composing a shot through viewfinder

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buster2

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john
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Now this maybe a silly question but i'm a little confused, with my advanced compact obviously you do change the iso,apature etc and can see the changes on the lcd screen but with the dslr although i realise your changing iso etc but i can only see the result after reviewing the shot on the lcd,which makes me wonder whats the point of the viewfinder? as it takes longer to get the setting right. Am i missing something?
 
optical view finders are more detailed and easier to work with during bright day light. You can use it in any light and as long as your eyes can see, you can compose.
 
It does seem a bit silly to me, yeah. What is it that Live View tells you, that the viewfinder doesn't? Bearing in mind that, until you take the shot, you don't have the shot. The best Live View can do is constantly report what the image WOULD have looked like 5ms before, if you HAD taken the shot at any given instant, and you hadn't just been looking at Live View instead.
 
On a dslr, the mirror needs to move out of the way of the sensor to show a live mode. So to capture a shot with live mode the mirror has to drop, sensor resets to photo mode, mirror lifts, photo is taken, mirror drops. Often the auto focus is better through the viewfinder too as the live mode uses contrast focusing where as view finder focus uses phase detection which is a little quicker and sharper.

With mirrorless you dont need the mirror actuations so it makes no odds (only in bright light as said above)
 
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Let me give an example if i have each camera on full manual,with g11 the lcd maybe too dark/light so i adjust the settings until its right, with the 60d when looking through the viewfinder it doesn't change only after ive taken a picture can i see whether its too dark/light etc
 
An optical view finder gives you a continuous, bright sharp. uncluttered view of the subject. Ideal in all light conditions.
some better ones include a fully parallax corrected, illuminated frame.
Others give exposure details.

In the past it was not thought necessary to include any information in viewfinders, as the photographer would know what he had set.
More recent cameras automate most of the settings, so a repeat of this information can be useful.
 
buster2 said:
Let me give an example if i have each camera on full manual,with g11 the lcd maybe too dark/light so i adjust the settings until its right, with the 60d when looking through the viewfinder it doesn't change only after ive taken a picture can i see whether its too dark/light etc
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optical view finder is exactly that: optical. It only allows you to look through the lens, nothing more.

As I said, its advantage is that helps with composition and with some better focus screens, check focus. OVF does not allow you to check camera's metering or live view of possible final image, the Live view mode does that.

If it's live view preview of photo is what you want, Sony Alpha current line of cameras is what you should be looking at. DSLR doesn't offer it through their optical view finder.
 
yes i understand that what i'm saying is would it be right in thinking sometimes in full manual anyway you have to guess the settings? because the vf doesn't indicate whether the shot will come out too dark/light and then alter them
 
wuyanxu said:
optical view finder is exactly that: optical. It only allows you to look through the lens, nothing more.

As I said, its advantage is that helps with composition and with some better focus screens, check focus. OVF does not allow you to check camera's metering or live view of possible final image, the Live view mode does that.

If it's live view preview of photo is what you want, Sony Alpha current line of cameras is what you should be looking at. DSLR doesn't offer it through their optical view finder.
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Its not a complaint, I'm new to all this and if i dont ask i wont find out:cool:
Day by day its getting easier and this is not a problem, simply wondered if i was/wasn't doing something i should/shoudn't be but you've answered my query,thanks
 
In your viewfinder you should see the information like aperture shutter ISO and if shooting manual you get a little meter so you can see whether you are under or overexposed. Have you read your manual.
 
but when your camera is in a position where you cant use the viewfinder eg very low to the grond , the live view is the only option and also if the camera is on a tripod too high to see through it

I hope this helps

Cheers Steve
 
It also gives you a lot better battery life as you can always look through it, regardless of whether the camera is on. Not that that's the purpose, but it's an added bonus.
 
artyman said:
In your viewfinder you should see the information like aperture shutter ISO and if shooting manual you get a little meter so you can see whether you are under or overexposed. Have you read your manual.
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I have Ken yes its all much clearer now, these have so much more than any other camera i've owned it takes a bit of getting used to but all becoming much clearer:)
 
I think the OP is referring to the rather poor direct optical viewfinder of the Canon G11 compact. It's little more than a crude 'aiming device' and can't hold a candle to a good DSLR's TTL optical viewinder. It's only about 85% coverage but still a heck of a lot better than nothing (which is what most compacts have these days, ie nothing) and you can at least frame a shot with the camera held properly at eye level, and use it in bright sun when rear LCDs are hard to see.
 
HoppyUK said:
I think the OP is referring to the rather poor direct optical viewfinder of the Canon G11 compact. It's little more than a crude 'aiming device' and can't hold a candle to a good DSLR's TTL optical viewinder. It's only about 85% coverage but still a heck of a lot better than nothing (which is what most compacts have these days, ie nothing) and you can at least frame a shot with the camera held properly at eye level, and use it in bright sun when rear LCDs are hard to see.
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Ohhhh.. the OP's OP makes A LOT more sense to me, now. :)
 
HoppyUK said:
I think the OP is referring to the rather poor direct optical viewfinder of the Canon G11 compact. It's little more than a crude 'aiming device' and can't hold a candle to a good DSLR's TTL optical viewinder. It's only about 85% coverage but still a heck of a lot better than nothing (which is what most compacts have these days, ie nothing) and you can at least frame a shot with the camera held properly at eye level, and use it in bright sun when rear LCDs are hard to see.
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I've had no need to use the vf on the g11 little point really
 
SimonH said:
It does seem a bit silly to me, yeah. What is it that Live View tells you, that the viewfinder doesn't? Bearing in mind that, until you take the shot, you don't have the shot. The best Live View can do is constantly report what the image WOULD have looked like 5ms before, if you HAD taken the shot at any given instant, and you hadn't just been looking at Live View instead.
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sorry i tend to disagree just been useing a friends G15 and its so easy to change the settings through the dials and the lcd LV and what you compose through the lcd is what came out in final shot and i dont think there's anything wrong with my eye site,crystal clear pics an impressive camera
 
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John, you might be right, it could be that the limitations of the rear screen (compared to the optical viewfinder):
You're watching what just happened
Dealing with sunlight and reflections
The unsteady holding position
Lack of resolution

Are unimportant compared to the advantages.

Or it could be that they are less important to you than they would be to most serious photographers.

It's a bit like front wheel drive - the manufacturers have used some pretty neat marketing to sell us the idea. And most people happily drive about in front wheel drive cars. So if they're so good and so obviously popular, why are all the great cars rear wheel drive (or 4wd)?

Could it be that front wheel drive is cheaper and easier to manufacture?

How much does a G15 cost? How about a 1Dx with it's gorgeous 100% big bright viewfinder?

It certainly makes you think?
 
buster2 said:
sorry i tend to disagree just been useing a friends G15 and its so easy to change the settings through the dials and the lcd LV and what you compose through the lcd is what came out in final shot and i dont think there's anything wrong with my eye site,crystal clear pics an impressive camera
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Perhaps, then, what the live view provides is an alternative to knowledge and experience. When I shoot through an optical viewfinder, I am rarely - if ever - surprised by the shot I get. My eye has a vastly superior dynamic range compared with a live view - I can see detail in a silhouetted foreground AND detail in the sky, without having to make camera adjustments. Combine that with my understanding of how my camera meters, mentally add in any exposure adjustments I've made, and live view cannot compete.
 
The fact that your eyes see so much more than the camera's sensor can (and adapt across a larger dynamic range) could I suppose cause dissapointment when seeing the end result from camera.
However, I too live with this and solely use an optical viewfinder as I much prefer seeing the real thing and yet know what the image will look like when taken. (my DSLR doesn't even have live view so not much choice really!)
 
As a Canon G11,and DSLR, shooter there are times where the flip out screen becomes unusable especially in bright sunlight.

As others have said after a while you will mostly have a feel as to how an image will look, except sometimes when shooting in very different circumstances to normal.

For some subject & lighting the G series can be a very good camera, however for some other subjects they are almost totally useless.

Admittedly the live histogram can be a great aid when setting the exposure, when you have a fair bit of time, and the flip out screen can be very handy at times.

When shooting with it I tend to use the screen a lot more than the viewfinder, especially for relatively static subjects. Howver it certainly feels more natural for me to be shooting through a viewfinder.
 
buster2 said:
yes i understand that what i'm saying is would it be right in thinking sometimes in full manual anyway you have to guess the settings? because the vf doesn't indicate whether the shot will come out too dark/light and then alter them
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It's called knowing what you are doing :shrug:
 
tell me if im wrong here but the live view will probably refresh at around 30fps (standard screen) therefore your maximum exposure on that is 1/30th of a second.

now if im out shooting at night and i take a 1/30th second shot on biggest aperture i usually dont get much.

however my eye sees almost everything as its adjusted to the light and the camera would need more than 1/30th of a second. even with the iso turned up the optical viewfinder helps massively and for anything darker than daylight (maybe a bit extreme) i wouldnt be without it.
 
Phil V said:
John, you might be right, it could be that the limitations of the rear screen (compared to the optical viewfinder):
You're watching what just happened
Dealing with sunlight and reflections
The unsteady holding position
Lack of resolution

Are unimportant compared to the advantages.

Or it could be that they are less important to you than they would be to most serious photographers.

It's a bit like front wheel drive - the manufacturers have used some pretty neat marketing to sell us the idea. And most people happily drive about in front wheel drive cars. So if they're so good and so obviously popular, why are all the great cars rear wheel drive (or 4wd)?

Could it be that front wheel drive is cheaper and easier to manufacture?

How much does a G15 cost? How about a 1Dx with it's gorgeous 100% big bright viewfinder?

It certainly makes you think?
Click to expand...

Yes but i'm not comparing an advanced with a dslr, i know there's a big difference, i've already found several important differences and nothing feels like a dslr with a lens although the G15/11 are very well built camera's and great to carry everywhere when the 60d would be too bulky.
I was just saying ease of use of g15 (not that i'm finding the 60d difficult,there's just more to get to know)
 
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