 
dejongj said:
Oh dear. And what is wrong with that. It's only once in a lifetime. Either you want that license or not. A pathetic excuse in my opinion.
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That's why a staggered scheme will harm no one.
What about snow/ice driving? Should that be included?
If so, should all learners move to Scotland until they pass, and pray it's inclement weather when their test comes around?
 
viv1969 said:
That's why a staggered scheme will harm no one.
What about snow/ice driving? Should that be included?
If so, should all learners move to Scotland until they pass, and pray it's inclement weather when their test comes around?
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Yes good idea :p

If snow was a regular occurance then yes. But come on we are talking about a motorway. It is 2016 not 1955.
 
dejongj said:
. It is 2016 not 1955.
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Nothing much has changed in that time if you live somewhere like northern Scotland, Norfolk etc.
 
Major said:
Ruth, I'm not attacking elders, all I say is that at this age most struggle with simplest tasks and sadly suffer some bad effects of said age. Being young and irresponsible is not the same thing as being old and barely able to control the vehicle.

BTW, common sense is not related to age. You either have it or you don't.
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Somewhat sweeoing statements in there. You have tested 'most' 93 year olds?

My last car was parked legally, in a quiet side road, clear blue light evening, whilst I visited my sister.

Screech of tyres, metal on metal sound and then another.

Yep - a car had ran into the car behind mine and pushed it into my car. Result 3 written off cars. Driver turned out to be a little worse for drink and was still on a ban from his then current DUI ban. Entended further at court.

All I can say, using your mindset, it is a typical behaviour of an 'up their own arse' 29 year old. (Really his age)

So you have till your 29th birthday to be perfect then it's downhill till you are 93.

At 61 with 41 years of driving - I have Zero points for any traffic offence, no 'to blame' accidents, zero parking tickets.... I voluntarily surrendered my driving licence for 15 months after a stroke last year and had to retake an extended driving test, which I passed easily, to get it back.

My 2 sons are 26 and 30..... they are very careful drivers.... do you think it might have to do with the current points theu have built up ln their licences?

Damn those nonsensical sweeping statements.....
 
viv1969 said:
Nothing much has changed in that time if you live somewhere like northern Scotland, Norfolk etc.
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Hehehe even the more reason.

I took three lessons. But each was a day long, so probably the equivalent of 15 lessons. Basically intense sessions where you get used to all driving conditions like rush hour, quiet periods, motorway driving, rural driving. As I said it's only once that you do this. People go more often on holiday ;)
 
MartynK said:
What about including a night driving slot too, which could only start after about 11pm or later in midsummer? Should people who take their test in smaller towns, where there isn't much traffic, have to take a further test before being allowed to drive in large cities? This would add a few hours more...just getting there.
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I took my test in a small town and in the 30years I have been driving never have I been on a motorway, To avoid going on the A55 I go over the mountains where they is no phone signal. I don't think I'd last long in a city, most of my friends are the same. This is where the thread began with my sister, when I get to her house in Wrexham she takes us shopping to Chester. Sob sob no more shopping for a whole month whilst the car is sorted. I am a country lane driver, you need great skill for this type of driving:agree:
 
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Shirleyr said:
. I am a country lane driver, you need great skill for this type of driving:agree:
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Really though, a truly proficient driver can easily cope with all conditions without apprehension.
Nervous drivers are dangerous....break pedal riders.
 
Shirleyr said:
I am a country lane driver, you need great skill for this type of driving:agree:
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The only real skill you need is to be able to reverse, you can bet the people you meet can't :(
I drive a lot of narrow lanes at work, no different to any other country road.
 
a good idea ---- from i think Australia

a 'new' driver under (18.?) can only drive alone
If he wants his mates/sheilas to be in the car too -- he has to have 1 adult with them
stops all the larking about

stops all the fun with sheila too.........:(
 
Steve,

Do I really need to "test" most 93 year olds? How would such tests be done? You just admitted yourself that you gave up your licence. Why? For fun? Or to avoid unnecessary risks? At 61 you still had a bit of wait till 93..

I have seen fairly few cases of folks much younger than 93 for whom even going to the toilet was a challenge. Never mind the details. I think I know where you're coming from - "some 29 yo t*** will not say I can't do this or that". That was not my point. My point is based on natural way things change.

Up my own arse you say.... Funny that, one elder gentleman that fainted in our local Tesco's car park didn't think so. It was just normal shopping with family, I went to pick few magazines and then my girl runs to me and shouts 'get your arse over there quick, someone just crashed into the gate'. As it turned out, he just lost it behind the wheel, floored it, smashed delivery gate and woke up after that. Brand new Mazda 6 was a total write off, by the time I arrived to the spot all possible fluids were leaking on the ground, someone took the keys off the barrel but ignition was still on. Staff was there but they didn't know what to do. After I managed to pop the hood to rip off the leads off the battery, I was holding his head and his blood was dripping on my hands till fire brigade arrived to cut him out of the wreck. Luckily he was responsive, so we managed to find out numbers to his family and some documents. Fella in his 60s. I will remember till my last day the look he gave me when he was being taken to the ambulance and the way he said 'thank you'.

Reading few post of the new forum member that I happen to be tells you nothing about my mindset. Same as your response tells me nothing about yours. Rest assured I am far from it. I've seen some nasty stuff that involved elders and young ones alike, including death. Things I didn't want to see.

But let me congratulate you on well rised children. I am a father of two myself, just a bit younger. My son started to ride bikes when he was 4yo - two years ago. He has his own bike and believe me, running after him in the car park just to catch him if things were to go pear shaped paid off. His skills are amazing and he rides like an animal - but knows his own limits. Sometimes we ride together too ;).

But getting back to the point - I think you misunderstood my post a bit.

Peace!
 
Gremlin said:
I drive a lot of narrow lanes at work, no different to any other country road.
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Absolutely!
And some of the cross country short cuts I take in Norfolk, the Mirrors are touching both sides of the hedgerow,
Life on the (h)edge :D
 
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From the town where I live it's 48 miles to the motorway. No way in hell could a driving test include that. There aren't enough examiners here to get through the applicants now never mind with that included. If you designed a driving test that really tested people's driving ability you'd be lucky to do one a day. Motorway, nighttime, rain, snow, rush hour, reversing 200 yards down country lanes, and keep adding things that drivers can't do properly.
 
viv1969 said:
Really though, a truly proficient driver can easily cope with all conditions without apprehension.
Nervous drivers are dangerous....break pedal riders.
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You never know what's round the next corner, especially in the dark. e.g black cow lying in the road, flock of sheep with no one with them. No pavements and children walking to school, your either on the road or in the ditch. Hazard after hazard.
 
Shirleyr said:
You never know what's round the next corner, especially in the dark. e.g black cow lying in the road, flock of sheep with no one with them. No pavements and children walking to school, your either on the road or in the ditch. Hazard after hazard.
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And?
That doesn't take a better driver.
 
When I did my CBT, instructor asked what is the hazard on the road. We started to list all stuff like animals, playing kids etc, but he just said "Everything is a f*****g hazard"
 
Shirleyr said:
This has been an excellent thread, tomorrow should I start another one 'Who are the best drivers ladies or men.':rolleyes:
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Are they on a country road, or a motorway?
What are their ages?
Are they towing?
:D
 
Gaz J said:
From the town where I live it's 48 miles to the motorway. No way in hell could a driving test include that. There aren't enough examiners here to get through the applicants now never mind with that included. If you designed a driving test that really tested people's driving ability you'd be lucky to do one a day. Motorway, nighttime, rain, snow, rush hour, reversing 200 yards down country lanes, and keep adding things that drivers can't do properly.
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48 miles. Wow you make it sound like it is far away ;)

It's a once in your lifetime event, come on let's get real about it.
 
Shirleyr said:
This has been an excellent thread, tomorrow should I start another one 'Who are the best drivers ladies or men.':rolleyes:
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Depends on how old the woman is ;)
 
dejongj said:
48 miles. Wow you make it sound like it is far away ;)

It's a once in your lifetime event, come on let's get real about it.
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I still don't think you're grasping that the DVSA, have refused to entertain the idea of motorway driving being included in the standard test on many occasions.
 
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boliston said:
Dual carriageways often have vehicles that travel below 20mph such as horse drawn vehicles and agricultural vehicles as well as pedal cycles - a minimum speed limit would only ever work on roads that do not carry this type of vehicle such as motorways. It would not be easy to enforce as there are often reasons to go 20mph below the speed limit such as fog and heavy rain.
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If you have a decent council, cyclists are on a shared cycle/footpath. Horse drawn vehicles are rare in this day and age and slow moving agricultural vehicles have to have a visible flashing light and a sign on the back warning it is a slow vehicle. It isn't always necessary to travel as much as 20mph lower than the speed limit because of fog or heavy rain neither. But aside from that there is no reason on a clear day for the majority of traffic to travel slower than a lorries maximum speed, meaning a lorry has to hold everyone up whilst he attempts to overtake and if it's a foreign lorry driver just pull out to overtake regardless of other traffic in the outside lane.
 
Shirleyr said:
This has been an excellent thread, tomorrow should I start another one 'Who are the best drivers ladies or men.':rolleyes:
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I've see quite a few blokes who drive like old women, does that help answer your question? ;)
 
It could be worse, we could have very simple driving tests to get a license like some other countries. These people can then come over here and drive on our roads. Up until 2011,
in Egypt all that was required was that you drove 6M forward and then 6M back. The current test doesn't involve much more.
In Pakistan you have to be 18, but you simply turn up to the license office, take a simple written test which hardly anyone fails, have had a medical, then spend less than a minute driving in and out of cones without knocking any over.
In India, if you haven't bribed the examiner 4-5,000 rupees to get your license, all you need to do is drive in a straight line, turn left and stop.
Best of all we have Mexico, you can get a driving permit at 15 for $100 and at 18 you will be issued with a full license, no training, no test, you don't even have to have sat in a car.
 
Major said:
Steve,

Do I really need to "test" most 93 year olds? How would such tests be done? You just admitted yourself that you gave up your licence. Why? For fun? Or to avoid unnecessary risks? At 61 you still had a bit of wait till 93..

I have seen fairly few cases of folks much younger than 93 for whom even going to the toilet was a challenge. Never mind the details. I think I know where you're coming from - "some 29 yo t*** will not say I can't do this or that". That was not my point. My point is based on natural way things change.

Up my own arse you say.... Funny that, one elder gentleman that fainted in our local Tesco's car park didn't think so. It was just normal shopping with family, I went to pick few magazines and then my girl runs to me and shouts 'get your arse over there quick, someone just crashed into the gate'. As it turned out, he just lost it behind the wheel, floored it, smashed delivery gate and woke up after that. Brand new Mazda 6 was a total write off, by the time I arrived to the spot all possible fluids were leaking on the ground, someone took the keys off the barrel but ignition was still on. Staff was there but they didn't know what to do. After I managed to pop the hood to rip off the leads off the battery, I was holding his head and his blood was dripping on my hands till fire brigade arrived to cut him out of the wreck. Luckily he was responsive, so we managed to find out numbers to his family and some documents. Fella in his 60s. I will remember till my last day the look he gave me when he was being taken to the ambulance and the way he said 'thank you'.

Reading few post of the new forum member that I happen to be tells you nothing about my mindset. Same as your response tells me nothing about yours. Rest assured I am far from it. I've seen some nasty stuff that involved elders and young ones alike, including death. Things I didn't want to see.

But let me congratulate you on well rised children. I am a father of two myself, just a bit younger. My son started to ride bikes when he was 4yo - two years ago. He has his own bike and believe me, running after him in the car park just to catch him if things were to go pear shaped paid off. His skills are amazing and he rides like an animal - but knows his own limits. Sometimes we ride together too ;).

But getting back to the point - I think you misunderstood my post a bit.

Peace!
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I have always been a 'petrolhead' - fastest I have driven is 168mph, (Lotus Carlton) on a track, fastest on a a UK public road is 135 (ish) - emergency blood delivery with Police escort. And on and on.

The simple fact is that stats alone, unless sanitized, tell us nothing.

Proportionately there are more 'elderly' drivers than 'young' drivers, so at first look the elderly have morw accidents than young.

Then break it down by normalising the data and the elderly actually have less accidents.

More young drivers die in their cars from accidents than the elderly..... and so on.

I voluntarily gave up my licence after the stroke I had in Jan 2015 left me unable to fire my DSLR let alone drive my (then Jag) car. That is because I have never seen my licence to drive as a right or permanent. When I was confident I asked my stroke consultant what he thought about me driving. He said go for it.

People of all ages can develop medical conditions that affect eyesight, hand/ete co-ordination, brain function and many more. One of my own compa y drivers crashed a car due to food poisoning. I would not let my first wife drive during her period.....

Yes the elderly need more managemdnt/rules/tests/medical as do new/younger/accident prone drivers.

The other side of the coin is cost. I woulf be happy if £0.0025 was put on the cost of fuel towards firming up the controls placed of drivers as the join and have to be tested age/illnss/competency matters etc.

You want to point a finger, then go and dig into the stats. The details are all there but you have to drill into them. Headlines are not facts.

I look forward to seeing a post from you in 12-15 years or so when your kids start driving..... you may then see the irony of commenting on other people's grown children who have reached the age of majority. PMSL at that one Major.....

On a sombre note, I was a Chair of Governors at a big secondary school.

In 3 years I went to 4 ex pupils and 1 current pupil) funerals who had died in car crashes; all under 21. All deeped driver at fault. In the same period I also attended the funeral of a 36 year old teacher who died in an early morning crash after a party.

So I agree age is a factor in car crashes.
 
viv1969 said:
I still don't think you're grasping that the DVSA, have refused to entertain the idea of motorway driving being included in the standard test on many occasions.
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I do grasp that idea, and have worked long enough in the public sector that I've got a pretty good idea what some of the motivations was behind that. And I bet they didn't make the report ;)
 
Shirleyr said:
You never know what's round the next corner, especially in the dark. e.g black cow lying in the road, flock of sheep with no one with them. No pavements and children walking to school, your either on the road or in the ditch. Hazard after hazard.
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Well I must be an absolutely amazing driver then.......

The vast majority of my driving is done on urban roads, my daily commute is 17 miles each way, around a few miles on "side streets" then dual-carriage ways with speed limits from 40mph up to the national speed limit.

A few times a year I drive on M-ways without issue.

This year I managed to drive all the way from Southend-on-Sea, Essex to Lantree in Devon (around 283 miles) where I encountered (for only about the 3rd/4th time in 21 years) the country roads you describe. In a lot of cases they barely passed as road being single track an in a bad state of repair.

Then there were very steep hills with twisty bits, agricultural vehicles etc, we also ran into a herd of cows. Somehow I managed to make progress and still keep my car and it's occupants safe.

Dunno how I coped with all of that considering how infrequently I've encountered those conditions/scenarios ;)
 
Russ77 said:
Well I must be an absolutely amazing driver then.......

The vast majority of my driving is done on urban roads, my daily commute is 17 miles each way, around a few miles on "side streets" then dual-carriage ways with speed limits from 40mph up to the national speed limit.

A few times a year I drive on M-ways without issue.

This year I managed to drive all the way from Southend-on-Sea, Essex to Lantree in Devon (around 283 miles) where I encountered (for only about the 3rd/4th time in 21 years) the country roads you describe. In a lot of cases they barely passed as road being single track an in a bad state of repair.

Then there were very steep hills with twisty bits, agricultural vehicles etc, we also ran into a herd of cows. Somehow I managed to make progress and still keep my car and it's occupants safe.

Dunno how I coped with all of that considering how infrequently I've encountered those conditions/scenarios ;)
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:)

I just got the biggest 4x4 I could get and barge through it all. Simples :)
 
I see there is a lot of p**** taking, water off a ducks back gentlemen. I don't think we need to open a thread who are the best drivers, goes without saying, us girls of course.:agree: how I wish that I could be a mod for a minute and lock the thread then no could argue, Hello lady mod's are you up yet, my thread, could you lock it to save me from all these men above who think different.:ty:
 
Lock the thread? Where's the fun in that? :-)
 
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