Developing with caffeine?

cardiff_gareth

cardiff_gareth

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This popped up on my Google news feed and it looked so odd I had to share to see if this is actually a thing?

Caffenol

<b>Dedicated to the power of Caffenol and Caffenol-C film developer made of: <br><br>instant coffee, washing soda and vitamin-C.<br><br>Competes with the best developers available <br> <br> This developer deserves more attention. <br> <br> Time for a cup of coffee....</b> <br> <br> Ifyou are new...
caffenol.blogspot.com caffenol.blogspot.com
 
Yes - and the nastier the coffee the better. Coffee, Vitamin C and washing soda - smells foul once mixed but will give results. I also have mixed my own Rodinal alternative, paracetamol capsules, caustic soda and campden tablets.

My cat on HP5+ dev'd in Caffenol

2011-11-22_tigger_Caffenol.jpg


Lock gate - HP5+ in Parodinol (home brew)

2012-01-01_13.jpg
 
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Yes, it is a thing!
 
Plus, if I remember correctly, red wine and urine (not together:)). I assume that this is not only environmentally friendly, but also excellent recycling.
 
StephenM said:
Plus, if I remember correctly, red wine and urine (not together:)). I assume that this is not only environmentally friendly, but also excellent recycling.
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When this thread goes off the rails (well, they all do), will it be on Coffee, Wine or Urine :exit:
 
cardiff_gareth said:
Well I never knew! @dmb caustic soda!

I need to read up more on this. I have a well expired roll of Tmax 400 here I wouldn't mind shooting and having a caffeine dev play with!

Don't mind wasting caffeine but I draw the line at red wine!
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Saving your urine too I see. Some swear peeing on your feet cures foot rot and others swear by drinking it — I think it has to be your own in the latter case ;).
 
You might like to read Anchell and Troop's "Film Developing Cookbook". I did, when I read it some years ago. Some of the quotes in the margins are wonderful.
 
@cardiff_gareth

Note in Caffenol the alkali is washing soda (sodium carbonate) the more hazardous caustic soda (sodium hydroxide) is used in the Rodinal home brew


My Parodinal Recipe

23 x 500mg capsules paracetamol (just the powder from inside the capsules)
22.5g sodium metabisulphite (Youngs u-brew Camden tablets from Wilkos)
19.1g sodium hydroxide (sold as Caustic soda in B&Q)

Cooled boiled water (boiling softens and removes dissolved oxygen)

1) Dissolve 10g NaOH in 50ml water. It will get warm. While still warm add the paracetamol, stir and allow to cool.

2) Dissolve 9.1g NaOH in 70ml of water, allow to cool and add metabisulphite.

3) Mix two solutions at room temperature and make up to 150ml and decant to a bottle that you can exclude air from. I use my daughter's discarded Schwarzkopf hair dye applicator bottles.

4) Allow to 'meld' for at least 72 hours

There will be crystals that deposit at the bottom of the bottle, those appear to act as oxygen scavengers and should not be removed.

Oh and word of warning - do the mixing in a well ventilated area and no where near photo film or paper as sulphur dioxide from camden tablets will fog them. Wear eye and skin protection when mixing, caustic soda burns are nasty.
 
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dmb said:
@cardiff_gareth

Note in Caffenol the alkali is washing soda (sodium carbonate) the more hazardous caustic soda (sodium hydroxide) is used in the Rodinal home brew


My Parodinal Recipe

16 x 500mg capsules paracetamol
20g sodium metabisulphite (Youngs u-brew Camden tablets from Wilkos)
19g sodium hydroxide (sold as Caustic soda in B&Q)

Cooled boiled water (boiling softens and removes dissolved oxygen)

1) Dissolve 10g NaOH in 50ml water. It will get warm. While still warm add the paracetamol, stir and allow to cool.

2) Dissolve 9g NaOH in 70ml of water, allow to cool and add metabisulphite.

3) Mix two solutions at room temperature and make up to 150ml and decant to a bottle that you can exclude air from. I use my daughter's discarded Schwarzkopf hair dye applicator bottles.

4) Allow to 'meld' for at least 72 hours

There will be crystals that deposit at the bottom of the bottle, those appear to act as oxygen scavengers and should not be removed.

Oh and word of warning - do the mixing in a well ventilated area and no where near photo film or paper as sulphur dioxide from camden tablets will fog them. Wear eye and skin protection when mixing, caustic soda burns are nasty.
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+1 for care with sodium hydroxide but also the sulphur dioxide from the Camden tabs — I’m very sensitive to sulphur dioxide and it will give me an almost instant asthma-type attack — a colleague passed out while passing the open door to a laboratory where SO2 was being used. It seems not to affect some people in low doses — obviously given the wide use of Camden tablets in the kitchen etc,
 
It is interesting the number of different solutions that can be used to develop film - some people use beer - but I just find it a whole lot easier to use Kodak HC110. Using dilution H, a 1-litre bottle costing about £35 can generate 64 litres of developer, enough to develop about 256 films if your tank needs 250ml per film. The cost is therefore 13pence per film, and the bottle lasts for years without going bad.
 
Thought for the day.

“The fact is that relatively few photographers ever master their medium. Instead they allow the medium to master them and go on an endless squirrel cage chase from new lens to new paper to new developer to new gadget, never staying with one piece of equipment long enough to learn its full capacities, becoming lost in a maze of technical information that is of little or no use since they don’t know what to do with it.” – Edward Weston
 
Having experimented with several developers over the years, I would never seek to stop others from exploring what might be available out there. What has become entirely clear to me over the years is that I never shot nearly enough film to really be able to master any of them, nor did I ever do direct comparisons with standard developers by shooting another film at the same time to see which I preferred. Having done chemistry and worked in a lab many years ago, I was always comfortable messing about with chemicals, so no problem there.

Under the sink in my utility room/darkroom there is some old brown Rodinal, a gently ageing bottle of HC-110 and a newly mixed batch of Xtol which I use at stock strength and replenish. All 3 are ready to go at short notice, and personal experience has shown me that stock Xtol can keep for a year with the generous use of marbles to keep the bottles full. How many alternatives have gone off and gone down the drain over the years? :eek: I have a couple of other powder developers unopened as yet, which I'll hopefully try some day.

I really need to shoot more film and adopt a more scientific/artistic approach to processing it. and I almost feel a New Year Resolution coming on. Given the small quantities needed for Rodinal and HC-110 in a Paterson Orbital, I should try shooting 2 sheets of 5x4 film in identical light and develop them in different developers to see if I prefer one over the other. That's my positive thought for the day! :cool: (we need a processing/darkroom smilie, so will make do with Gareth's coffee meantime :coffee:)
 
StephenM said:
Thought for the day.

“The fact is that relatively few photographers ever master their medium. Instead they allow the medium to master them and go on an endless squirrel cage chase from new lens to new paper to new developer to new gadget, never staying with one piece of equipment long enough to learn its full capacities, becoming lost in a maze of technical information that is of little or no use since they don’t know what to do with it.” – Edward Weston
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Very true, though people can be be more interested, or specialise in, some particular area of photography (or any subject really) even, say, collecting old cameras.

A recent view saying much the same thing as Weston:

I won't even mention the names of the developers that were supposed to be special that weren't, because tender feelings linger out there still.

At some point I realized that everybody was looking for a magic bullet, something to make their work special...even if those magic bullets didn't exist. I finally figured out that if you really discovered something that was special, other people would just copy you anyway. What was the point? I made up my mind to go the other way, and make a principle out of simply doing things the way everybody else did them.

I decided it was foolish to chase fiendishly clever ways of doing things. I wanted to use the techniques that were common and popular and characteristic of my era. At the time that meant what I called "my Photo 101 technique"—35mm Tri-X developed in D-76 printed full frame (sorry) on 8x10 or 11x14 paper. The idea was to just go ahead and use whatever people are using and do whatever they are doing. Be a part of your era. Follow the crowd. But do it better.

(my bold)

theonlinephotographer.typepad.com

Doing It Well

In private correspondence, Tony McLean re-quoted something quoted in a forum by Andrew Rodney: "You can do all sorts of things that are fiendishly clever, then fall in love with them because they're fiendishly clever, while overlooking the fact that...
theonlinephotographer.typepad.com
 
I don't think I'll ever master developing at home but I'm more than happy to experiment and find new ways to do things!

Currently I use Ilfosol 3 but it goes off pretty quickly I find. I do squeeze the bottle to get all the air out so it causes a vacuum but the last 500ml bottle I had to waste a load that had gone like a cola colour.

HC110 looks interesting as I see it has a long shelf life once opened. Also interesting is the powder forms such as ID11 but what puts me off powder is they make huge batches and I worry that'll go off also before I get half way through it and it's wasted.
Not so much wasting my money but also the environmental impact of pouring it away.
Also HC110, out of stock everywhere bar one company online who wants over £75 for a bottle!!
 
Agree with the posts above.. I tried Cafinol once and it was a fun thing to do but it was a bit of a faff and once was enough. :)
I too plan to stick with one or two developers from now on. 'Keep it simple' suits me..
 
cardiff_gareth said:
Also HC110, out of stock everywhere bar one company online who wants over £75 for a bottle!!
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Bearing in mind that I haven't actually tried it, Ilfotec LC29 is supposedly the Ilford equivalent of HC-110 for low usage. (their Ilfotec HC is the same, but for bigger/faster usage). Best price I can see for the LC29 is at Wex at £16.99 for 500ml and £2.99 standard postage, and allegedly in stock! https://www.ilfordphoto.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/ILFOTEC-LC29-AUG19.pdf

www.wexphotovideo.com

Ilford Ilfotec LC29 Developer 500ml | Wex Photo Video

www.wexphotovideo.com
 
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Thanks. From what I've read, and I try not to read too much so it over complicates things but Ilfotec LC29 is a diluted form of Ilford Ilfotec HC which is the same as Kodak HC110?

So I could get either the LC29 or HC but before I go and try one of these, are the shelf lives of these developers good and does one outlast the other in terms of shelf live?

Next up will be looking for a cheaper fixer as I use Ilford Rapid fixer that uses 100ml per 400ml so I go through that pretty quick!
 
cardiff_gareth said:
Thanks. From what I've read, and I try not to read too much so it over complicates things but Ilfotec LC29 is a diluted form of Ilford Ilfotec HC which is the same as Kodak HC110?

So I could get either the LC29 or HC but before I go and try one of these, are the shelf lives of these developers good and does one outlast the other in terms of shelf live?

Next up will be looking for a cheaper fixer as I use Ilford Rapid fixer that uses 100ml per 400ml so I go through that pretty quick!
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From the Ilford description

Page 1 of 8 Aug 2019

Overview
ILFORD ILFOTEC LC29 is a high dilution liquid concentrate black and white film developer that is flexible and
economic to use. It is based on the technology used in ILFORD ILFOTEC HC developer but is formulated to be
an easy to pour liquid for small volume film processing.
Click to expand...
 
We all have our own special interests or biases. I was always more interested in the theory rather than the practice when it came to developing and film testings. Plus lack of money really precluded "waste" by using things just for the sake of it - or, at least, without any obvious gain in the form of a print at the end.

I did experiment - too dignified a word really, as experiments should involve a measure of control and documentation - with different films and a few easily obtained developers (no mail order in those days). In practice, I standardised on Unitol as being easy to use. Powder developers were more trouble, for no obvious (to me) gains; the only other developer I used was Acutol, and that was because it was the only one that I could actually see gave a different result with the higher acutance.

I suppose I put more emphasis on predictability and reproducibility than on small and possibly invisible differences in prints from different developers. Unlike many though, I'm not using 35mm where enlargement could reveal differences I would never see.
 
I came across that website as well (https://caffenol.blogspot.com/) which inspired me to have a go and I developed my first roll on Christmas day (the first time I have developed B&W since my teens in the 70s). I had a roll of Fomapan 100 lying around (which had come with a recent camera purchase) but as our weather has been dull and dark I decided to shoot it at 400 and I think I didn't develop it for long enough so it is rather atmospheric underexposed.

Three sample shots - Fomapan 100 @ 400 developed in Caffenol C-M for 15 mins

One of our cats, 1/30 at f2.8, Zuiko 24mm f2.8
E3F5CFCF-FEE2-4C0C-85D4-6689C50F9D14.jpeg

Waterfall on the Fairlie Burn, Zuiko 24mm f2.8 (can't recall the details)
16FB894F-2BF8-4234-AB8D-5480E74EDA51.jpeg

After walk coffee, 1/30 at f2.8, Zuiko 24mm f2.8
56EBE2A4-8F3D-448C-BF44-C8B776E8D4E2.jpeg
 
Apologies in advance for the iPhone images:

Some of the negatives (using ScreenLight on the iPad as a light box)
DC339D87-E132-4B7E-96B7-59734CBADDAB.jpeg

The developer ingredients:
24E3CD58-E767-491E-BE3F-7E3FAA440296.jpeg
 
Seeing the coffee brand made me think of cappuccino cake, and a request I made for the ingredients of a rather good version I'd just eaten at one of the Brighton Artist's Open Houses last month. The key was the specific brand and type of instant coffee used apparently.

I'm now wondering if there is going to be a market for a Caffenol Developing Cookbook, where all the varieties and brands of instant coffee are tested and evaluated :)
 
StephenM said:
The key was the specific brand and type of instant coffee used apparently.
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The same for developing - from what I've read the cheaper and stronger the better (and definitely no decaf) and some people advise against using arabica. I selected based on price!
 
cardiff_gareth said:
This popped up on my Google news feed and it looked so odd I had to share to see if this is actually a thing?

Caffenol

<b>Dedicated to the power of Caffenol and Caffenol-C film developer made of: <br><br>instant coffee, washing soda and vitamin-C.<br><br>Competes with the best developers available <br> <br> This developer deserves more attention. <br> <br> Time for a cup of coffee....</b> <br> <br> Ifyou are new...
caffenol.blogspot.com caffenol.blogspot.com
Click to expand...

There's this Gareth.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPrSRpoL110&t=1s


Greg Carrick is very good and is interested in all sorts of mad things.
 
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