Canon FF mirrorless...

Phil V said:
I hope you have a source of data to back up that statement.

I have never heard or read of anyone buying a camera just because it was the most popular (we’ll not since the OM10)
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Very many people rent Photoshop because it is the market leader and therefore the best. I have lost count of the discussions I have had about the silly pricing of Photoshop and people telling me that I am a fool for buying other (much cheaper and better) software. (I am aware that Photoshop is not a camera, before someone finds it necessary to tell me).
 
john.margetts said:
Very many people rent Photoshop because it is the market leader and therefore the best. I have lost count of the discussions I have had about the silly pricing of Photoshop and people telling me that I am a fool for buying other (much cheaper and better) software. (I am aware that Photoshop is not a camera, before someone finds it necessary to tell me).
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But that's not a popularity issue, it's an 'industry standard' issue.

I started with a rival product, but was frustrated that it was difficult to find guidance, whereas the WWW is full of photoshop and lightroom tutorials.
 
I attended a Canon event in Bristol last Wednesday specifically to use the EOS R, 24/105, 50, 35 and adapter with EF lens. I have to say I was very impressed, however it is different to use to say the 5D, 7D range.

Couple of points raised and answered on the day, the sensor is made specifically for the R and not borrowed from the 5Div. The reason for no IBS is IS is lens specific, bodies with IBS only work well with wide angle lenses. Also some EF lenses are performing better on the R with the adapter, they named the 50L1.2 did give better images.

Not my words/thoughts, just notes from the day I thought good to share [emoji4]
 
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Phil V said:
I’m sorry, I didn’t expect to have to explain the concept of ‘industry standard’,
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That explains why the industry buys Photoshop but that does not apply to amateurs who have no need to comply with any sort of standard. The vast numbers of amateurs who buy Photoshop buy it because everyone(ish) buys it.
 
john.margetts said:
That explains why the industry buys Photoshop but that does not apply to amateurs who have no need to comply with any sort of standard. The vast numbers of amateurs who buy Photoshop buy it because everyone(ish) buys it.
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It's the same with canon. Ask a armature why they bought into the Canon system and most say because its what everyone buys.
 
jonneymendoza said:
It's the same with canon. Ask a armature why they bought into the Canon system and most say because its what everyone buys.
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:LOL::LOL:

I’m sure if I saw an armature buying a camera I’d be totally shocked, and whilst I’d want to know how come an electric motor component wanted to buy a Canon camera, I’m not sure I’d get a response more useful than a buzzing sound.

Seriously though; amateurs at cameraclubs tend to be Nikon owners, where amateurs without nerdy friends bought Canon, for the same reason people buy Dell, simple brand recognition.

As Richard says, for most of the last 40 years, Canon have broadly made the best products. Despite the fact that the jonney come latelies see them as a failing company.
 
Mike.P said:
Tell me about it ... 30 people over 85 that have all been to Botswana photographing lions and Tigers just so they can win the club competition. Never seen so many people up their own backsides in one small room before.
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It was there I truly began to understand the meaning of 'clique' - I felt so out of place, I showed up enthusiastically with my little D90 and 5th hand kit lens into a bunch of miserable old farts, men and women [the women were actually more sour pussed] who stared me up and down from the off before hitting me with a barrage of stupid questions. It was an interrogation more like, the pack were uneasy with a lone cub wandering into their crusty lair. This crowd just happened to be 100% Canon shooters, but I don't think that mattered. The session I turned up to saw them mid-plan on an 'exhibition' of work they had done on recent photo walks *shudder* - every second image looking the same, same angle, same bridge, same PP ... and they'd look to me for my thoughts as they went through the prints. "Um, yeah, that's .... nice ... were you all just standing in the same spot?" :tumbleweed:

The funny thing is, I didn't just discover this group, they discovered me! I was out doing some LE shooting with my little tripod one night and a car pulls up beside me, I though it was the cops or something and I was ready to get all defensive about my right to shoot car trails, but it was the guy who runs the club - "I see you like your photography" - No s*** Sherlock! - he offered me a lift out to the club [which was in an abandoned old house in the middle of nowhere btw] that Thurs night, though I'd nothing to lose. I'm sure I lost some brain cells after it was finally over though.
 
I have only ever ran into 1 camera club out in the wild so to speak. It was in Kyoto Japan at some famous Zen garden. I saw about 10 people with soooo much gear, 8/10 had 1Dxm2, all L-glass, 70-200L, camera backpacks and those jackets. I felt out of place with my 5D4 and 35/85L !

Curiosity got the better of me and I asked if they were from the National Geographic, turns out they were some camera club out of New Zealand on a photo trip.

They were nice enough but the whole thing felt weird to me.
 
I'm sure there's some decent clubs about, with genuinely nice people, my experience just felt like an old episode of the Twilight Zone, or maybe more like it should have been based here ...
tumblr_lnkyiigT2j1qm7srzo1_500.jpg
 
jonneymendoza said:
It's the same with canon. Ask a armature why they bought into the Canon system and most say because its what everyone buys.
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Speaking as a non-armature I can say that the reason I bought into Canon was that at the time I was moving into digital it was the only company that did a mid-range camera body (the 20D). Plus a few lenses, of course. And as I am not particularly techie having found my way round most of the menu system by now I'm loath to start at the bottom of a new learning curve with another system. (But still might.....). As I have said before there are all sorts of reasons for choosing one system over another and all sorts of reasons for staying with it (or not).

It's easy to generalise but not always very useful.
 
jerry12953 said:
Speaking as a non-armature I can say that the reason I bought into Canon was that at the time I was moving into digital it was the only company that did a mid-range camera body (the 20D). Plus a few lenses, of course. And as I am not particularly techie having found my way round most of the menu system by now I'm loath to start at the bottom of a new learning curve with another system. (But still might.....). As I have said before there are all sorts of reasons for choosing one system over another and all sorts of reasons for staying with it (or not).

It's easy to generalise but not always very useful.
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If you still have that 20D any new camera menu will look a little strange as as far as I remember the 20D "menu" was just a list. Back then the only times I accessed the list were to format the card or change the clock and a lot of the time I could call up the list, spin the wheel and hit the format option. These days my cameras have pages of options but I usually only dive in to do those same two things, format the card and change the clock.

Honestly all the internet talk of menus and complaints about them has me scratching my head as once I've set my cameras up I rarely need to bother with them.
 
woof woof said:
Honestly all the internet talk of menus and complaints about them has me scratching my head as once I've set my cameras up I rarely need to bother with them.
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Same here, though I do love that I have touch screen to shorten my time spent in the menu even more.

To format a card now takes only 2 clicks after switching the camera on, as I have it set to remember my last position in the menu. Other than that I really only use the menus for switching constant/live preview to off when using flash, the odd time I change AF mode, or the even odder times I mess about with video. I have a bunch of customisable Fn buttons, too many in fact, there's rarely a need to go digging. As you say, once you have it set up to your liking you really can just point and shoot
 
Well that’s 9 minutes of my life totally wasted to learn SFA.
 
Kev.s said:
I attended a Canon event in Bristol last Wednesday specifically to use the EOS R, 24/105, 50, 35 and adapter with EF lens. I have to say I was very impressed, however it is different to use to say the 5D, 7D range.

Couple of points raised and answered on the day, the sensor is made specifically for the R and not borrowed from the 5Div. The reason for no IBS is IS is lens specific, bodies with IBS only work well with wide angle lenses. Also some EF lenses are performing better on the R with the adapter, they named the 50L1.2 did give better images.

Not my words/thoughts, just notes from the day I thought good to share [emoji4]
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....I wanted to go to that event but Canon only emailed me about it AFTER the date it was held!! Duh! Not clever, Canon! My daughter lives in Bristol and I could have stayed overnight at her house.

As I already have the mirrorless EOS M5, which I only use with EF lenses via Canon's adapter, I am already at basecamp for the mirrorless EOS R. Currently my intention is to replace my M5 with the R body and my only slight hesitation is if another higher end EOS R body is officially, not rumoured, announced to be released within a two or three months.

If a higher end R body is released after I have bought the first version, there is no reason I can't part-ex but I would only do so IF the newer features satisfy my requirements - Faster fps and retaining a fully articulated screen.
 
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Gaz J said:
Well that’s 9 minutes of my life totally wasted to learn SFA.
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I learned something - that he wasn't invited to either of the Canon or Nikon launch events, and that they won't loan him a camera either :eek:
 
His findings appear to contrast greatly with just about everyone else whose hands on experience of the AF I've read who found it fast, snappy and accurate. Face detection might be a bit lacking?

Nikon's AF C seems to be extremely poor according to DPR and others
 
wooster said:
His findings appear to contrast greatly with just about everyone else whose hands on experience of the AF I've read who found it fast, snappy and accurate. Face detection might be a bit lacking?

Nikon's AF C seems to be extremely poor according to DPR and others
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Not kei. He said the af wasn't good either
 
[QUOTE="Kev.s, post: 8273511, member: 25335bodies with IBS only work well with wide angle lenses.[/QUOTE]

Really?

Someone forgot to tell Olympus that then as my 75-300mm lens is superbly stable due to the IS.

Also an old manual focus 400mm (EFL 800mm) lens is also rather stable.
 
="GreenNinja67, post: 8274009, member: 54831"][QUOTE="Kev.s, post: 8273511, member: 25335bodies with IBS only work well with wide angle lenses.
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Really?

Someone forgot to tell Olympus that then as my 75-300mm lens is superbly stable due to the IS.

Also an old manual focus 400mm (EFL 800mm) lens is also rather stable.
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I couldn't call my 500mm lens on a Sony A77 with IBIS "superbly stable" with IBIS on, but it's definitely the case that I can handhold usefully slower shutter speeds with the IBIS on than not.
 
chris malcolm said:
I couldn't call my 500mm lens on a Sony A77 with IBIS "superbly stable" with IBIS on, but it's definitely the case that I can handhold usefully slower shutter speeds with the IBIS on than not.
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Olympus/Panasonic IBIS is miles ahead of Sony's, of course it's moving about a smaller sensor, but you're also getting better reach at the same FL. I was able to single hand hold a 600mm equiv lens and get pin sharp shots using the G80, the IBIS on M43 really is incredible. And it really does help a lot with tele lenses while framing. Whoever said IBIS is best for WA only must have a few screws loose
 
"AF is pretty good" he says. He likes DPAF he says. Mind you he needs to realise cameras work better using two hands
 
Well, I'm sure it won't come to any surprise to most of you guys but today my name was added to a reserved list for an EOS R to include EF adapter (of course) and RF 24-105mm F/4L IS < Replacing my M5 and EF 24-70mm F/4L IS. Control Ring adapter will come later.

I don't know exactly when it will arrive but no doubt I'll post here when it does. Don't expect an in-depth critical review though - I'm already a happy Canon EOS system user, but I will say if there's anything I don't like and why. Of course I will also share what I do like.
 
Well I've discounted the R for now. I will go with a 5DIV after all.

Also, I'm actually flogging some of my fuji lenses and contemplating my next APS-C mirrorless. I'm possibly going with the M5. Initially I had been vacillating, but some opinions on here have swayed me more towards it again.
 
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Re clubs, my experience of the only one I was ever a member of was different. I might have been lucky but I was made to feel most welcome and people offered to help me with all aspects of my photography.. Competitions were light- hearted affairs with some pretty good stuff being shown and constructive criticism mixed with some good-natured banter was the predominant tone. I really enjoyed it and only stopped going when I moved :)
 
wooster said:
Well I've discounted the R for now. I will go with a 5DIV after all.

Also, I'm actually flogging some of my fuji lenses and contemplating my next APS-C mirrorless. I'm possibly going with the M5. Initially I had been vacillating, but some opinions on here have swayed me more towards it again.
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....I feel confident you will enjoy the 5D-4 < I did.

The M5 delivers excellent image quality which is indistinguishable from the 7D-2. See what you think of IQ in my M5 album on Flickr :

https://www.flickr.com/photos/114775606@N07/albums/72157683996949495

@Phil V uses a M5 too I think. I have only mounted EF lenses on mine (soon to be for sale).
 
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