dslr v csc

Nope, film's been dead 10 years, yet I still use 2 Film SLRs regularly.
 
I can't see the DSLR every going down, but I can see CSC's becoming more popular in future, as their more versatile.
 
havent read any reviews or anything else just seen them in jessops... how they handle ISO performance and there is any external flashguns ?
 
I have seen them, but IMHO, by the time you put an external flashgun and buy various lenses, it becomes not so compact any more.

:)
 
so basically they would become quite uncomfortable to hold with all gadgets on them and pretty silly looking with so small body. :thinking:
 
So the trick is to minimise gadgets. One body, one lens, compact and subtle; use its strengths rather than examining its weaknesses.

I'm enjoying the NEX at the moment - and I've only ever shot it with the 16mm prime. No flash, no gadgets attached to it except a Wii wrist strap. The 24mm angle is one I'm not especially used to, and it's an interesting new view of the world.
 
But in time you want to get some more lenses e.t.c.

Just curious how it performs with high ISO ?
 
Plenty of things I would like a compact system camera to do - including replacing my LX3 which I still enjoy using.
However I wouldn't be looking for one to replace the 60D I recently got - wouldn't have gone one.

I think my ideal would be maybe to have a compact system for faster stuff (with optional digital viewfinder), then a full frame or (lottery ticket pending) compact medium format digital for stuff where the extra IQ is going to be worthwhile.
 
As a 'keen amateur', the G1 is functionally on a par with the 5D Mark II I had before, I never feel like it stops me getting the shots I want.

Certainly if I was advising a newbie photographer who was looking at getting an entry level-camera, unless they needed fast telephoto for wildlife/sports, I would point them towards the Panasonic G series, I don't believe that the Nikon/Canon entry-level models offer anything extra. The size and weight of the G-series gets past the barrier that accounts for most lapsed amateurs.....'not taking the camera out with me'-syndrome.

I can see the entry-level Canon/Nikon market getting squeezed pretty hard.
 
wallyboy said:
i read an article in mag about compact systems camera, looks like all the big names in camera's are going to make csc's, is this the beginning of the end of dslr
Click to expand...

Yeah I'm selling my D3 and buying a compact and an iPhone. Sorry but I think the DSLR is here to stay a while yet.
 
i think the dslr will be here for a long time, the pro's will take a long time to give up their gear (if at all) but the csc are ideal for amateurs like me - easy to use, allow creativity and more importantly you dont kill yourself lugging around heavy gear!
 
Compact will become more and more popular for those that just want to take photos when they are out, but for those on these forums will stay with DSLR's my missus has a compact and she loves it but i have used it a couple times, Composition imho isn't as easy for quick shots, nothing like you can get from a DSLR.

You can picture it now, sitting at home watching the footy on tv and you spot a 600mm lens mounted on a monopod with a compact attached to the other end lol he would get laughed off the pitch
 
CSC's have a place alongside DSLR's, they are not intended to replace them.
Both have their strengths and weeknesses.
 
duttytd said:
Get the desire hd the camera is spot on.
Click to expand...


I have a HTC desire. Sorry but somehow I can't imagine clients being too happy if I turned up with my phone LOL.

I hate using any phone as a camera, they are hard to hold and compose the shot, no view finder, terrible on screen menu based controls and IQ is sub par to say the least. Yeah I've seen the wedding shot on a phone and the coffee table books. It's a gimmick.
 
So you're not going for the latest phone compact system camera, then?
nokia-6280-slr-hack-1.jpg
 
Anything intended to be compact is compromised by design. I'd rather use something designed to be in your hands and used for taking photos than something that was designed to fit in a certain space.
 
interesting comments, one of the downsides is the changing of glass because it is not mechanical as such like dslr they are saying the sensor could be damaged by dust dirt etc even tho some have an automatic cleaner,
as a beginner it will be a difficult choice for me when i get new camera next year,
 
wallyboy said:
interesting comments, one of the downsides is the changing of glass because it is not mechanical as such like dslr they are saying the sensor could be damaged by dust dirt etc even tho some have an automatic cleaner,as a beginner it will be a difficult choice for me when i get new camera next year,
Click to expand...

Not sure what you mean about changing glass???
Sensors are NOT going to be damaged by dust or dirt as there are various layers added to the sensor, IR filters and such.
Pany and Oly have the BEST sensor cleaning system available.
 
I think CSC's are an alternative to SLR's, not necessarily a replacement in the marketplace. At present, they don't have the AF to match that of SLR's, and certainly not the image quality (or glass) to match full frame SLR's. It'll be interesting to see what happens in the future though.
 
Howi said:
Not sure what you mean about changing glass???
Sensors are NOT going to be damaged by dust or dirt as there are various layers added to the sensor, IR filters and such.
Pany and Oly have the BEST sensor cleaning system available.
Click to expand...

to quote....there is a perennial danger of dumping dust on the sensor when you change lenses, even if the model in question has a built in cleaning system,

article was from digital camera
 
Sony_SoFar said:
I can't see the DSLR every going down, but I can see CSC's becoming more popular in future, as their more versatile.
Click to expand...

More versatile in what way?

I think the DSLR is the most versatile system, especially now that most of them have video (should you want that).

Rob 80386 said:
I have seen them, but IMHO, by the time you put an external flashgun and buy various lenses, it becomes not so compact any more.
Click to expand...

They are marketed as being compact, and they are when they are reviewed with the small kit lens, or even worse with a prime lens attached, but as soon as you put a longer lens on, or have multiple lenses then it is not as compact a system. More compact than the equivalent DSLR system, but not 'compact'.

danbroad said:
So the trick is to minimise gadgets. One body, one lens, compact and subtle; use its strengths rather than examining its weaknesses.
Click to expand...

That sounds like a good idea, but I think more users will want more than one lens, and again, it isn't as compact anymore. The Sony NEX more than the others looks like it could be very uncomfortable and unbalanced with a longer lens on imho.

Howi said:
CSC's have a place alongside DSLR's, they are not intended to replace them.
Click to expand...

That's not maybe what the manufacturers intend. ;)

DazJW said:
Anything intended to be compact is compromised by design. I'd rather use something designed to be in your hands and used for taking photos than something that was designed to fit in a certain space.
Click to expand...

When people are interested in a DSLR, the prevailing first bit of advice is to try one in the hand, as they have normally chosen the level of camera based on features they want, though that has maybe dictated the size of the camera. The CSC buyer seems to go with the intention of getting the smallest camera. I'm not saying they don't try them, or that they don't consider the features and differences between the manufacturers, just that the size seems to be the overwhelming consideration in the camera choosing process, again imho.


As long as they are happy with what they have bought, who cares? ;)
 
wallyboy said:
to quote....there is a perennial danger of dumping dust on the sensor when you change lenses, even if the model in question has a built in cleaning system,

article was from digital camera
Click to expand...

That's true, of a CSC or a DSLR. However, dust does not damage anything. It just causes "bunnies". My E-3 had a brilliant sensor cleaning system which meant I never saw a dust problem but it certainly didn't help me with what was considered to be pollen by the chap that eventually cleaned it off.
Having a camera with a decent sensor cleaning system and taking care when changing lenses (i.e. not in long grass like I did :)) results in it not being a problem to be too concerned about.
 
viewfromthenorth said:
At present, they don't have the AF to match that of SLR's,
Click to expand...

Yes they do - Panasonic GH2, G3

and certainly not the image quality
Click to expand...

Not full frame, but yes to APS, Panasonic GH1, GH2 and G3 and obviously the NEX etc are already APS.

(or glass) to match full frame SLR's. It'll be interesting to see what happens in the future though.
Click to expand...

Panasonic and Olympus Glass is excellent glass, and size is no barrier to quality in glass,as it covers a smaller image circle there's inherently less of it all else being equal.

What cannot match a DSLR? AF tracking - without phase detect it's impossible to tell which way a subject is moving (except laterally), so it does suck.

FF sensoer performance - because there isn't a FF sensor, yet.

High frame rates in burst - no reason why they can't, but they just don't at the minute
 
Wait wait, why are people saying CSC?

The best name for these small cameras is EVIL
 
Alan Clogwyn said:
Yes they do - Panasonic GH2, G3



Not full frame, but yes to APS, Panasonic GH1, GH2 and G3 and obviously the NEX etc are already APS.



Panasonic and Olympus Glass is excellent glass, and size is no barrier to quality in glass,as it covers a smaller image circle there's inherently less of it all else being equal.

What cannot match a DSLR? AF tracking - without phase detect it's impossible to tell which way a subject is moving (except laterally), so it does suck.

FF sensoer performance - because there isn't a FF sensor, yet.

High frame rates in burst - no reason why they can't, but they just don't at the minute
Click to expand...


Valid points, but therein lies the problem, some CSC cameras provide exceptions to the rule. But in general, they don't appear to, or at least from the reviews I've read in the comics. However, if you wanted the features where SLR cameras have the upper hand, you'd buy an SLR, likewise for a CSC. The CSC cameras have similar but also different strengths, and for a lot of camera buyers are probably a better choice. An SLR is not the answer to every camera buying question, and neither is a CSC.
 
According to a poll on DPReview, they're to be known as MILCs - Mirrorless Interchangeable Lens Cameras.

Conceptually, they are, or can be, everything that a DSLR is, but with a whole raft of fundamental and very substantial advantages. Smaller (no mirror/prism), cheaper (no mirror/prism), faster (no mirror), potentially solid sate (using sensor switching, no shutter), brilliant AF that can track a specific subject anywhere, x-sync at any speed (with sensor switching), better/smaller/cheaper lenses (no back-focus mirror problems).

They are not there yet in terms of performance - AF, and their electronic vierwfinders particularly - but they've only been around for a year, are already pretty good, and selling in very big numbers now. Quite a few people on here have got them, and traded their DSLRs.

DSLRs are not going a way for a very long time, but these MILCs will outsell them within the next few years for sure. I think that when Caninkon show their hand, enthusiasts will sit up.
 
HoppyUK said:
According to a poll on DPReview, they're to be known as MILCs - Mirrorless Interchangeable Lens Cameras.

Conceptually, they are, or can be, everything that a DSLR is, but with a whole raft of fundamental and very substantial advantages. Smaller (no mirror/prism), cheaper (no mirror/prism), faster (no mirror), potentially solid sate (using sensor switching, no shutter), brilliant AF that can track a specific subject anywhere, x-sync at any speed (with sensor switching), better/smaller/cheaper lenses (no back-focus mirror problems).

They are not there yet in terms of performance - AF, and their electronic vierwfinders particularly - but they've only been around for a year, are already pretty good, and selling in very big numbers now. Quite a few people on here have got them, and traded their DSLRs.



DSLRs are not going a way for a very long time, but these MILCs will outsell them within the next few years for sure. I think that when Caninkon show their hand, enthusiasts will sit up.
Click to expand...


Can't stop progress. After all we don't see people walking along in front of an automobile waving a flag to warn of danger anymore.
 
Last edited:
danbroad said:
except that some cameras don't have the electronic viewfinder, so no 'E'. Plus, as a system name for advertising it's hardly got mileage. CSC is probably the group name that's sticking the best.
Click to expand...


there's also the point that the market for many of these cameras doesn't want a viewfinder, optical or electronic - they are so used to live view on their compacts and phones, the only way they know to compose shots is at arms length!

may sound silly to many people here, but seems to be how most people under 30 shoot their dslrs, as well as anyone older with poor eye sight... and lets not forget the demands of video..its a huge market and it couldn't care less about a viewfinder...
 
had nex 5 no way as good as dslr image quality wise
but great for a compact
 
pepper1786 said:
had nex 5 no way as good as dslr image quality wise
but great for a compact
Click to expand...

How can it not be as good? Same sensor and lenses as a Sony DSLR - that's the whole point of them.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top